Where to go to short stock?
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
April 30, 2024, 08:15:25 PM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  Forum Community
  Off-topic Board (Moderators: The Dowager Mod, The Mikado, YE)
  Where to go to short stock?
« previous next »
Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Where to go to short stock?  (Read 380 times)
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,070
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: April 02, 2024, 03:22:59 PM »

I want to short Trump's Truth Social stock, but the only app I've used is Stash that doesn't allow shorting. Anywhere I can do this?
Logged
President of the great nation of 🏳️‍⚧️
Peebs
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 16,044
United States



Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2024, 04:51:54 PM »

BRTD threaf
Logged
GeorgiaModerate
Moderators
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 32,716


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2024, 07:49:27 PM »

Any online brokerage would allow you to do it, allow they may have rules on how much value is in your account before you can.  Also, please note that SEC rules prohibit shorting a newly traded stock for 30 days after its IPO.
Logged
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,070
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2024, 10:37:58 PM »

Any online brokerage would allow you to do it, allow they may have rules on how much value is in your account before you can.  Also, please note that SEC rules prohibit shorting a newly traded stock for 30 days after its IPO.
So I can't until next month?
Logged
lfromnj
Atlas Politician
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 19,381


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2024, 10:23:08 PM »
« Edited: April 09, 2024, 12:18:20 PM by lfromnj »

Online brokerage. IBKR from what I see allows it. Its UI confuses me but you could probably do it. However fair warning. The short interest fee is insane on this stock at 500% which means
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/topstocks/why-shorting-trump-s-djt-stock-could-cost-you-a-500-fee/ar-BB1l1vlp
Pretty sure you can short it now as it isn't an IPO and the stock did exist before as DWAC
Quote
Based on that data, to short 100 shares of Trump Media & Technology Group at the current price, it would cost between $24,895 and $29,874 a year. That means the stock would have to fall about 1.4% a day just to cover the cost of shorting it. And if the short were held for a year, the bet would still lose about $20,000 to $25,000, even if the stock price fell to $1.

Even if the stock falls to 0 over a year you would lose $20k. You only would profit a touch if it goes to 0 within say around 10 weeks. Don't touch this. Another potential risk is the possibility of a short squeeze if it gets over shorted and if it for some reason goes up it could trigger a cascade of short sellers trying to rebuy the stock further pushing the price up.

If you want to have fun with some light gambling $2.5 dollar puts expiring either January 2025 or January 2026.  This would cost you roughly 40 dollars or 80 dollars for the latter one and give you either 210 for the former or 170 profit for the latter if the stock hits 0 dollars.(excluding the losses on the risk free interest rate). Note that any losses you incur on this put strategy is not my fault as it is not financial advice, just a possible play with less risk than your suggested play.

Also for anyone dumb enough to want to buy the stock for some reason, you can actually buy the stock with a weekly discount by just going synthetic longs by buying a call and selling a put. Normally a synthetic long should cost 0 dollars or even cost you money due to bid-ask spreads but in this case a synthetic long is cheaper than the stock itself. To be specific this discount exists due to short selling and you would forgoe the short selling fee but brokerages rarely give you the full fee when you lend a stock.
Logged
Benjamin Frank 2.0
Frank 2.0
Jr. Member
***
Posts: 1,107
Canada


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2024, 11:28:14 PM »

Online brokerage. IBKR from what I see allows it. Its UI confuses me but you could probably do it. However fair warning. The short interest fee is insane on this stock at 500% which means
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/topstocks/why-shorting-trump-s-djt-stock-could-cost-you-a-500-fee/ar-BB1l1vlp
Pretty sure you can short it now as it isn't an IPO and the stock did exist before as DWAC
Quote
Based on that data, to short 100 shares of Trump Media & Technology Group at the current price, it would cost between $24,895 and $29,874 a year. That means the stock would have to fall about 1.4% a day just to cover the cost of shorting it. And if the short were held for a year, the bet would still lose about $20,000 to $25,000, even if the stock price fell to $1.

Even if the stock falls to 0 over a year you would lose $20k. You only would profit a touch if it goes to 0 within say around 10 weeks. Don't touch this. Another potential risk is the possibility of a short squeeze if it gets over shorted and if it for some reason goes up it could trigger a cascade of short sellers trying to rebuy the stock further pushing the price up.

If you want to have fun with some light gambling $2.5 dollar puts expiring either January 2025 or January 2026.  This would cost you roughly 40 dollars or 80 dollars for the latter one and give you either 210 for the former or 170 profit for the latter if the stock hits 0 dollars.(excluding the losses on the risk free interest rate). Note that any losses you incur on this put strategy is not my fault as it is not financial advice, just a possible play with less risk than your suggested play.

Also for anyone dumb enough to want to buy the stock for some reason, you can actually buy the stock with a weekly discount by just going synthetic longs by buying a call and selling a put. Normally a synthetic long should cost 0 dollars or even cost you money due to bid-ask spreads but in this case a synthetic long is cheaper than the stock itself.

Exactly, even though 'DJT' is falling in value, you should always heed Keynes advice of 'the market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent' and never short a stock.

Buying a put option is the way to go instead. As you know, a 'put option' is a derivative as its value derives from the value of the underlying stock.

The most you can lose buying a put option is its cost, the losses of shorting a stock are theoretically unlimited.
Logged
lfromnj
Atlas Politician
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 19,381


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2024, 07:32:38 AM »
« Edited: April 09, 2024, 09:17:47 AM by lfromnj »

I wouldn't say never short but someone new to the market other than ETF's should never short especially a stock as volatile as this. However even for most investors a deep In the money put option would be fine. This even excludes the short interest fee which is through the roof. One option to normally short a stock would be a call credit spread where you sell a lower price value call and buy a higher price one. One issue with this strategy right now though is that I believe a lot of call options will be exercised early so hedge funds can get the stock itself and get the short interest fee, the interest fee as a retailer you get is much lower than what funds can negotiate.
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,191
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2024, 06:47:06 PM »

Shorting is a bad f**king idea unless you're a professional stock trader and doing your full due diligence and have a lot of money to burn away if things go south. It might be a fun meme until it really, really isn't. I'd try to find a less risky way to own the cons if I were you.
Logged
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,070
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2024, 07:12:46 PM »

Shorting is a bad f**king idea unless you're a professional stock trader and doing your full due diligence and have a lot of money to burn away if things go south. It might be a fun meme until it really, really isn't. I'd try to find a less risky way to own the cons if I were you.
It's not like I'd be putting in loads of money. Definitely wouldn't do anything higher than $100.
Logged
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,070
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2024, 07:41:00 PM »

Online brokerage. IBKR from what I see allows it. Its UI confuses me but you could probably do it. However fair warning. The short interest fee is insane on this stock at 500% which means
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/topstocks/why-shorting-trump-s-djt-stock-could-cost-you-a-500-fee/ar-BB1l1vlp
Pretty sure you can short it now as it isn't an IPO and the stock did exist before as DWAC
Quote
Based on that data, to short 100 shares of Trump Media & Technology Group at the current price, it would cost between $24,895 and $29,874 a year. That means the stock would have to fall about 1.4% a day just to cover the cost of shorting it. And if the short were held for a year, the bet would still lose about $20,000 to $25,000, even if the stock price fell to $1.

Even if the stock falls to 0 over a year you would lose $20k. You only would profit a touch if it goes to 0 within say around 10 weeks. Don't touch this. Another potential risk is the possibility of a short squeeze if it gets over shorted and if it for some reason goes up it could trigger a cascade of short sellers trying to rebuy the stock further pushing the price up.

If you want to have fun with some light gambling $2.5 dollar puts expiring either January 2025 or January 2026.  This would cost you roughly 40 dollars or 80 dollars for the latter one and give you either 210 for the former or 170 profit for the latter if the stock hits 0 dollars.(excluding the losses on the risk free interest rate). Note that any losses you incur on this put strategy is not my fault as it is not financial advice, just a possible play with less risk than your suggested play.

Also for anyone dumb enough to want to buy the stock for some reason, you can actually buy the stock with a weekly discount by just going synthetic longs by buying a call and selling a put. Normally a synthetic long should cost 0 dollars or even cost you money due to bid-ask spreads but in this case a synthetic long is cheaper than the stock itself. To be specific this discount exists due to short selling and you would forgoe the short selling fee but brokerages rarely give you the full fee when you lend a stock.
I definitely wouldn't be putting down $20k lol.

No more than I'd bring to a Blackjack table, which I've never done more than $100.
Logged
lfromnj
Atlas Politician
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 19,381


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2024, 08:16:37 PM »
« Edited: April 09, 2024, 08:30:58 PM by lfromnj »

Online brokerage. IBKR from what I see allows it. Its UI confuses me but you could probably do it. However fair warning. The short interest fee is insane on this stock at 500% which means
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/topstocks/why-shorting-trump-s-djt-stock-could-cost-you-a-500-fee/ar-BB1l1vlp
Pretty sure you can short it now as it isn't an IPO and the stock did exist before as DWAC
Quote
Based on that data, to short 100 shares of Trump Media & Technology Group at the current price, it would cost between $24,895 and $29,874 a year. That means the stock would have to fall about 1.4% a day just to cover the cost of shorting it. And if the short were held for a year, the bet would still lose about $20,000 to $25,000, even if the stock price fell to $1.

Even if the stock falls to 0 over a year you would lose $20k. You only would profit a touch if it goes to 0 within say around 10 weeks. Don't touch this. Another potential risk is the possibility of a short squeeze if it gets over shorted and if it for some reason goes up it could trigger a cascade of short sellers trying to rebuy the stock further pushing the price up.

If you want to have fun with some light gambling $2.5 dollar puts expiring either January 2025 or January 2026.  This would cost you roughly 40 dollars or 80 dollars for the latter one and give you either 210 for the former or 170 profit for the latter if the stock hits 0 dollars.(excluding the losses on the risk free interest rate). Note that any losses you incur on this put strategy is not my fault as it is not financial advice, just a possible play with less risk than your suggested play.

Also for anyone dumb enough to want to buy the stock for some reason, you can actually buy the stock with a weekly discount by just going synthetic longs by buying a call and selling a put. Normally a synthetic long should cost 0 dollars or even cost you money due to bid-ask spreads but in this case a synthetic long is cheaper than the stock itself. To be specific this discount exists due to short selling and you would forgoe the short selling fee but brokerages rarely give you the full fee when you lend a stock.
I definitely wouldn't be putting down $20k lol.

No more than I'd bring to a Blackjack table, which I've never done more than $100.

Here's the thing. Lets say you short 3 shares right now. At a 500% Short interest fee it has to go down by 3 dollars a week right now just for you to break even.  This isn't even including the risk of a short squeeze. You are required to put up maintenance margin and DJT spikes up you will either have to put more cash in to maintain your margin or your money will be lost. To be specific here is it how it could go. You short 3 shells of DJT at 33.33 and collect 100 dollars. Your broker requires you to put 100 dollars more as a safety margin and keep it in a separate account and let you collect some interest while you pay the short interest fee which is far greater than the pennies of interest. Anyway lets say there is no interest or short interest fee and the stock goes upto 50 dollars. To rebuy 3 shares of DJT it would cost 150 dollars and your broker is worried and now demands you put in another 100 dollars or they will rebuy the shares automatically with the money in your account and close out your position. Another thing about shorts is your broker will probably require you to have a certain amount invested anyway to even be able to open a short.

If you are willing to only put 100 dollars on this bet you should just buy those put options above. If you want me to explain how a put goes here is how it works.

For that 2.5 dollar strike put you are paying 40 cents. The put will expire in January 2025. You are free to exercise this put whenever you want but it is almost always better to just sell the option to someone else. Anyway this put option gives you the OPTION to sell a share of DJT for 2.5 dollars whenever you want from now till January 2025. Right now you can buy DJT for 35 dollars which means you would lose 32.5 dollars doing so as you would pay 35 dollars to buy a share and sell it for only 2.5. However if it falls to 0 which is basically what this option is betting on you can buy a share of DJT for well 0 dollars and sell it for 2.5 dollars.


To be specific one thing to note about all option contracts is they are multiplied by 100 so you are actually paying 40 dollars for the right to sell 100 shares of DJT at 2.5 dollars. If you have any further questions feel free to ask me.  So if you buy 2 of these contracts for 80 dollars you could then sell 200 shares of DJT for 500 dollars if DJT becomes 0 dollar and therefore profit 420 dollars. The absolute worst case scenario here is that you lose your 80 dollars if DJT doesn't reach 2.5 or lower by January of 2025.
Logged
Crumpets
Thinking Crumpets Crumpet
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,733
United States


Political Matrix
E: -4.06, S: -6.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2024, 09:09:24 PM »

r/Superstonk

(This is not financial advice.)
Logged
FT-02 Senator A.F.E. 🇵🇸🤝🇺🇸🤝🇺🇦
AverageFoodEnthusiast
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,323
Virgin Islands, U.S.


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2024, 10:00:38 PM »

GameStop (GME)
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,191
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2024, 03:59:41 AM »
« Edited: April 11, 2024, 06:32:17 AM by Antonio the Sixth »

Shorting is a bad f**king idea unless you're a professional stock trader and doing your full due diligence and have a lot of money to burn away if things go south. It might be a fun meme until it really, really isn't. I'd try to find a less risky way to own the cons if I were you.
It's not like I'd be putting in loads of money. Definitely wouldn't do anything higher than $100.

The thing with shorting is it doesn't matter how much you're putting down - your losses are potentially infinite because it involves a promise to buy the stock later at whatever price it might have at the time.

Do I think DJT stocks are gonna go up massively? Probably not, but with the amount of volatility inherent in that kind of "meme stock" I would not risk it.
Logged
lfromnj
Atlas Politician
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 19,381


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2024, 07:30:47 AM »
« Edited: April 10, 2024, 08:37:54 AM by lfromnj »

Shorting is a bad f**king idea unless you're a professional stock trader and doing your full due diligence and have a lot of money to burn away if things go south. It might be a fun meme until it really, really isn't. I'd try to find a less risky way to own the cons if I were you.
It's not like I'd be putting in loads of money. Definitely wouldn't do anything higher than $100.

The thing with shorting is it doesn't matter how much you're putting down - your losses are potentially infinite because it involves a promise to buy the stock later at whatever price it might have at the time.

Do I think DJT socks are gonna go up massively? Probably not, but with the amount of volatility inherent in that kind of "meme stock" I would not risk it.

Relatively rare . The broker would require a 100% maintenance margin for this stock to start with and if the stock spikes up as long as it doesn't double which isn't impossible the broker should rebuy the stocks to close out your position. They would still rebuy if it more than doubles within a day you would just have a deficit and I assume they could sue you for the remainder of the cash. In the  end it doesn't matter no broker is letting BRTD have a 100 dollar account for shorting
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,191
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #15 on: April 10, 2024, 01:34:14 PM »

Shorting is a bad f**king idea unless you're a professional stock trader and doing your full due diligence and have a lot of money to burn away if things go south. It might be a fun meme until it really, really isn't. I'd try to find a less risky way to own the cons if I were you.
It's not like I'd be putting in loads of money. Definitely wouldn't do anything higher than $100.

The thing with shorting is it doesn't matter how much you're putting down - your losses are potentially infinite because it involves a promise to buy the stock later at whatever price it might have at the time.

Do I think DJT socks are gonna go up massively? Probably not, but with the amount of volatility inherent in that kind of "meme stock" I would not risk it.

Relatively rare . The broker would require a 100% maintenance margin for this stock to start with and if the stock spikes up as long as it doesn't double which isn't impossible the broker should rebuy the stocks to close out your position. They would still rebuy if it more than doubles within a day you would just have a deficit and I assume they could sue you for the remainder of the cash. In the  end it doesn't matter no broker is letting BRTD have a 100 dollar account for shorting

Fair enough. Still, if things go poorly, you can still be liable for much more than what you originally intended to put in. I wouldn't want to take that risk without serious research.
Logged
Smash255
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,454


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2024, 09:03:10 AM »

Another idea, which I'm actually kicking myself for not doing is buying put options

Logged
Pages: [1]  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.061 seconds with 11 queries.