What is the best long term solution for Israel/Palestine ?

[Saint Milei]

Full citizenship to Palestinians and acknowledge Israel is the homeland of Jews and Arabs. The only way forward is assimilation between both ethnic groups under a new identity. Oh and defeat Hamas if it isn't obvious.

[pppolitics]

Full citizenship to Palestinians and acknowledge Israel is the homeland of Jews and Arabs. The only way forward is assimilation between both ethnic groups under a new identity. Oh and defeat Hamas if it isn't obvious.

...and henceforth they will be known as Palestijew

[WalterWhite]

Full citizenship to Palestinians and acknowledge Israel is the homeland of Jews and Arabs. The only way forward is assimilation between both ethnic groups under a new identity. Oh and defeat Hamas if it isn't obvious.

Religious differences are going to prevent Palestinians (who are mainly Muslim) and Israelis (who are mainly Jewish) from assimilating with each other completely.

[Hollywood]

Gaza becomes some sort of protectorate, I don't particularly care who administers it because literally anyone else will be better than Hamas.

Israel annexes the West Bank, granting full citizenship to all residents regardless of religion or ethnicity, and embarking on a program to deradicalize those Palestinians sympathetic to terrorist groups. Ideally within a decade most Palestinians can vote in elections, etc.

For the latter part, the only question is whether to just do it now to rip the bandaid off, or delay a decade or so to strengthen Israel's demographic cushion. Such a cushion is needed to ensure Israel can remain both Jewish and democratic after the annexation.

The status quo on the Temple Mount is also unacceptable, though understandable given the fraught circumstances. Any true solution needs to include an allowance for Jews to pray on the Mount - our holiest site -  on at least some fixed number of days each year.

A one and a half state solution, I guess. The West Bank is much less radicalized than Gaza and unlike Gaza I don't think annexing it would endanger Israel's Jewish and democratic character. Israel will need to pump a LOT of money into deradicalization, education, and workforce training for the West Bank Palestinians but that is worth it and far better than the current situation. But before this can happen the Palestinians (Hamas aside) will need to recognize that they've lost, they aren't getting a state, and it's time to look forward rather than backward.

I literally do not care what the path forward is for Gaza as long as whoever administers it next doesn't allow it to be a safe harbor for terrorism. And *anyone else* is better than Hamas.

There is no evidence that the Gaza population is more radicalised than the West Bank. Polling in these conditions is hard, but what evidence exists suggests that the two regions view things similarly or that the West Bank is a bit more radical.
https://pcpsr.org/en/node/938
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20230730-new-poll-shows-decline-in-support-for-two-state-solution-amongst-palestinians-israelis/
https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/what-do-palestinians-want

I think you might be correct.  The West Bank voted for the more moderate Fatah faction and the Gaza Strip elected the more radical Hamas Government.  However, Hamas ran on a reform platform.

Eventually, Fatah dismissed Hamas from the Coalition Government in 2006 or 2007, and Hamas continued to rule Gaza.  No election has been held in Gaza since that point.

[WalterWhite]

Handing over the region to me.

In other news...AverageFoodEnthusiast becomes the dictator of the areas once formerly known as Israel and Palestine. Their first act will be to replace every politician in the current Israeli and Palestinian governments with other food enthusiasts.

[pppolitics]

If the US decides to withhold aid to Israel until a solution is found, the solution will be found in no time.

[Saint Milei]

Full citizenship to Palestinians and acknowledge Israel is the homeland of Jews and Arabs. The only way forward is assimilation between both ethnic groups under a new identity. Oh and defeat Hamas if it isn't obvious.

Religious differences are going to prevent Palestinians (who are mainly Muslim) and Israelis (who are mainly Jewish) from assimilating with each other completely.

This is true, but it's the only solution. Full assimilation will never occur, but nothing perfect will happen there

[pppolitics]

The Two state solution is dead and has been dead for awhile. Similarly the idea of the Israelites and Palestinians living in peace and harmony is complexly unrealistic and would just turn this  religious' ethnic conflict into a serious of bloody Yugoslavia style   conflicts.

The "best" solution probably looks alot like what looks to be happening Azerbaijan and Armenia. One side "wins" in a quick/mostly bloodless way and the other relocates.

Population transfers did a lot to lower tension between Greece and Turkey. They are of course part of the reason Poland/ Germany aren't trying to regain Kaliningrad.

The issue of course comes in where do the Palestinians go. The Arab world for all their Pro-Palestine talk have refused to grant citizenship to any refugees, created by the wars they started.  Jordan makes the most sense.

The problems with the above of of course are clear, but I would argue the cycle of religious/ethnic slaughter is worse. It is sad that this is probably the best way forward but I honesty don't find the other proposals realistic.

The two-state solution is only dead because the United States became Israel's enabler.

If the United States puts its foot down and demand that it happens, the two-state solution is suddenly viable.

[It’s so Joever]

I used to look forward to a potential two-state solution in the future. Hamas just made it clear these past days that Gaza will not be playing a part in that. It seems thoroughly clear that a two state solution is no longer possible. If anyone has a genuine proposal for a genuinely independent state in the West Bank that would *not* be a permanent staging point for wanton attacks on Israeli civilians I would very much like to hear it!

UN sanctioned elections in West Bank along with some form of ceasefire agreement in exchange for EVERY single settlement within the 1967 borders as a starting point?
Not that leadership on either side would ever agree to such a thing, Bibi and Abbas both have far more to gain exploiting this conflict.

[It’s so Joever]

The Two state solution is dead and has been dead for awhile. Similarly the idea of the Israelites and Palestinians living in peace and harmony is complexly unrealistic and would just turn this  religious' ethnic conflict into a serious of bloody Yugoslavia style   conflicts.

The "best" solution probably looks alot like what looks to be happening Azerbaijan and Armenia. One side "wins" in a quick/mostly bloodless way and the other relocates.

Population transfers did a lot to lower tension between Greece and Turkey. They are of course part of the reason Poland/ Germany aren't trying to regain Kaliningrad.

The issue of course comes in where do the Palestinians go. The Arab world for all their Pro-Palestine talk have refused to grant citizenship to any refugees, created by the wars they started.  Jordan makes the most sense.

The problems with the above of of course are clear, but I would argue the cycle of religious/ethnic slaughter is worse. It is sad that this is probably the best way forward but I honesty don't find the other proposals realistic.

This is mass forced relocation but I agree that it’s the most likely outcome at this point. All of this was preventable and I will certainly remember the posters on here who cheered on the removal of 2 million people. Humanity never ceases to disappoint.

[Gass3268]

At this point there are no good, average, or even bad long term solutions. Anything that's going to be considered now will be horrific. Also what is a three state solution?

[WalterWhite]

At this point there are no good, average, or even bad long term solutions. Anything that's going to be considered now will be horrific. Also what is a three state solution?

Probably the West Bank, Israel, and the Gaza Strip being separate countries

[Unbeatable Titan Susan Collins]

The Two state solution is dead and has been dead for awhile. Similarly the idea of the Israelites and Palestinians living in peace and harmony is complexly unrealistic and would just turn this  religious' ethnic conflict into a serious of bloody Yugoslavia style   conflicts.

The "best" solution probably looks alot like what looks to be happening Azerbaijan and Armenia. One side "wins" in a quick/mostly bloodless way and the other relocates.

Population transfers did a lot to lower tension between Greece and Turkey. They are of course part of the reason Poland/ Germany aren't trying to regain Kaliningrad.

The issue of course comes in where do the Palestinians go. The Arab world for all their Pro-Palestine talk have refused to grant citizenship to any refugees, created by the wars they started.  Jordan makes the most sense.

The problems with the above of of course are clear, but I would argue the cycle of religious/ethnic slaughter is worse. It is sad that this is probably the best way forward but I honesty don't find the other proposals realistic.

The two-state solution is only dead because the United States became Israel's enabler.

If the United States puts its foot down and demand that it happens, the two-state solution is suddenly viable.

Palestine rejected the two state solution in the 40s, and the 90s.

The idea that you think the US can just snaps its fingers and make this go away so how unserious you are in this topic

[pppolitics]

The Two state solution is dead and has been dead for awhile. Similarly the idea of the Israelites and Palestinians living in peace and harmony is complexly unrealistic and would just turn this  religious' ethnic conflict into a serious of bloody Yugoslavia style   conflicts.

The "best" solution probably looks alot like what looks to be happening Azerbaijan and Armenia. One side "wins" in a quick/mostly bloodless way and the other relocates.

Population transfers did a lot to lower tension between Greece and Turkey. They are of course part of the reason Poland/ Germany aren't trying to regain Kaliningrad.

The issue of course comes in where do the Palestinians go. The Arab world for all their Pro-Palestine talk have refused to grant citizenship to any refugees, created by the wars they started.  Jordan makes the most sense.

The problems with the above of of course are clear, but I would argue the cycle of religious/ethnic slaughter is worse. It is sad that this is probably the best way forward but I honesty don't find the other proposals realistic.

The two-state solution is only dead because the United States became Israel's enabler.

If the United States puts its foot down and demand that it happens, the two-state solution is suddenly viable.

Palestine rejected the two state solution in the 40s, and the 90s.

The idea that you think the US can just snaps its fingers and make this go away so how unserious you are in this topic

Why would Israel do anything when the US continues to reward Israel for its bad behavior?

...and $3 billion a year is one hell of a reward

[Aurelius2]

At this point there are no good, average, or even bad long term solutions. Anything that's going to be considered now will be horrific. Also what is a three state solution?

The idea that Gaza becomes part of Egypt and the West Bank becomes part of Jordan. This will never happen because neither of those countries wants those respective parts of Palestine, and they would have to be defeated in a war to be induced to accept taking them over. Jordan is already under demographic pressure and Jordanians remember Black September very well, when in the early 1970s the PLO launched a war against the Jordanian state and sought to overthrow the monarchy. Egypt is run by a secular dictatorship which is already bursting under the strain of explosive population growth. The Muslim Brotherhood is a constant threat to their power, and the last thing they want is to take in 2 million poor, radicalized refugees who have strong sympathies with radical Islamist groups and are deeply committed to ideological struggles which would cause trouble with their neighbors. Israel seeking to pawn off Gaza and the West Bank on these countries would necessitate a broader regional war which would make the current conflict look like peanuts. And Egypt and Jordan, by Middle Eastern standards, are *allies* of Israel.

This scenario has received an uptick of attention the last couple days, as the insanity coming out of Gaza has made it more and more clear that the fortunes, and futures, of the two parts of the Palestinian territories are increasingly decoupled. The two-state solution is quite obviously dead at this point, in large part due to deep obstinacy of the Palestinian leadership during the pivotal decades of the '80s through the '00s, and people are trying to salvage the hope of something, anything, from the wreckage. I hope that this uptick will exhaust itself as people keep thinking deeper about it and realize that literally nobody wants this - Gaza in particular is a hot mess that Israel will have to find a way to deal with itself, without getting to foist it off on someone else. Some sort of internationally guaranteed, UN-backed protectorate is my dreamworld scenario but even that is extremely unlikely, and we all know the UN ain't good for crap.

[WalterWhite]

If a 2-state solution is off the table, a temporary 31-state solution might honestly be the next best solution. This solution will take time, but it might honestly be the one that minimizes deaths.

Phase I: 31-state solution

Abolish the current Israeli and Palestinian states. In their places, establish the following 31 countries, whose borders are based on either Israeli subdivisions or Palestinian governorates. In parentheses are the Israeli subdivisions or Palestinian governorates the country will control.

- Republic of West Jerusalem (Jerusalem District)
- Republic of East Jerusalem (Jerusalem Governorate)
- Republic of Safed (Safed Subdivision)
- Republic of Kinneret (Kinneret Subdivision)
- Republic of Jezreel (Jezreel Subdivision)
- Republic of Acre (Acre Subdivision)
- Republic of Haifa (Haifa Subdivision)
- Republic of Hadera (Hadera Subdivision)
- Republic of HaSharon (HaSharon Subdivision)
- Republic of Petah Tikva (Petah Tikva Subdivision)
- Republic of Ramla (Ramla Subdivision)
- Republic of Rehovot (Rehovot Subdivision)
- Republic of Tel Aviv (Tel Aviv Subdivision)
- Republic of Ashkelon (Ashkelon Subdivision)
- Republic of Beersheba (Beersheba Subdivision)
- Republic of Jenin (Jenin Governorate)
- Republic of Tubas (Tubas Governorate)
- Republic of Tulkarm (Tulkarm Governorate)
- Republic of Nablus (Nablus Governorate)
- Republic of Qalqilya (Qalqilya Governorate)
- Republic of Salfit (Salfit Governorate)
- Republic of Ramallah and al-Bireh (Ramallah and al-Bireh Governorate)
- Republic of Jericho (Jericho Governorate)
- Republic of Bethlehem (Bethlehem Governorate)
- Republic of Hebron (Hebron Governorate)
- Republic of North Gaza (North Gaza Governorate)
- Republic of Gaza (Gaza Governorate)
- Republic of Deir al-Balah (Deir al-Balah Governorate)
- Republic of Khan Yunis (Khan Yunis Governorate)
- Republic of Rafah (Rafah Governorate)

During this stage, the following measures will be taken to ensure the territorial integrity of the states:

- United Nations, American, Russian, Saudi, and Iranian soldiers will be initially stationed across the borders of these countries. Over time, these will be replaced by local soldiers.
- To ensure a foreign power, such as Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, or Egypt, does not try to annex any of these countries and gain an influence in the region, there will be significantly more soldiers stationed across the borders between these countries and outside countries.
- All 31 countries will be admitted into the United Nations.

Phase II: 30-state solution and initial referendum

After a period of time, begin the reunification process. At this stage, the Republics of West Jerusalem and East Jerusalem will be combined into the United Nations Protectorate of Jerusalem, bringing the total country county in the area from 31 to 30.

Afterwards, hold referenda in each country on the question of reunification. The ballot question should look something as follows:

With regards to the United Nations Protectorate of Jerusalem; and the Republics of Safed, Kinneret, Jezreel, Acre, Haifa, Hadera, HaSharon, Petah Tikva, Ramla, Rehvoot, Tel Aviv, Ashkelon, Beersheba, Jenin, Tubas, Tulkarm, Nablus, Qalqilya, Salfit, Ramallah and al-Bireh, Jericho, Bethlehem, Hebron, North Gaza, Gaza, Deir al-Balah, Khan Yunis, and Rafah: which of the following options do you support?
(1) Reunification of all countries into a single country
(2) Unification of the countries, except for the United Nations Protectorate of Jerusalem, into a Palestinian and an Israeli country
(3) Separation of all 30 countries

If Option (2) won, would you support your country joining a Palestinian country or an Israeli country? [NOT AVALIABLE FOR BALLOTS IN THE UNITED NATIONS PROTECTORATE OF JERUSALEM]
(a) Palestinian
(b) Israeli

If Option 1 wins the plurality of voters throughout the 30 countries, all 30 countries get admitted into a unified state as provinces.

If Option 2 wins the plurality of voters throughout the 30 countries, the countries that opted to join Palestine would join Palestine and the countries that opted to join Israel would join Israel. The United Nations Protectorate of Jerusalem would remain neutral.

If Option 3 wins the plurality of voters throughout the 30 countries, all 30 countries remain independent, and the United Nations Protectorate of Jerusalem would become the Republic of Jerusalem.

Phase III: Continued referenda

If Option 3 won the initial vote, referenda will keep being conducted indefinitely every 5 years until either Options 1 or 2 win the plurality of voters.

[Upper Canada Tory]

All countries should take a principled stance in favour of a two-state solution. No conflict is easy to solve and this one is no different, but it won't be solved by one side ruling over the other. Plenty of historical grievances in the Middle East that have snowballed over time. Maybe it's time to let go of the past and move on. The only thing that matters is today and what happens going forward.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Full citizenship to Palestinians and acknowledge Israel is the homeland of Jews and Arabs. The only way forward is assimilation between both ethnic groups under a new identity. Oh and defeat Hamas if it isn't obvious.

...and henceforth they will be known as Palestijew

Integralist Israel would be quite something.

[GMantis]

Occupied Palestinian Territory (OPT) has 4.5 million Palestinians living there.

Imagine if those Palestinians suddenly become citizens of Israel.

Non-Jews (Muslims or otherwise) would suddenly outnumber Jews, making Israel no longer a Jewish majority state.

What Israel wants is to annex OPT without giving citizenship to the Palestinians living there.

That would mean de jure apartheid or ethnic cleansing on a massive scale.

That is probably too distasteful for the US to accept otherwise Israel would do it.

The lunatics on here want it both ways, they want a Jewish majority state AND the land of the Palestinian people, they won’t tell you their dirty little secret on how to get both though…

Which is why I'm advocating full Israeli citizenship for West Bank Palestinians and a protectorate for Gaza...

Even giving citizenship to 2.7 million Palestinians in the West Bank would be enough to vote out the far-right government in power which is why it won't happen.

Israel must remain a majority Jewish nation

So leave the West Bank then, this is the best way to guarantee that Israel remains Jewish majority.

[CumbrianLefty]

Palestine rejected the two state solution in the 40s, and the 90s.

The idea that you think the US can just snaps its fingers and make this go away so how unserious you are in this topic

Israel has also done a great deal to make it an unviable prospect.

Anybody who pretends otherwise is a simple propagandist and not serious.

[Meclazine for Israel]

Israeli Dad's and Uncle's need to get armed up like a Montana Militia.

[H.E. VOLODYMYR ZELENKSYY]

The more pessimistic I get about what a one-state solution would look like, the less likely a two-state solution gets.

[Mr. Illini]

The more pessimistic I get about what a one-state solution would look like, the less likely a two-state solution gets.

Was just recently thinking this. It is unlikely to be resolved in my lifetime, and if it is, I actually fear what that resolution is.

[GALeftist]

Ultimately, a one-state solution seems like a pipe dream, but a two-state solution is almost certainly impossible at this point and a three-state solution is even more impossible. So I suppose one-state.

[gerritcole]

i doubt there will be a formal long term solution adopted, i believe it more likely that the existing status quo continues on until it is overturned (i don''t think this current conflict will escalate to that level)