NY: Trump on Trial!

[Ferguson97]

Time to see whether Americans who constantly say "no one is above the law" actually believe that.

Frankly I'm more interested in hearing from people like OSR who empathically believe that the president should be above the law.

[Ferguson97]

I don't believe people realize what will happen if Trump gets arrested.  A lot of his supporters feel they have nothing to lose.  Plus, Trump himself is going to fuel the fire.  This is going to get very ugly....  

You could probably do a better job hiding the fact that you’re rooting for this to happen.

[Ferguson97]

I don't believe people realize what will happen if Trump gets arrested.  A lot of his supporters feel they have nothing to lose.  Plus, Trump himself is going to fuel the fire.  This is going to get very ugly....  

You could probably do a better job hiding the fact that you’re rooting for this to happen.

It doesn’t change the fact that this would be breaking with precedent to charge a president(current or former) over something like this . We correctly didn’t charge Clinton over Perjury and Trump shoudnt be charged over this .

There are only two instances a president should have been charged post ww2 :

Nixon - If the Sabotage of the Vietnam Peace talks came out

Trump - Jan 6th

Both instances were a president or presidential candidate flagrantly violating the national security of our nation for their own political interest

But I don’t think Nixon should have been charged over watergate, Clinton over Perjury or Bush over Iraq/Gitmo

Genuinely would like to know how you think Watergate isn't a violation of this standard.

[Ferguson97]

Also how sad is it that not a single person here is arguing that Trump isn't guilty. All of the "don't indict" arguments are just people worried that his reaction will be so bad that he will incite terrorism. Like how far have we fallen as a nation?

[Ferguson97]

Also how sad is it that not a single person here is arguing that Trump isn't guilty. All of the "don't indict" arguments are just people worried that his reaction will be so bad that he will incite terrorism. Like how far have we fallen as a nation?

Seriously, one of the biggest grievances that people all around the world have is that politicians seem to be able to do whatever they want and rarely have to face legal consequences. The fact that a possible Trump indictment produces such terror and arguments about "precedent" or some such bullcrap is pretty messed up.

Cause you don’t want to set a precedent where each administration tries to go after the other because the fact is presidents operate under legally grey areas all the time when it comes to foreign policy . Do you really want to open that can of worms .

It’s why it should only be done in extremely flagrant cases like the two I mentioned

This is honestly more pathetic than just straight-up defending Trump.

[Ferguson97]

Also how sad is it that not a single person here is arguing that Trump isn't guilty. All of the "don't indict" arguments are just people worried that his reaction will be so bad that he will incite terrorism. Like how far have we fallen as a nation?

Seriously, one of the biggest grievances that people all around the world have is that politicians seem to be able to do whatever they want and rarely have to face legal consequences. The fact that a possible Trump indictment produces such terror and arguments about "precedent" or some such bullcrap is pretty messed up.

Cause you don’t want to set a precedent where each administration tries to go after the other because the fact is presidents operate under legally grey areas all the time when it comes to foreign policy . Do you really want to open that can of worms .

It’s why it should only be done in extremely flagrant cases like the two I mentioned

This is honestly more pathetic than just straight-up defending Trump.

That’s how we have done things for decades , otherwise both Clinton and Bush would have been prosecuted after they left office .

Thank god that they weren’t

Why do you want presidents to be held to a higher standard than the average person?

If you think they should only be prosecuted if their actions threaten national security, then you are necessarily saying that a president could strangle his wife in her sleep, and he shouldn't be prosecuted. That is the logical conclusion of your beliefs.

[Ferguson97]

But I don’t think Nixon should have been charged over watergate, Clinton over Perjury or Bush over Iraq/Gitmo

Sweet Christmas OSR. So just no rules for presidents? But rules for other politicians? (ostensibly)

This country truly does deify POTUS. Absolutely atrocious. The president is just another person who won an election. If they break the law, treat them like anyone else would be.

I’m just going if precedent of what we have pretty much always done and I gave 3 examples of where we decided not to prosecute a president even though there was a case to be made that you could have . Keep in mind I do think Trump should be prosecuted but over Jan 6th and the fake electoral scheme in GA.

Like people forget that Obama made this decision in 2009:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/aide-obama-wont-prosecute-bush-officials/

It  was the right decision imo

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

The President should not be above the law. They should be held to the same standard as anyone else.

[Ferguson97]

Yeah it’s not as simple as that . It’s easy to say this but reality is different than theory .

You know who agrees with me on this , Barack Obama

Obama was wrong.

[Ferguson97]

Yeah it’s not as simple as that . It’s easy to say this but reality is different than theory .

You know who agrees with me on this , Barack Obama

Obama was wrong.

I disagree as arresting Bush and Cheney would have not been good for our nation .

Do you think Ford was right to pardon Nixon?

[Ferguson97]

Yeah I don't know where he got Tuesday from anyway. They will probably give him a couple of days to surrender himself in NY.

I'd be really surprised if he turned himself in, despite what he says he'd love nothing more than a picture of himself in cuffs, so he can really sell the "martyr" angle.

[Ferguson97]

Yeah it’s not as simple as that . It’s easy to say this but reality is different than theory .

You know who agrees with me on this , Barack Obama

Obama was wrong.

I disagree as arresting Bush and Cheney would have not been good for our nation .

Do you think Ford was right to pardon Nixon?

With Hindsight Yes. It's clear his decision to pardon Nixon helped us move on from Nixon faster

This is the exact opposite of reality.

Nixon facing no real consequences for his crimes damaged our nation. People lost trust in institutions.

[Ferguson97]

I really don't understand why this is such a huge deal for some or why they're triggered. Just don't get it. Regardless of whether you like Trump's policies or not, at this point you need to accept that there's very strong evidence he broke multiple laws and on issues that aren't minor.

If he's really innocent as claims, let an investigation and trial happen. Whether he's a former POTUS or not is irrelevant. The law is the law. If anything, politicians should be held to higher standard that average Joe's, not to a lesser standard.

There's basically three kinds of conservatives responding to this.

Some, like OSR, fundamentally believe that the president should be above the law. He agrees that Trump broke the law, but thinks that he should get a free pass just because he was the president. These people are the "wishy-washy faux Never Trumpers".

Others sincerely believe that even if Trump is completely innocent of all crimes, and that any efforts to prosecute him are politically motivated and that the charges are 100% fabricated. These people are the "true believers".

And then a lot of them know that he's guilty, but don't care because they like Trump and agree with his politics. They're closer to Republican loyalists than Trump loyalists, and will change their arguments in half a second if they think that this is the way that the party is moving. They make similar arguments as the true believers group, but deep down know that Trump is guilty. They just don't care. They don't care about institutions or principles, all they care about is advancing the conservative agenda. These people are "the hacks".

[Ferguson97]

https://thehill.com/homenews/3907716-haberman-trump-very-anxious-about-potential-indictment-in-new-york/

Trump is nervous, according to Maggie Haberman.

“Yes, two things can be true at once. He is aware that there are reasons to believe this could help him politically … But he does not want to face getting arrested, which is what happens when you get indicted. You get fingerprinted. You get brought in. You have to ask for bail. None of that is something that he is excited about,” Haberman said.

So dumb question, how is this going to work since New York abolished cash bail? Could Bragg really hold Trump until the trial, or is there some mechanism that Trump could do to get freed?

[Ferguson97]

https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1637817111216107522

The brainworms have indeed gotten to Tenney.

Good to know that I can just not show up in court and everything will be fine

[Ferguson97]

OSR be like

https://twitter.com/NGrossman81/status/1637119106557026304

[Ferguson97]

Politico reports that Trump will likely be indicted either this afternoon or Wednesday afternoon.

...but not Tuesday?

[Ferguson97]

Politico reports that Trump will likely be indicted either this afternoon or Wednesday afternoon.

...but not Tuesday?

This GJ meets Monday and Wednesday so they'd have to be called in special to indict Tuesday, so he'd probably just wait until Wednesday.

Biden seems confident it will happen today:

https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/1637574673494933506

[Ferguson97]

"Legitimate legislative interest" doesn't mean there has to a specific legislation pending. Bragg's testimony would aid general consideration of whether and how to legislate on election laws or local DA's ability to target federal elections, such as presidential campaigns

Is your argument that people running for president should be above the law?

[Ferguson97]

Is it your argument that local DAs can use politically motivated prosecutions to interfere with national elections?

Even the most woke leftists acknowledge that Bragg has an extremely weak case

Which woke leftists are arguing this?

[Ferguson97]

I think we’re all excited for what comes after.

I have to say, it's really concerning that you keep talking about how excited you are about potential domestic terrorism.

[Ferguson97]

I think we’re all excited for what comes after.

I have to say, it's really concerning that you keep talking about how excited you are about potential domestic terrorism.

Mostly peaceful protests and blowback in the media isn’t domestic terrorism.

Then why wouldn't you want to be in NY if it's just peaceful protests?

I’d recommend you listen to Bannon’s War Room podcast if you want to hear what they’re planning. I’m glad I’m not in NYC today if this is true.

[Ferguson97]

*surprised pikachu*

Business Insider:

https://www.businesstoday.in/latest/world/story/us-attorney-who-is-likely-to-arrest-donald-trump-got-funding-from-george-soros-report-374010-2023-03-19

George Soros, a Hungarian-American billionaire who recently targeted India's Adani Group, is currently under attack in America for allegedly funding the attorney who is said to be preparing to arrest former US President Donald Trump.

Trump is facing a probe for allegedly paying a hush-money to adult film star Stormy Daniels and reports suggest that he may be arrested by next week. The probe against Trump is being led by Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg, who according to reports got support from a political action committee that took money from George Soros.

Democratic donor backs Democratic politician. More at 11.

Genuinely don't know what you think this proves. 

[Ferguson97]

Hopefully the DA has been talked out of it.  Whatever you think of Trump, this leads nowhere good.  Would likely result in every former president being prosecuted going forward. 

This is equivalent to saying that former Presidents should be entitled to break laws with impunity.

We all break laws, mostly with impunity. You have assuredly committed multiple felonies over the last year. Most of them go uncharged, but if a DA doesn't like you, he'll find something.

I am extremely confident that I didn’t commit any felonies last year

[Ferguson97]

https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1638576268244553730

I mean to me this means something's happening today, right? Alternative explanation would be that they got a really credible bomb threat or something.

[Ferguson97]

Anyway an source that grades different outlets has them at the same level when it comes to trustworthiness.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/fox-news-bias/

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/msnbc/

Why should I take "mediabiasfactcheck.com" seriously?