Florida bill would take custody of trans kids or kids of trans parents even if they are out of state

[Ferguson97]

https://www.businessinsider.com/florida-anti-trans-bill-court-custody-kids-gender-affirming-care-2023-3

A proposed bill making its way through the Florida State Senate would allow the state "emergency jurisdiction" over children who receive or are "at risk of" receiving gender-affirming care — or if their parent receives it themselves.

Senate Bill 254, introduced Friday by State Senator Clay Yarborough, would grant the court authority to take emergency custody of kids under the same statute that protects them from domestic violence and abuse.

The state could take temporary custody of children if "it is necessary in an emergency to protect the child because the child, or a sibling or parent of the child" is "at risk of or is being subjected to the provision of sex reassignment prescriptions or procedures," according to the proposed bill text.

The proposed bill defines sex reassignment prescriptions or procedures as hormone therapy, puberty blockers, and surgeries or procedures that "affirm a person's perception of his or her sex if that perception is inconsistent with the person's sex" at birth.

The court would also be granted "jurisdiction to vacate, stay, or modify a child custody determination of a court of another state to protect the child from the risk of being subjected to the provision of sex-reassignment prescriptions or procedures," according to the proposed bill text. "The court must vacate, stay, or modify the child custody determination to the extent necessary to protect the child from the provision of such prescriptions or procedures."

"This is just about parental rights to teach certain topics. Stop freaking out over nothing."

[T'Chenka]

Simply can't be true. I was told on Atlas that people saying these things would happen were insane liars.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Republicans' obsession with trans people is becoming quite disturbing. 

[T'Chenka]

Trangender parents (or one cisgender parent one transgender parent) can't have straight cisgender kids without the state taking them away? What an extremist bill. The implication is either that trans adults are such a bad influence on their kids that being a trans parent is child abuse, OR possibly it's more along the lines of "transgender people are groomers, so these people are molesting their own kids".

On top of the Texas-style "parents that let their kids be trans are bad parents" stuff, the "trans parents are bad parents or molesters" stuff is also extremely disturbing.

It's actually VERY scary when the government takes a group of people and paints them all as bad people that shouldn't be trusted or be allowed around children. We saw in Nazi Germany what can eventually happen if the government continually encourages citizens to look upon a certain group as disgusting, evil, untrustworthy or subhuman. Whatever the term is for that, perhaps "dehumanizing", the same thing that happened to jewish people in 1930s Germany by the government is happening to trans people in the USA, but not (yet?) on the same level.

Republicans needs to look in the mirror and decide if this is the path they want to take.

[T'Chenka]

post removed by moderator

The number of American children who have surgery on their genitals to change a penis to a vagina, or a vagina to a penis, is extremely small. That's a FACT, not an opinion. Most trans people who have sex reassignment surgery have the surgery as adults. Again, that's a FACT. It's verifiable with evidence, data, etc. Not just something I want to be true and fits my narrative.

Out of the very small group of minors who do have that surgery, the vast majority of them are 17 year olds, and almost all of them have been consulting with their family, doctor and therapist for years leading up to it. It's more a matter of "it's going to happen as soon as they turn 18 anyways, beyond a doubt, at this point". That's also a FACT.

I want to make it VERY clear to you, that I'm not sharing my opinion with you... I'm telling you what the reality is. Reality has nothing to do with my political opinions, policy positions, ideologies, what news and political content I watch and how it influences me. That's all totally separate from reality.

From here, you can either challenge what I'm saying, which you won't have the evidence or proof to do, or you can continue living in your alternate reality fantasy world that you were brainwashed into with right wing anti-trans propaganda. The choice is yours.

[Libertas Vel Mors]

Post removed by moderator.

The number of American children who have surgery on their genitals to change a penis to a vagina, or a vagina to a penis, is extremely small. That's a FACT, not an opinion. Out of the very small group of kids who do have that surgery, the vast majority of them are 17 year olds, and almost all of them have been consulting with their family, doctor and therapist for years leading up to it. It's more a matter of "it's going to happen as soon as they turn 18 anyways, beyond a doubt, at this point". That's also a FACT.

I want to make it VERY clear to you, that I'm not sharing my opinion with you... I'm telling you what the reality is. Reality has nothing to do with my political opinions, policy positions, ideologies, what news and political content I watch and how it influences me. That's all totally separate from reality.

From here, you can either challenge what I'm saying, which you won't have the evidence or proof to do, or you can continue living in your alternate reality fantasy world that you were brainwashed into with right wing anti-trans propaganda. The choice is yours.

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

[BG-NY]

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

The bill also includes language on hormone therapy and puberty blockers, neither of which is surgical.

[Vice President Christian Man]

As someone that supports parental rights, I oppose the state trying to raise their children. This could lead to a massive backlash which would demonize Christianity if this passes.

[Figueira]

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

The bill also includes language on hormone therapy and puberty blockers, neither of which is surgical.

It also allows taking away custody if there's even a hunch that medical transition might happen at some point.

[T'Chenka]

The number of American children who have surgery on their genitals to change a penis to a vagina, or a vagina to a penis, is extremely small. That's a FACT, not an opinion. Out of the very small group of kids who do have that surgery, the vast majority of them are 17 year olds, and almost all of them have been consulting with their family, doctor and therapist for years leading up to it. It's more a matter of "it's going to happen as soon as they turn 18 anyways, beyond a doubt, at this point". That's also a FACT.

I want to make it VERY clear to you, that I'm not sharing my opinion with you... I'm telling you what the reality is. Reality has nothing to do with my political opinions, policy positions, ideologies, what news and political content I watch and how it influences me. That's all totally separate from reality.

From here, you can either challenge what I'm saying, which you won't have the evidence or proof to do, or you can continue living in your alternate reality fantasy world that you were brainwashed into with right wing anti-trans propaganda. The choice is yours.

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

What? That doesn't make any sense at all. You'll need to elaborate.

[Mr. Reactionary]

Megathread

[Libertas Vel Mors]

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

What? That doesn't make any sense at all. You'll need to elaborate.

If your response to my saying that parents should not be allowed to castrate their children is to say that not very many parents castrate their children, then my assumption is that you agree that castrating children is bad, in which case the number of parents who castrate their children shouldn't matter.

[HillGoose]

big govt communism

[T'Chenka]

If your response to my saying that parents should not be allowed to castrate their children is to say that not very many parents castrate their children, then my assumption is that you agree that castrating children is bad, in which case the number of parents who castrate their children shouldn't matter.

If we are discussing surgery, and not puberty blockers, and not hormone therapies, then I'm not fully opposed to completely banning sex reassignment surgery for people under the age of 18. It's not an unreasonable proposal, in my mind.

What bothers me is that the people trying to get these laws passed, to limit surgeries, to limit puberty blockers, to limit hormone therapies, are not approaching the subject matter from a logic-based and reality-based perspective. You can't claim to know how to fix the problems going on in America if you clearly demonstrate that you do not understand what is happening in America. If you think tens of thousands of kids, many of which in your delusions would be 16 years olds or younger, 12 year olds, whatever, are having sex reassignment surgeries, then you don't live in the real world, but rather, a delusional alternate reality that you're convinced yourself is real, for whatever reason. People that aren't living in the real world should not be making real-world decisions for other people's lives.

Get your facts straight, know what you're actually talking about, and come to the table for a good faith discussion. From there, a lot of problems might be able to be solved or at least compromised upon. The problem is, the right wing media and GOP in America have ABSOLUTELY zero interest in doing that with trans issues. You don't have to be like them, though.

[DrScholl]

The number of American children who have surgery on their genitals to change a penis to a vagina, or a vagina to a penis, is extremely small. That's a FACT, not an opinion. Out of the very small group of kids who do have that surgery, the vast majority of them are 17 year olds, and almost all of them have been consulting with their family, doctor and therapist for years leading up to it. It's more a matter of "it's going to happen as soon as they turn 18 anyways, beyond a doubt, at this point". That's also a FACT.

I want to make it VERY clear to you, that I'm not sharing my opinion with you... I'm telling you what the reality is. Reality has nothing to do with my political opinions, policy positions, ideologies, what news and political content I watch and how it influences me. That's all totally separate from reality.

From here, you can either challenge what I'm saying, which you won't have the evidence or proof to do, or you can continue living in your alternate reality fantasy world that you were brainwashed into with right wing anti-trans propaganda. The choice is yours.

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

What? That doesn't make any sense at all. You'll need to elaborate.

If your response to my saying that parents should not be allowed to castrate their children is to say that not very many parents castrate their children, then my assumption is that you agree that castrating children is bad, in which case the number of parents who castrate their children shouldn't matter.

You're talking in circles. Your castration point failed and it's as simple as that. Even the majority of transgender adults avoid full reassignment surgery because of the dangers. No legitimate doctor would perform it on a minor and no parent would demand it for their child. And you can't even justify taking children away from transgender parents or if they have transgender siblings.

[Mr. Reactionary]

Here is a link to the actual text of the bill which, shocker, doesnt say anything about transgender parents like Fergie the troll claims. Put these troll threads in the damn megathread already.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/254/?Tab=BillText

[Libertas Vel Mors]

The number of American children who have surgery on their genitals to change a penis to a vagina, or a vagina to a penis, is extremely small. That's a FACT, not an opinion. Out of the very small group of kids who do have that surgery, the vast majority of them are 17 year olds, and almost all of them have been consulting with their family, doctor and therapist for years leading up to it. It's more a matter of "it's going to happen as soon as they turn 18 anyways, beyond a doubt, at this point". That's also a FACT.

I want to make it VERY clear to you, that I'm not sharing my opinion with you... I'm telling you what the reality is. Reality has nothing to do with my political opinions, policy positions, ideologies, what news and political content I watch and how it influences me. That's all totally separate from reality.

From here, you can either challenge what I'm saying, which you won't have the evidence or proof to do, or you can continue living in your alternate reality fantasy world that you were brainwashed into with right wing anti-trans propaganda. The choice is yours.

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

What? That doesn't make any sense at all. You'll need to elaborate.

If your response to my saying that parents should not be allowed to castrate their children is to say that not very many parents castrate their children, then my assumption is that you agree that castrating children is bad, in which case the number of parents who castrate their children shouldn't matter.

You're talking in circles. Your castration point failed and it's as simple as that. Even the majority of transgender adults avoid full reassignment surgery because of the dangers. No legitimate doctor would perform it on a minor and no parent would demand it for their child. And you can't even justify taking children away from transgender parents or if they have transgender siblings.

Vanderbilt University Medical Center performed sex reassignment surgeries until this October. Would you say that the doctors at Vanderbilt are not legitimate doctors?

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/09/us/vanderbilt-suspends-gender-affirming-surgery-minors/index.html

[OriAr]

Here is a link to the actual text of the bill which, shocker, doesnt say anything about transgender parents like Fergie the troll claims. Put these troll threads in the damn megathread already.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/254/?Tab=BillText

And quoting the exact paragraph from the text for the lazy ones:

"A court of this state has jurisdiction to vacate, stay,
or modify a child custody determination of a court of another
state to protect the child from the risk of being subjected to
the provision of sex-reassignment prescriptions or procedures as
defined in s. 456.001. The court must vacate, stay, or modify
the child custody determination to the extent necessary to
protect the child from the provision of such prescriptions or
procedures."

[T'Chenka]

Vanderbilt University Medical Center performed sex reassignment surgeries until this October. Would you say that the doctors at Vanderbilt are not legitimate doctors?

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/09/us/vanderbilt-suspends-gender-affirming-surgery-minors/index.html

That article you linked says that none of the surgeries were genital surgeries. In this context, "gender affirming surgery" means removal of breasts. The article is about how they'll know longer remove breasts from transgender boys, most of whom would be 17 but I suppose maybe a few 16 years olds possibly.

[Ferguson97]

Here is a link to the actual text of the bill which, shocker, doesnt say anything about transgender parents like Fergie the troll claims. Put these troll threads in the damn megathread already.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/254/?Tab=BillText

Are you illiterate or just a liar?

80 (1) A court of this state has temporary emergency
81 jurisdiction if the child is present in this state and the child
82 has been abandoned or it is necessary in an emergency to protect
83 the child because the child, or a sibling or parent of the
84 child is subjected to or threatened with mistreatment or abuse
85 or is at risk of or is being subjected to the provision of sex-
86 reassignment prescriptions or procedures as defined in s.

[Mr. Reactionary]

Here is a link to the actual text of the bill which, shocker, doesnt say anything about transgender parents like Fergie the troll claims. Put these troll threads in the damn megathread already.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/254/?Tab=BillText

Are you illiterate or just a liar?

80 (1) A court of this state has temporary emergency
81 jurisdiction if the child is present in this state and the child
82 has been abandoned or it is necessary in an emergency to protect
83 the child because the child, or a sibling or parent of the
84 child is subjected to or threatened with mistreatment or abuse
85 or is at risk of or is being subjected to the provision of sex-
86 reassignment prescriptions or procedures as defined in s.

You deliberately omitted the underlines.



"At risk or being subjected to" denotes lack of informed consent. If you read the bill it exempts treatments for 18 and olders with informed consent. You are deliberately reading nonsense interpretations into this bill to troll in bad-faith.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Reactionary you are the last person to call someone a bad faith troll between the crap you argued in discord to defend Knowles’ CPAC comments on eliminating transgenderism from the public or referring to how Putin treats gay people as “people upset they can’t use pronouns”

[DrScholl]

The number of American children who have surgery on their genitals to change a penis to a vagina, or a vagina to a penis, is extremely small. That's a FACT, not an opinion. Out of the very small group of kids who do have that surgery, the vast majority of them are 17 year olds, and almost all of them have been consulting with their family, doctor and therapist for years leading up to it. It's more a matter of "it's going to happen as soon as they turn 18 anyways, beyond a doubt, at this point". That's also a FACT.

I want to make it VERY clear to you, that I'm not sharing my opinion with you... I'm telling you what the reality is. Reality has nothing to do with my political opinions, policy positions, ideologies, what news and political content I watch and how it influences me. That's all totally separate from reality.

From here, you can either challenge what I'm saying, which you won't have the evidence or proof to do, or you can continue living in your alternate reality fantasy world that you were brainwashed into with right wing anti-trans propaganda. The choice is yours.

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

What? That doesn't make any sense at all. You'll need to elaborate.

If your response to my saying that parents should not be allowed to castrate their children is to say that not very many parents castrate their children, then my assumption is that you agree that castrating children is bad, in which case the number of parents who castrate their children shouldn't matter.

You're talking in circles. Your castration point failed and it's as simple as that. Even the majority of transgender adults avoid full reassignment surgery because of the dangers. No legitimate doctor would perform it on a minor and no parent would demand it for their child. And you can't even justify taking children away from transgender parents or if they have transgender siblings.

Vanderbilt University Medical Center performed sex reassignment surgeries until this October. Would you say that the doctors at Vanderbilt are not legitimate doctors?

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/09/us/vanderbilt-suspends-gender-affirming-surgery-minors/index.html

What are you even talking about? That article doesn't prove your failed point.

[Mr. Reactionary]

Reactionary you are the last person to call someone a bad faith troll between the crap you argued in discord to defend Knowles’ CPAC comments on eliminating transgenderism from the public or referring to how Putin treats gay people as “people upset they can’t use pronouns”

Def sounds like you are misleading what I said for your own goals. Color me shocked. Id be happy to explain why you are grossly wrong ... if that means this becomes the Megathread once and for all, since this is a thread about a proposed Florida bill to ban child sex changes and now you want to talk about whether transgenderism and transgender people are interchangeable phrases and the degree to which Russian laws on the public display of rainbows led to a 180 on how Democrats perceived Russia. If the mods consolidate all of the compiled threads into this one, I will engage with your questions. Otherwise it would be thread derailing.

[7,052,770]

If that's the case, then you should have no problem with this bill.

The bill also includes language on hormone therapy and puberty blockers, neither of which is surgical.

All of what I said above re: castration would also apply to giving your child drugs that stop their development and often result in sterilization.

Just because you didn't know about something until the 2010s doesn't mean it wasn't done until the 2010s. Puberty blockers have been used on trans youth since the 1990s and the drugs existed for non-trans reasons before then.