Israel General Discussion: Annus Horribilis

[Silent Hunter]

There was a shooting at a Jerusalem synagogue. 5 killed, ten victims total including injured. That's not including the shooter who was "neutralized".

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-64430491

Seven dead now. This has just handed the Israelis a casus belli for another round of attacks on Gaza.

[America Needs R'hllor]

There was a shooting at a Jerusalem synagogue. 5 killed, ten victims total including injured. That's not including the shooter who was "neutralized".

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-64430491

Seven dead now. This has just handed the Israelis a casus belli for another round of attacks on Gaza.

This is the wrong way to look at this. Israel usually has no interest to attack Gaza (of course, with this government you never know). What usually happens is Israel starts a round of arrests and special operations in the West Bank, the Gaza organizations respond with missiles, Israel strikes back, and it begins. Certainly could happen again.

[Hnv1]

I can’t see Bibi escalating the situation, if things hear up he will lose all legitimacy to advance the reform (like the opposition will lose its legitimacy in protesting). The Israeli public highly dislikes divisive politics during conflicts and Bibi values the legal reform more than the simple rally around the flag shtick

[Silent Hunter]

He also can't sit around and do nothing - especially as the current government campaigned strongly on security.

[Meclazine for Israel]

Israel are not going to mess around in 2023.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-64438905

"Israel's security cabinet has approved measures to make it easier for Israelis to carry guns after two separate attacks by Palestinians in Jerusalem over the past two days.

The new measures also include depriving an attacker's family members of residency and social security rights."

The entire family gets the boot and perhaps (?) loses their real estate.

For the Muslim terrorists who carried out attacks against Israel, they used to have a law where they destroyed their family home.

[Hnv1]

Israel are not going to mess around in 2023.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-64438905

"Israel's security cabinet has approved measures to make it easier for Israelis to carry guns after two separate attacks by Palestinians in Jerusalem over the past two days.

The new measures also include depriving an attacker's family members of residency and social security rights."

The entire family gets the boot and perhaps (?) loses their real estate.

For the Muslim terrorists who carried out attacks against Israel, they used to have a law where they destroyed their family home.

It's not their real estate, its their eligibility to welfare benefits. The dubious right to vote in the municipal elections is hardly ever exercised in East Jerusalem.

[Hollywood]

The Israeli Judicial System is an objectively anti-Democratic branch.  It is made-up of a self-appointed judiciary that acts as legislator, executive, and drafter of Israel's Constitution.  Its body has the power to select and deny prosecutors, ministers, and elected officials.  It functions without any checks and balances on legislative and administrative prosecutorial powers, because it originated the constitution that established its authoritative powers.  It is unlike any Western Judiciary System.  Naturally, the judicial and prosecutorial body is notoriously corrupt and politically-motivated.  They will enact legislation on the fly in order to limit the powers of incoming or outgoing, democratically-elected representatives.

In regards to criminal handling of ministers, legislators, and judges, the AGs will overzealously prosecute political foes, and drag their feat when it comes to allies.  They often prosecute cases based on external media or internal political pressure as opposed to the strength of their case.  An example is AG Yehuda Weinstein's delays when it came to prosecuting Secular-Left-wing, Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman as opposed to Jewish politicians.  Such difference are also glaring in the prosecutorial process when judges (peers) are involved.  The speed of prosecution is a serious problem, because the judiciary has enacted legislation that forces government official out of office during litigation.  It's just ripe for abuse. 

[Darthpi – Anti-Florida Activist]

The Israeli Judicial System is an objectively anti-Democratic branch.  It is made-up of a self-appointed judiciary that acts as legislator, executive, and drafter of Israel's Constitution.  Its body has the power to select and deny prosecutors, ministers, and elected officials.  It functions without any checks and balances on legislative and administrative prosecutorial powers, because it originated the constitution that established its authoritative powers.  It is unlike any Western Judiciary System.  Naturally, the judicial and prosecutorial body is notoriously corrupt and politically-motivated.  They will enact legislation on the fly in order to limit the powers of incoming or outgoing, democratically-elected representatives.

In regards to criminal handling of ministers, legislators, and judges, the AGs will overzealously prosecute political foes, and drag their feat when it comes to allies.  They often prosecute cases based on external media or internal political pressure as opposed to the strength of their case.  An example is AG Yehuda Weinstein's delays when it came to prosecuting Secular-Left-wing, Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman as opposed to Jewish politicians.  Such difference are also glaring in the prosecutorial process when judges (peers) are involved.  The speed of prosecution is a serious problem, because the judiciary has enacted legislation that forces government official out of office during litigation.  It's just ripe for abuse. 

Deranged

[Hnv1]

The Israeli Judicial System is an objectively anti-Democratic branch.  It is made-up of a self-appointed judiciary that acts as legislator, executive, and drafter of Israel's Constitution.  Its body has the power to select and deny prosecutors, ministers, and elected officials.  It functions without any checks and balances on legislative and administrative prosecutorial powers, because it originated the constitution that established its authoritative powers.  It is unlike any Western Judiciary System.  Naturally, the judicial and prosecutorial body is notoriously corrupt and politically-motivated.  They will enact legislation on the fly in order to limit the powers of incoming or outgoing, democratically-elected representatives.

In regards to criminal handling of ministers, legislators, and judges, the AGs will overzealously prosecute political foes, and drag their feat when it comes to allies.  They often prosecute cases based on external media or internal political pressure as opposed to the strength of their case.  An example is AG Yehuda Weinstein's delays when it came to prosecuting Secular-Left-wing, Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman as opposed to Jewish politicians.  Such difference are also glaring in the prosecutorial process when judges (peers) are involved.  The speed of prosecution is a serious problem, because the judiciary has enacted legislation that forces government official out of office during litigation.  It's just ripe for abuse. 

I entered "a delirious rant by an American poster who knows basically nothing about Israel first-hand" into ChatGPT and look what I got!

[CumbrianLefty]

I entered "a delirious rant by an American poster who knows basically nothing about anything" into ChatGPT and look what I got!

There, amended for even greater accuracy

[Hnv1]

It speaks volumes that we're in the middle of one of the biggest political occurrences in our history, and we can't even describe it in real time adequately.

today in Jerusalem was powerful. No surrender. They're going to fold

[Lexii, harbinger of chaos and sexual anarchy]

THE GRAND MUFTI OF JERUSALEM will finally be brought to JUSTICE

https://www.timesofisrael.com/former-grand-mufti-of-jerusalem-to-be-investigated-for-incitement-to-terror/

[Torie]

Anyone have any speculation as to what the end game of this initiative to emasculate the judiciary will be? At what point will the ongoing evolution of Israel if it continues precipitate a substantial increase in emigration, as particularly young people just give up on the place?

[Cassius]

Anyone have any speculation as to what the end game of this initiative to emasculate the judiciary will be? At what point will the ongoing evolution of Israel if it continues precipitate a substantial increase in emigration, as particularly young people just give up on the place?

I’m not an Israeli obviously, but my understanding is that younger Israelis tend to be very firmly on the political right (particularly when it comes to the question of whether Israel is a ‘Jewish and democratic’ or simply a Jewish state), so it seems unlikely that young people as a group would be the ones who ‘give up’ on Israel.

[Hnv1]

Anyone have any speculation as to what the end game of this initiative to emasculate the judiciary will be? At what point will the ongoing evolution of Israel if it continues precipitate a substantial increase in emigration, as particularly young people just give up on the place?

I’m not an Israeli obviously, but my understanding is that younger Israelis tend to be very firmly on the political right (particularly when it comes to the question of whether Israel is a ‘Jewish and democratic’ or simply a Jewish state), so it seems unlikely that young people as a group would be the ones who ‘give up’ on Israel.

These young Israeli so allegedly on the right are mostly workers of the outdated protectionist economy, the workers in the lucrative tech industry or white collar jobs trend more to the left and a fair number of them will look across the Atlantic for opportunities if they feel Israel is constraining them.

Tel Aviv will probably remain as a liberal enclave in an intensifying absolutist regime, but I have no doubt there’ll be a brain drain.

[No War, but the War on Christmas]

https://twitter.com/ShnizelInBag/status/1619648748631769088?s=20

[Torie]

I was watching last night an interview with this very articulate history professor at U of M knowledgeable about Israel, and he did not expect much of the planned Blinken visit to Israel. He expected him to mouth platitudes about a two state solution, and so forth, that is dead in the water. I then looked up what happened with the Blinken trip. It appears next to nothing. Does anyone have an opinion of what he accomplished, and the impact of the visit, other than the null set, and mouthing of platitudes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-pA23q4eZ8

[CumbrianLefty]

Anyone have any speculation as to what the end game of this initiative to emasculate the judiciary will be? At what point will the ongoing evolution of Israel if it continues precipitate a substantial increase in emigration, as particularly young people just give up on the place?

I’m not an Israeli obviously, but my understanding is that younger Israelis tend to be very firmly on the political right (particularly when it comes to the question of whether Israel is a ‘Jewish and democratic’ or simply a Jewish state), so it seems unlikely that young people as a group would be the ones who ‘give up’ on Israel.

Its the sorts of young people that would leave - ie a genuine "brain drain". Maybe a minority, but one that Israel can ill afford to lose given its pretensions towards being a modern technological economy.

[Comrade Funk]

I was watching last night an interview with this very articulate history professor at U of M knowledgeable about Israel, and he did not expect much of the planned Blinken visit to Israel. He expected him to mouth platitudes about a two state solution, and so forth, that is dead in the water. I then looked up what happened with the Blinken trip. It appears next to nothing. Does anyone have an opinion of what he accomplished, and the impact of the visit, other than the null set, and mouthing of platitudes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-pA23q4eZ8

The Americans have no policy minus worthless platitudes and sticking their heads in the sand. Well at least in terms of this administration/party.

[pppolitics]

I was watching last night an interview with this very articulate history professor at U of M knowledgeable about Israel, and he did not expect much of the planned Blinken visit to Israel. He expected him to mouth platitudes about a two state solution, and so forth, that is dead in the water. I then looked up what happened with the Blinken trip. It appears next to nothing. Does anyone have an opinion of what he accomplished, and the impact of the visit, other than the null set, and mouthing of platitudes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-pA23q4eZ8

The Americans have no policy minus worthless platitudes and sticking their heads in the sand. Well at least in terms of this administration/party.

Withhold US aids.

Let see how far Israel go before it starts begging for our money.

[Comrade Funk]

I was watching last night an interview with this very articulate history professor at U of M knowledgeable about Israel, and he did not expect much of the planned Blinken visit to Israel. He expected him to mouth platitudes about a two state solution, and so forth, that is dead in the water. I then looked up what happened with the Blinken trip. It appears next to nothing. Does anyone have an opinion of what he accomplished, and the impact of the visit, other than the null set, and mouthing of platitudes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-pA23q4eZ8

The Americans have no policy minus worthless platitudes and sticking their heads in the sand. Well at least in terms of this administration/party.

Withhold US aids.

Let see how far Israel go before it starts begging for our money.

The point I'm making is they won't withhold any aid regardless of what this government does.

[All Along The Watchtower]

I was watching last night an interview with this very articulate history professor at U of M knowledgeable about Israel, and he did not expect much of the planned Blinken visit to Israel. He expected him to mouth platitudes about a two state solution, and so forth, that is dead in the water. I then looked up what happened with the Blinken trip. It appears next to nothing. Does anyone have an opinion of what he accomplished, and the impact of the visit, other than the null set, and mouthing of platitudes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-pA23q4eZ8

The Americans have no policy minus worthless platitudes and sticking their heads in the sand. Well at least in terms of this administration/party.

That’s true of the Middle East in general and related issues (ie. the GWOT/Afghanistan). It’s all on autopilot and the back burner while the focus is on containing Russia and China. And successive administrations of both parties (Obama, Trump, Biden) have indicated in different ways and to one extent or another that they’re sick of both the post-9/11 “endless wars” and the many conflicts in the region more broadly. In this, they are merely responding to American public opinion, which is even less interested—far less.

[CumbrianLefty]

Yes, endless war was very much a neocon idea. How has it worked out in practice?

[Meclazine for Israel]

Yes, endless war was very much a neocon idea. How has it worked out in practice?

Maybe not endless war, but smarter interactions.

With Israel, they have been blueing with the Palestinian population since before I was born. There needs to be a smarter way of dealing with the situation.

[jaymichaud]

What is Deri referring to when he says the Ashkenazi comitted a genocide against Mizrahi? Like I get its bullsh**t but is there a specific lieu de mémoire he is referring to?


 Does this not affect his relations with UTJ?

I'm Mizrahi, my family aren't from the Arab world but i'm pretty well read on our history and the hardships and challenges we had to endure, and I found his comments extremely tasteless! There obviously was no "genocide" and maybe him and his welfare queen voter base should be grateful to the demographic who actually did the heavy lifting during the founding of the state and winning the war of independence.