Resolution on the issue of Atlasian recognition of the USA [Failed]

[Ebowed]

Resolution on the issue of Atlasian recognition of the United States of America

Whereas, contrary to the official standpoint of the Atlasian government, the United States of America are still in existence, and still in possession of all the territories formerly in their possession,

1. The Government of Atlasia is urged to recognize de jure the United States of America, and the legality of the government of the United States of America.
2. The Government of Atlasia is urged to establish diplomatic relations with the United States of America.
3. The Government and the people of Atlasia are urged to frigging come to grips with the fact that Atlasia ain't no superpower, but is in fact a tiny US-shaped country with a population in the low three-digits.


Sponsor: Lewis Trondheim (prev.), The President pro tempore

[True Democrat]

Umm. . .what?

[The Man From G.O.P.]

I was of the understanding that Atlasia in many ways replaced the United States, I see this bill slightly conflicting with this idea.

[Colin]

I was of the understanding that Atlasia in many ways replaced the United States, I see this bill slightly conflicting with this idea.

Well it basically changes our role in the world from replacing the United States to become just another, albeit very small, part of a community of nations that includes the United States. I can see what Lewis is trying to do here in that, the way we've been running things, its pretentious to say that even in a fantasy world we are a superpower and it would be better to project some sort of reality onto the Atlasian nation as a whole.

[The Man From G.O.P.]

I was of the understanding that Atlasia in many ways replaced the United States, I see this bill slightly conflicting with this idea.

Well it basically changes our role in the world from replacing the United States to become just another, albeit very small, part of a community of nations that includes the United States. I can see what Lewis is trying to do here in that, the way we've been running things, its pretentious to say that even in a fantasy world we are a superpower and it would be better to project some sort of reality onto the Atlasian nation as a whole.

Oh... I didn't mind being the Superpower, but I'd like to know what everyone thinks

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Having a degree of co-identification between Atlasia and America I think is useful.  Indeed, one of the things that I think impedes fresh blood from joining Atlasia is the degree to which it has diverged from America, even in areas where such divergence has been unintentional.  I cannot support the resolution.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I'll admit it was pretty amusing how Atlasia supposedly remained a superpower despite having an attempted coup or civil war after every election.

[minionofmidas]

Having a degree of co-identification between Atlasia and America I think is useful.  Indeed, one of the things that I think impedes fresh blood from joining Atlasia is the degree to which it has diverged from America, even in areas where such divergence has been unintentional.  I cannot support the resolution.

Well... we still have all the same states and everything. This resolution doesn't change anything about Atlasia's internal affairs ... what it does is basically explain why all the major international policy action of the years since the first Atlasian presidential elections have happened - and thence clarify that they have indeed happens, which is currently mostly unknown. We used to have presidential debates in Atlasia once upon a time - I think one of the reasons they've disappeared is because it became more or less impossible to ask realistic questions about anything other than Atlasian constitutional issues.
If anything, thence, it actually reduces the divergence between Atlasia and reality.

[DownWithTheLeft]

I plan to vote Aye because that way we could have quicker reactions to world events

[minionofmidas]

If anyone wants to introduce an amendment to strike the last bit about a "low three-digit population" ... that might make sense. There should be some npc Atlasians left.

[Јas]

Amendment:
That the words "with a population in the low three-digits" be stricken from section 3.

[Ebowed]

We are voting on the following:

Amendment:
That the words "with a population in the low three-digits" be stricken from section 3.

Aye

[Јas]

Aye

[Brandon H]

Aye

[The Man From G.O.P.]

Aye

[PBrunsel]

Aye

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Aye

[Colin]

Aye

[Ebowed]

The amendment passes.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I've been asked to testify on this issue by (former) Senator Trondheim. I will mainly be talking about my time as GM, but I will also mention some issues that arose when I was Secretary of State.

You must all have noticed that there has been no news from other countries for a very long time now (over a year maybe? more than just a few months at the very least). This isn't down to GM's being lazy or anything like that, but is the case for one reason and one reason only; decisions taken by Atlasian politicians and by GM's have meant that we are now too far removed from a realistic timeline (or real life events. Take your pick) to report on any non-Atlasian news without any such reports being nothing but worthless, and highly unrealistic, fantasy. It became impossible to create realistic foreign policy storylines, making it even harder for anyone to be an effective GM, resulting in the eventual abolition of that post.
To give some examples of quite how far removed we have become from reality (and plausibility), I remember being surprised to find out that, when I was Secretary of State, that the King of Nepal (who I had just publically criticised for his domestic repression) had, apparently, been already overthrown and killed.
More examples; the crisis in Darfur was, apparently, solved years ago. Maybe we "solved" the crisis in Iraq as well; I honestly can't remember, I honestly don't care and I suspect that that is the case for just about everyone else as well.
The lack of news from abroad is bad for more than just a flawed (and now dead) institution; it is bad for Atlasian Democracy and the game itself in ways that should be very obvious to you all.

I'm happy to answer any questions any of you might have.

[Brandon H]

So if this passes, where is Atlasia located? Or where is the real US located? (Who is between Canada and Mexico?) I do see the point that Atlasia has gone from a completely different direction than the US and that a GM can't guess the actions of 300 or so in response to our actions. But if we in Atlasia try to do something different from the US (like the Puerto Rico or Guam Statehood Acts), is someone going to say "No, you can't do that because it's too different from the real US." Would we have to undo many of the bills and other actions that have taken place over the last 3 years?

[minionofmidas]

So if this passes, where is Atlasia located? Or where is the real US located? (Who is between Canada and Mexico?)

The US.

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No, not at all. (Although we might have to accept some - by no means all - earlier foreign policy actions as fantasy.) Puerto Rico is a state of Atlasia, but not of the US. Etc.

So if this passes, where is Atlasia located?

Ah, good question. Suggestions welcome.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Why not just assume that there's some minature version of North America in the middle of the Atlantic or something? No more of a stretch than most of the other stuff we've gotten up to over the years.

[True Democrat]

If we're going to pass this, I say we include a provision about how all history made up by the GM is reset except for essential stuff.

Also, what about our budget?  Is our population the same as the United States?  Do we have the same revenue?  Expenditures?

[jokerman]

This bill is absurd, in my opinion, and would ruin any chance atlasia has of recovering by horrendously confusing economics and foreign policy.  We have always been the de facto United States, and should continue to be.