January 6th legal proceedings and investigations megathread

[Redban]

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/supreme-court-rules-against-special-counsel-will-not-expedite-trump-immunity-clash

Lmao deranged Jack Smith got wrecked HARD.

This probably means Trump will not be tried in 2024 srs because it will get tied up in the lower appeals courts. The only other way they can stop him is the ballot access suits, and this decision indicates SCOTUS is not eager to interfere with democracy. Das it mane.

[emailking]

I don't see why the appeals court would be the weak link here. Smith got a favorable draw for the appeal and they're fast tracking that, the full court will likely fast track as well given its history of doing so. SCOTUS could take however long they want but they could still decide quickly. Just because they don't want to deviate from the normal process doesn't imply they want to slow walk it.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/supreme-court-rules-against-special-counsel-will-not-expedite-trump-immunity-clash

Lmao deranged Jack Smith got wrecked HARD.

This probably means Trump will not be tried in 2024 srs because it will get tied up in the lower appeals courts. The only other way they can stop him is the ballot access suits, and this decision indicates SCOTUS is not eager to interfere with democracy. Das it mane.

Um, no.  They're (quite reasonably) waiting for the appeals court to weigh in first -- and the appeals court has already set a very aggressive schedule for hearing Trump's appeal.  Is this slower than if SCOTUS had taken it up immediately?  Yes.  Does it mean a delay of months?  Not likely.

[2016]

I don't see why the appeals court would be the weak link here. Smith got a favorable draw for the appeal and they're fast tracking that, the full court will likely fast track as well given its history of doing so. SCOTUS could take however long they want but they could still decide quickly. Just because they don't want to deviate from the normal process doesn't imply they want to slow walk it.

I think Redban is gaslighting us yet again here. I think you're right. Once the D.C. Court of Appeals has made its Decision the SCOTUS will have to take the case.

[politicallefty]

I don't see why the appeals court would be the weak link here. Smith got a favorable draw for the appeal and they're fast tracking that, the full court will likely fast track as well given its history of doing so. SCOTUS could take however long they want but they could still decide quickly. Just because they don't want to deviate from the normal process doesn't imply they want to slow walk it.

What panel was drawn for the upcoming arguments on January 9th? If the ruling from that case is against Trump, I would expect a swift denial for an en banc hearing. (Trump knows he would lose there, but I still think he would try it just to delay.) At that point, Smith would be on sturdier ground to ask SCOTUS to expedite.

[GeorgiaModerate]

I don't see why the appeals court would be the weak link here. Smith got a favorable draw for the appeal and they're fast tracking that, the full court will likely fast track as well given its history of doing so. SCOTUS could take however long they want but they could still decide quickly. Just because they don't want to deviate from the normal process doesn't imply they want to slow walk it.

What panel was drawn for the upcoming arguments on January 9th? If the ruling from that case is against Trump, I would expect a swift denial for an en banc hearing. (Trump knows he would lose there, but I still think he would try it just to delay.) At that point, Smith would be on sturdier ground to ask SCOTUS to expedite.

-Florence Pan (Biden)
-Michelle Childs (Biden)
-Karen Henderson (George H.W. Bush)

[2016]

I don't see why the appeals court would be the weak link here. Smith got a favorable draw for the appeal and they're fast tracking that, the full court will likely fast track as well given its history of doing so. SCOTUS could take however long they want but they could still decide quickly. Just because they don't want to deviate from the normal process doesn't imply they want to slow walk it.

What panel was drawn for the upcoming arguments on January 9th? If the ruling from that case is against Trump, I would expect a swift denial for an en banc hearing. (Trump knows he would lose there, but I still think he would try it just to delay.) At that point, Smith would be on sturdier ground to ask SCOTUS to expedite.

-Florence Pan (Biden)
-Michelle Childs (Biden)
-Karen Henderson (George H.W. Bush)

Going to be a 3-0 unanimous Ruling here. I just heard George Conway on CNN and he said he expects a Decision by the D.C. Court of Appeals by the 3 Week of January.

[politicallefty]

I don't see why the appeals court would be the weak link here. Smith got a favorable draw for the appeal and they're fast tracking that, the full court will likely fast track as well given its history of doing so. SCOTUS could take however long they want but they could still decide quickly. Just because they don't want to deviate from the normal process doesn't imply they want to slow walk it.

What panel was drawn for the upcoming arguments on January 9th? If the ruling from that case is against Trump, I would expect a swift denial for an en banc hearing. (Trump knows he would lose there, but I still think he would try it just to delay.) At that point, Smith would be on sturdier ground to ask SCOTUS to expedite.

-Florence Pan (Biden)
-Michelle Childs (Biden)
-Karen Henderson (George H.W. Bush)

Interesting. Henderson is quite conservative and has heard multiple cases involving Trump. There's certainly a high chance she'll be a vote for Trump here. We don't know much about the other two except that Biden appointed them. I'd be interested to hear what Lindsey Graham has to say if Childs is the one that writes for the panel and completely shreds Trump's arguments.

[Pres Mike]

Seems bad. Appeals court is going lightning speed but Trump can appeal en banc and then to SCOTUS with like 30 and 45 delays before "deciding" to do so, so the trial is most likely getting delayed now.

SCOTUS can easily decide to reject Cert in an appeal like they have done to many of Trump's petitions. Also being delayed doenst mean delayed past election.

A Trial in like August would be worse for Trump than a trial in March

Agreed on that.

The more things delayed, the more this gets pushed back into the heat of the presidential election.

I just wonder whether there's anything with regard to the trial or a possible verdict in conjunction with the timing of the election? Ergo, would the trial have to paused and/or the announcement of a verdict delayed when the election is just weeks away? Imagine a conviction around October 25 or so.

Thats Trump's plan, delay the trial to as close as the election as possible. Than ask the judge to postpone the trial until after the election to avoid "election interference"

Honestly, I think it will work.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Seems bad. Appeals court is going lightning speed but Trump can appeal en banc and then to SCOTUS with like 30 and 45 delays before "deciding" to do so, so the trial is most likely getting delayed now.

SCOTUS can easily decide to reject Cert in an appeal like they have done to many of Trump's petitions. Also being delayed doenst mean delayed past election.

A Trial in like August would be worse for Trump than a trial in March

Agreed on that.

The more things delayed, the more this gets pushed back into the heat of the presidential election.

I just wonder whether there's anything with regard to the trial or a possible verdict in conjunction with the timing of the election? Ergo, would the trial have to paused and/or the announcement of a verdict delayed when the election is just weeks away? Imagine a conviction around October 25 or so.

Thats Trump's plan, delay the trial to as close as the election as possible. Than ask the judge to postpone the trial until after the election to avoid "election interference"

Honestly, I think it will work.

I can see Judge Cannon postponing on that premise in the Florida case, but not Judge Chutkan in DC or the judge in the Georgia state trial.

[emailking]

I've calmed down. It seems like a delay of 1-2 months or the summer at the most based on listening to several legal experts. There's also a possibility of no delay at all if the appeals court removes the stay which would allow Chutkan to restart trial preparations while SCOTUS appeal plays out.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Seems bad. Appeals court is going lightning speed but Trump can appeal en banc and then to SCOTUS with like 30 and 45 delays before "deciding" to do so, so the trial is most likely getting delayed now.

SCOTUS can easily decide to reject Cert in an appeal like they have done to many of Trump's petitions. Also being delayed doenst mean delayed past election.

A Trial in like August would be worse for Trump than a trial in March

Agreed on that.

The more things delayed, the more this gets pushed back into the heat of the presidential election.

I just wonder whether there's anything with regard to the trial or a possible verdict in conjunction with the timing of the election? Ergo, would the trial have to paused and/or the announcement of a verdict delayed when the election is just weeks away? Imagine a conviction around October 25 or so.

Thats Trump's plan, delay the trial to as close as the election as possible. Than ask the judge to postpone the trial until after the election to avoid "election interference"

Honestly, I think it will work.

I doubt it will work on Chutkan. It might work on the DC Appeals court, and have no idea how the Roberts Court will respond.

Obviously if Trump is re-elected because he successfully delays justice, the United States is finished as a functional country (though Republicans will disagree, their opinions on this matter, as with so many others, are completely worthless).

[2016]

LOL, someone sounds like is very SCARED

https://twitter.com/CWBOCA/status/1738948369718903227

[Inmate Trump]

If he has all this overwhelming evidence THEN REVEAL IT.

Put up or shut up!

[emailking]

Trump: ‘May they rot in Hell. Merry Christmas’

Former President Trump in an unusual Christmas message on Truth Social called for various people he sees as “looking to destroy” the nation to “rot in Hell.”

It was one of several Christmas messages on the former president’s preferred social media platform going after President Biden, special counsel Jack Smith and other political opponents throughout Monday.

The opponents included world leaders and people in favor of the use of electric cars.

“Merry Christmas to all, including Crooked Joe Biden’s ONLY HOPE, Deranged Jack Smith,” Trump began in a Truth Social post at 2:38 p.m. EST. 

Trump frequently describes Smith, who is prosecuting the former president over his actions connected to the 2020 election and the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol, as deranged. The Supreme Court just Friday said it would not immediately consider a request by Smith to make a determination on Trump’s insistence he is immune from prosecution because he was taking presidential actions at the time.

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4376797-trump-may-they-rot-in-hell-merry-christmas/



Here are the Christmas posts in question.

JOE BIDEN’S MISFITS & THUGS, LIKE DERANGED JACK SMITH, ARE COMING AFTER ME. AT LEVELS OF PERSECUTION NEVER SEEN BEFORE IN OUR COUNTRY???

WHY DID THE UNSELECT JANUARY 6th COMMITTEE OF POLITICAL HACKS & THUGS ILLEGALLY DELETE & DESTROY ALL OF THE EVIDENCE THEY USED TO WRITE THEIR FAKE REPORT. WHY DO THEY NOT SHOW THAT I USED THE WORDS “PEACEFULLY & PATRIOTICALLY” IN MY SPEECH? THEY ACTUALLY PRETENDED THAT THESE WORDS WERE NEVER UTTERED. CROOKED POLITICS!!!

THEY SPIED ON MY CAMPAIGN, LIED TO CONGRESS, CHEATED ON FISA, RIGGED A PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION, ALLOWED MILLIONS OF PEOPLE, MANY FROM PRISONS & MENTAL INSTITUTIONS, TO INVADE OUR COUNTRY, SCREWED UP IN AFGHANISTAN, & JOE BIDEN’S MISFITS & THUGS, LIKE DERANGED JACK SMITH, ARE COMING AFTER ME, AT LEVELS OF PERSECUTION NEVER SEEN BEFORE IN OUR COUNTRY??? IT’S CALLED ELECTION INTERFERENCE. MERRY CHRISTMAS!

[about 5 other similar Merry Christmas posts not included]

Merry Christmas to all, including Crooked Joe Biden’s ONLY HOPE, Deranged Jack Smith, the out of control Lunatic who just hired outside attorneys, fresh from the SWAMP (unprecedented!), to help him with his poorly executed WITCH HUNT against “TRUMP” and “MAGA.” Included also are World Leaders, both good and bad, but none of which are as evil and “sick” as the THUGS we have inside our Country who, with their Open Borders, INFLATION, Afghanistan Surrender, Green New Scam, High Taxes, No Energy Independence, Woke Military, Russia/Ukraine, Israel/Iran, All Electric Car Lunacy, and so much more, are looking to destroy our once great USA. MAY THEY ROT IN HELL. AGAIN, MERRY CHRISTMAS!

[emailking]

Trump tells Jack Smith to ‘go to hell’ as campaign prepares Supreme Court challenge
The former president’s legal team is expected to challenge a landmark Colorado ruling at the highest court

Donald Trump spent Christmas Day telling his perceived enemies to “rot in hell.” The next day, the frontrunner for the Republican nomination for president told the man leading federal investigations into his attempts to overturn 2020 election results and withhold classified documents to “go to hell”.

In the middle of a posting spree on his Truth Social account, Mr Trump launched familiar attacks at special counsel Jack Smith, suggested his appointment is unconstitutional, and repeated his conspiracy theory that the multiple criminal indictments and lawsuits against him are coordinated by his rival President Joe Biden to keep him out of office.

“Biden’s Flunky, Deranged Jack Smith, should go to HELL,” Mr Trump wrote on Tuesday.

The former president’s latest screed against the special counsel comes days after the US Supreme Court rejected Mr Smith’s request to fast-track a hearing on whether Mr Trump can claim “presidential immunity” as a legitimate defence in his federal election conspiracy case.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-jack-smith-supreme-court-hell-b2469713.html



Here is the go to hell post.

Biden’s Flunky, Deranged Jack Smith, should go to HELL. He is helping his Corrupt and Incompetent President to destroy America through Weaponization and ELECTION INTERFERENCE! Smith is a Crooked Prosecutor who shouldn’t even be allowed to be in the position he is in—It is Prosecutorial Misconduct. The Great Ed Meese from the Ronald Reagan Era has him figured perfectly! https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023/12/20/jack-smiths-special-counsel-appointment-is-unconstitutional-former-attorney-general-tells-supreme-court/

[GeorgiaModerate]

Can anyone imagine what the right would do if Biden, Obama, or Hillary posted a Christmas message like that?  They'd still be talking about it next Christmas.

[riceowl]

Can anyone imagine what the right would do if Biden, Obama, or Hillary posted a Christmas message like that?  They'd still be talking about it next Christmas.

I mean based on "basket of deplorables," 7 Christmases later.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Can anyone imagine what the right would do if Biden, Obama, or Hillary posted a Christmas message like that?  They'd still be talking about it next Christmas.

If there's any silver lining at all to the continued existence of Donald Trump, it's how he keeps reminding everyone that every single times Republicans have claimed to stand for anything good, honest, or decent, it has been a lie.

[emailking]

Special counsel Jack Smith seeks to block Trump from making 'political attacks' during trial
Smith also asked the court to prohibit Trump from blaming law enforcement for the attack on the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021.

Special counsel Jack Smith filed a motion Wednesday in Donald Trump’s federal election interference case seeking to block him from making political arguments and referring to conspiracy theories during the trial.

“The Court should not permit the defendant to turn the courtroom into a forum in which he propagates irrelevant disinformation, and should reject his attempt to inject politics into this proceeding,” the filing reads.

Smith asked the court to prohibit Trump from advancing "a theory of selective or vindictive prosecution or to otherwise improperly inject politics into the trial."

Smith pointed to Trump's arguments that he is only being prosecuted for political reasons.

...

Additionally, Smith seeks to have the court prohibit Trump from telling the jury arguments he's made publicly that others are to blame for the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol, "including law enforcement, military forces, unidentified secret agents, and foreign influence."

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/special-counsel-jack-smith-seeks-block-trump-making-political-attacks-rcna131303

[emailking]

Recordings, emails show how Trump team flew fake elector ballots to DC in final push to overturn 2020 election

Two days before the January 6 insurrection, the Trump campaign’s plan to use fake electors to block President-elect Joe Biden from taking office faced a potentially crippling hiccup: The fake elector certificates from two critical battleground states were stuck in the mail.

So, Trump campaign operatives scrambled to fly copies of the phony certificates from Michigan and Wisconsin to the nation’s capital, relying on a haphazard chain of couriers, as well as help from two Republicans in Congress, to try to get the documents to then-Vice President Mike Pence while he presided over the Electoral College certification.

...

The new details provide a behind-the-scenes glimpse of the chaotic last-minute effort to keep Donald Trump in office. The fake electors scheme features prominently in special counsel Jack Smith’s criminal indictment against the former president, and some of the officials who were involved have spoken to Smith’s investigators.

The emails and recordings also indicate that a top Trump campaign lawyer was part of 11th-hour discussions about delivering the fake elector certificates to Pence, potentially undercutting his testimony to the House select committee that investigated January 6 that he had passed off responsibility...

https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/28/politics/recordings-trump-team-fake-elector-ballots/index.html

[Crumpets]

https://twitter.com/kyledcheney/status/1740760153111109644

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

This story is from a few days ago, but former Nebreaska Congressman Jeff Fortenberry had his conviction for lying to FBI agents overturned on appeal:

https://www.politico.com/news/2023/12/26/appeals-court-reverses-conviction-against-former-rep-jeff-fortenberry-00133213

Fortenberrry had to resign from Congress after being convicted.  But the verdict was overturned because the court said the trial was held in the wrong venue.  He shouldn’t have been tried in California when the lying took place in Washington, DC.

This broached the question to me: if an appeal that a trial is being held in the wrong place will only be heard after conviction (and after Fortenberry already resigned), why is Trump’s appeal that he is immune being heard before the trial even takes place?  This seems very inconsistent.

[emailking]

Trump's immunity and double jeopardy appeals are in a privileged class that can be heard pretrial. Venue is not.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Trump's immunity and double jeopardy appeals are in a privileged class that can be heard pretrial. Venue is not.

I guess it just seems like if there exists privileged class of appeals to be heard pretrial, holding the trial in the correct venue should be in that class. 

Venue seems like much clearer instance where the correct ruling can be made based on the law alone separate from any facts that may be revealed during the trial.  By contrast, part of Trump’s immunity claim is that his actions were within the scope of his presidential duties. which seems like a fact-based determination that should be heard at trial before being adjudicated.