Historic Protestant Traditions by Specific US Denomination
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
April 28, 2024, 08:02:33 PM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Discussion
  Religion & Philosophy (Moderator: Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.)
  Historic Protestant Traditions by Specific US Denomination
« previous next »
Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Historic Protestant Traditions by Specific US Denomination  (Read 1276 times)
RINO Tom
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,016
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -0.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: October 18, 2023, 12:55:40 PM »

I thought it would be interesting to look at how various historic Protestant traditions break down by specific denomination in the United States.  Unfortunately many churches did not report adherents in the 2020 ASARB data, so I was forced to go by number of congregations instead.  Also, just to keep it simple I chose the Protestant groups represented in the "Seven Sisters of American Protestantism" because I knew they all had multiple denominations.  They are Lutherans, Anglicans/Episcopalians, Presbyterians, Congregationalists, Methodists, Baptists and Restorationists.  I included every church that got at least 2.0% for that tradition.

Also, just for fun I put my own SUBJECTIVE categorization of each denomination into these (again - subjective!) categories:
- Mainline Protestant
- Evangelical Protestant
- Historically Black Protestant

LUTHERAN
49.6% Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA)
33.0% Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod (LCMS)

6.7% Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod (WELS)
4.3% Lutheran Congregations in Mission for Christ (LCMC)
2.5% North American Lutheran Church (NALC)

3.9% Other


ANGLICAN/EPISCOPALIAN
83.0% Episcopal Church
11.4% Anglican Church in North America (ACNA)

5.6% Other

PRESBYTERIAN
66.6% Presbyterian Church (USA) (PC(USA))
14.1% Presbyterian Church in America (PCA)
4.7% Evangelical Presbyterian Church (EPC)
4.6% Cumberland Presbyterian Church
3.1% ECO: A Covenant Order of Evangelical Presbyterians
2.5% Orthodox Presbyterian Church (OPC)
4.4% Other

CONGREGATIONALIST
85.7% United Church of Christ (UCC)
5.8% National Association of Congregational Christian Churches (NACCC)

5.6% Conservative Congregational Christian Conference (CCCC)
3.0% Other

METHODIST
80.7% United Methodist Church (UMC)
9.9% African Methodist Episcopal Church (AMEC)
4.3% Christian Methodist Episcopal Church (CME)

0.9% Other

BAPTIST
68.3% Southern Baptist Convention (SBC)
10.1% National Missionary Baptist Convention of America, Inc. (NBCA)
6.4% American Baptist Churches in the USA
3.4% National Baptist Convention USA, Inc. (NBC)
2.6% National Association of Free Will Baptists (NAFWB)
9.3% Other

I might continue to try to look at this stuff for other Protestant traditions (e.g., Holiness, Pentecostal, Continental Reformed, etc.) and even how various Orthodox traditions break out, but unfortunately I have to input the categorizations (beyond the specific denomination name) myself.
Logged
Skill and Chance
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 12,652
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2023, 02:53:03 PM »

I thought it would be interesting to look at how various historic Protestant traditions break down by specific denomination in the United States.  Unfortunately many churches did not report adherents in the 2020 ASARB data, so I was forced to go by number of congregations instead.  Also, just to keep it simple I chose the Protestant groups represented in the "Seven Sisters of American Protestantism" because I knew they all had multiple denominations.  They are Lutherans, Anglicans/Episcopalians, Presbyterians, Congregationalists, Methodists, Baptists and Restorationists.  I included every church that got at least 2.0% for that tradition.

Also, just for fun I put my own SUBJECTIVE categorization of each denomination into these (again - subjective!) categories:
- Mainline Protestant
- Evangelical Protestant
- Historically Black Protestant

LUTHERAN
49.6% Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA)
33.0% Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod (LCMS)

6.7% Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod (WELS)
4.3% Lutheran Congregations in Mission for Christ (LCMC)
2.5% North American Lutheran Church (NALC)

3.9% Other


ANGLICAN/EPISCOPALIAN
83.0% Episcopal Church
11.4% Anglican Church in North America (ACNA)

5.6% Other

PRESBYTERIAN
66.6% Presbyterian Church (USA) (PC(USA))
14.1% Presbyterian Church in America (PCA)
4.7% Evangelical Presbyterian Church (EPC)
4.6% Cumberland Presbyterian Church
3.1% ECO: A Covenant Order of Evangelical Presbyterians
2.5% Orthodox Presbyterian Church (OPC)
4.4% Other

CONGREGATIONALIST
85.7% United Church of Christ (UCC)
5.8% National Association of Congregational Christian Churches (NACCC)

5.6% Conservative Congregational Christian Conference (CCCC)
3.0% Other

METHODIST
80.7% United Methodist Church (UMC)
9.9% African Methodist Episcopal Church (AMEC)
4.3% Christian Methodist Episcopal Church (CME)

0.9% Other

BAPTIST
68.3% Southern Baptist Convention (SBC)
10.1% National Missionary Baptist Convention of America, Inc. (NBCA)
6.4% American Baptist Churches in the USA
3.4% National Baptist Convention USA, Inc. (NBC)
2.6% National Association of Free Will Baptists (NAFWB)
9.3% Other

I might continue to try to look at this stuff for other Protestant traditions (e.g., Holiness, Pentecostal, Continental Reformed, etc.) and even how various Orthodox traditions break out, but unfortunately I have to input the categorizations (beyond the specific denomination name) myself.

My first observation is that the conservative Lutherans are actually much stronger than you would expect.  All of the other denominations roughly follow the 80/20 rule. 

Free Will Baptists are also fascinating.  On the one hand, their numbers appear to be tiny.  On the other hand, a ton of the post-WWII non-denominational churches are approximately Free Will Baptist in their theology without officially declaring it.
Logged
RINO Tom
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,016
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -0.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2023, 03:10:56 PM »

^ Yep, definitely agreed.  The Youtuber Redeemed Zoomer calls Non-Denominational Christians "Baptists with a smoke machine" (or Baptists with a lowercase "b"), and I definitely agree with him ... the inevitable conclusion of Baptist theology is a thousand different specific denominations and eventually denominations that swear they are "not actually a denomination," lol.

As for Lutherans, I think part of it is that the churches with heritage related to the LCMS are actually quite old, but they never tried to merge together with the denominations that would eventually become the ELCA.  So whereas with Presbyterians you had the vast majority in the PC(USA) and there was therefore a "market" for a conservative offshoot like the PCA in the mid-Twentieth Century, the LCMS has stood rather stably as the conservative-yet-historic alternative to the more theologically liberal churches.

I'm a Lutheran so I know less about the other denominations, but I think Lutherans and Anglicans are really the only Protestant denominations where you would not have to choose between being theologically conservative and being highly traditional/historic/liturgical.  It seems in other traditions, the Mainline church is traditional and theologically liberal, and the evangelical offshoots are less traditional (partly because the Mainline one kept all of the actually pretty buildings and partly because all evangelical offshoots start to sound more Baptist over time...) and more theologically conservative.  Of the major Lutheran denominations I am aware of, the only one I would for sure call evangelical is WELS.
Logged
LabourJersey
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 3,188
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2023, 07:31:21 PM »

This is extremely interesting, thank you.

The biggest surprise to me is the Presbyterians. I would have thought the gap between PCUSA and PCA was much closer, for some reason (as in I thought a bigger percentage were PCA).
Logged
RINO Tom
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,016
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -0.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2023, 10:44:24 AM »

This is extremely interesting, thank you.

The biggest surprise to me is the Presbyterians. I would have thought the gap between PCUSA and PCA was much closer, for some reason (as in I thought a bigger percentage were PCA).

This surprised me, as well.  The PCA has been around a decently long time (separated from the predecessor of the PC(USA) in 1973), and I would have thought it would be bigger.  I confess that I know next to nothing about this, but I imagine the timeline of just how liberal each Mainline church got matters a lot.  For example, it is my perception that the ELCA was much more liberal at a much earlier time than the UMC, so that delayed more conservative Methodist offshoots.
Logged
Del Tachi
Republican95
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,839
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.52, S: 1.46

P P P

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2023, 03:34:30 PM »

No love for the Restorationists, Tom?

RESTORATIONIST
44.5% Churches of Christ
43.1% Christian Churches and churches of Christ
12.4% Disciples of Christ

Logged
Skill and Chance
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 12,652
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2023, 04:21:34 PM »

No love for the Restorationists, Tom?

RESTORATIONIST
44.5% Churches of Christ
43.1% Christian Churches and churches of Christ
12.4% Disciples of Christ



Wouldn't Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses, and arguably even Mormons also be restorationists?
Logged
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,033
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2023, 04:32:08 PM »

No love for the Restorationists, Tom?

RESTORATIONIST
44.5% Churches of Christ
43.1% Christian Churches and churches of Christ
12.4% Disciples of Christ



Wouldn't Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses, and arguably even Mormons also be restorationists?
No, Restorationist in this context clearly refers to descended from the Stone–Campbell Movement.
Logged
Del Tachi
Republican95
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,839
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.52, S: 1.46

P P P

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2023, 04:36:17 PM »

No love for the Restorationists, Tom?

RESTORATIONIST
44.5% Churches of Christ
43.1% Christian Churches and churches of Christ
12.4% Disciples of Christ



Wouldn't Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses, and arguably even Mormons also be restorationists?

Restorationist has dual meanings.  In this sense it means the American Restoration Movement, or "Campbellism", and is not related to groups like the LDS or Jehovah's Witness. 
Logged
RINO Tom
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,016
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -0.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2023, 08:54:06 PM »

No love for the Restorationists, Tom?

RESTORATIONIST
44.5% Churches of Christ
43.1% Christian Churches and churches of Christ
12.4% Disciples of Christ



I actually just lost track and hit post too early!  I even called out the “Seven Sisters” and only posted six, lol.  Thanks for posting.

EDIT: Even as I have become interested in theology and done a lot of research … I’m still not sure I understand the differences between the first two!
Logged
Del Tachi
Republican95
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,839
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.52, S: 1.46

P P P

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2023, 12:21:23 PM »

No love for the Restorationists, Tom?

RESTORATIONIST
44.5% Churches of Christ
43.1% Christian Churches and churches of Christ
12.4% Disciples of Christ



I actually just lost track and hit post too early!  I even called out the “Seven Sisters” and only posted six, lol.  Thanks for posting.

EDIT: Even as I have become interested in theology and done a lot of research … I’m still not sure I understand the differences between the first two!

Each of these three groups trace their heritage to the unified Stone-Campbell movement of the 1830s.  After the Civil War, divisions began to arise over various issues, especially the establishment of missionary societies and the use of instrumental music in worship services.  By 1906, the movement had primarily split into two groups, the Disciples of Christ and the Churches of Christ, the latter of which mostly rejected instrumental worship and the sponsorship of institutions (i.e., bible colleges, missionary societies, etc.) 

Both groups were still fully congregational, but the 20th century saw the more institutionally-focused Disciples of Christ move toward a more liberal theology.  Conservatives reacted by organizing through groups like the North American Christian Convention, which met annually from 1951 and 2018.  By the 1960s, the rift had grown to the point where both sides were pushing for a reorganization, which came officially in 1968.  Liberal churches within the Disciples of Christ officially restructured under a denominational structure, while conservatives left to remain non-denominational (i.e., "the Christian Churches.")

In many places, the Christian Churches eventually folded back into the (non-instrumental) Churches of Christ.  But those that remained separate are still distinguished by their practice of instrumental worship.  From what I can know, the non-instrumental branch is dominant in the South while the instrumental branch is more heavily focused in the Midwest.  However, there are some areas where both groups are still relevant as seperate entities (i.e., Tennessee and Kentucky.)  I remember my grandma's small town (of 300 people!) having both an instrumental and non-instrumental Church of Christ literally on the same block, LOL.  One really only now sees the Disciples of Christ in cities/suburbs.
Logged
RINO Tom
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 17,016
United States


Political Matrix
E: 2.45, S: -0.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2023, 02:59:38 PM »

The more I thought about this stuff (and got more interested in it), I really wish Christianity were divided up like this by academics ... I think it makes way more sense.

Catholic: Needs no explanation.

Eastern Orthodox: Needs no explanation.

Protestant: Much more narrowly applied to denominations that came out of the Magisterial Reformation.  These are categorized by the traditions that pushed for a reformation of the Catholic church - NOT a revolution.  Lutheran, Reformed/Calvinist (Presbyterian, Congregationalist, Continental Reformed, etc.), Anglican/Episcopalian and Methodist (by virtue of having merely reformed Anglicanism and not revolutionizing mainstream Protestant beliefs).  You could then sub-divide these groups between "Mainline" and "Confessional."

Restorationist: A broad and very subjective grouping, but all of these groups are categorized by a tendency to "start over" as far as church tradition goes, at least in some aspects.  This can go from groups that pushed for minor changes to church tradition (e.g., rejecting infant baptism but keeping most core Protestant beliefs) all the way to ones that changed quite a bit (e.g., the Stone-Campbell Restorationists rejecting very mainstream creeds).  Baptist, Anabaptist, Pentecostal, Holiness, Non-Denominational, etc.  While these groups are all considered Protestant today, they all had some aspect of "throwing the baby out with the bath water" in a way that the Protestants listed above did not.  I know Pentecostals branch from the Methodists and Baptists arguably branch out of Anglicanism, but they both rejected fundamental aspects of mainstream Protestantism so as to deserve a new categorization, IMO.  However, this label stops short of any Non-Trinitarian groups.

Non-Trinitarian: Pretty much a catch-all for any groups that reject something as essential and unifying (i.e., Catholics, Orthodox and Protestants all agree on it) as the Trinity for being considered part of mainstream Christianity.

TL;DR ... This is not meant to be "gatekeeping" the label Protestant, but I think it would be far more useful and interesting to have a tighter definition of Protestant that only refers to the groups that are more confessional (at least historically) and did not want to change too much about Catholicism.  What got me thinking about this is when I saw some online Baptists maintaining adamantly that they descended from English Puritans, even though theologically - everything from baptism to a low view of the sacraments - they ran full speed ahead toward Anabaptist beliefs and put themselves so far outside the beliefs of the other major Protestant groups.  And, you could argue that groups like the Holiness movement, Pentecostals and the Restorationists really just kind of adopted a Baptist view of sacraments and church authority and added their own twists to it.

Logged
100% pro-life no matter what
ExtremeRepublican
Moderators
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 11,718


Political Matrix
E: 7.35, S: 5.57


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2023, 09:51:58 PM »

The more I thought about this stuff (and got more interested in it), I really wish Christianity were divided up like this by academics ... I think it makes way more sense.

Catholic: Needs no explanation.

Eastern Orthodox: Needs no explanation.

Protestant: Much more narrowly applied to denominations that came out of the Magisterial Reformation.  These are categorized by the traditions that pushed for a reformation of the Catholic church - NOT a revolution.  Lutheran, Reformed/Calvinist (Presbyterian, Congregationalist, Continental Reformed, etc.), Anglican/Episcopalian and Methodist (by virtue of having merely reformed Anglicanism and not revolutionizing mainstream Protestant beliefs).  You could then sub-divide these groups between "Mainline" and "Confessional."

Restorationist: A broad and very subjective grouping, but all of these groups are categorized by a tendency to "start over" as far as church tradition goes, at least in some aspects.  This can go from groups that pushed for minor changes to church tradition (e.g., rejecting infant baptism but keeping most core Protestant beliefs) all the way to ones that changed quite a bit (e.g., the Stone-Campbell Restorationists rejecting very mainstream creeds).  Baptist, Anabaptist, Pentecostal, Holiness, Non-Denominational, etc.  While these groups are all considered Protestant today, they all had some aspect of "throwing the baby out with the bath water" in a way that the Protestants listed above did not.  I know Pentecostals branch from the Methodists and Baptists arguably branch out of Anglicanism, but they both rejected fundamental aspects of mainstream Protestantism so as to deserve a new categorization, IMO.  However, this label stops short of any Non-Trinitarian groups.

Non-Trinitarian: Pretty much a catch-all for any groups that reject something as essential and unifying (i.e., Catholics, Orthodox and Protestants all agree on it) as the Trinity for being considered part of mainstream Christianity.

TL;DR ... This is not meant to be "gatekeeping" the label Protestant, but I think it would be far more useful and interesting to have a tighter definition of Protestant that only refers to the groups that are more confessional (at least historically) and did not want to change too much about Catholicism.  What got me thinking about this is when I saw some online Baptists maintaining adamantly that they descended from English Puritans, even though theologically - everything from baptism to a low view of the sacraments - they ran full speed ahead toward Anabaptist beliefs and put themselves so far outside the beliefs of the other major Protestant groups.  And, you could argue that groups like the Holiness movement, Pentecostals and the Restorationists really just kind of adopted a Baptist view of sacraments and church authority and added their own twists to it.



I don't fully agree with this breakdown, but I think the grouping of Baptists and Pentecostals is kind of interesting.  The two traditions have very different views on things like the theology of the Holy Spirit.  But, then, the churches that are rapidly becoming the main evangelical churches could almost be described as "Bapticostal".  They take their shared understanding of a lack of liturgy, credobaptism, and similar views of Salvation; but, then, a lot of these churches have an understanding of the Holy Spirit in the middle of the old-school Baptist churches and Pentecostal ones.  Many would call themselves "continuationist" but reject being "charismatic".  An example would be that they would affirm the existence of tongues today but reject the Pentecostal belief that they are the primary evidence for having the Holy Spirit (instead believing that God gives different gifts to different people and that none is superior to another). 

Some of these sorts of churches might even technically be affiliated with the SBC, but they usually don't include "Baptist" in their names.  Others might be non-Denominational.  As an aside, a joke about non-Denominational churches has been that they are "Baptist with a cool website", but the reality is that their theology tends to be a half-step more charismatic than the average Baptist church- especially an old-school one like "First Baptist of Town Name".
Logged
Irenaeus of Smyrna
Rookie
**
Posts: 27
Sweden
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2024, 08:25:47 PM »

Great list i'm lutheran to. So will only comment that I think that Lutheran Congregations in Mission for Christ should be considered Evangelical as the split from the ECLA and have contemporary worship. Have a great day maybe include pentacostals as they have some Historically Black Protestan denoms.
Logged
Pages: [1]  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.055 seconds with 12 queries.