Which of the following leaders could be described as “leftist”?

[TheReckoning]

What do you think?

[Vice President Christian Man]

Ortega, Diaz-Canel, Maduro, Al-Assad, Jingping, Jong-Un, Sisoulith, and Phuc

[PSOL]

The last three leaders are doing business as always.

The other ones on this list are engaging in immense privatization measures.

Now, don’t get me wrong; Diaz-Canel, Sousolith, Phuc, and Xi Jinping are leftists in being social democrats but they aren’t far-left in the realm of actual policy excluding solidarity from experiencing overthrows.

Assad and arguably Kim are liberals transitioning away from fascist states.

Ortega is a sellout, but qualitatively I don’t know much about him.

The world is complicated like that.

[Alben Barkley]

Assad and arguably Kim are liberals transitioning away from fascist states.

LMFAO

[PSOL]

Assad and arguably Kim are liberals transitioning away from fascist states.

LMFAO

In no way can Ba’athism be called anything but a fascist movement—its disregard for class in support of the nation, jingoistic qualities and subsequent directed hatred of the majority of the working class and peripheral elites, and godawful cringe aesthetics prove that—and the same goes for North Korea.

There was a time when Assad was a liberal darling for him cooperating in the fight against Islamists and privatization and austerity regimens, but that went out the window once it was convenient for the MIC to revel in its hateboner that it didn’t finish the job with westernizers who don’t fully capitulate. The Kim’s alignment with the Soviets in the past and the wrong facial structure don’t even get that.

[The Mikado]

If PSOL can't point to a single world leader out of 190-odd as reflective of his ideology, even Laos or Cuba, maybe its time for him to recognize that his ideology is despised by the vast vast majority of humanity and any claim to represent "the working class" is a fundamental lie as the workers clearly despise his ideas.

Just maybe.

[PSOL]

If PSOL can't point to a single world leader out of 190-odd as reflective of his ideology, even Laos or Cuba, maybe its time for him to recognize that his ideology is despised by the vast vast majority of humanity and any claim to represent "the working class" is a fundamental lie as the workers clearly despise his ideas.

Just maybe.

I’m mainly playing devils advocate, and in no way am I responding any more seriously to a bait thread thereckoning likes to make for me

[TheTide]

The ones leading countries that are officially communist, and the ones leading parties that are officially democratic socialist/social democratic.

[CumbrianLefty]

The ones leading countries that are officially communist, and the ones leading parties that are officially democratic socialist/social democratic.

Too simplistic, unfortunately.

There is no way Ortega these days can be considered "left" in anything but the most nominal sense, for example. And no that isn't just deploying the "no true Scotsman" thing, but based on an objective analysis of their recent actions.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Now, don’t get me wrong; Diaz-Canel, Sousolith, Phuc, and Xi Jinping are leftists in being social democrats

what

[PSOL]

Assad and arguably Kim are liberals transitioning away from fascist states.

Reporting for duty.

*salutes*

Un for most of his tenure has been a major westernizer in a sense of focusing his reforms on rebranding North Korea internally and bringing some awful aspects of South Korean pop culture into the mainstream there.

The ones leading countries that are officially communist, and the ones leading parties that are officially democratic socialist/social democratic.

Too simplistic, unfortunately.

There is no way Ortega these days can be considered "left" in anything but the most nominal sense, for example. And no that isn't just deploying the "no true Scotsman" thing, but based on an objective analysis of their recent actions.

The IMF deal was not the real nail in the coffin, but just the most visible representation outside the country that something indeed has gone truly wrong. What went wrong was the continual rot caused by the Ortega’s courting the old security apparatus heads as a support against the more urbane financial elites who had a relationship with Washington.

The Soviets managed to cleanse the army just under the skin of their teeth, and that lessened the rot for so long until 1956, but by then it was too late.

Now, don’t get me wrong; Diaz-Canel, Sousolith, Phuc, and Xi Jinping are leftists in being social democrats

what

Most don’t ask questions whether the Anglophone Labour parties were still “social democrats” or “workers” parties when they privatized and defunded social programs and national industries, I fail to see why that same thinking can’t cross over. A duck is a duck if it is objectively a duck.

[Senator Incitatus]

NOTA; none are French and it is absurd to apply the French terminology to other nations.

[scutosaurus]

Now, don’t get me wrong; Diaz-Canel, Sousolith, Phuc, and Xi Jinping are leftists in being social democrats

what

Most don’t ask questions whether the Anglophone Labour parties were still “social democrats” or “workers” parties when they privatized and defunded social programs and national industries, I fail to see why that same thinking can’t cross over. A duck is a duck if it is objectively a duck.

You typically have to support democracy to be considered a democrat

[PSOL]

Now, don’t get me wrong; Diaz-Canel, Sousolith, Phuc, and Xi Jinping are leftists in being social democrats

what

Most don’t ask questions whether the Anglophone Labour parties were still “social democrats” or “workers” parties when they privatized and defunded social programs and national industries, I fail to see why that same thinking can’t cross over. A duck is a duck if it is objectively a duck.

You typically have to support democracy to be considered a democrat

Many of these parties did have mass organizations that went to serve and listen to regular joes. Compared to the previous regimes of each country, the communist parties on freedom of speech would seem like absolutists on the issue. Vietnam especially is unique among these states on how free it is, the problem is with organization.

Just looking at apples here, no one questions whether east European social democrats like Smer or the Czech Social democrats are social democrats when they use the state to silence critics, nor the Aussie Labor party in agreeing with the Lib/Nats in scaling back free journalism in the country.

[scutosaurus]

Now, don’t get me wrong; Diaz-Canel, Sousolith, Phuc, and Xi Jinping are leftists in being social democrats

what

Most don’t ask questions whether the Anglophone Labour parties were still “social democrats” or “workers” parties when they privatized and defunded social programs and national industries, I fail to see why that same thinking can’t cross over. A duck is a duck if it is objectively a duck.

You typically have to support democracy to be considered a democrat

Many of these parties did have mass organizations that went to serve and listen to regular joes. Compared to the previous regimes of each country, the communist parties on freedom of speech would seem like absolutists on the issue. Vietnam especially is unique among these states on how free it is, the problem is with organization.

Just looking at apples here, no one questions whether east European social democrats like Smer or the Czech Social democrats are social democrats when they use the state to silence critics, nor the Aussie Labor party in agreeing with the Lib/Nats in scaling back free journalism in the country.

You're correct that Vietnam is the most free of the nations you mentioned, and only one party is legally allowed to run in Vietnamese elections. They are not democracies of any kind or under any definition.

And people... definitely do question whether those parties are social democratic? The Wikipedia article for Smer describes it as "national populist," "social conservative," and "neo-fascist."

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Why is Obummer not on this list.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Smer is one of those political parties that has been On A Journey (not uncommon in that part of the world, c.f. Fidesz), but I don't think anyone seriously regards it as a social democratic party in its present form.

[PSOL]

Smer is one of those political parties that has been On A Journey (not uncommon in that part of the world, c.f. Fidesz), but I don't think anyone seriously regards it as a social democratic party in its present form.

Well I was talking about old Smer.

On second thought just replace Smer with Hlas, now the analogy works

Now, don’t get me wrong; Diaz-Canel, Sousolith, Phuc, and Xi Jinping are leftists in being social democrats

what

Most don’t ask questions whether the Anglophone Labour parties were still “social democrats” or “workers” parties when they privatized and defunded social programs and national industries, I fail to see why that same thinking can’t cross over. A duck is a duck if it is objectively a duck.

You typically have to support democracy to be considered a democrat

Many of these parties did have mass organizations that went to serve and listen to regular joes. Compared to the previous regimes of each country, the communist parties on freedom of speech would seem like absolutists on the issue. Vietnam especially is unique among these states on how free it is, the problem is with organization.

Just looking at apples here, no one questions whether east European social democrats like Smer or the Czech Social democrats are social democrats when they use the state to silence critics, nor the Aussie Labor party in agreeing with the Lib/Nats in scaling back free journalism in the country.

You're correct that Vietnam is the most free of the nations you mentioned, and only one party is legally allowed to run in Vietnamese elections. They are not democracies of any kind or under any definition.

Apples to oranges, the development of Vietnam to other nations has been different and due to current geopolitical reality, this is as best as it is going to get. The very wealthy nations benefiting from imperialism, modeled in a liberal-democratic system, often can do without keeping their guard up as they are rich enough to just bribe and co-opt the opposition. Also given many elites in liberal democratic systems are dismantling such systems as best as they can, that doesn’t bade well.

It’s not like there isn’t factional dispute within the CPV that requires them to reach out to grassroots momentum and let the democratic trappings deal with the rest, there is, it’s just that a lot of it is in Vietnamese and mainly in obscure clandestine journals and in the Twitter rumorverse.

[Sweet kiss of liquid modernity]

Smer is one of those political parties that has been On A Journey (not uncommon in that part of the world, c.f. Fidesz), but I don't think anyone seriously regards it as a social democratic party in its present form.

It's very obvious what Smer is if you pay any attention - a party that claims to be on the left and/or pro-worker, and may even occasionally act like it, but which primarily concerns itself with antagonising Bratislava liberals and ethnic minorities and dabbling in organised crime. There has always been room for a party like that in Slovak politics and there probably will be for a long time to come, even if the name, personnel and/or tone change every so often.