Special Election megathread (6/11: OH-6, 6/25: CO-4)

[Stuart98]

Also, no one is trying to "cancel" Turner. Stop being ridiculous.

From the getgo, Turner was the one acting as if she *deserved* the nomination. Maybe it's good someone knocked her down a few pegs and made her realize she's not inevitable here.

Repeating the same argument I already refuted doesn't make it any more true. Given the DNC's continued platforming of others who conditionalized their vote from the right, it's clear that Turner is being cancelled because they don't want another progressive in the House.

See this is where the far left loses people. Shontel Brown is not a republican. It's always the 'far left' vs everyone else in the Democratic Party. You know you can be a progressive and be a Democrat without being like Nina Turner, right?

Correct; Shontel Brown is not a progressive however and her transphobia should disqualify her from even approaching a victory in a democratic primary in and of itself; that it hasn't done so is disappointing.

[Adam Griffin]

Spoiler alert: he's not talking about Shontel Brown. He's talking about other examples where the Democratic Party establishment excuses or otherwise elevates former Republicans (or those who have carried water for them) while freaking out over people who haven't voted Republican but who don't carry buckets worth of the establishment's bile.

If you need an example from just this week alone, let's look at how the most populous persuadable nation in the most geopolitically volatile region in the world will now have an ambassador who spent years s[inks]tting on the Democratic Party and blocking its agenda, but gets forgiven instantly because he once said "Muh Trump Is Just a Bridge Too Far!!!11".

[wbrocks67]

https://twitter.com/HotlineJosh/status/1415622567742873600

[wbrocks67]

Also, no one is trying to "cancel" Turner. Stop being ridiculous.

From the getgo, Turner was the one acting as if she *deserved* the nomination. Maybe it's good someone knocked her down a few pegs and made her realize she's not inevitable here.

Repeating the same argument I already refuted doesn't make it any more true. Given the DNC's continued platforming of others who conditionalized their vote from the right, it's clear that Turner is being cancelled because they don't want another progressive in the House.

See this is where the far left loses people. Shontel Brown is not a republican. It's always the 'far left' vs everyone else in the Democratic Party. You know you can be a progressive and be a Democrat without being like Nina Turner, right?

Correct; Shontel Brown is not a progressive however and her transphobia should disqualify her from even approaching a victory in a democratic primary in and of itself; that it hasn't done so is disappointing.

And where is the proof that Brown is transphobic?

[RussFeingoldWasRobbed]

If Turner was not running, Browns transgender remarks would have led to the DNC denouncing her and treating her like a pariah. You can't convince me otherwise

[PSOL]

Well the people who voted brown prior to a month back had some valuable insights into this race. I would change my rating to lean-Shontel Brown.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

https://twitter.com/HotlineJosh/status/1415622567742873600

wbrocks: Shontel Brown is not a Republican

Also wbrocks: Here is this Republican poll that shows that Shontel Brown is tied with Turner

[wbrocks67]

https://twitter.com/HotlineJosh/status/1415622567742873600

wbrocks: Shontel Brown is not a Republican

Also wbrocks: Here is this Republican poll that shows that Shontel Brown is tied with Turner

I'm just sharing the info.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

idk man when a candidate has the same views on trans people as Republican and is backed by Republicans, they're probably a Republican.

[Left Wing]

Also, no one is trying to "cancel" Turner. Stop being ridiculous.

From the getgo, Turner was the one acting as if she *deserved* the nomination. Maybe it's good someone knocked her down a few pegs and made her realize she's not inevitable here.

Repeating the same argument I already refuted doesn't make it any more true. Given the DNC's continued platforming of others who conditionalized their vote from the right, it's clear that Turner is being cancelled because they don't want another progressive in the House.

See this is where the far left loses people. Shontel Brown is not a republican. It's always the 'far left' vs everyone else in the Democratic Party. You know you can be a progressive and be a Democrat without being like Nina Turner, right?

Correct; Shontel Brown is not a progressive however and her transphobia should disqualify her from even approaching a victory in a democratic primary in and of itself; that it hasn't done so is disappointing.

And where is the proof that Brown is transphobic?

I mean, read the thread? It’s on page 13.

[GeneralMacArthur]

Also, no one is trying to "cancel" Turner. Stop being ridiculous.

From the getgo, Turner was the one acting as if she *deserved* the nomination. Maybe it's good someone knocked her down a few pegs and made her realize she's not inevitable here.

Repeating the same argument I already refuted doesn't make it any more true. Given the DNC's continued platforming of others who conditionalized their vote from the right, it's clear that Turner is being cancelled because they don't want another progressive in the House.

See this is where the far left loses people. Shontel Brown is not a republican. It's always the 'far left' vs everyone else in the Democratic Party. You know you can be a progressive and be a Democrat without being like Nina Turner, right?

Correct; Shontel Brown is not a progressive however and her transphobia should disqualify her from even approaching a victory in a democratic primary in and of itself; that it hasn't done so is disappointing.

And where is the proof that Brown is transphobic?

I mean, read the thread? It’s on page 13.

One of the many, many, many extremely annoying and juvenile things the Nina Turner left likes to do is:

1) Take one single incident or statement from a politician, that's either obviously out of step with their actual beliefs/personality, or possible to misrepresent as such by taking it out of context and/or lying about it

2) Try to convince everyone that incident/statement is completely representative of their actual beliefs/personality, and everything else they've done to the contrary can be dismissed as "just an act"

3) Hyperbolize about it to absurd, comical extremes

4) Use the hyperbole as a weapon to try and cancel the politician and ruthlessly attack anyone who dares to support her


It's a pattern we see over and over again and now we're seeing them do it by labeling Shontel Brown a "transphobe" over one single incident where she accidentally misgendered someone and then immediately apologized.

Never mind the thousands of other times where she's spoken about trans people without misgendering them.  Never mind that it was obviously a mistake and she apologized for it.  Nope, they're going to pretend that she was doing it on purpose to let us know what a transphobe she is, and all the other times she's been respectful of trans people are just putting on an act to hide her transphobia.  Of course just misgendering someone once doesn't make you a transphobe, especially since she obviously wasn't doing it in an asshole Tucker Carlson way to signal that she doesn't respect the transition, but if they're going to lie about Shontel, why not go all the way?  Shontel Brown is basically a member of the Westboro Baptist Church and you are a terrible, terrible, terrible person if you support her!

It's just so obviously childish, manipulative and dishonest, and I don't get how more people aren't insulted by leftists like sawx constantly trying to lie to us with this kind of crap.  Like why am I the only one on Atlas with the balls to call this crap out for what it is?  Why am I the only one who notices these patterns?

[GeneralMacArthur]

Well the people who voted brown prior to a month back had some valuable insights into this race. I would change my rating to lean-Shontel Brown.

I voted Shontel Brown five months ago, and here's what I wrote then.  Of course this was before Nina got a solid set of local endorsements as well, but most of the points still hold up:

I don't know why Brown's supporters haven't updated that Wikipedia article, but on Twitter I've seen her getting endorsements from dozens of state/local officials, unions, and other organizations.

Meanwhile Turner's section of the article lists a bunch of people who don't live in Ohio.  Yeah I'm not surprised she got endorsed by Krystal Ball, Shaun King, Marianne Williamson, Susan Sarandon and Ilhan Omar.  I don't think those endorsements will carry much weight in OH-11.  But they certainly make her endorsements list really long.

Clinton beat Sanders by 56-43 in 2016, but in the 11th district she stomped him 68-32.  Obviously there's no signal from 2020 because Biden trashed Sanders everywhere in the state.  But Nina's entire set of endorsements just frames her as "Bernie's candidate" which I don't think is an advantage in the 11th district.

So from a million miles away, it looks to me like one candidate is running a national campaign while the other is running a very local campaign.  Nina has endorsements from Bernie and his crew of Hollywood celebrities, Justice Dem congresswomen, YouTubers and podcast hosts.  Shontel doesn't have any podcast hosts on her side but she does have the 11th district steelworker's union or whatever.  Which will matter more?

There's also the fact that Shontel is likely to score the endorsement of Fudge herself.  That could end up being all that matters.

I could be wrong of course, Nina is going to have a massive fundraising advantage (she's already outraising Shontel 15-1) from running her national campaign.  But from the votes in this poll you'd think Shontel only has a 3-5% chance of winning and I'd definitely take those odds.  Cenk Uygur spent nearly $2,000,000 on his CA-25 Congressional run and ended up getting 4%.  You can't just buy seats these days.

There's also the split race factor -- Nina could win with 30% just like the Sanders campaign planned to during the primary.  Hopefully Marcia Fudge's endorsement will clear the field for Brown.

[jdk]

Turner's congressional campaign is really starting to look more and more like Andrew Yang's mayoral run: early huge lead in a crowded field based on name recognition (in Yang's case from the 2020 election run, in Turner's case she bought the lead with an early ad blitz), only for the campaign to fall apart once they get to the home stretch and people start paying attention and learn more about the candidates and discover just how awful they really are.

[GALeftist]

Also, no one is trying to "cancel" Turner. Stop being ridiculous.

From the getgo, Turner was the one acting as if she *deserved* the nomination. Maybe it's good someone knocked her down a few pegs and made her realize she's not inevitable here.

Repeating the same argument I already refuted doesn't make it any more true. Given the DNC's continued platforming of others who conditionalized their vote from the right, it's clear that Turner is being cancelled because they don't want another progressive in the House.

See this is where the far left loses people. Shontel Brown is not a republican. It's always the 'far left' vs everyone else in the Democratic Party. You know you can be a progressive and be a Democrat without being like Nina Turner, right?

Correct; Shontel Brown is not a progressive however and her transphobia should disqualify her from even approaching a victory in a democratic primary in and of itself; that it hasn't done so is disappointing.

And where is the proof that Brown is transphobic?

I mean, read the thread? It’s on page 13.

One of the many, many, many extremely annoying and juvenile things the Nina Turner left likes to do is:

1) Take one single incident or statement from a politician, that's either obviously out of step with their actual beliefs/personality, or possible to misrepresent as such by taking it out of context and/or lying about it

2) Try to convince everyone that incident/statement is completely representative of their actual beliefs/personality, and everything else they've done to the contrary can be dismissed as "just an act"

3) Hyperbolize about it to absurd, comical extremes

4) Use the hyperbole as a weapon to try and cancel the politician and ruthlessly attack anyone who dares to support her

I realize this is an obvious dunk and I really shouldn't bother but at this point there are 21 pages of you whining about the "bowl of sh*t" comment to characterize a longtime Democrat as some sort of fifth column determined to turn the Democratic party into the Communist Party or destroy it trying

[Left Wing]

Also, no one is trying to "cancel" Turner. Stop being ridiculous.

From the getgo, Turner was the one acting as if she *deserved* the nomination. Maybe it's good someone knocked her down a few pegs and made her realize she's not inevitable here.

Repeating the same argument I already refuted doesn't make it any more true. Given the DNC's continued platforming of others who conditionalized their vote from the right, it's clear that Turner is being cancelled because they don't want another progressive in the House.

See this is where the far left loses people. Shontel Brown is not a republican. It's always the 'far left' vs everyone else in the Democratic Party. You know you can be a progressive and be a Democrat without being like Nina Turner, right?

Correct; Shontel Brown is not a progressive however and her transphobia should disqualify her from even approaching a victory in a democratic primary in and of itself; that it hasn't done so is disappointing.

And where is the proof that Brown is transphobic?

I mean, read the thread? It’s on page 13.

One of the many, many, many extremely annoying and juvenile things the Nina Turner left likes to do is:

1) Take one single incident or statement from a politician, that's either obviously out of step with their actual beliefs/personality, or possible to misrepresent as such by taking it out of context and/or lying about it

2) Try to convince everyone that incident/statement is completely representative of their actual beliefs/personality, and everything else they've done to the contrary can be dismissed as "just an act"

3) Hyperbolize about it to absurd, comical extremes

4) Use the hyperbole as a weapon to try and cancel the politician and ruthlessly attack anyone who dares to support her


It's a pattern we see over and over again and now we're seeing them do it by labeling Shontel Brown a "transphobe" over one single incident where she accidentally misgendered someone and then immediately apologized.

Never mind the thousands of other times where she's spoken about trans people without misgendering them.  Never mind that it was obviously a mistake and she apologized for it.  Nope, they're going to pretend that she was doing it on purpose to let us know what a transphobe she is, and all the other times she's been respectful of trans people are just putting on an act to hide her transphobia.  Of course just misgendering someone once doesn't make you a transphobe, especially since she obviously wasn't doing it in an asshole Tucker Carlson way to signal that she doesn't respect the transition, but if they're going to lie about Shontel, why not go all the way?  Shontel Brown is basically a member of the Westboro Baptist Church and you are a terrible, terrible, terrible person if you support her!

It's just so obviously childish, manipulative and dishonest, and I don't get how more people aren't insulted by leftists like sawx constantly trying to lie to us with this kind of crap.  Like why am I the only one on Atlas with the balls to call this crap out for what it is?  Why am I the only one who notices these patterns?

Look, I don’t even support Turner or really care about this race at all, but if you can’t see why what she said is upsetting and disqualifying for many people, that’s just absurd. Typing long winded posts like these full of straw men isn’t convincing  anyone’s mind on this race and just comes across as desperate.

[GeneralMacArthur]

I realize this is an obvious dunk and I really shouldn't bother but at this point there are 21 pages of you whining about the "bowl of sh*t" comment to characterize a longtime Democrat as some sort of fifth column determined to turn the Democratic party into the Communist Party or destroy it trying

This is a complete lie.  Firstly, a solid chunk of my posts in this thread are just posting Shontel endorsements or Turner atrocities that Atlas doesn't want to talk about.  Secondly, I've got about three dozen different things I've gone after Nina Turner for, it's not just her "bowl of s--t" comment, which I actually don't think I've even mentioned other than the linked post.

And I don't actually have that many posts in this thread.  I have 25 posts in this entire thread, barely over one per page, and like I said half of them are just Brown getting endorsements or Turner saying something terrible.  But it probably seems like I have more because every time I post, a bunch of people pile on to tell me how much they can't wait to see me cry when Turner wins, or whatever.  So there's a lot more "Quote from: GeneralMacArthur" posts than actual posts by me.

Look, I don’t even support Turner or really care about this race at all, but if you can’t see why what she said is upsetting and disqualifying for many people, that’s just absurd. Typing long winded posts like these full of straw men isn’t convincing  anyone’s mind on this race and just comes across as desperate.

If people are still upset at Shontel and wanting to disqualify her after they find out it was a one-time mistake that she apologized for, that's silly but that's on them.  But that isn't what's happening here.  What's happening is sawx and other Turner stans running around lying about Shontel like this incident proves she's some lifelong transphobe who hates trans people.  They're intentionally misrepresenting the incident to try and smear Shontel, and they know it.  It's very cynical and calculated.

[Calthrina950]

How is Shontel Brown a transphobe? I listened to that segment, and the most you could accuse her of would be the offense of "misgendering". From the tone that she used and the language that she used, I didn't get the impression that she was bigoted or prejudiced. As I've said elsewhere, you have legitimately hateful people out there who ought to be criticized, but there are many reasonable people who don't fully understand all of the nuances around gender identity and sexual orientation, and the like, but who are supportive of LGBT rights and who are trying to seek greater understanding about the issue. This woman seems to fall into that category.

[Lief 🗽]

Yikes, looks like that Free Beacon poll may be true if they’re bringing in the big guns like this!
https://twitter.com/daveweigel/status/1415731970672365579?s=21

[Horus]

Shontel Brown is a sub par, boring candidate and Turner is clearly the better option, but that wasn't transphobic. False accusations such as this are why people have a hard time taking certain parts of the left seriously. Somehow literally EVERYTHING gets related back to trans issues with these people.

[GALeftist]

My take on the whole Shontel Brown transphobia thing is she's probably not any more transphobic than the median Democrat (which to be honest doesn't say a whole lot, unfortunately). However, the fact that she was so careless with her pronoun usage when talking about a black trans woman who died isn't nothing, and demonstrates at the very least a level of disengagement with the issue which some voters would be totally justified in not being comfortable with for a Democratic nominee.

[coloradocowboi]

Shontel Brown is a sub par, boring candidate and Turner is clearly the better option, but that wasn't transphobic. False accusations such as this are why people have a hard time taking certain parts of the left seriously. Somehow literally EVERYTHING gets related back to trans issues with these people.

Maybe it's because... transgender people almost all face some degree of violence, discrimination, and marginalization daily and therefore it's the most important issue in many LGBTQ peoples' lives?

Like can you fathom and understand that people have different experiences from yours and resultantly different priorities? Anyway, as a gay person, I get why people are pissed off.

Which brings me to....

One of the many, many, many extremely annoying and juvenile things the Nina Turner left likes to do is:

1) Take one single incident or statement from a politician, that's either obviously out of step with their actual beliefs/personality, or possible to misrepresent as such by taking it out of context and/or lying about it

2) Try to convince everyone that incident/statement is completely representative of their actual beliefs/personality, and everything else they've done to the contrary can be dismissed as "just an act"

3) Hyperbolize about it to absurd, comical extremes

4) Use the hyperbole as a weapon to try and cancel the politician and ruthlessly attack anyone who dares to support her


It's a pattern we see over and over again and now we're seeing them do it by labeling Shontel Brown a "transphobe" over one single incident where she accidentally misgendered someone and then immediately apologized.

Never mind the thousands of other times where she's spoken about trans people without misgendering them.  Never mind that it was obviously a mistake and she apologized for it.  Nope, they're going to pretend that she was doing it on purpose to let us know what a transphobe she is, and all the other times she's been respectful of trans people are just putting on an act to hide her transphobia.  Of course just misgendering someone once doesn't make you a transphobe, especially since she obviously wasn't doing it in an asshole Tucker Carlson way to signal that she doesn't respect the transition, but if they're going to lie about Shontel, why not go all the way?  Shontel Brown is basically a member of the Westboro Baptist Church and you are a terrible, terrible, terrible person if you support her!

It's just so obviously childish, manipulative and dishonest, and I don't get how more people aren't insulted by leftists like sawx constantly trying to lie to us with this kind of crap.  Like why am I the only one on Atlas with the balls to call this crap out for what it is?  Why am I the only one who notices these patterns?

One of the most juvenile and annoying thing that centrist, neoliberal moderates do is campaign on social justice, antiracism, and equality when they are running against a fascist in a campaign, promising to include marginalized people in gov't and to focus on their issues only to turn around a few months after a campaign and demand that they shut up, all the while refusing to do anything at all.

It shocks me (well not in your case, but still...) that people are more offended by marginalized people speaking their truths than the fact that the corrupt octogenarian you shoved down anybody's throat has accomplished absolutely nothing as president and is driving our country right back toward total Republican rule.

You can't even make this argument without hyperbole too. Nobody called her mistakes Westboro Baptist Church level transphobia--you did! Because for you it's all just a projection. Transgender people are pawns to be moved against your imagined political enemies because of some weird tribal loyalty to liberalism, and not because you care at all about making their lives better. So, excuse me if some LGBTQ people are gonna be loud with our grievances. Evidently, based on your inability to comprehend or take them seriously, we should be even louder.

Shontel Brown is a sub par, boring candidate and Turner is clearly the better option, but that wasn't transphobic. False accusations such as this are why people have a hard time taking certain parts of the left seriously. Somehow literally EVERYTHING gets related back to trans issues with these people.

Like can't you dummies fathom that when your daily experience is full of discrimination and violence that it will be your main concern? It's not that difficult if you can achieve the same task elementary school aged children do all the time called empathy.

Anyway, y'all's loss if you can't, because if Shontel Brown loses it looks like it will be a narrower margin than originally thought at this point, and she could really use that LGBTQ vote. Obviously, she'll never get it because like you two's her politics is all about shutting marginalized people up and not listening to them.

[Holmes]

Also, no one is trying to "cancel" Turner. Stop being ridiculous.

From the getgo, Turner was the one acting as if she *deserved* the nomination. Maybe it's good someone knocked her down a few pegs and made her realize she's not inevitable here.

Repeating the same argument I already refuted doesn't make it any more true. Given the DNC's continued platforming of others who conditionalized their vote from the right, it's clear that Turner is being cancelled because they don't want another progressive in the House.

See this is where the far left loses people. Shontel Brown is not a republican. It's always the 'far left' vs everyone else in the Democratic Party. You know you can be a progressive and be a Democrat without being like Nina Turner, right?

Correct; Shontel Brown is not a progressive however and her transphobia should disqualify her from even approaching a victory in a democratic primary in and of itself; that it hasn't done so is disappointing.

And where is the proof that Brown is transphobic?

I mean, read the thread? It’s on page 13.

One of the many, many, many extremely annoying and juvenile things the Nina Turner left likes to do is:

1) Take one single incident or statement from a politician, that's either obviously out of step with their actual beliefs/personality, or possible to misrepresent as such by taking it out of context and/or lying about it

2) Try to convince everyone that incident/statement is completely representative of their actual beliefs/personality, and everything else they've done to the contrary can be dismissed as "just an act"

3) Hyperbolize about it to absurd, comical extremes

4) Use the hyperbole as a weapon to try and cancel the politician and ruthlessly attack anyone who dares to support her


It's a pattern we see over and over again and now we're seeing them do it by labeling Shontel Brown a "transphobe" over one single incident where she accidentally misgendered someone and then immediately apologized.

Never mind the thousands of other times where she's spoken about trans people without misgendering them.  Never mind that it was obviously a mistake and she apologized for it.  Nope, they're going to pretend that she was doing it on purpose to let us know what a transphobe she is, and all the other times she's been respectful of trans people are just putting on an act to hide her transphobia.  Of course just misgendering someone once doesn't make you a transphobe, especially since she obviously wasn't doing it in an asshole Tucker Carlson way to signal that she doesn't respect the transition, but if they're going to lie about Shontel, why not go all the way?  Shontel Brown is basically a member of the Westboro Baptist Church and you are a terrible, terrible, terrible person if you support her!

It's just so obviously childish, manipulative and dishonest, and I don't get how more people aren't insulted by leftists like sawx constantly trying to lie to us with this kind of crap.  Like why am I the only one on Atlas with the balls to call this crap out for what it is?  Why am I the only one who notices these patterns?

You can actually not write a 10 paragraph post excusing transphobic microaggressions and then go on about how only “the far left!!” is offended by what happened. So annoying.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

How is Shontel Brown a transphobe? I listened to that segment, and the most you could accuse her of would be the offense of "misgendering". From the tone that she used and the language that she used, I didn't get the impression that she was bigoted or prejudiced. As I've said elsewhere, you have legitimately hateful people out there who ought to be criticized, but there are many reasonable people who don't fully understand all of the nuances around gender identity and sexual orientation, and the like, but who are supportive of LGBT rights and who are trying to seek greater understanding about the issue. This woman seems to fall into that category.

Frankly, people who call Shontel Brown a transphobe are unintentionally doing bigots a favor by watering down the term through overuse and thus making it harder for them to be called out effectively. Save the term for actual transphobes; let's not use it as political football against Dems we don't like.

[GeneralMacArthur]

By the way here is Shontel's apology after the forum.  This is your "transphobe."

I appreciate the request to clarify my statement from last night’s equality forum.

I was fortunate to learn more about the struggles of the LGBTQIA+ community from my friend before their passing and was able to acknowledge and use my privilege to support many of the unaddressed issues.

Out of respect for my friend I did not share their name as I discussed their tragic passing, but I did refer to them as “he.”

To be clear, my friend didn’t always present themself as a woman, but when doing so I would refer to my friend as she. When my friend presented as a man, I would address them as he.  As I mentioned in the forum, I knew them since we were children and while they spent most of their life identifying as a man, I have always been respectful to refer to them how they wanted to be referred to.

Like everyone, I make mistakes – I am still learning, and sometimes I trip up. I am working every day to be better – and I sincerely apologize to everyone in the trans community for my mistake. I will always stand with the trans community – who are under attack here in Ohio from a Republican Party that is working tirelessly every day to strip their basic human rights.

Nearly every day we learn of another murdered trans woman of color. And our leaders – in Ohio, and in Washington – have done little to stop this epidemic of violence. When elected, my door will always be open. I will never stop fighting for the rights of trans people and will hold myself and others in my own party to account when they fail to speak up.

My goal last night was to be as open about my own experience losing a friend, who was a member of the trans community, when asked about violence against black trans women and how more needs to be done to address them specifically.

I am also committed to respecting any and every person’s preferred pronouns and I will continue to lead by learning and do the work as an ally and advocate for the LGBTQIA+ and other underrepresented communities.

Thank you for being a voice in this great democracy and I appreciate all of the work you do.

Of course, the path to trans rights is via a draconian approach where simple, honest mistakes are grounds for ruthless demonization and cancellation, and then apologies are never accepted so any imperfection results in permanent, inescapable condemnation to the fires of hell.  That's really the best way to get people on your side and help reluctant allies adapt to an unfamiliar new reality.  Just kill them the second they step out of lines they're still trying to get used to.

Bonus points if you, Robespierre, are not actually trans yourself, but you're feigning outrage on behalf of trans people and rejecting the apology on their behalf, because this is just a game to you and trans people are just a political weapon.

[YE]

Do I need to lock this thread temporarily? This is a political forum for discussion not a contest on whoever can be more argumentative.