Conservatives: if you had a child who came out as transgender, how would you react?

[Vosem]

[OSR stands with Israel]

This thread makes me glad to remember that most people on this blog aren’t going to have children.

There’s some sort of strange belief that being a parent means you somehow have absolute domain over your child and their life. But children are people, and they grow up, and they’ll live their own lives. Eventually your position of parent becomes obsolete to them, and it’s up to your children to decide whether they want to continue to have you be part of their life. They’ll remember how you treated them and reacted to them at their most vulnerable and honest moments, and how you continue to treat them beyond that. They’ll remember if you were there for them, and what you chose when it came down between your ideology and your (hopefully naturalistic, inborn unconditional) love for them. It’s easy to say you’re going to resist the transgender agenda or whatever when you’re just writing on a blog, but it’s another thing once you’ve held your child in your arms, helpless and tiny, feeling that deep parental bond. And that’s how you see your child for the rest of their lives - tiny and helpless, with only you there in the world for them. You would have to be quite a poor parent to actively attempt to sever that in favor of your own ideological beliefs.

Beautifully expressed, but don't you see?   This is exactly why some parents want to protect their kids from being led down this road that they believe will harm them.

If you raise your child well, you ought to trust and believe them. I’m sorry you feel this sort of animosity toward your potential children.

Wait do you have kids

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

This thread makes me glad to remember that most people on this blog aren’t going to have children.

There’s some sort of strange belief that being a parent means you somehow have absolute domain over your child and their life. But children are people, and they grow up, and they’ll live their own lives. Eventually your position of parent becomes obsolete to them, and it’s up to your children to decide whether they want to continue to have you be part of their life. They’ll remember how you treated them and reacted to them at their most vulnerable and honest moments, and how you continue to treat them beyond that. They’ll remember if you were there for them, and what you chose when it came down between your ideology and your (hopefully naturalistic, inborn unconditional) love for them. It’s easy to say you’re going to resist the transgender agenda or whatever when you’re just writing on a blog, but it’s another thing once you’ve held your child in your arms, helpless and tiny, feeling that deep parental bond. And that’s how you see your child for the rest of their lives - tiny and helpless, with only you there in the world for them. You would have to be quite a poor parent to actively attempt to sever that in favor of your own ideological beliefs.

Beautifully expressed, but don't you see?   This is exactly why some parents want to protect their kids from being led down this road that they believe will harm them.

If you raise your child well, you ought to trust and believe them. I’m sorry you feel this sort of animosity toward your potential children.

There is no animosity in trying to protect your children from a culture that is pushing propaganda on them to make them feel alienated from their own bodies up to the point of being suicidal and calling this normal.

[Pedocon Theory is not a theory]

This thread makes me glad to remember that most people on this blog aren’t going to have children.

There’s some sort of strange belief that being a parent means you somehow have absolute domain over your child and their life. But children are people, and they grow up, and they’ll live their own lives. Eventually your position of parent becomes obsolete to them, and it’s up to your children to decide whether they want to continue to have you be part of their life. They’ll remember how you treated them and reacted to them at their most vulnerable and honest moments, and how you continue to treat them beyond that. They’ll remember if you were there for them, and what you chose when it came down between your ideology and your (hopefully naturalistic, inborn unconditional) love for them. It’s easy to say you’re going to resist the transgender agenda or whatever when you’re just writing on a blog, but it’s another thing once you’ve held your child in your arms, helpless and tiny, feeling that deep parental bond. And that’s how you see your child for the rest of their lives - tiny and helpless, with only you there in the world for them. You would have to be quite a poor parent to actively attempt to sever that in favor of your own ideological beliefs.

Beautifully expressed, but don't you see?   This is exactly why some parents want to protect their kids from being led down this road that they believe will harm them.

If you raise your child well, you ought to trust and believe them. I’m sorry you feel this sort of animosity toward your potential children.

There is no animosity in trying to protect your children from a culture that is poisoning their minds to make them feel alienated from their own bodies up to the point of being suicidal and calling this normal.

Correct, this is why I oppose Evangelical Christianity as a cancer on society.

[Trans Rights Are Human Rights]

There is no animosity in trying to protect your children from a culture that is pushing propaganda on them to make them feel alienated from their own bodies up to the point of being suicidal and calling this normal.

You guys are getting propaganda pushed on you to make you feel alienated from your own body? ...Lucky.

[Boobs]

This thread makes me glad to remember that most people on this blog aren’t going to have children.

There’s some sort of strange belief that being a parent means you somehow have absolute domain over your child and their life. But children are people, and they grow up, and they’ll live their own lives. Eventually your position of parent becomes obsolete to them, and it’s up to your children to decide whether they want to continue to have you be part of their life. They’ll remember how you treated them and reacted to them at their most vulnerable and honest moments, and how you continue to treat them beyond that. They’ll remember if you were there for them, and what you chose when it came down between your ideology and your (hopefully naturalistic, inborn unconditional) love for them. It’s easy to say you’re going to resist the transgender agenda or whatever when you’re just writing on a blog, but it’s another thing once you’ve held your child in your arms, helpless and tiny, feeling that deep parental bond. And that’s how you see your child for the rest of their lives - tiny and helpless, with only you there in the world for them. You would have to be quite a poor parent to actively attempt to sever that in favor of your own ideological beliefs.

Beautifully expressed, but don't you see?   This is exactly why some parents want to protect their kids from being led down this road that they believe will harm them.

If you raise your child well, you ought to trust and believe them. I’m sorry you feel this sort of animosity toward your potential children.

There is no animosity in trying to protect your children from a culture that is pushing propaganda on them to make them feel alienated from their own bodies up to the point of being suicidal and calling this normal.

And there we have it, complete with pigheaded smugness. What kind of parent spouts this ideological garbage when their child is trying to be open, honest and vulnerable with them?

[kia boyz '24]

I would redacted

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

This thread makes me glad to remember that most people on this blog aren’t going to have children.

There’s some sort of strange belief that being a parent means you somehow have absolute domain over your child and their life. But children are people, and they grow up, and they’ll live their own lives. Eventually your position of parent becomes obsolete to them, and it’s up to your children to decide whether they want to continue to have you be part of their life. They’ll remember how you treated them and reacted to them at their most vulnerable and honest moments, and how you continue to treat them beyond that. They’ll remember if you were there for them, and what you chose when it came down between your ideology and your (hopefully naturalistic, inborn unconditional) love for them. It’s easy to say you’re going to resist the transgender agenda or whatever when you’re just writing on a blog, but it’s another thing once you’ve held your child in your arms, helpless and tiny, feeling that deep parental bond. And that’s how you see your child for the rest of their lives - tiny and helpless, with only you there in the world for them. You would have to be quite a poor parent to actively attempt to sever that in favor of your own ideological beliefs.

Beautifully expressed, but don't you see?   This is exactly why some parents want to protect their kids from being led down this road that they believe will harm them.

If you raise your child well, you ought to trust and believe them. I’m sorry you feel this sort of animosity toward your potential children.

There is no animosity in trying to protect your children from a culture that is pushing propaganda on them to make them feel alienated from their own bodies up to the point of being suicidal and calling this normal.

And there we have it, complete with pigheaded smugness. What kind of parent spouts this ideological garbage when their child is trying to be open, honest and vulnerable with them?

Are you treating me as role playing as your parent in this conversation we are having here? 

[Boobs]

That’s probably the closest you should ever get to parenthood, if your posts are anything to go by.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

That’s probably the closest you should ever get to parenthood, if your posts are anything to go by.

I can't be your psychotherapist, but I'd be glad to help you find one.

[Ferguson97]

There is no animosity in trying to protect your children from a culture that is pushing propaganda on them to make them feel alienated from their own bodies up to the point of being suicidal and calling this normal.

When trans kids do commit suicide, it's often because they have a parent like you who refuses to accept them.

I can't think of anything more devastating than having the person who supposed to love you unconditionally reject a fundamental aspect of your identity.

When a child hears their parent talk about transgender people the way that many conservatives do - calling them things like mentally ill, disgusting, sneering that they'll "never be a real man/woman" - you know what that kid is gonna think when they realize that they're transgender? "Does mom/dad think this about me? Are they going to hate me too? What if they beat me? What if they kick me out?"

And there is no 'propaganda' tricking children into becoming transgender. This is an absolutely ridiculous premise.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

There is no animosity in trying to protect your children from a culture that is pushing propaganda on them to make them feel alienated from their own bodies up to the point of being suicidal and calling this normal.

When trans kids do commit suicide, it's often because they have a parent like you who refuses to accept them.

I can't think of anything more devastating than having the person who supposed to love you unconditionally reject a fundamental aspect of your identity.

When a child hears their parent talk about transgender people the way that many conservatives do - calling them things like mentally ill, disgusting, sneering that they'll "never be a real man/woman" - you know what that kid is gonna think when they realize that they're transgender? "Does mom/dad think this about me? Are they going to hate me too? What if they beat me? What if they kick me out?"

And there is no 'propaganda' tricking children into becoming transgender. This is an absolutely ridiculous premise.

What's ridiculous is the claim that unconditional love requires parents to consent to their children getting mastectomies when there isn't anything physically wrong with them.

I would never refuse to accept my child. That doesn't mean I have to accept what people like you tell them about themselves.

[parochial boy]

But no-one is suggesting giving children mastectomies. The question is, in the event your child comes to you with a difficult and painful revelation that they will have been struggling with - do you trust then and support them? Or do turn around and try to explain to them that they are wrong about this issue that they will have been struggling with for a long time before coming to you; and that they are just following a trend or whatever?

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

But no-one is suggesting giving children mastectomies. The question is, in the event your child comes to you with a difficult and painful revelation that they will have been struggling with - do you trust then and support them? Or do turn around and try to explain to them that they are wrong about this issue that they will have been struggling with for a long time before coming to you; and that they are just following a trend or whatever?

Teenagers are getting mastectomies. Which isn't surprising when they are told that if they don't feel like a "girl" then it means they aren't and they need their body to match their identity, and the medical and mental health fields are going along with it.

It is possible to listen and try to understand what a child is experiencing, and to aim to respond with sensitivity to it, without necessarily agreeing with their interpretation of it, which is likely to be heavily influenced by contemporary culture - including mass media, education, and peers both in person and on-line.

[Ferguson97]

What's ridiculous is the claim that unconditional love requires parents to consent to their children getting mastectomies when there isn't anything physically wrong with them.

Yes there is. Their gender does not match their biological sex. Preventing a transgender person from transitioning is child abuse.

How would you feel if, tomorrow, you woke up in a woman's body?

Which isn't surprising when they are told that if they don't feel like a "girl" then it means they aren't and they need their body to match their identity, and the medical and mental health fields are going along with it.

"Am I so out of touch? No. It's the doctors, psychologists, and people experiencing it who are wrong."

[OSR stands with Israel]

What's ridiculous is the claim that unconditional love requires parents to consent to their children getting mastectomies when there isn't anything physically wrong with them.

Yes there is. Their gender does not match their biological sex. Preventing a transgender person from transitioning is child abuse.

How would you feel if, tomorrow, you woke up in a woman's body?

Stop throwing out the word abuse like this .

I can tell you this , I cannot see my self ever agreeing to let my child use puberty blockers or HRT and there is absolutely nothing abusive about it .

[parochial boy]

What's ridiculous is the claim that unconditional love requires parents to consent to their children getting mastectomies when there isn't anything physically wrong with them.

Yes there is. Their gender does not match their biological sex. Preventing a transgender person from transitioning is child abuse.

How would you feel if, tomorrow, you woke up in a woman's body?

Stop throwing out the word abuse like this .

I can tell you this , I cannot see my self ever agreeing to let my child use puberty blockers or HRT and there is absolutely nothing abusive about it .

Sorry, no, but if your child comes out as trans then there is a way to react that is undeniably abusive. It is not unacceptable to want to be cautious about it on the whole. Because the various treatments aren't something to be taken likely, because of the implications about how they will be treated by the same transphobic society that you yourself are contributing to. it is OK to want to be as safe as possible, to speak to medical professionals, to make double-triple sure whatever, before moving in that sort of direction.

But to categorically say outright, no way you will ever let your child go through a medical transition, even when their gender identity is causing them long term, real suffering. Even when every single signal points in the same direction. That's just abusive. In fact it's willing to sit back and see your child suffer, even having identified the cause of their suffering, because of some culture war that you yourself have dug yourself into.

I genuinely hope that when it is someone you love, you would have the lucidity and self-awareness to see that.

[OSR stands with Israel]

"Am I so out of touch? No. It's the doctors, psychologists, and people experiencing it who are wrong."

If those people are doing stuff like this , then no I would not trust them :

https://www.city-journal.org/transgender-identifying-adolescents-threats-to-parental-rights

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

What's ridiculous is the claim that unconditional love requires parents to consent to their children getting mastectomies when there isn't anything physically wrong with them.

Yes there is. Their gender does not match their biological sex. Preventing a transgender person from transitioning is child abuse.

How would you feel if, tomorrow, you woke up in a woman's body?

Which isn't surprising when they are told that if they don't feel like a "girl" then it means they aren't and they need their body to match their identity, and the medical and mental health fields are going along with it.

"Am I so out of touch? No. It's the doctors, psychologists, and people experiencing it who are wrong."

Thank you for illustrating my point above: Calling refusal to allow a kid to get a mastectomy "child abuse" is the undeniable logical conclusion of "trans rights" discourse.  Let's not pretend anything less is being demanded by the call for "affirmation."

[Ferguson97]

Thank you for illustrating my point above: Calling refusal to allow a kid to get a mastectomy "child abuse" is the undeniable logical conclusion of "trans rights" discourse.  Let's not pretend anything less is being demanded by the call for "affirmation."

Why are you framing your position as if you're simply drawing the line at gender-reaffirming surgery? You've made it clear that you would go as far to deny your child the opportunity to use their preferred pronouns or a new name.

I can tell you this , I cannot see my self ever agreeing to let my child use puberty blockers or HRT and there is absolutely nothing abusive about it.

Forcing your child to go through the wrong puberty is abusive.

Let me ask you this. Let's say you had a child who was born male and decided, after turning 18, that they now identify as a woman. They're 18 and living on their own, and are paying for their own HRT.

All she asks of you is to use she/her pronouns to refer to her and call her by her new name. Would you do that?

[OSR stands with Israel]

I can tell you this , I cannot see my self ever agreeing to let my child use puberty blockers or HRT and there is absolutely nothing abusive about it.

Let me ask you this. Let's say you had a child who was born male and decided, after turning 18, that they now identify as a woman. They're 18 and living on their own, and are paying for their own HRT.

All she asks of you is to use she/her pronouns to refer to her and call her by her new name. Would you do that?

Yes

[Devout Centrist]

To my knowledge, no one brought up childhood mastectomies here?

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

Thank you for illustrating my point above: Calling refusal to allow a kid to get a mastectomy "child abuse" is the undeniable logical conclusion of "trans rights" discourse.  Let's not pretend anything less is being demanded by the call for "affirmation."

Why are you framing your position as if you're simply drawing the line at gender-reaffirming surgery? You've made it clear that you would go as far to deny your child the opportunity to use their preferred pronouns or a new name.

I'm drawing the line at assenting to an ideology that leads to people using phrases like "gender-reaffirming surgery."

What names or pronouns I would use for a child is not something I am going to try to take any firm position on in the abstract.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

I don't plan on ever having kids, but if I did I would make sure that they knew just because they don't fit into gender stereotypes doesn't mean they are transgender.

[Ferguson97]

Thank you for illustrating my point above: Calling refusal to allow a kid to get a mastectomy "child abuse" is the undeniable logical conclusion of "trans rights" discourse.  Let's not pretend anything less is being demanded by the call for "affirmation."

Why are you framing your position as if you're simply drawing the line at gender-reaffirming surgery? You've made it clear that you would go as far to deny your child the opportunity to use their preferred pronouns or a new name.

I'm drawing the line at assenting to an ideology that leads to people using phrases like "gender-reaffirming surgery."

Why? Other than the fact that it's "ahhh new thing is different and scary to me"?