French political discussion megathread: Yellow Vest Redux

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Is there any particular reason why you chose to frontload an otherwise decent series of points with an irrelevant personal attack, Zinneke?

[Хahar 🤔]

I don't give a sh*t that she posed for Playboy and I was planning to ignore the story entirely, then I saw the full picture and apparently she had the article of the French constitution Macron used to ram through his pension reform tattooed on her boob??

Occam's razor would suggest that it's not a real tattoo and it was just placed there to get the people talking, but I'm not going to inquire into this further.

[Antonio the Sixth]

I don't give a sh*t that she posed for Playboy and I was planning to ignore the story entirely, then I saw the full picture and apparently she had the article of the French constitution Macron used to ram through his pension reform tattooed on her boob??

Occam's razor would suggest that it's not a real tattoo and it was just placed there to get the people talking, but I'm not going to inquire into this further.

I mean, either way, the message is the same. Zero respect for the institutional power they wield and how it is perceived by the vast majority of French people. It's all just a game for these people. But yeah, now that you mention it, it might just have been printed over the photo.

[Zinneke]

Is there any particular reason why you chose to frontload an otherwise decent series of points with an irrelevant personal attack, Zinneke?

It is not a personal attack on Antonio, it is a personal attack on Antonio's political views. I have no doubt Antonio is a thoroughly decent individual with a strong moral code. You can tell this because he actually cares.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Is there any particular reason why you chose to frontload an otherwise decent series of points with an irrelevant personal attack, Zinneke?

It is not a personal attack on Antonio, it is a personal attack on Antonio's political views. I have no doubt Antonio is a thoroughly decent individual with a strong moral code. You can tell this because he actually cares.

Fair enough, but I still think we're in danger of getting distracted by the Playboy aspect, which up until now no one here, including Antonio, has really focused on. I'm not sure why you tried to foreground it given that you don't seem to have an especially high opinion of the focus on frivolous showboating in French politics right now either.

[Zinneke]

Is there any particular reason why you chose to frontload an otherwise decent series of points with an irrelevant personal attack, Zinneke?

It is not a personal attack on Antonio, it is a personal attack on Antonio's political views. I have no doubt Antonio is a thoroughly decent individual with a strong moral code. You can tell this because he actually cares.

Fair enough, but I still think we're in danger of getting distracted by the Playboy aspect, which up until now no one here, including Antonio, has really focused on. I'm not sure why you tried to foreground it given that you don't seem to have an especially high opinion of the focus on frivolous showboating in French politics right now either.

Well I am a fan of playing devil's advocate, so the bulk of my post relating to Schiappa's stunt was defending her as she did not pose to talk about 49.3, she posed to talk about the serious issue of women being harassed on the street for dressing like they want to dress. And while I don't buy the French Right's paranoia over this being about islam (it is in reality about young men), I also criticize the way the Fancophone Left doesn't want to actually tackle the paternalist structures in certain communities that result in women being harassed in the street. So in essence if Schiappa's stunt had actually worked, it would have been worth it.

It failed because she not only decided to tattoo 49.3 on her chest as a troll, but also because it seems a lot of people who would otherwise consider themselves progressive on social issues think that because she is Macronista, and attractive, she can be subject to ridicule.

When Sanna Marin was posing with a decolleté, she was criticised by right-wing bad faith actors and defended to the hilt over it by some here even on the Left, but when Schiappa does it, suddenly it's...open season? Yet Sanna Marin wasn't even promoting a valid reason for posing, she was just getting the horny points in and posing to be the nice bland social democatic wondergirl while the real politics happens behind her and she was punished in the end.

I agree that that the "frivolous showboating" and overall "peopleisation" is a net negative, hence why I went off on a tangent about the return of a party political system as opposed to personalist vehicles for attention-seeking firebands.

[CumbrianLefty]

Is there any particular reason why you chose to frontload an otherwise decent series of points with an irrelevant personal attack, Zinneke?

It is not a personal attack on Antonio, it is a personal attack on Antonio's political views. I have no doubt Antonio is a thoroughly decent individual with a strong moral code. You can tell this because he actually cares.

Fair enough, but I still think we're in danger of getting distracted by the Playboy aspect, which up until now no one here, including Antonio, has really focused on. I'm not sure why you tried to foreground it given that you don't seem to have an especially high opinion of the focus on frivolous showboating in French politics right now either.

Well I am a fan of playing devil's advocate, so the bulk of my post relating to Schiappa's stunt was defending her as she did not pose to talk about 49.3, she posed to talk about the serious issue of women being harassed on the street for dressing like they want to dress. And while I don't buy the French Right's paranoia over this being about islam (it is in reality about young men), I also criticize the way the Fancophone Left doesn't want to actually tackle the paternalist structures in certain communities that result in women being harassed in the street. So in essence if Schiappa's stunt had actually worked, it would have been worth it.

It failed because she not only decided to tattoo 49.3 on her chest as a troll, but also because it seems a lot of people who would otherwise consider themselves progressive on social issues think that because she is Macronista, and attractive, she can be subject to ridicule.

When Sanna Marin was posing with a decolleté, she was criticised by right-wing bad faith actors and defended to the hilt over it by some here even on the Left, but when Schiappa does it, suddenly it's...open season? Yet Sanna Marin wasn't even promoting a valid reason for posing, she was just getting the horny points in and posing to be the nice bland social democatic wondergirl while the real politics happens behind her and she was punished in the end.

I agree that that the "frivolous showboating" and overall "peopleisation" is a net negative, hence why I went off on a tangent about the return of a party political system as opposed to personalist vehicles for attention-seeking firebands.

If you mean the recent election result, she increased her party's seat tally.

(which is rare for an incumbent PM in Finland)

[lfromnj]

https://twitter.com/europeelects/status/1643630500857118721?s=46&t=PcorhUAA4...

Looks like Le Pen would beat Macron in a 3rd rematch if Macron could run again according to this poll.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

https://twitter.com/EuropeElects/status/1644308495217352705

Another poll showing the same.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

Macaroon is being French again

[NewYorkExpress]

Four were killed and several more were injured in an avalanche in the Alps.

At least four people have died in an avalanche in the French Alps, the country's interior minister, Gerald Darmanin, has said.

The incident happened at the Armancette glacier near Mont Blanc in south-eastern France around midday on Sunday local time.

It's thought the victims were among a group of hikers.

Mr Darmanin said several others were injured and a search and rescue operation was under way.

Officials from the Haute-Savoie prefecture, the local authority in charge of the area, put the number of injured at nine.

[Harlow]

Eight people feared trapped under rubble after an apparent explosion in Marseille.

PARIS, April 9 (Reuters) - Eight people are not responding to calls and are thought to be under the rubble of two buildings that collapsed in an explosion early on Sunday in the southern French city of Marseille, local officials said.

The cause of the explosion was not yet known, Marseille prosecutor Dominique Laurens said.

The collapse caused a fire that has complicated rescue efforts and investigations, and it has not been brought under control, she told a news conference.

[Zinneke]

https://mobile.twitter.com/libe/status/1645751872085544961

[Progressive Pessimist]

https://twitter.com/europeelects/status/1643630500857118721?s=46&t=PcorhUAA4...

Looks like Le Pen would beat Macron in a 3rd rematch if Macron could run again according to this poll.

Thankfully he is term limited. But I don't know if I have hope that any other candidate who is even slightly sane can beat Le Pen next time.

[No War, but the War on Christmas]

Great analysis.

[CumbrianLefty]

Thankfully he is term limited. But I don't know if I have hope that any other candidate who is even slightly sane can beat Le Pen next time.

Le Pen always polls better in midterm, though?

[Mike88]

Constitutional Council approves Macron's pension reform:

https://twitter.com/FRANCE24/status/1646906629202272264

[Antonio the Sixth]

Disappointing, but not surprising. The Constitutional Council is a joke, but tbh it wasn't really their job to clean up Macron's mess.

Sadly this fight is probably over, but Macron is now weaker than ever, and I doubt he'll be able to 49.3 his way out of the next controversy.

[lfromnj]

Disappointing, but not surprising. The Constitutional Council is a joke, but tbh it wasn't really their job to clean up Macron's mess.

Sadly this fight is probably over, but Macron is now weaker than ever, and I doubt he'll be able to 49.3 his way out of the next controversy.

what about the referendum option? Or will the French just riot instead of taking democracy into their own hands?

[Zinneke]

Disappointing, but not surprising. The Constitutional Council is a joke, but tbh it wasn't really their job to clean up Macron's mess.

Sadly this fight is probably over, but Macron is now weaker than ever, and I doubt he'll be able to 49.3 his way out of the next controversy.

what about the referendum option? Or will the French just riot instead of taking democracy into their own hands?

Referendums will be from this point on just be seen as plebiscites on the government in question (which is obviously the huge debate in every country that doesn't have a culture of referendums). It won't be seen in any capacity as a referendum on the actual issue.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Disappointing, but not surprising. The Constitutional Council is a joke, but tbh it wasn't really their job to clean up Macron's mess.

Sadly this fight is probably over, but Macron is now weaker than ever, and I doubt he'll be able to 49.3 his way out of the next controversy.

what about the referendum option? Or will the French just riot instead of taking democracy into their own hands?

That was shot down by the Constitutional Council as well. Can't hold a referendum on fiscal issues.

[CumbrianLefty]

Disappointing, but not surprising. The Constitutional Council is a joke, but tbh it wasn't really their job to clean up Macron's mess.

Sadly this fight is probably over, but Macron is now weaker than ever, and I doubt he'll be able to 49.3 his way out of the next controversy.

what about the referendum option? Or will the French just riot instead of taking democracy into their own hands?

Referendums will be from this point on just be seen as plebiscites on the government in question (which is obviously the huge debate in every country that doesn't have a culture of referendums). It won't be seen in any capacity as a referendum on the actual issue.

"from this point"?

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

Disappointing, but not surprising. The Constitutional Council is a joke, but tbh it wasn't really their job to clean up Macron's mess.

Sadly this fight is probably over, but Macron is now weaker than ever, and I doubt he'll be able to 49.3 his way out of the next controversy.

You can oppose the reform, but why would it be unconstitutional?

[Antonio the Sixth]

Disappointing, but not surprising. The Constitutional Council is a joke, but tbh it wasn't really their job to clean up Macron's mess.

Sadly this fight is probably over, but Macron is now weaker than ever, and I doubt he'll be able to 49.3 his way out of the next controversy.

You can oppose the reform, but why would it be unconstitutional?

There are a few things about the procedure followed to pass the bill that were at the very least unorthodox. Whether they rise to the level of unconstitutionality, I can't say, but again, I wasn't expecting the CC to want to got there anyway. It's certainly not like the SCOTUS in this respect.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Great analysis.

God I hate the French accent. This was painful. But yeah, that aside it's a good rundown.