DC Unrest Megathread

[Interlocutor is just not there yet]

Marjorie Taylor Greene?

I totally forgot about her for a minute.  But, yes, she is probably the #1 example of what Badger was talking about.  Still, my point stands that I don't believe most Republican officeholders really want to stick with Trumpism going forward.

GOP officeholders may not want to stick with it, but I feel their voters have a different opinion.

[Virginiá]

Hard to feel that great about people like Murkowski turning on him considering it's literally a couple weeks before he is leaving office anyway. If this happened a year ago, I think we'd be seeing far less dissent in the GOP ranks.

When dissent like this actually mattered, all these people were nowhere to be found or so much less forceful in their denunciations and actions that they might as well have done nothing at all.

[Calthrina950]

Many, many Trump supporters are utterly embarassed at what has happened, IRL and on forum.

Sure, but the question therefore is; are they still Trump supporters?  The answer to that will tell us all we need to know.

No, even that doesn't go far enough. It's easy for these profile in Courage last-minute converts to democracy to reject Trump in the last week and a half of his presidency when he is irrelevant towards conservatives maintaining political power and advancing their agenda. If they don't oppose Trump ISM, which encompasses all those jackass congressmen, Senators, Governors, and hundreds of assorted Republican officials who full bore stood by and parotid Trump's Fantastical claims of election fraud and incitements for Direct action.

If they can't bring themselves to throw out those individuals for at bare minimum a sane Republican like Nancy Mays, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Etc, or if not then bite the bullet and vote Democrat or third-party, then they've demonstrated they really don't give a crap. Between conservatism and democracy, they will choose the former every time.

Except for the fact that you could count on one hand the number of elected Republican politicians who are truly Trumpists.  Frankly, that list might begin and end with Josh Hawley.  And, even he is probably more pandering than anything.

Tuberville?  Gosar?  Mo Brooks?  Boebert?  Greene?  Gaetz?  We're already over one hand and those are just the first ones that jumped to mind.

Jim Jordan is another one that I can think of. As I was remarking elsewhere, the number of extremist ideologues in the Republican caucus is alarming to me.

How can we forget Big Louie Gohmert

Him also. I knew there was someone I was missing. I would have included Ken Buck also, but he shocked me by not voting for the objections.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Many, many Trump supporters are utterly embarassed at what has happened, IRL and on forum.

Sure, but the question therefore is; are they still Trump supporters?  The answer to that will tell us all we need to know.

No, even that doesn't go far enough. It's easy for these profile in Courage last-minute converts to democracy to reject Trump in the last week and a half of his presidency when he is irrelevant towards conservatives maintaining political power and advancing their agenda. If they don't oppose Trump ISM, which encompasses all those jackass congressmen, Senators, Governors, and hundreds of assorted Republican officials who full bore stood by and parotid Trump's Fantastical claims of election fraud and incitements for Direct action.

If they can't bring themselves to throw out those individuals for at bare minimum a sane Republican like Nancy Mays, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Etc, or if not then bite the bullet and vote Democrat or third-party, then they've demonstrated they really don't give a crap. Between conservatism and democracy, they will choose the former every time.

Except for the fact that you could count on one hand the number of elected Republican politicians who are truly Trumpists.  Frankly, that list might begin and end with Josh Hawley.  And, even he is probably more pandering than anything.

Tuberville?  Gosar?  Mo Brooks?  Boebert?  Greene?  Gaetz?  We're already over one hand and those are just the first ones that jumped to mind.

Jim Jordan is another one that I can think of. As I was remarking elsewhere, the number of extremist ideologues in the Republican caucus is alarming to me.

How can we forget Big Louie Gohmert

Don't leave out rising stars Bob Good and Mary Miller!

[Calthrina950]

Many, many Trump supporters are utterly embarassed at what has happened, IRL and on forum.

Sure, but the question therefore is; are they still Trump supporters?  The answer to that will tell us all we need to know.

No, even that doesn't go far enough. It's easy for these profile in Courage last-minute converts to democracy to reject Trump in the last week and a half of his presidency when he is irrelevant towards conservatives maintaining political power and advancing their agenda. If they don't oppose Trump ISM, which encompasses all those jackass congressmen, Senators, Governors, and hundreds of assorted Republican officials who full bore stood by and parotid Trump's Fantastical claims of election fraud and incitements for Direct action.

If they can't bring themselves to throw out those individuals for at bare minimum a sane Republican like Nancy Mays, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Etc, or if not then bite the bullet and vote Democrat or third-party, then they've demonstrated they really don't give a crap. Between conservatism and democracy, they will choose the former every time.

Except for the fact that you could count on one hand the number of elected Republican politicians who are truly Trumpists.  Frankly, that list might begin and end with Josh Hawley.  And, even he is probably more pandering than anything.

Tuberville?  Gosar?  Mo Brooks?  Boebert?  Greene?  Gaetz?  We're already over one hand and those are just the first ones that jumped to mind.

Jim Jordan is another one that I can think of. As I was remarking elsewhere, the number of extremist ideologues in the Republican caucus is alarming to me.

How can we forget Big Louie Gohmert

Don't leave out rising stars Bob Good and Mary Miller!

These two as well. They are major downgrades from Denver Riggleman and John Shimkus.

[Diabolical Materialism]

While the committed and open "Trumpist faction" of the GOP is a minority, it isn't just a handful of elected officials. This is a legitimate faction within the Republican Party.

[Badger]

Many, many Trump supporters are utterly embarassed at what has happened, IRL and on forum.

Sure, but the question therefore is; are they still Trump supporters?  The answer to that will tell us all we need to know.

No, even that doesn't go far enough. It's easy for these profile in Courage last-minute converts to democracy to reject Trump in the last week and a half of his presidency when he is irrelevant towards conservatives maintaining political power and advancing their agenda. If they don't oppose Trump ISM, which encompasses all those jackass congressmen, Senators, Governors, and hundreds of assorted Republican officials who full bore stood by and parotid Trump's Fantastical claims of election fraud and incitements for Direct action.

If they can't bring themselves to throw out those individuals for at bare minimum a sane Republican like Nancy Mays, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Etc, or if not then bite the bullet and vote Democrat or third-party, then they've demonstrated they really don't give a crap. Between conservatism and democracy, they will choose the former every time.

Except for the fact that you could count on one hand the number of elected Republican politicians who are truly Trumpists.  Frankly, that list might begin and end with Josh Hawley.  And, even he is probably more pandering than anything.

Unless you have 147 fingers on your hand, your math is way way off.

And that was just the members of Congress still willing to challenge the free and fair election results based on less credible evidence than the Nigerian prince email scam, EVEN AFTER ARMED RIOTERS STORMED THE CAPITOL BECAUSE OF THE "FRAUDULENT" VOTE! It doesn't include the various Governors, Statewide party officials, state senators and representatives across the country, etc etc who joined in loud and clear with this non-stop Litany of Lies, conspiracy theories, and inciting political violence.

Or again, you're simply trying to minimize how completely and thoroughly you were party remains infected with Trump ism even As Trump is getting ready to leave.

If you vote for Hawley or Cruise in 2024, again, you're a conservative first, and an American second. If you are even remotely inclined to consider that, you have some soul-searching to do.

Again, supposedly normal Republicans like you willing to accept and endorse Trump and his Unapologetic extreme authoritarianism for the last five years to get your conservative ideology / principles whatever enacted are absolutely just as much the problem here as the die-hard trumpists. Trump would have never come to power or been able to drag this country down to shame the way he has the past five years if it wasn't for voters like you. And if you sold your soul to this devil, you'll sell your soul to any future ones as well.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Kind of trivial at this point, but nevertheless amusing:

https://twitter.com/vplus/status/1347675040117088258

[Buffalo Mayor Young Kim]

Many, many Trump supporters are utterly embarassed at what has happened, IRL and on forum.

Sure, but the question therefore is; are they still Trump supporters?  The answer to that will tell us all we need to know.

No, even that doesn't go far enough. It's easy for these profile in Courage last-minute converts to democracy to reject Trump in the last week and a half of his presidency when he is irrelevant towards conservatives maintaining political power and advancing their agenda. If they don't oppose Trump ISM, which encompasses all those jackass congressmen, Senators, Governors, and hundreds of assorted Republican officials who full bore stood by and parotid Trump's Fantastical claims of election fraud and incitements for Direct action.

If they can't bring themselves to throw out those individuals for at bare minimum a sane Republican like Nancy Mays, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Etc, or if not then bite the bullet and vote Democrat or third-party, then they've demonstrated they really don't give a crap. Between conservatism and democracy, they will choose the former every time.

Except for the fact that you could count on one hand the number of elected Republican politicians who are truly Trumpists.  Frankly, that list might begin and end with Josh Hawley.  And, even he is probably more pandering than anything.

Tuberville?  Gosar?  Mo Brooks?  Boebert?  Greene?  Gaetz?  We're already over one hand and those are just the first ones that jumped to mind.

Jim Jordan is another one that I can think of. As I was remarking elsewhere, the number of extremist ideologues in the Republican caucus is alarming to me.

How can we forget Big Louie Gohmert

Don't leave out rising stars Bob Good and Mary Miller!

These two as well. They are major downgrades from Denver Riggleman and John Shimkus.

I couldn’t imagine anyone being a downgrade from Shimkus, but here we are.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I didn't have Lindsey Graham being chased through an airport by an angry mob of Trumpists on my 2021 bingo card. lol

Serves him right.

Wait, what? Link?

I was just taking TG's word for it.

[H.E. VOLODYMYR ZELENKSYY]

Many, many Trump supporters are utterly embarassed at what has happened, IRL and on forum.

Sure, but the question therefore is; are they still Trump supporters?  The answer to that will tell us all we need to know.

No, even that doesn't go far enough. It's easy for these profile in Courage last-minute converts to democracy to reject Trump in the last week and a half of his presidency when he is irrelevant towards conservatives maintaining political power and advancing their agenda. If they don't oppose Trump ISM, which encompasses all those jackass congressmen, Senators, Governors, and hundreds of assorted Republican officials who full bore stood by and parotid Trump's Fantastical claims of election fraud and incitements for Direct action.

If they can't bring themselves to throw out those individuals for at bare minimum a sane Republican like Nancy Mays, Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Etc, or if not then bite the bullet and vote Democrat or third-party, then they've demonstrated they really don't give a crap. Between conservatism and democracy, they will choose the former every time.

Except for the fact that you could count on one hand the number of elected Republican politicians who are truly Trumpists.  Frankly, that list might begin and end with Josh Hawley.  And, even he is probably more pandering than anything.

Tuberville?  Gosar?  Mo Brooks?  Boebert?  Greene?  Gaetz?  We're already over one hand and those are just the first ones that jumped to mind.

Jim Jordan is another one that I can think of. As I was remarking elsewhere, the number of extremist ideologues in the Republican caucus is alarming to me.

How can we forget Big Louie Gohmert

Don't leave out rising stars Bob Good and Mary Miller!

These two as well. They are major downgrades from Denver Riggleman and John Shimkus.

I couldn’t imagine anyone being a downgrade from Shimkus, but here we are.

Nor I from Denver “Bigfoot Erotica” Riggleman.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

https://twitter.com/seattlepi/status/1347660852850270210

What are chances that they actually resign or that the Senate expel them by 2/3?

Must be pretty close to nonexistent.

I'll predict now that the outcome will be a vote of censure against Hawley at least.  Less sure about Cruz.

That definitely seems plausible.

Yeah, a censure seems both the most appropriate and likely move in this case.

[Gass3268]

https://twitter.com/yashar/status/1347681193479655424?s=21

[Hammy]

https://twitter.com/seattlepi/status/1347660852850270210

What are chances that they actually resign or that the Senate expel them by 2/3?

Must be pretty close to nonexistent.

I'll predict now that the outcome will be a vote of censure against Hawley at least.  Less sure about Cruz.

That definitely seems plausible.

Yeah, a censure seems both the most appropriate and likely move in this case.

Most likely, yes. Most appropriate however would be sedition charges.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

https://twitter.com/seattlepi/status/1347660852850270210

What are chances that they actually resign or that the Senate expel them by 2/3?

Must be pretty close to nonexistent.

I'll predict now that the outcome will be a vote of censure against Hawley at least.  Less sure about Cruz.

That definitely seems plausible.

Yeah, a censure seems both the most appropriate and likely move in this case.

Most likely, yes. Most appropriate however would be sedition charges.

Sedition charges imo would make sense for Hawley for moving the Pennsylvania objection even after the attack, but for Cruz they would be much harder to sustain legally or morally. My own stance is that Cruz should be censured, Hawley expelled, and every member of the House who put forward the Pennsylvania objection censured.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I cannot in good conscience advocate for sedition charges being given to either of them primarily because of how terribly abused the precedent in this instance, however valid it could possibly be argued to be, would end up being, years down the line.
A censure is painful enough. Word it as harshly as befits the situation, which is to say, very harshly.

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

https://twitter.com/seattlepi/status/1347660852850270210

What are chances that they actually resign or that the Senate expel them by 2/3?

Must be pretty close to nonexistent.

I'll predict now that the outcome will be a vote of censure against Hawley at least.  Less sure about Cruz.

That definitely seems plausible.

Yeah, a censure seems both the most appropriate and likely move in this case.

Most likely, yes. Most appropriate however would be sedition charges.

Sedition charges imo would make sense for Hawley for moving the Pennsylvania objection even after the attack, but for Cruz they would be much harder to sustain legally or morally. My own stance is that Cruz should be censured, Hawley expelled, and every member of the House who put forward the Pennsylvania objection censured.

I don't know if there is a meaningful difference morally between moving the objection and voting to sustain it, but there might be a legal distinction —I'm not aware.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

https://twitter.com/seattlepi/status/1347660852850270210

What are chances that they actually resign or that the Senate expel them by 2/3?

Must be pretty close to nonexistent.

I'll predict now that the outcome will be a vote of censure against Hawley at least.  Less sure about Cruz.

That definitely seems plausible.

Yeah, a censure seems both the most appropriate and likely move in this case.

Most likely, yes. Most appropriate however would be sedition charges.

Sedition charges imo would make sense for Hawley for moving the Pennsylvania objection even after the attack, but for Cruz they would be much harder to sustain legally or morally. My own stance is that Cruz should be censured, Hawley expelled, and every member of the House who put forward the Pennsylvania objection censured.

I don't know if there is a meaningful difference morally between moving the objection and voting to sustain it, but there might be a legal distinction —I'm not aware.

The only reason I don't want everybody who voted to sustain either objection censured and every House member who announced an objection after the attack expelled is for the propaganda benefit of showing restraint.

[Born to Slay. Forced to Work.]

I didn't have Lindsey Graham being chased through an airport by an angry mob of Trumpists on my 2021 bingo card. lol

Love that for him

[Gass3268]

https://twitter.com/oneunderscore__/status/1347684684310982660?s=21

[Middle-aged Europe]

https://twitter.com/oneunderscore__/status/1347684684310982660?s=21

It's true, I just wanted to access his account. It's gone.

[Born to Slay. Forced to Work.]

https://twitter.com/oneunderscore__/status/1347684684310982660?s=21

Now suspend hun from america

[Badger]

https://twitter.com/seattlepi/status/1347660852850270210

What are chances that they actually resign or that the Senate expel them by 2/3?

Must be pretty close to nonexistent.

I'll predict now that the outcome will be a vote of censure against Hawley at least.  Less sure about Cruz.

That definitely seems plausible.

Yeah, a censure seems both the most appropriate and likely move in this case.

Most likely, yes. Most appropriate however would be sedition charges.

Sedition charges imo would make sense for Hawley for moving the Pennsylvania objection even after the attack, but for Cruz they would be much harder to sustain legally or morally. My own stance is that Cruz should be censured, Hawley expelled, and every member of the House who put forward the Pennsylvania objection censured.

I don't know if there is a meaningful difference morally between moving the objection and voting to sustain it, but there might be a legal distinction —I'm not aware.

The only reason I don't want everybody who voted to sustain either objection censured and every House member who announced an objection after the attack expelled is for the propaganda benefit of showing restraint.

Yeah? How's that strategy been working out for us the Last 5 Years?

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

I cannot in good conscience advocate for sedition charges being given to either of them because of how terribly abused the precedent in this instance, however valid it could possibly be argued to be, would end up being, years down the line.
A censure is painful enough. Word it as harshly as befits the situation, which is to say, very harshly.

I am really tired of hearing how we can't hold politicians accountable for their actions because of some vague notion of "precedent." Very disappointing.

[Clarko95 📚💰📈]

shoulda done this six years ago when he started his campaign by slandering Mexicans