Russia-Ukraine war and related tensions Megathread

[Badger]

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraine-heads-into-winter-with-hobbled-energy-system-2023-10-06/

"Ukraine heads into winter with a hobbled energy system"

But there has been neither the money nor the time to complete preparations for the winter, meaning more long nights without light, heat and water for millions of Ukrainians and more suffering too for businesses and the wider economy.

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1710190384842735946?s=12
I’m shocked jaichind spread misinformation 😱

Care to address this and acknowledge that your stream of Russian propaganda is usually wrong?

[Badger]

https://www.lefigaro.fr/societes/l-ukraine-met-le-budget-europeen-sous-pression-20231005

"Ukraine puts European budget under pressure"

EU Audit Chamber is sounding the alarm on how to get the funds to the next round of Ukraine aid.

Silly goose! You totally forgot to acknowledge your complete misinformation here per usual, and apologize profusely for taking the line of a terrorist state. Now's your chance!

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1710190384842735946?s=12
I’m shocked jaichind spread misinformation 😱

[Gass3268]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

[jaichind]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Which the GOP will make contingent on passage of funding for border control on the USA Southern border (AKA Build the Wall)

[Gass3268]

https://twitter.com/andrewdesiderio/status/1711451983826034926?s=46

[Hindsight was 2020]

So the White House is considering to add Ukraine’s aid to Israel’s aid package, interesting move to box in the far right in the house.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/09/israel-hamas-war-gaza-violence/#link-AUL4BFRZ2RAXTPN6N7NMBZIOBU

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

So the White House is considering to add Ukraine’s aid to Israel’s aid package, interesting move to box in the far right in the house.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/09/israel-hamas-war-gaza-violence/#link-AUL4BFRZ2RAXTPN6N7NMBZIOBU

Genius move. Just what I like to see from Biden.

[OSR stands with Israel]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

[Hindsight was 2020]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Ukraine almost definitely needs the help more than Israel. If it wasn't for Western help they would have been defeated many months ago, meanwhile Israel is an autonomous ally of sorts, if anything.
Of course it's two distinct types of aid. Ukraine aid is more helping an aspirational vassal, while Israeli aid is more to preserve a relationship that gives Washington ties to one of the stronger military-industrial complexes of the region. But that's not an argument against this. It's simply recognition of how things can get tied together in a well-rounded foreign policy.

[OSR stands with Israel]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Israel is equally as important as Ukraine so no

[Hindsight was 2020]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Israel is equally as important as Ukraine so no

If they’re equally important then it should be no issue to tie them together then 🤷‍♂️

[Gass3268]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Israel is equally as important as Ukraine so no

If they’re equally important then it should be no issue to tie them together then 🤷‍♂️

Exactly, this is the smart thing to do.

[Ferguson97]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Israel is equally as important as Ukraine so no

Whether or not they are equally important has no bearing on the fact that Ukraine needs more help than Israel.

[Hollywood]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Ukraine almost definitely needs the help more than Israel. If it wasn't for Western help they would have been defeated many months ago, meanwhile Israel is an autonomous ally of sorts, if anything.
Of course it's two distinct types of aid. Ukraine aid is more helping an aspirational vassal, while Israeli aid is more to preserve a relationship that gives Washington ties to one of the stronger military-industrial complexes of the region. But that's not an argument against this. It's simply recognition of how things can get tied together in a well-rounded foreign policy.

Ukraine could really use help from that strong military-industrial complexes, but Israel can't provide support until their security concerns are eliminated.  Israel is able to withstand a neutral Russia and China, but their ability to defend the country will be severely strained if those nations put their weight behind Iran's proxies.  They need the US for supplemental support in order to counter a coalition of this magnitude.  It doesn't matter how many times you criticize Israel, they simply can't make a move on behalf of Ukraine until they have assurances that America will help them with a Russian-backed Iran.  

This is essential for Ukraine given Israel's intelligence and weapons expertise.  Israel was behind numerous American victories during the cold war whether it be capturing Russian technology and Intelligence, or providing advanced military technology to American allies.  Israel can also put pressure on Russian allies (Syria and Iran).  

[OSR stands with Israel]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Israel is equally as important as Ukraine so no

Whether or not they are equally important has no bearing on the fact that Ukraine needs more help than Israel.

If Israel falls , there literally would be no Jewish nation left on the planet and the humanitarian consequences for Jews would be even worse than if Ukraine had fallen .

Anyway I think both Israel and Ukraine should be funded but people like Forumlurker should stop acting like it would be ok to defund Israel because no it would not be

[AndyHogan14]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Israel is equally as important as Ukraine so no

Whether or not they are equally important has no bearing on the fact that Ukraine needs more help than Israel.

If Israel falls , there literally would be no Jewish nation left on the planet and the humanitarian consequences for Jews would be even worse than if Ukraine had fallen .

Anyway I think both Israel and Ukraine should be funded but people like Forumlurker should stop acting like it would be ok to defund Israel because no it would not be

The issue here is that Israel will likely defeat Hamas and do whatever they want to the Gaza Strip with or without US aide. Sure, US aide will make their job easier (which is why I support aide to Israel), but Ukraine certainly needs US/western aide in order to stay in the fight with Russia.

[OSR stands with Israel]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Israel is equally as important as Ukraine so no

Whether or not they are equally important has no bearing on the fact that Ukraine needs more help than Israel.

If Israel falls , there literally would be no Jewish nation left on the planet and the humanitarian consequences for Jews would be even worse than if Ukraine had fallen .

Anyway I think both Israel and Ukraine should be funded but people like Forumlurker should stop acting like it would be ok to defund Israel because no it would not be

The issue here is that Israel will likely defeat Hamas and do whatever they want to the Gaza Strip with or without US aide. Sure, US aide will make their job easier (which is why I support aide to Israel), but Ukraine certainly needs US/western aide in order to stay in the fight with Russia.

I support aid to Ukraine but I dont think its good to make either aid dependent on each other. Make other things dependent on aid passing

[AndyHogan14]

I don't think this is controversial, but any new military aid to Israel should be contingent on the new aid package to Ukraine passing.

Absolutely not . Aid to either nation should not be made contingent on aid to the other .

Why not? It forces the Putin simps into a concern and tbh Ukraine needs the help more than Israel

Israel is equally as important as Ukraine so no

Whether or not they are equally important has no bearing on the fact that Ukraine needs more help than Israel.

If Israel falls , there literally would be no Jewish nation left on the planet and the humanitarian consequences for Jews would be even worse than if Ukraine had fallen .

Anyway I think both Israel and Ukraine should be funded but people like Forumlurker should stop acting like it would be ok to defund Israel because no it would not be

The issue here is that Israel will likely defeat Hamas and do whatever they want to the Gaza Strip with or without US aide. Sure, US aide will make their job easier (which is why I support aide to Israel), but Ukraine certainly needs US/western aide in order to stay in the fight with Russia.

I support aid to Ukraine but I dont think its good to make either aid dependent on each other. Make other things dependent on aid passing

I get that, but the US has a long tradition of attaching certain bits of legislation that may not have support from one faction or another to a must-pass bill. As long as both Ukraine and Israel get what they need, I will be perfectly content no matter what kind of politicking had to be done on Capitol Hill to get it done.

[Logical]

Very good news. Since the usual anti Ukraine mouthbreathers will be busy screaming about how much they love Israel, this should pass without much trouble.
https://twitter.com/mattia_n/status/1711391436602511790

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

Very good news. Since the usual anti Ukraine mouthbreathers are busy screaming about how much they love Israel, this should pass without much trouble.
https://twitter.com/mattia_n/status/1711391436602511790

To paraphrase from former President Donald Trump...

[bilaps]

Russian offensive towards Avdeevka this morning.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Looks like Russia is finally executing the great donbas cauldron of may 2022 but so far most early vids getting leaked to tg and sources reporting on the ground are the Russians taking heavy casualties and Ukraine holding

https://t.me/DeepStateUA/17794

[bilaps]

Well, Russians are claiming gains north and south of Avdeevka. Obviously, Ukraine is claiming the opposite. Don't know why you post claims from only one side.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Dismissing Deepstate as just “one side” is pretty ignorant seeing as even pro-Russian trolls like Woodbury admitted DS is probably one of if not the best on the ground sources for the war. In addition Ukraine is posting vids of the attacks being repulsed so far and unlike the Russians there hasn’t been any evidence these vids are just months old recordings being used now as propaganda