Was the Virginia-GOP's decision to switch to a convention the smartest ever for a state party?
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  Was the Virginia-GOP's decision to switch to a convention the smartest ever for a state party?
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Author Topic: Was the Virginia-GOP's decision to switch to a convention the smartest ever for a state party?  (Read 707 times)
The Economy is Getting Worse
riverwalk3
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« on: September 07, 2023, 02:30:54 PM »

Prior to Youngkin, the party was in shambles. They just nominated Corey Stewart, a neo-Confederate, for the 2018 Senate race, losing it by 16.

Now, here's the state of the VA-GOP party:


They also seem to have not nominated insane candidates for their legislative districts, contrary to say, the AZ-GOP party.
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AMB1996
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« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2023, 04:51:52 PM »

I think we might see more state parties move toward a Virginia system, or at least a hybrid New Jersey style system where the party establishment has heavy input in the nomination process.
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Progressive Pessimist
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« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2023, 06:06:09 PM »

Probably, but what does it say about your party that you need to deprive your primary voters of their vote to nominate electable candidates in the first place?
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WalterWhite
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« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2023, 06:16:56 PM »
« Edited: September 07, 2023, 06:21:24 PM by WalterWhite »

This is just another instance of Republican Party elites trying to undermine democracy. As if the Brooks Brothers Riot, the January 6th Riot, Trump's scheme to overturn the 2020 Election, and the voter suppression measures Republican state governments are enacting across the country are not enough, you now have an entire state Republican Party blatantly reverting to an autocratic apparatus.

Plus, if your party has to revert to an unambiguously undemocratic autocracy just to win elections, what does that say about the platform of your party? It could perhaps mean that the voters to whom you most cater are not representative of the general population of your state.
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Vosem
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« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2023, 07:16:37 PM »

No, Republican conventions (including in Virginia) quite routinely return very unelectable candidates (the modern example coming to mind immediately is E.W. Jackson for Lieutenant Governor in 2013), and the general history of the convention system in the United States suggests that it's very capable of providing candidates much more extreme than the ones the primary system provides. Since McGovern-Fraser, we've had 13 presidential elections, 11 of which were decided by single-digits in the decisive state (and the two that weren't -- 1972 and 1984 -- saw contested conventions!). Before that, landslides were the norm; presumably they happened because one candidate or the other was unacceptable.

Under Youngkin, the firehouse primary has been widely adopted by the VAGOP, but I think it's provided better candidates than regular primaries mostly just because it uses ranked-choice. I don't think lower turnout necessarily provides better outcomes than higher turnout (consider nominations in notoriously suppressed-primary-turnout New York), and conventions often reward good rhetoricians, which was a relevant skill in 19th-century campaigning but just isn't something that helps you in the 21st.

(I think Youngkin has also gotten lucky in that the most prominent 'populist' VAGOP figure of the post-2018 period, Amanda Chase, has been singularly unsuccessful in connecting with the base; I think a habit of leaving the party and reentering it is not actually looked upon kindly by voters who think of themselves as loyalists. Youngkin is also advantaged by having been a nobody during the 2020 cycle.)
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Shaula🏳️‍⚧️
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« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2023, 07:17:36 PM »

I think we might see more state parties move toward a Virginia system, or at least a hybrid New Jersey style system where the party establishment has heavy input in the nomination process.
The Virginia system is way better than the NJ system.
In Virginia thr party activists have a say in who the nominee is, in NJ its just corrupt smoke-filled rooms of politicians who decide who the nominees are.
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AMB1996
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« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2023, 07:22:33 PM »

I think we might see more state parties move toward a Virginia system, or at least a hybrid New Jersey style system where the party establishment has heavy input in the nomination process.

The Virginia system is way better than the NJ system.
In Virginia thr party activists have a say in who the nominee is, in NJ its just corrupt smoke-filled rooms of politicians who decide who the nominees are.

In the New Jersey system, candidates are endorsed by a majority of the  democratically elected precinct delegates. The corruption in NJ stems mainly from the cost of entry into politics, but a competent, well-funded challenger can take over a county convention without much problem. This often happens under the radar because the elections are ultimately uncontested by the challenged party.

Reduce the cost of entry (media time) and New Jersey could have a healthy grassroots movement, as it did in both parties (but especially the Republican Party) during the era of local newspapers circa 1981–2009.
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mlee117379
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« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2023, 09:21:32 PM »

the modern example coming to mind immediately is E.W. Jackson for Lieutenant Governor in 2013

now that's a name I haven't heard in a while.

Also TIL that this guy is running for President, LOL: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._W._Jackson#2024_presidential_candidacy
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Vosem
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« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2023, 09:53:58 PM »

the modern example coming to mind immediately is E.W. Jackson for Lieutenant Governor in 2013

now that's a name I haven't heard in a while.

Also TIL that this guy is running for President, LOL: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._W._Jackson#2024_presidential_candidacy

I once met him IRL, actually; we have a mutual friend. He's a very compelling speaker and very entertaining to listen to, but, like, it does not strike me as strange at all that he totally failed to become a politician. He wouldn't have gotten anywhere near as far as he did if not for the convention system rewarding being a compelling speaker so much.
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JoeyJoeJoe
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« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2023, 10:18:00 PM »

It might have been a smart move, but probably not the smartest one ever, as the question asks.  There has to be a smarter decision by a state party at some point in American history.
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