Biden infrastructure/tax increase megathread

[The Dowager Mod]

Nancy is so good at this. lol

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Motion to reconsider tabled:

https://twitter.com/RepCloakroom/status/1461716122106048513?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%...

[jojoju1998]

Either way, the US Congress is incompetent.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

Either way, the US Congress is incompetent.

I’m glad someone here can keep their perspective. It agonised for months over this one bill, tore out most of it, added some poison and only passed it after an election loss. Pelosi either couldn’t or chose not to reign in Gottheimer, which makes her a bit of a joke.

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

What would Harry Truman think of these tax giveaways to the “eastern establishment.”

"If and when that happens we'll just quit being democrats with a little d. To hell with these millionaires at the head of things!"

[jojoju1998]

Either way, the US Congress is incompetent.

I’m glad someone here can keep their perspective. It agonised for months over this one bill, tore out most of it, added some poison and only passed it after an election loss. Pelosi either couldn’t or chose not to reign in Gottheimer, which makes her a bit of a joke.

Despite, the UK Parliament's loudness, it can get stuff done if it has and wants to.

The Congress is so worthless that it can get 3 major bills done after months and months of Soap Opera Drama and Saturday Night live antics.

[BigSerg]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

[7,052,770]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

[MR DARK BRANDON]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

[It’s so Joever]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

[BigSerg]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

[Mr. Illini]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

He said he wants to wait til we pass the debt Ceiling and Fund the Govt which we should before BBB, but he along with Sinema can pass a clean Debt Ceiling increase without Rs with either Eliminate the Filibuster thru reform or attach the Debt Ceiling like Mcconnell said 8 weeks ago with the Spending bill

All Ds did was build back Better ignoring the Rs on Debt Ceiling, the Rs want sequester cuts like they had under Obama that's all, sequester cuts weren't that bad as D's feared under Obama but Pelosi is pushing for a blank check

We need a carve out for VR too for Filibuster reform

He said he wants to pass BBB by Jan, 22 that's when everything will pass you are being presumptuous just like Biden is up 8 over Insurrectionists Trump and you post 40 percent Approvals

[It’s so Joever]

Don't count your Manchins before they hatch.

[BigSerg]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

Yes, has not passed the Senate. So nothing has happened yet. Manchin has said about 20 times this month that he wants to delay the vote until after the 2022 elections

[Holy Unifying Centrist]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

How does raising the SALT cap to 82,500 help people in poverty? Not to mention this bill doesn’t actually pay for itself, meaning the government pays more than it gets into revenue, leading to higher inflation. Also, because some of the provisions sunset after 2-5 years, that means the inflationary pressures are even stronger short-term.

Y’all, this bill is not good as it stands. Reduce the SALT cap to 10,000 or 20,000 at most and then make the bill actually paid for, and then I support it. I didn’t vote for Joe Biden and the dems to give tax cuts to upper middle class and rich people living in high tax states. I mean, this personally benefits me a lot because my parents pay taxes in New Jersey, but it’s sh** policy and weird seeing “progressives” gloat over a tax cut for the rich.

[Splash]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

Yes, has not passed the Senate. So nothing has happened yet. Manchin has said about 20 times this month that he wants to delay the vote until after the 2022 elections

He had this to say less than 48 hours ago:

https://twitter.com/mkraju/status/1461004860564910085

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

Yes, has not passed the Senate. So nothing has happened yet. Manchin has said about 20 times this month that he wants to delay the vote until after the 2022 elections

He had this to say less than 48 hours ago:

https://twitter.com/mkraju/status/1461004860564910085

The D's have to fund the Govt too before the end of the year it's not just about Spending bill

D Day is Dec 3 fir Govt shutdown and Dec 15 the fir Debt Ceiling increase

We need another Stimulus check and delaying a vote on the Debt Ceiling isn't helpful during Holidays it's screwing with as

SSA and Unemployment and Military won't be paid if Debt Ceiling increase

But, it would be postponed, cc retro pay would go into effect

[BigSerg]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

Yes, has not passed the Senate. So nothing has happened yet. Manchin has said about 20 times this month that he wants to delay the vote until after the 2022 elections

He had this to say less than 48 hours ago:

https://twitter.com/mkraju/status/1461004860564910085

That doesn't say much, obviously if the senate calls him to vote, he has to vote. That doesn't mean he's going to "yes".

[GeneralMacArthur]

BBB for Thanksgiving?  Is it really going to happen?

[Splash]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

How does raising the SALT cap to 82,500 help people in poverty? Not to mention this bill doesn’t actually pay for itself, meaning the government pays more than it gets into revenue, leading to higher inflation. Also, because some of the provisions sunset after 2-5 years, that means the inflationary pressures are even stronger short-term.

Y’all, this bill is not good as it stands. Reduce the SALT cap to 10,000 or 20,000 at most and then make the bill actually paid for, and then I support it. I didn’t vote for Joe Biden and the dems to give tax cuts to upper middle class and rich people living in high tax states. I mean, this personally benefits me a lot because my parents pay taxes in New Jersey, but it’s sh** policy and weird seeing “progressives” gloat over a tax cut for the rich.

I agree that the SALT provision in the bill currently is horrible policy and horrible optics. Hopefully the Senate substitutes it with their own SALT compromise that's much more palatable and costs much less. Better yet, strip SALT out entirely (not going to happen, but one can hope!)

In regards to the deficit impact of the bill, you have to consider that the Senate will very likely strip out the paid family leave provisions since Manchin opposes them and the immigration provisions will be ruled non-germane under reconciliation after the 'Byrd Bath' is completed. Those two actions alone will reduce gross estimated outlays to the tune of $300 billion or so. That doesn't even consider the fact that CBO didn't include the score for the tax enforcement provisions, which should further increase revenue and make the bill budget positive.

Here is the breakout:

Current CBO Estimated Effect on Deficit: $367 Billion (Cost)

Paid Family & Medical Leave: +$205 Billion (Cost)

Immigration Provisions: +$111 Billion (Cost)

Tax Enforcement Provisions: -$127 Billion (Savings)

So add in the savings from the tax enforcement provisions and subtract outlays for the immigration provisions and paid family and medical leave and the effect on the deficit over ten years is $76 billion in savings. Of course, there's good reason to argue that CBO's estimated savings from the tax enforcement provisions included in the bill are overly-conservative (WH estimates around $400 billion in savings over ten years, FYSA).

[Crumpets]

9 am ET, the "we don't care if the West Coast is watching" time slot.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

https://twitter.com/RepJoshG/status/1461704253551087621
Red wave incoming! His like will avoid the blame, though.

[7,052,770]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

Yes, has not passed the Senate. So nothing has happened yet. Manchin has said about 20 times this month that he wants to delay the vote until after the 2022 elections

He had this to say less than 48 hours ago:

https://twitter.com/mkraju/status/1461004860564910085

That doesn't say much, obviously if the senate calls him to vote, he has to vote. That doesn't mean he's going to "yes".

Schumer won't call a vote if he doesn't know he has all 50 Yesses.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

This has not passed the senate, I don't know why everyone is celebrating. Not a sure thing.

Cope.

*Manchin votes "no"

Cope

Huh? The Senate hasn't voted yet, silly.

Thank you, Nancy, for delivering for the American middle class, despite the brief obstruction of House business last night by a deranged lunatic who had stumbled into the chamber from a nearby watering hole.

How does raising the SALT cap to 82,500 help people in poverty? Not to mention this bill doesn’t actually pay for itself, meaning the government pays more than it gets into revenue, leading to higher inflation. Also, because some of the provisions sunset after 2-5 years, that means the inflationary pressures are even stronger short-term.

Y’all, this bill is not good as it stands. Reduce the SALT cap to 10,000 or 20,000 at most and then make the bill actually paid for, and then I support it. I didn’t vote for Joe Biden and the dems to give tax cuts to upper middle class and rich people living in high tax states. I mean, this personally benefits me a lot because my parents pay taxes in New Jersey, but it’s sh** policy and weird seeing “progressives” gloat over a tax cut for the rich.

I agree that the SALT provision in the bill currently is horrible policy and horrible optics. Hopefully the Senate substitutes it with their own SALT compromise that's much more palatable and costs much less. Better yet, strip SALT out entirely (not going to happen, but one can hope!)

In regards to the deficit impact of the bill, you have to consider that the Senate will very likely strip out the paid family leave provisions since Manchin opposes them and the immigration provisions will be ruled non-germane under reconciliation after the 'Byrd Bath' is completed. Those two actions alone will reduce gross estimated outlays to the tune of $300 billion or so. That doesn't even consider the fact that CBO didn't include the score for the tax enforcement provisions, which should further increase revenue and make the bill budget positive.

Here is the breakout:

Current CBO Estimated Effect on Deficit: $367 Billion (Cost)

Paid Family & Medical Leave: +$205 Billion (Cost)

Immigration Provisions: +$111 Billion (Cost)

Tax Enforcement Provisions: -$127 Billion (Savings)

So add in the savings from the tax enforcement provisions and subtract outlays for the immigration provisions and paid family and medical leave and the effect on the deficit over ten years is $76 billion in savings. Of course, there's good reason to argue that CBO's estimated savings from the tax enforcement provisions included in the bill are overly-conservative (WH estimates around $400 billion in savings over ten years, FYSA).

If you're explaining, you're losing. BBB still seems to be legislature which improves the status quo, but if it passes in its current form, the SALT provision is going to be an excellent talking point for the GOP and a devastating blow to BBB's (already questionable) popularity, especially in the short-to-medium term when the effects of the bill aren't felt firsthand by voters.

Trump will have full credibility when he outflanks the Democrats on SALT, and I hope the next administration slashes the cap to $0.