Biden infrastructure/tax increase megathread

[CookieDamage]

Yeah ultimately I think we'll get something that passes, even if the total amount is significantly lower. I think progressives are pushing for more to push the moderates to the left, but will fully be on board with the final bill. Sinema seems to be the bigger issue than Manchin.

I think as long as the final bill is closer to $2.5 trillion (the upper end of the final predicted amount), I will be happy with it. 

Agreed. I am sanguine about a bill in the 2 to 2.5T range passing. But still, Sinema worries me...

[Buffalo Mayor Young Kim]

Yeah ultimately I think we'll get something that passes, even if the total amount is significantly lower. I think progressives are pushing for more to push the moderates to the left, but will fully be on board with the final bill. Sinema seems to be the bigger issue than Manchin.

I think as long as the final bill is closer to $2.5 trillion (the upper end of the final predicted amount), I will be happy with it. 

Agreed. I am sanguine about a bill in the 2 to 2.5T range passing. But still, Sinema worries me...

I’m 90% sure she’s lashing out now (which, tbh, is a step up from ‘I’m in the Senate by the elevator’) because she was queuing this up to be her big John McCain thumbs down moment and now she can’t do it.

I think that’s over now, she’s been building a whole campaign back home around her bill and as long as the don’t release it she’s stuck.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

As I said earlier it's a great Bill but what about Student Loan forgiveness, most people don't take out Student Loans for Undergraduate but Lawyers and Nurses and Doctors and Paralegals and Law Clerks are handstrung by Graduate school student loan
If you serve in Natl Guard or become a cop, Undergraduate school is free anyways no need for free Community College

Biden hasn't kept his campaign promise of Forgiving Student Loan Debt because he voted for Bankruptcy Reform in 2005
.we are in an automation economy where Undergraduate school is like a HS diploma you don't go into Logic like Graduate school, you go over revised Subjects more detailed than HS

That's why students pay for Tutoring online with Student loans

[compucomp]

‘That’s not going to happen’: Jayapal rejects Manchin’s $1.5T price tag for Biden’s spending plan

Emboldening House moderates, Manchin (D-W.Va.) expressed new reluctance last Wednesday to the spending plan’s $3.5 trillion price tag, which was agreed upon this summer by Senate Democratic leadership and the White House. POLITICO reported last Thursday that Manchin proposed a deal to Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer in July that would limit the total cost of the legislation to $1.5 trillion.

Asked whether House progressives could get behind Manchin’s $1.5 trillion proposal, Jayapal told CNN’s “State of the Union” on Sunday, “That’s not going to happen.” The figure put forth by Manchin is “too small to get our priorities in,” she added, predicting the final cost of the spending plan would “be somewhere between 1.5 and 3.5” trillion dollars.

But Jayapal offered few other details about what exact number House progressives would ultimately accept and instead stressed that debate over the spending plan has “never been about the price tag. It’s about what we want to deliver.”

Looks like Jayapal sees what I see, and to be fair she did say the right things about not being tied to a number, however the problem for her is that she is setting herself up to take an L down the road. If 1.5T is rejected and final result settles at 2T, it would be very hard to spin that as a W. She probably would have been better served trying to pretend that she never took the hardline position and that any reconciliation passing is a W, like posters in this thread are now doing.

[CookieDamage]

Yeah ultimately I think we'll get something that passes, even if the total amount is significantly lower. I think progressives are pushing for more to push the moderates to the left, but will fully be on board with the final bill. Sinema seems to be the bigger issue than Manchin.

I think as long as the final bill is closer to $2.5 trillion (the upper end of the final predicted amount), I will be happy with it. 

Agreed. I am sanguine about a bill in the 2 to 2.5T range passing. But still, Sinema worries me...

I’m 90% sure she’s lashing out now (which, tbh, is a step up from ‘I’m in the Senate by the elevator’) because she was queuing this up to be her big John McCain thumbs down moment and now she can’t do it.

I think that’s over now, she’s been building a whole campaign back home around her bill and as long as the don’t release it she’s stuck.

It's so pathetic how much she wants to be like John McCain... John McCain was John McCain and he's dead. Doesn't she have her own identity?? Then again she has no real ideology...

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

‘That’s not going to happen’: Jayapal rejects Manchin’s $1.5T price tag for Biden’s spending plan

Emboldening House moderates, Manchin (D-W.Va.) expressed new reluctance last Wednesday to the spending plan’s $3.5 trillion price tag, which was agreed upon this summer by Senate Democratic leadership and the White House. POLITICO reported last Thursday that Manchin proposed a deal to Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer in July that would limit the total cost of the legislation to $1.5 trillion.

Asked whether House progressives could get behind Manchin’s $1.5 trillion proposal, Jayapal told CNN’s “State of the Union” on Sunday, “That’s not going to happen.” The figure put forth by Manchin is “too small to get our priorities in,” she added, predicting the final cost of the spending plan would “be somewhere between 1.5 and 3.5” trillion dollars.

But Jayapal offered few other details about what exact number House progressives would ultimately accept and instead stressed that debate over the spending plan has “never been about the price tag. It’s about what we want to deliver.”

Looks like Jayapal sees what I see, and to be fair she did say the right things about not being tied to a number, however the problem for her is that she is setting herself up to take an L down the road. If 1.5T is rejected and final result settles at 2T, it would be very hard to spin that as a W. She probably would have been better served trying to pretend that she never took the hardline position and that any reconciliation passing is a W, like posters in this thread are now doing.

in

The Senators, not House Members are the Final Arbitor s of Bills, due to Filibuster and the Progressives know that everything moved thru the Senate, Manchin already had a argument with AOC, the Progressves arent gonna get everything they want we have a Debt Ceiling problem

[Vaccinated Russian Bear]

https://twitter.com/sahilkapur/status/1444355616613539854?s=10
Sinema looks to be demanding a vote. No idea how she’ll react if it goes down. Probably willing to tank everything now or then if she doesn’t get some victory.

"The failure of the U.S. House to hold a vote on the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act is inexcusable, and deeply disappointing for communities across our country"

Why do Democrats do this to US? Hehe, I wonder, if it will "harden" Manchin & Sinema?

[Shadows]

It should be a 2.5-2.7T $ number minimum, atleast more towards 2.5T than 2T, maybe 2.3-2.4T odd.

Beyond that there will be huge cuts & the $ amount will be insufficient.

Without CPC, the Bipartisan infra crashes & Sinema's achievement is a big 0 before she goes into re-election. Does she want a huge win for that or will she blow that up? Same with Manchin.

If they want the bipartisan bill which will bring some jobs & infra to their states which they can tout, they have to go to a reasonable number which will enable - Paid Family Leave, Community College, Child Tax Credit, Lower Drug Prices, Free Childcare, Big investment for Climate change.

It is not possible to cover all those in 1.5T$ !

[Shadows]

https://twitter.com/sahilkapur/status/1444355616613539854?s=10
Sinema looks to be demanding a vote. No idea how she’ll react if it goes down. Probably willing to tank everything now or then if she doesn’t get some victory.

"The failure of the U.S. House to hold a vote on the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act is inexcusable, and deeply disappointing for communities across our country"

Why do Democrats do this to US? Hehe, I wonder, if it will "harden" Manchin & Sinema?

Harden? If she doesn't support reconciliation & the bipartisan bill fails, the most to lose in Sinema apart from Biden. She was the author & she will parade that bill for the next 2-3 years going into her re-election.

Biden has made clear that it was tied to reconciliation & there was always 2 tracks. Pelosi's 27th Vote was based upon reconciliation clearing Senate by then. I don't know why she is surprised given both were always tied together.

Besides she has left DC & is doing expensive fundraisers in resorts with lobbyists & her pac !

[Pres Mike]

In another timeline

-Filibuster is abolished
-Debt limit is abolished
-No shutdown rule (if budget isn't pass, current levels automatically continue)
-1.7 Trillion Jobs Plan passed
-6 Trillion Families plan passed (with public option)
-John Lewis Voting Rights Act passed
-For the People Act passed

Joe Biden could have went down as the greatest president of the 21st century

[Vaccinated Russian Bear]

https://twitter.com/sahilkapur/status/1444355616613539854?s=10
Sinema looks to be demanding a vote. No idea how she’ll react if it goes down. Probably willing to tank everything now or then if she doesn’t get some victory.

"The failure of the U.S. House to hold a vote on the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act is inexcusable, and deeply disappointing for communities across our country"

Why do Democrats do this to US? Hehe, I wonder, if it will "harden" Manchin & Sinema?

Harden? If she doesn't support reconciliation & the bipartisan bill fails, the most to lose in Sinema apart from Biden. She was the author & she will parade that bill for the next 2-3 years going into her re-election.

Electorally? Perhaps. Kinda tired, that everyone here only think about electoral consequences. TX abortion law very well might hurt GOP electorally, they did this anyway. They didn't care about the electoral consequences.

I'm wildly speculating, but I think, that latest news might harden Sinema's and Manchin's stances about their demands for a reconciliation bill. I might very well be totally wrong, though.

[Lief 🗽]

In another timeline

-Filibuster is abolished
-Debt limit is abolished
-No shutdown rule (if budget isn't pass, current levels automatically continue)
-1.7 Trillion Jobs Plan passed
-6 Trillion Families plan passed (with public option)
-John Lewis Voting Rights Act passed
-For the People Act passed

Joe Biden could have went down as the greatest president of the 21st century

Blame Cal Cunningham and the moron Biden/Collins voters for making Manchin and Sinema the swing votes.

[No War, but the War on Christmas]

As someone who was a fan before she actually started serving her term; literally almost any Democrat running against her in '24 will have my support, financially and otherwise.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Food banks are still full in this Pandemic, What is she Thinking

[MillennialModerate]

In another timeline

-Filibuster is abolished
-Debt limit is abolished
-No shutdown rule (if budget isn't pass, current levels automatically continue)
-1.7 Trillion Jobs Plan passed
-6 Trillion Families plan passed (with public option)
-John Lewis Voting Rights Act passed
-For the People Act passed

Joe Biden could have went down as the greatest president of the 21st century

Blame Cal Cunningham and the moron Biden/Collins voters for making Manchin and Sinema the swing votes.

What do you think the odds are we win Georgia Runoffs if Dems win ME & NC?

[roxas11]

In another timeline

-Filibuster is abolished
-Debt limit is abolished
-No shutdown rule (if budget isn't pass, current levels automatically continue)
-1.7 Trillion Jobs Plan passed
-6 Trillion Families plan passed (with public option)
-John Lewis Voting Rights Act passed
-For the People Act passed

Joe Biden could have went down as the greatest president of the 21st century

Honestly, this list seems more like a progressive fantasy than a plausible alternate timeline for president Biden

[NOVA Green]

As someone who was a fan before she actually started serving her term; literally almost any Democrat running against her in '24 will have my support, financially and otherwise.

Draft Gallego to Primary her in 2024!

https://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/574969-arizona-democrats-frustration-with-sinema-comes-to-a-head

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/29/us/kyrsten-sinema-voters.html?searchResultPosition=5

[KaiserDave]

In another timeline

-Filibuster is abolished
-Debt limit is abolished
-No shutdown rule (if budget isn't pass, current levels automatically continue)
-1.7 Trillion Jobs Plan passed
-6 Trillion Families plan passed (with public option)
-John Lewis Voting Rights Act passed
-For the People Act passed

Joe Biden could have went down as the greatest president of the 21st century

This just kind of a fantasy. Biden might have willing to sign these laws, but just adding a few Democratic Senators doesn't make their passage a sure thing, at all.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

In another timeline

-Filibuster is abolished
-Debt limit is abolished
-No shutdown rule (if budget isn't pass, current levels automatically continue)
-1.7 Trillion Jobs Plan passed
-6 Trillion Families plan passed (with public option)
-John Lewis Voting Rights Act passed
-For the People Act passed

Joe Biden could have went down as the greatest president of the 21st century

This just kind of a fantasy. Biden might have willing to sign these laws, but just adding a few Democratic Senators doesn't make their passage a sure thing, at all.
[/quote

If Mahchin allowed to get rid of Fillibuster we would have DC Statehood and would have 52/50 Senate right now and passage of bills is a sure bet, Kaiser Dave you know if D's get 52/48 Senate and Keep the H their gonna pass DC Statehood Tester already said he doesn't agree with Manchin on Filibuster



A 222/216 DH and 52/48 Senate is possible or more after 2022/ Rs can't crack the blue wall

That's why so many Rs want D's to lose the H to prevent DC Statehood

[jaichind]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/sinema-confronted-by-immigration-activists-in-a-bathroom.amp

"Sinema confronted by immigration activists in a bathroom"

Sounds like a great way to get her to change her vote

[Torie]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/sinema-confronted-by-immigration-activists-in-a-bathroom.amp

"Sinema confronted by immigration activists in a bathroom"

Sounds like a great way to get her to change her vote

Performance art is the thing. The rest is noise. The public square has finally managed to achieve the level of maturity it had during the Middle Ages, thanks, inter alia,  to the f'ing I-phone culture, and Facebook, and all the other toxic waste dumps out there. And Twitter and Trump both start with the same letter. Think about it. 

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

https://news.yahoo.com/can-1-trillion-coins-solve-the-debt-ceiling-crisis-141922491.html

With 14 left to solve DEBT CEILING BOT JUST INFRASTRUCTURE AND RECONCILIATION THIS IS HOW A T dollar coin would work time is a wasting

It's really 10 days due to weekend

Again, you can't default on debt SSA checks and child tax credit and military pay would be delayed but made retro active for any missed time

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

https://twitter.com/sahilkapur/status/1444355616613539854?s=10

Sinema looks to be demanding a vote. No idea how she’ll react if it goes down. Probably willing to tank everything now or then if she doesn’t get some victory.

BREAKING NEWS: Woman who Fortnite danced on the poor clutches her pearls over "publicity stunts". Film at 11.

[Matty]

There is not a single credible argument against manchin's position that the goodies in the reconciliation bill should be means-tested.

it is a total waste of tax money to give the kids of rich families free community college, to give rich yuppies free daycare, and to give rich seniors free vision and dental.

THE GREAT SOCIETY OF THE 1960S WAS MEANS-TESTED.

why can't 2021 be?

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Social Security is gonna go Bankrupt in 2035 and there hasn't been any phase out for any income group except when you die, rich people live the longest

Again, the Bill misses the mark and it gives free Community College and most people don't take out Student Loans for Community College and most people are going online now


We need Student Loan reform but Biden voted for Bankruptcy Reform bill in 2005

What's the big deal about a bit lol that give us the bare necessities this isn't a build back better

Most of the jobs that was created after Pandemic are factory jobs, you have to work nights and WEEKENDS, that's why it's tough to get workers

The reason why this bill lacking because we have a 29T Natl Dent and we can't lift the Debt Ceiling and the Congress is negotiating a smaller package