Gallup: Biden takes a big hit from Democrats after Israel events

[Pericles]

Israel used to be seen as vulnerable, surrounded by enemies and thought about with the then recent memory of the Holocaust in mind. That view doesn't resonate with young people now, there is a huge power imbalance between Israel and the Palestinian population. Their treatment of the Palestinians is obviously oppressive and an injustice that the free world should be ashamed to support. Hamas is the greater evil and terrorism is obviously appalling, but the Israeli response has also been criminal and being fully allied with that would not be a comfortable position.

[Open Source Intelligence]

Allow me to state the obvious and say that we're a year and a week away from the election and Israel-Gaza should be out of everyone's minds then. If it is still going, these net 11% that disapprove of him would need someone else to vote for or just stay home for it to affect Biden.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Israel used to be seen as vulnerable, surrounded by enemies and thought about with the then recent memory of the Holocaust in mind. That view doesn't resonate with young people now, there is a huge power imbalance between Israel and the Palestinian population. Their treatment of the Palestinians is obviously oppressive and an injustice that the free world should be ashamed to support. Hamas is the greater evil and terrorism is obviously appalling, but the Israeli response has also been criminal and being fully allied with that would not be a comfortable position.

The Palestinians and other nations in the region rejected peace over and over again so this is the consequence of that decision.

[Senator Incitatus]

Disgusting. These people could hand the White House to an unhinged criminal because Biden isn't an anti-Semite.

They could just vote for Dean Phillips.

[Ferguson97]

I fully believe that Biden's approval rating dropped among Democrats because of his response; however, I also fully believe that if had taken the position that these people wanted him to, that his approval rating would have dropped by an even larger amount.

[ηєω ƒяσηтιєя]

It's just one poll, so it's not the be-all-end-all. Also, Israel-Palestine is not the only hot-button topic happening recently, so the dip could also include other factors.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Americans don't want war or to pay for other people's wars. Biden has been seen as more hawkish than even Trump. Trump was smart to engage in military conflict in a targeted way(he was no dove) but avoid headline grabbing invasions and paying for your allies war efforts or even self defense. I'm only talking about Trump's optics on foreign policy and not how disastrous he actually was.

 We are moving towards austerity talk and Americans already feel like they're being nickel and dimed to death in their everyday lives. Hearing about tens of billions of dollars of spending bills here and there for Ukraine and Israel is not popular and will only get less popular as U.S. politicians start to talk about spending cuts and government shutdowns at home. Can't claim brokenness when you got hundreds of billions of dollars of corporate welfare for people to buy weapons.

Trump didn’t engage in a smart way, the press just didn’t talk about his foreign policy because they were too busy with his domestic scandals crap

[OSR stands with Israel]

Americans don't want war or to pay for other people's wars. Biden has been seen as more hawkish than even Trump. Trump was smart to engage in military conflict in a targeted way(he was no dove) but avoid headline grabbing invasions and paying for your allies war efforts or even self defense. I'm only talking about Trump's optics on foreign policy and not how disastrous he actually was.

 We are moving towards austerity talk and Americans already feel like they're being nickel and dimed to death in their everyday lives. Hearing about tens of billions of dollars of spending bills here and there for Ukraine and Israel is not popular and will only get less popular as U.S. politicians start to talk about spending cuts and government shutdowns at home. Can't claim brokenness when you got hundreds of billions of dollars of corporate welfare for people to buy weapons.

Trump didn’t engage in a smart way, the press just didn’t talk about his foreign policy because they were too busy with his domestic scandals crap

His FP was still better than Bush’s or Obama’s which yes is a low bar but seemed good compared to anything else we have had this century

[Progressive Pessimist]

I fully believe that Biden's approval rating dropped among Democrats because of his response; however, I also fully believe that if had taken the position that these people wanted him to, that his approval rating would have dropped by an even larger amount.

Not only that, but the Republican alternative doesn't give any f***s about Gaza/Palestinian interests. I wish they would realize that.

[Tekken_Guy]

It's just one poll, so it's not the be-all-end-all. Also, Israel-Palestine is not the only hot-button topic happening recently, so the dip could also include other factors.

This is true. It could be an outlier rather than a sustained trend that could reverse itself by December, and other factors could play a role too like the economy and age concerns.

I fully believe that Biden's approval rating dropped among Democrats because of his response; however, I also fully believe that if had taken the position that these people wanted him to, that his approval rating would have dropped by an even larger amount.

I don’t believe it’s mainly because of Israel and I think it’s a mixture of various events, and an outlier.

[ملكة كرينجيتوك]

Israel used to be seen as vulnerable, surrounded by enemies and thought about with the then recent memory of the Holocaust in mind. That view doesn't resonate with young people now, there is a huge power imbalance between Israel and the Palestinian population. Their treatment of the Palestinians is obviously oppressive and an injustice that the free world should be ashamed to support. Hamas is the greater evil and terrorism is obviously appalling, but the Israeli response has also been criminal and being fully allied with that would not be a comfortable position.

I regret that I have but one Recommend to give. There are very good reasons why public opinion among my personal social media feed is one-sidedly sympathetic to Palestine and Palestinians.

That being said, the decolonization narrative is false and dangerous. It (falsely IMO) paints Jewish Israelis as “white” and Arab Palestinians as “POC”, the basis of which gets into really murky “race science” logic among other things. Too lazy to find the actual Atlantic piece so here: https://www.instagram.com/p/Cy65O1dMkCi/?

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

I hate this country.

[Jingizu]

Wasn’t sure where to put this, and I didn’t want to clog up the board with yet another thread:

https://twitter.com/aghamilton29/status/1718033920325779627?s=46&t=vBNt1YgD3...

When Bernie Sanders gets attacked for daring to memorialize the five-year anniversary of the Tree of Life Synagogue massacre - committed by an alt-rightist, remember? - by the far left, something is very wrong. This is on the level of those pr!cks who are tearing down posters of missing Jewish children. One can oppose what Israel is doing, one can demonstrate and wave Palestinian flags, one can even say “Free Palestine”, and none of that necessarily is antisemitic. But there’s a contingent on the far left which is going far beyond that, into celebrating the kidnapping, rape, torture, and murder of innocents as long as they’re Jews. There are a fair number of people - including on this forum! - who need to take a hard look into the mirror and see what they’ve become.

[7,052,770]

^^ As always, I'll point out that there's no reason to believe most of those Tweets are real, sincere posts from actual Americans. Even less reason since Elon wrecked the site.

[PSOL]

I fully believe that Biden's approval rating dropped among Democrats because of his response; however, I also fully believe that if had taken the position that these people wanted him to, that his approval rating would have dropped by an even larger amount.

These people were asking was to condemn the anti-Arab/Muslim wave happening across the United States.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

^^ As always, I'll point out that there's no reason to believe most of those Tweets are real, sincere posts from actual Americans. Even less reason since Elon wrecked the site.

Quite a few are from well-documented activists or struggling Hollywood screenwriters, so it's likely a mix.

[Red Velvet]

Clueless party decides to kill their electoral chances for the sake of a country in the other side of the world because they have no contact or dialogue with their base.

OR

Pragmatic party decides to stick a fork on their electoral chances for the sake of a country in the other side of the world because they already expect to lose anyway.

? I really am not sure which is it. It’s always hard for me to tell whether the Democratic Party does dumb stuff on purpose or if they never really understand what they’re doing.

[Red Velvet]

One thing is very clear to everyone throughout the globe though, the US government is an institution that acts thinking of their self-interests instead of following some consistent moral guideline. The inconsistencies in their Palestine/Israel positions when compared with Ukraine/Russia have now been exposed for even the average NPC to see, which is what is causing this drop in support.

Rules of game theory tell that you make the biggest gains being a hawk while stimulating others to be doves, which is why they need to sell this propaganda of fighters for morals and democracy - in order to set an example that doesn’t exist in the world that others will be driven to follow it - even if they don’t do it themselves. That way they convince everyone to be do “doves” while they act like “hawks” for maximum self-gain.

So you had this entire group of people who for a year consumed media telling them that the positioning on Ukraine was for the sake of “Freedom”; “Democracy”; “Land Protection” or “Self-Determination” and that these principles should be stimulated and valued.

Only for after this year the same places that sent them this message to throw it all out of the window and tell them the opposite moral message because it suits them better in the case of Israel/Palestine. Problem is, you cannot really brainwash people so radically in such a short amount of time.

These teenagers and idealistic youngsters who have a very negative of both Israel and Russia for their “agressor” larger power status in their respective conflicts were previously validated in the very principles they were led to believe in and power establishments not following what they already defended only brings more dissatisfaction with them instead of people simply changing their opinions again for the sake of self-interest.

A lot of them do it automatically of course, but not all. So it’s expected that government base support would go down a lot with that electorate segment that is Pro-Ukraine and Pro-Palestine because of their incorrect expectations of their government positions. They bought a moral propaganda that isn’t converting itself to reality.

[OSR stands with Israel]

One thing is very clear to everyone throughout the globe though, the US government is an institution that acts thinking of their self-interests instead of following some consistent moral guideline. The inconsistencies in their Palestine/Israel positions when compared with Ukraine/Russia have now been exposed for even the average NPC to see, which is what is causing this drop in support.

Rules of game theory tell that you make the biggest gains being a hawk while stimulating others to be doves, which is why they need to sell this propaganda of fighters for morals and democracy - in order to set an example that doesn’t exist in the world that others will be driven to follow it - even if they don’t do it themselves. That way they convince everyone to be do “doves” while they act like “hawks” for maximum self-gain.

So you had this entire group of people who for a year consumed media telling them that the positioning on Ukraine was for the sake of “Freedom”; “Democracy”; “Land Protection” or “Self-Determination” and that these principles should be stimulated and valued.

Only for after this year the same places that sent them this message to throw it all out of the window and tell them the opposite moral message because it suits them better in the case of Israel/Palestine. Problem is, you cannot really brainwash people so radically in such a short amount of time.

These teenagers and idealistic youngsters who have a very negative of both Israel and Russia for their “agressor” larger power status in their respective conflicts were previously validated in the very principles they were led to believe in and power establishments not following what they already defended only brings more dissatisfaction with them instead of people simply changing their opinions again for the sake of self-interest.

A lot of them do it automatically of course, but not all. So it’s expected that government base support would go down a lot with that electorate segment that is Pro-Ukraine and Pro-Palestine because of their incorrect expectations of their government positions. They bought a moral propaganda that isn’t converting itself to reality.

It is actually completely laughable to compare Israel to Russia

[Jingizu]

Don’t you have a Roger Waters concert to go to and scream about dirty k***s RV? 

Maybe he’ll ask attendees to ‘throw their hands in the air’ - well, one hand, anyway.

[7,052,770]

Israel is the Ukraine of this conflict and Hamas is the Russia. None of those 4 parties would disagree with that statement, so why should random people on the Internet?

[Horus]

Israel is the Ukraine of this conflict and Hamas is the Russia. None of those 4 parties would disagree with that statement, so why should random people on the Internet?

They do not line up that neatly, and there are parallels between Ukraine and Palestine. Ukraine vs. Russia is about the most obvious example of a good vs. evil war we've had in a long time. Meanwhile the Israeli government and Hamas have both done terrible things. It's nowhere near that simple.

[Hindsight was 2020]

I’m suspecting that RV had a girlfriend who left him for a Ukrainian because his irrational hatred for Ukraine and reflexive need to dunk on its supporters is getting to Jackson Hinkle levels of weird

[7,052,770]

Israel is the Ukraine of this conflict and Hamas is the Russia. None of those 4 parties would disagree with that statement, so why should random people on the Internet?

They do not line up that neatly, and there are parallels between Ukraine and Palestine. Ukraine vs. Russia is about the most obvious example of a good vs. evil war we've had in a long time. Meanwhile the Israeli government and Hamas have both done terrible things. It's nowhere near that simple.

The governments and people of Russia, Ukraine, Israel, and Palestine overwhelmingly agree with me and disagree with you, so I'll believe them.

[Horus]

Israel is the Ukraine of this conflict and Hamas is the Russia. None of those 4 parties would disagree with that statement, so why should random people on the Internet?

They do not line up that neatly, and there are parallels between Ukraine and Palestine. Ukraine vs. Russia is about the most obvious example of a good vs. evil war we've had in a long time. Meanwhile the Israeli government and Hamas have both done terrible things. It's nowhere near that simple.

The governments and people of Russia, Ukraine, Israel, and Palestine overwhelmingly agree with me and disagree with you, so I'll believe them.

Ukraine abstained on the ceasefire resolution at the UN. Maybe Zelensky is finally seeing what bad "allies" they've been.