Resolution on the Middle East Conflict

[Jake]

And, we need the Vice President.

[MasterJedi]

And, we need the Vice President.

Correct, and he's been gone for about half a month now.

[ilikeverin]

Aye, and while I wish the Israelis would be more careful in how they are going about matters I wholeheartedly support the destruction of Hezbollah - I haven't forgotten what they did back in 1983. The only alternative solution I would back would be the disarmament and relocation of Hezbollah far, far away from Israel.

Actually, you might be one of the only ones in the Senate who was even alive in 1983

[Democratic Hawk]

Aye, and while I wish the Israelis would be more careful in how they are going about matters I wholeheartedly support the destruction of Hezbollah - I haven't forgotten what they did back in 1983. The only alternative solution I would back would be the disarmament and relocation of Hezbollah far, far away from Israel.

Actually, you might be one of the only ones in the Senate who was even alive in 1983

I wos

Dave 'Hawk'

[Јas]

And, we need the Vice President.

Correct, and he's been gone for about half a month now.

Assuming that Q doesn't return shortly (as appears likely), what is the procedure regarding the amendment before us?
Also, is there any precedent for dealing with what appears now to be an undeclared vacancy of the Vice Presidency?

[WMS]

Aye, and while I wish the Israelis would be more careful in how they are going about matters I wholeheartedly support the destruction of Hezbollah - I haven't forgotten what they did back in 1983. The only alternative solution I would back would be the disarmament and relocation of Hezbollah far, far away from Israel.

Actually, you might be one of the only ones in the Senate who was even alive in 1983

Well, me and Dave Hawk.

[jerusalemcar5]

From what I see, it looks like we're just stuck.  Also does the VP have the right to break ties on amendments?  I couldn't find the clause, so I'm unsure. 

[Jake]

3. The Vice President of the Republic of Atlasia shall be the President of the Senate, but shall have no vote unless they be equally divided.

[MasterJedi]

Bump to the top for Q, if he comes back.

[Јas]

Bump to the top for Q, if he comes back.

Given his unexplained time away since 17 July, I believe it is fair to describe the VP as absent (if not indeed having left the office vacant). Presumably, Article 1, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution is applicable:

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I would suggest that in the circumstances the PPT is entitled to lodge a casting vote. Whilest I presume that the PPT retains strong backing for the Israeli actions, I would rather that the Senate deals continues to try and deal with the issue rather than allow the resolution to flounder.
I would also like to propose an amendment to be added to the resolution:

Recognising the profoundly detrimental effect the conflict has had on innocent persons in the region, the Senate calls upon the Atlasian executive to persue active engagement in the conflict with the objective of ending the hostilities there with due haste.

[Colin]

Bump to the top for Q, if he comes back.

Given his unexplained time away since 17 July, I believe it is fair to describe the VP as absent (if not indeed having left the office vacant). Presumably, Article 1, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution is applicable:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I would suggest that in the circumstances the PPT is entitled to lodge a casting vote. Whilest I presume that the PPT retains strong backing for the Israeli actions, I would rather that the Senate deals continues to try and deal with the issue rather than allow the resolution to flounder.

That would be completely unconstitutional and, IIRC, against the regulations that the Senate has put forward. In order for the tie to be broken either Q needs to come back or a new VP must be selected.

[Јas]

Bump to the top for Q, if he comes back.

Given his unexplained time away since 17 July, I believe it is fair to describe the VP as absent (if not indeed having left the office vacant). Presumably, Article 1, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution is applicable:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I would suggest that in the circumstances the PPT is entitled to lodge a casting vote. Whilest I presume that the PPT retains strong backing for the Israeli actions, I would rather that the Senate deals continues to try and deal with the issue rather than allow the resolution to flounder.

That would be completely unconstitutional and, IIRC, against the regulations that the Senate has put forward. In order for the tie to be broken either Q needs to come back or a new VP must be selected.

For my own benefit, could you cite the relevant parts of the Constitution and of the OSPR which render the suggestion inoperable.

[MasterJedi]

Bump to the top for Q, if he comes back.

Given his unexplained time away since 17 July, I believe it is fair to describe the VP as absent (if not indeed having left the office vacant). Presumably, Article 1, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution is applicable:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I would suggest that in the circumstances the PPT is entitled to lodge a casting vote. Whilest I presume that the PPT retains strong backing for the Israeli actions, I would rather that the Senate deals continues to try and deal with the issue rather than allow the resolution to flounder.

That would be completely unconstitutional and, IIRC, against the regulations that the Senate has put forward. In order for the tie to be broken either Q needs to come back or a new VP must be selected.

For my own benefit, could you cite the relevant parts of the Constitution and of the OSPR which render the suggestion inoperable.

Article 1, Section 1, Clause 3 of the Constitution is all that talks about it. The VP breaks the tie and I can't do anything about it. And IIRC (not sure) the VP has 7 days to do it otherwise the amendment will fail.

[Democratic Hawk]

And we'll be no further forward as regards this matter, of quite urgency I might add. Any one know of the Vice-President's whereabouts?

'Hawk'

[Ebowed]

Someone could change their vote to Abstain.

[Colin]

Bump to the top for Q, if he comes back.

Given his unexplained time away since 17 July, I believe it is fair to describe the VP as absent (if not indeed having left the office vacant). Presumably, Article 1, Section 1, Clause 4 of the Constitution is applicable:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I would suggest that in the circumstances the PPT is entitled to lodge a casting vote. Whilest I presume that the PPT retains strong backing for the Israeli actions, I would rather that the Senate deals continues to try and deal with the issue rather than allow the resolution to flounder.

That would be completely unconstitutional and, IIRC, against the regulations that the Senate has put forward. In order for the tie to be broken either Q needs to come back or a new VP must be selected.

For my own benefit, could you cite the relevant parts of the Constitution and of the OSPR which render the suggestion inoperable.

Article 1, Section 1, Clause 3 of the Constitution is all that talks about it. The VP breaks the tie and I can't do anything about it. And IIRC (not sure) the VP has 7 days to do it otherwise the amendment will fail.

That is exactly the section that I was basing it off of. Also within the OSPR the Senate can only override the state powers of the PPT with regards to the introduction of legislation onto the Senate floor and the on budgetary and expired legislation matters. The powers of the PPT are precisely spelled out in Article 2 of the OSPR and in Article 1, Section 1, Clause 3 of the Constitution. In neither of these does it mention or make a statement of the President of the Senate's inability to discharge the office and powers therein given nor does it state that those powers, especially in a tie breaking scenario, devolve to the President Pro Tempore.

[jerusalemcar5]

Just in case this goes somewhere...

If Jedi amendment somehow passes: Nay.

If not: Aye.

[Јas]

IIRC (not sure) the VP has 7 days to do it otherwise the amendment will fail.

Given that more than 7 days have passed, can we assume the amendment has thus failed?

[MasterJedi]

IIRC (not sure) the VP has 7 days to do it otherwise the amendment will fail.

Given that more than 7 days have passed, can we assume the amendment has thus failed?

No, WMS tied the vote with an Aye on August 1, 7 days from that time to break the tie is tomorrow.

[Јas]

IIRC (not sure) the VP has 7 days to do it otherwise the amendment will fail.

Given that more than 7 days have passed, can we assume the amendment has thus failed?

No, WMS tied the vote with an Aye on August 1, 7 days from that time to break the tie is tomorrow.

Ah, I see. Apologies.

[MasterJedi]

With 5 Ayes, 5 Nays and 0 Abstentions and Q not around in the required time to break the tie, this amendment has failed.

[Jake]

Amendment:

Recognizing that the security and stability of the Middle East is threatened by the current conflict between Hezbollah and Israel,

The Atlasian Senate hereby recognizes that:
1. The terrorist group, Hezbollah, is acting without legitimate cause or grievance and is slaughtering innocent Israeli citizens.
2. It is acting with the tacit support of the Syrian and Iranian governments.

Thus the Atlasian Senate hereby:
1. Condemns Hezbollah, Syria and Iran.
2. Condemns Hezbollah for launching rockets from civilian areas, thus making Israel attack civilian areas and causing undue death of Lebanese citizens to protect its own citizens.
3. Gives support for the Israeli government to defend its territories and citizens against Hezballoh attacks.
4. Calls upon Syria and Iran to end their tacit support of Hezballoh.

[afleitch]

At this rate the war will be over by the time this gets passed....

[jerusalemcar5]

I motion for cloture following the vote on Jake's amendment which will obviously not pass since it still says nothing about Israel's actions that are disproportionate and mostly uncalled for.  This amendment will stall again.  *sigh*

[Democratic Hawk]

Think by any chance the Vice-President's over in the Lebanon right now trying to resolve this all on his pat ?

'Hawk'