COVID-19 Megathread 6: Return of the Omicron

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https://twitter.com/yascha_mounk/status/1297226437905260545?s=21

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https://twitter.com/cnn/status/1298582772932648960?s=21

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I think Texas and Mississippi were probably too quick to remove restrictions, but when is the right time to lift them? It seems like the virus won't be truly eradicated and we'll have to live with it like the flu.

Probably April-ish once almost everyone post 65 and high risk people 14-65 have it.

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COVID cases down to record lows not seen since September in Texas, three weeks after Gov Abbott allowed the mask mandates to expire.  There has been zero coverage of this from mainstream media outlets outside Fox News.  I wonder why. 🤔

Answer: Because the mainstream media is totally, completely corrupt and in the tank for the democratic party. Also: they get more $$$ from fearmongering

Hard edge there.

Am I wrong? How are CNN/MSNBC/ABC/WAPO not in the tank for the democratic party? They're only slightly less partisan than Fox News. You make more $$$ by appealing to a specific audience, and that specific audience are democratic-aligned partisan.

I do love when the right says this, well, the truth, the actual truth, generally does tilt to the left. Guess that means everything is biased and bad!

But the truth is that COVID cases went down in TX over the past month. Why are CNN/ABC/WAPO/etc. not reporting about this? Why aren't they saying the truth? They kept telling us that COVID cases would skyrocket. But they didn't. Why are they not giving us the accurate information?

They also carried water for Andrew Cuomo for months and months despite his super sh!tty record.

I don’t really disagree with what your saying but I don’t think it’s as simple as they’re in the tank for the Democratic Party. They’re just looking for clicks.

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There’s no need to close this thread altogether (we don’t need a new one really) or rename it (title is creative and technically accurate). Stop requesting such.

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Serious mitigation efforts are not needed until our hospital systems become at risk of being overrun. There’s way too much fearmongering in this thread.

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https://twitter.com/erictopol/status/1416443085798526976?s=21

https://twitter.com/erictopol/status/1417562950471090179?s=21

Vaccines do work very well against containing the virus. Israel numbers seem weirdly low in all studies presumably due to the regional variations of vaccination levels so I don’t think it’s particularly representative. Given that vaccinated areas have far fewer cases than non-vaccinated ones, the spread of the coronavirus is more or less halted by the vaccine. Comparing this to “masks don’t work” because the Delta Variant is burning through unvaccinated folks is nonsensical. Furthermore, opposing mask mandates is not Trumpist because outside of select relatively unvaccinated areas (and even then I’m ambivalent on mandates at this point because I’m not sure people will listen), the coronavirus doesn’t jeopardize our healthcare system. What would be Trumpist is opposing mask mandates back when there was no vaccine.

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No one is denying vaccines aren’t 100% effective. They’re effective at no longer making the coronavirus a threat to our healthcare system.

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Yeah, I think I'm done with this topic. This is legitimately the stupid country and there will be a price to pay for that. It's clear that some on the so-called left are just as bad as those on the right. Wearing a f-cking mask in a grocery store isn't harming anyone. Vaccines and masks together have the potential to crush this virus, but so many want to relinquish some of our best tools. What's going to start happening is that a significant part of the population is going to start staying home again because they're legitimately freaked out. It may be that the Delta variant isn't enough to send vaccinated people to the hospital for the most part, but allowing this virus to run rampant across the population is both reckless and dangerous.

The left including probably a majority of the thread want vaccine mandates. The right does not. So stop saying they are the same. And quit blaming vaccinated folks for allowing this virus to run rampant when the transmission is from unvaccinated folks.

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Where can you find out if your county is high or substantial transmission?

https://twitter.com/bnodesk/status/1420106376324468737?s=21

This seems way too harsh ofc.

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This is basically the teacher punishing the entire class for the behavior of a few bad apples.

The CDC is also undermining its credibility through this move. Now, we're going to see the anti-vaxxers say that they are "vindicated" by this, and the alarmists will be "vindicated" also. Both groups will claim that the vaccine is ineffective. I will be very angry if my workplace decides to reimpose its mask requirement, and if mask mandates return to Colorado. This is the kind of thing I could see having a detrimental effect politically in next year's midterms.

What these past few weeks have taught me is that the anti vax movement is still alive and well on the left. They just hide their vaccine skepticism by being super pro mask.

This is basically the teacher punishing the entire class for the behavior of a few bad apples.

The CDC is also undermining its credibility through this move. Now, we're going to see the anti-vaxxers say that they are "vindicated" by this, and the alarmists will be "vindicated" also. Both groups will claim that the vaccine is ineffective. I will be very angry if my workplace decides to reimpose its mask requirement, and if mask mandates return to Colorado. This is the kind of thing I could see having a detrimental effect politically in next year's midterms.

It seems with Trump, the CDC guidance ceased to operate based on science, Biden has continued this. Unless this administration is willing to a-mandate vaccines, or b-enforce mask mandates for the unvaccinated, all of this is nothing but 'look like we're doing something with the lowest possible effort' and is no different than cops busting people for an ounce of pot while letting larger drug rings go unpunished.

At this point, I'm afraid that we're still going to be in "COVID mode" this time next year, with the endless conversations about cases, variants, and all of the rest. It's clear to me that normalcy isn't going to return for several more months yet.

The unvaccinated is who is truly in “COVID mode”. The vaccinated are back to relative normal, and honestly this may just burn through the unvaccinated relatively quickly just because it’s so contagious. The Delta wave hasn’t been particularly long in other countries.

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https://twitter.com/sailorrooscout/status/1420443258170351620?s=21

https://twitter.com/sailorrooscout/status/1420444263603707908?s=21

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Now we know why the CDC changed their guidance; they analyzed an outbreak in Cape Cod and realized that it spread among a largely vaccinated population.

The bubble has burst. The party is over. The blind adherence to the idea that the "vaccine makes you and the community safe from COVID" must end. Clearly in the face of the Delta variant, the vaccine alone is not enough and we need mitigation measures. Given that masks are effective at slowing down the spread and cost nothing, it is utter folly at this point to not institute mask mandates.

But within weeks, health officials seemed to be on to something much bigger. The outbreak quickly grew to the hundreds and most of them appeared to be vaccinated.

As of Thursday, 882 people were tied to the Provincetown outbreak. Among those living in Massachusetts, 74% of them were fully immunized, yet officials said the vast majority were also reporting symptoms. Seven people were reported hospitalized.

The initial findings of the investigation led by the Massachusetts Department of Public Health, in conjunction with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, seemed to have huge implications.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/cdc-mask-decision-stunning-findings-cape-cod-beach/story?id=79148102

Many posters have acknowledged that it is possible to get the coronavirus while vaccinated. The odds of it being more than the flu, however, are relatively small. At this point, the major upside of wearing masks is to prevent vaccinated people from spreading to unvaccinated people to whatever extent that is possible.

This case feels like an ultra super spreader where the viral load is so strong it gets to vaccinated people.  Anyone (and this isn't explicitly directed at you specficially to be clear) who uses this as a reason not to trust vaccines has made an idiotic conclusion.

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CDC document warns Delta variant appears to spread as easily as chickenpox and cause more severe infection

The fearmongering from these Keystone Kops never ends, does it?

…what?

The R of chickenpox is around 10 IIRC someone correct me if I'm wrong. I've seen nothing to suggest the R of the delta variant is that high so that quote referenced above does appear to be an exaggeration.

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Now we know why the CDC changed their guidance; they analyzed an outbreak in Cape Cod and realized that it spread among a largely vaccinated population.

The bubble has burst. The party is over. The blind adherence to the idea that the "vaccine makes you and the community safe from COVID" must end. Clearly in the face of the Delta variant, the vaccine alone is not enough and we need mitigation measures. Given that masks are effective at slowing down the spread and cost nothing, it is utter folly at this point to not institute mask mandates.

But within weeks, health officials seemed to be on to something much bigger. The outbreak quickly grew to the hundreds and most of them appeared to be vaccinated.

As of Thursday, 882 people were tied to the Provincetown outbreak. Among those living in Massachusetts, 74% of them were fully immunized, yet officials said the vast majority were also reporting symptoms. Seven people were reported hospitalized.

The initial findings of the investigation led by the Massachusetts Department of Public Health, in conjunction with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, seemed to have huge implications.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/cdc-mask-decision-stunning-findings-cape-cod-beach/story?id=79148102

Many posters have acknowledged that it is possible to get the coronavirus while vaccinated. The odds of it being more than the flu, however, are relatively small. At this point, the major upside of wearing masks is to prevent vaccinated people from spreading to unvaccinated people to whatever extent that is possible.

This case feels like an ultra super spreader where the viral load is so strong it gets to vaccinated people.  Anyone (and this isn't explicitly directed at you specficially to be clear) who uses this as a reason not to trust vaccines has made an idiotic conclusion.

Ok, maybe not.

https://twitter.com/erictopol/status/1420920808629706758?s=21

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https://twitter.com/erictopol/status/1421154047776616451?s=21

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Guys it’s way too soon to conclude anything about this new variant when there’s barely been 100 cases.

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Jesus, the liberal egghead outlets like NYT, Washington Post, and NPR are in full-on propaganda mode right now. They're putting out daily headlines fear-mongering about Omicron and not-so-subtly smearing the heroes that are trying to make sure school actually stays open. If these social media companies actually wanted to be consistent about their misinformation policies they would ban or at least threaten to ban these publications too. I don't want that to happen, but I'm just saying that the COVID lies go far beyond the Q people.

In a revote I think virginia would be very close between trump and biden.. considering all this hysteria

Yup. Virginia’s electoral votes will of course be awarded to Trump either way in 2024, but at this rate the GOP may win the state outright anyway.

https://twitter.com/stephenmoore/status/1477011711605587977?s=21

No doubt nova has grown more liberal.. compared to the Obama years.

But its bizzare how everything is open here .. mask usage is 50 50 .. and people act normally and while many work from home it seems to be less than you'd think.

This is true in 80% of America.

Problem is like half the forum myself included live in the 20%. Hence the complaints about restrictions from myself and others.

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Jesus, the liberal egghead outlets like NYT, Washington Post, and NPR are in full-on propaganda mode right now. They're putting out daily headlines fear-mongering about Omicron and not-so-subtly smearing the heroes that are trying to make sure school actually stays open. If these social media companies actually wanted to be consistent about their misinformation policies they would ban or at least threaten to ban these publications too. I don't want that to happen, but I'm just saying that the COVID lies go far beyond the Q people.

In a revote I think virginia would be very close between trump and biden.. considering all this hysteria

Yup. Virginia’s electoral votes will of course be awarded to Trump either way in 2024, but at this rate the GOP may win the state outright anyway.

https://twitter.com/stephenmoore/status/1477011711605587977?s=21

No doubt nova has grown more liberal.. compared to the Obama years.

But its bizzare how everything is open here .. mask usage is 50 50 .. and people act normally and while many work from home it seems to be less than you'd think.

This is true in 80% of America.

Problem is like half the forum myself included live in the 20%. Hence the complaints about restrictions from myself and others.

Here we go again. There are no overarching government restrictions in force. A mask mandate is not a restriction. Some schools are going back to remote learning but that's decisions made at the local level by each individual school district depending on the local conditions, how many people caught COVID, etc. We all agreed that private entities have the right to restrict or shut themselves down.

I will give your side credit for being so loud that it has drowned out the majority of people who think the virus is a threat and want to try to slow it down. You're probably working the levers of power, badgering your elected officials with anti-restriction harangues, threatening to withhold donations, etc. Hell maybe you've even hired lobbyists by now.

A mandate is by definition a restriction. So is schools going remote because one is restricted from attending school in person.

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Jesus, the liberal egghead outlets like NYT, Washington Post, and NPR are in full-on propaganda mode right now. They're putting out daily headlines fear-mongering about Omicron and not-so-subtly smearing the heroes that are trying to make sure school actually stays open. If these social media companies actually wanted to be consistent about their misinformation policies they would ban or at least threaten to ban these publications too. I don't want that to happen, but I'm just saying that the COVID lies go far beyond the Q people.

In a revote I think virginia would be very close between trump and biden.. considering all this hysteria

Yup. Virginia’s electoral votes will of course be awarded to Trump either way in 2024, but at this rate the GOP may win the state outright anyway.

https://twitter.com/stephenmoore/status/1477011711605587977?s=21

No doubt nova has grown more liberal.. compared to the Obama years.

But its bizzare how everything is open here .. mask usage is 50 50 .. and people act normally and while many work from home it seems to be less than you'd think.

This is true in 80% of America.

Problem is like half the forum myself included live in the 20%. Hence the complaints about restrictions from myself and others.

Here we go again. There are no overarching government restrictions in force. A mask mandate is not a restriction. Some schools are going back to remote learning but that's decisions made at the local level by each individual school district depending on the local conditions, how many people caught COVID, etc. We all agreed that private entities have the right to restrict or shut themselves down.

I will give your side credit for being so loud that it has drowned out the majority of people who think the virus is a threat and want to try to slow it down. You're probably working the levers of power, badgering your elected officials with anti-restriction harangues, threatening to withhold donations, etc. Hell maybe you've even hired lobbyists by now.

A mandate is by definition a restriction. So is schools going remote because one is restricted from attending school in person.

No it's not. Masks don't prevent anyone from doing anything when the usual exceptions are carved out. Surgical masks cost 5c each. It's as much a mandate as an indoor no-smoking mandate or a mandate to wear clothes in public.

Schools are going remote because they have uncontrolled spread of COVID. Once they control the spread, they open back up. In the past school closures due to outbreaks of say measles or the flu was not unheard of.

It seems your side's true position is that COVID-19 is like the common cold and should be ignored. Your side should really be honest and publicly espouse that view and stop hiding behind complaints about "restrictions". Of course we all know why they won't, because it would instantly cause your side to lose credibility and support.

Wearing clothes is also a restriction and certainly smoking bans are also a restriction. They’re not overly intrusive and I’ll admit many people on this forum myself included are overly sensitive sometimes but it certainly is a restriction. I also don’t think masks will suddenly make a big dent in this pandemic with the Omicron variant just because of how contagious it is. Everyone is going to get it unless they’ve been boosted or already got it, and even then, they very well have a good chance of getting it. Hospitals are going to be overwhelmed, and at best, a mask mandate delays that by a day or two. I think, and this is especially true for universities, mask mandates, especially post-vaccine and pre-omicron, were mostly implemented as a form of virtue signaling, so that they feel like they did SOMETHING.

I’m actually fine with shutting schools (as if it were a snow day) if it becomes logistically impossible for schools to function due to so many absences and that’s something that should be decided on a school by school basis. That is not the same as remote learning because quite frankly that is not a viable education method especially for younger students.

I do think we need to start treating this as endemic (like the common cold). Vaccines were heralded as the end of the pandemic and in terms of lowering an individual’s risk of serious illness, it has delivered. It’s really terrible optics to keep shifting the goalposts.

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Still have not heard a rational argument against using hospital capacity as the primary metric in determining whether we need restrictions or not in certain areas.

Biggest problem these days though may not even be capacity, it could be just that so many staff are infected that they can’t go in (and having infected healthcare workers treat already at risk patients is…not really an option for obvious reasons lol)

In early 2021? Sure. During delta? It was debatable but that was mostly an issue for the unvaccinated. Now? Are restrictions even accomplishing anything meaningful with something so contagious? Western Europe is having less severe cases due to high vaccination rates but their cases are just as steep as ours except they are a week or so ahead of us in terms of experiencing the wave.

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How effective are these “high quality masks” at stopping omicron to begin with given how contagious it is? Is this another case of Democrats virtue signaling?

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Masks aren’t even that effective to begin with unless you’re already sick. The virus is mild now and transmission is relatively low (although likely to oscillate over the next several months) anyway. Masking is mostly a false sense of security at this point yet a few people here and in other places I know online continue to do it because they’ve become germaphobes thanks to the Democrats fear mongering (even if it was justified pre-vaccine) of the virus. They should be allowed to do it yes but I should also be allowed to think it’s dumb.