Biden's campaign admits that they're full of sh**t

[GoTfan]

B-b-but centrist kept saying he was the most progressive nominee in history!!!

Anyone who didn't see this coming was blind. Of course, the usual suspects are here talking about how stupid and dumb everyone left of Biden is. Keep it up fellas. Only strengthening calls for a third party.

[DrScholl]

The goal for some people is to get re-elected and then try again in four years to get Sanders elected. Wash, rinse, repeat.

This article is like tons of others that claim to have inside information. I seriously doubt that Biden isn't going to go for an ambitious agenda simply for the fact that a lagging economy is going to call for some changes. If the Senate flips, Biden will have a far less conservative Congress than Obama did at the start of his term, so that's another reason why a more aggressive agenda will be pursued.

[GoTfan]

The goal for some people is to get re-elected and then try again in four years to get Sanders elected. Wash, rinse, repeat.

This article is like tons of others that claim to have inside information. I seriously doubt that Biden isn't going to go for an ambitious agenda simply for the fact that a lagging economy is going to call for some changes. If the Senate flips, Biden will have a far less conservative Congress than Obama did at the start of his term, so that's another reason why a more aggressive agenda will be pursued.

I do doubt he'll do anything substantive to change it. Raise the corporate tax rate to 28%? It was at 35% under Obama.

[Horus]

This is not surprising. I'm not voting for Biden to be some beacon of progressive values, I'm voting for him because he's better than Donald Trump.

[wbrocks67]

No offense, but with literally everything going on in the country right now, I could literally not give a sh*t about something like this. Not important.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

Invocations of the primaries/"Won't change my [2020] vote, so irrelevant" are missing the point: if Biden is giving up on this now (and the out-of-hand dismissal of anonymous sources is interesting given the general reactions here to the Trump disparaging soldiers story), he's going to give up on even more in January. That doesn't mean people shouldn't vote for him in November, but beyond a certain point, diminishing efforts to produce incremental progress merely offset the rate of decline. If inequity continues to rise, there will be more room for another right-wing populist and they are unlikely to be as incompetent as Trump. The less prepared Biden is to follow his own promises, the less his almost inevitably more popular agenda will matter come election day 2024.

Of course it's imperative to beat Trump, but giving up on reforms is only laying the foundations for Hawley 2024.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

How do we know that the Warren people and not the bankers are the ones getting played here? Still, hopefully Biden keeps his word, or perhaps more accurately is kept to it. We do know though that Donald Trump will be much worse in virtually every way than Biden, and the only way to stop Trump winning again is to actually vote for Biden.

Well, we could check Biden's 36 years of voting record in the Senate and his 8 years as VP to have a pretty good idea what his real positions are, or we could go with some things on his website that his own campaign are telling the people Biden has always sided with to ignore.

https://twitter.com/GeorgeTakei/status/1302307468354166785

[GeneralMacArthur]

Invocations of the primaries/"Won't change my [2020] vote, so irrelevant" are missing the point: if Biden is giving up on this now (and the out-of-hand dismissal of anonymous sources is interesting given the general reactions here to the Trump disparaging soldiers story), he's going to give up on even more in January. That doesn't mean people shouldn't vote for him in November, but beyond a certain point, diminishing efforts to produce incremental progress merely offset the rate of decline. If inequity continues to rise, there will be more room for another right-wing populist and they are unlikely to be as incompetent as Trump. The less prepared Biden is to follow his own promises, the less his almost inevitably more popular agenda will matter come election day 2024.

Of course it's imperative to beat Trump, but giving up on reforms is only laying the foundations for Hawley 2024.

Right, Biden isn't going to prioritize USPS banking so that's a slippery slope to him abandoning his entire platform.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

Invocations of the primaries/"Won't change my [2020] vote, so irrelevant" are missing the point: if Biden is giving up on this now (and the out-of-hand dismissal of anonymous sources is interesting given the general reactions here to the Trump disparaging soldiers story), he's going to give up on even more in January. That doesn't mean people shouldn't vote for him in November, but beyond a certain point, diminishing efforts to produce incremental progress merely offset the rate of decline. If inequity continues to rise, there will be more room for another right-wing populist and they are unlikely to be as incompetent as Trump. The less prepared Biden is to follow his own promises, the less his almost inevitably more popular agenda will matter come election day 2024.

Of course it's imperative to beat Trump, but giving up on reforms is only laying the foundations for Hawley 2024.

Right, Biden isn't going to prioritize USPS banking so that's a slippery slope to him abandoning his entire platform.

It's not definite, but that he is buckling to pressure from elites this early indicates weakness. This kind of compromise with unelected powerbrokers, as opposed to elected Republicans, typically happens either in the primaries or once office has been assumed and elites actually mobilise to halt progress (as we saw with Obamacare).

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Because we all know how reliable these sort of articles are.

THIS! ^^^

Also, who's vote is supposed to be changed by this article lol?

The people who spent the last four years complaining about ten thousand horrible things Trump did, but now are looking for any single thing to hate about Biden so they can have an excuse to sit at home and not vote again.  And then spend the next 4 years blaming the Democrats for not defeating Trump.

So, Jfern?

When does jfern ever complain about anything Trump does? He probably voted for him in 2016.

[Beefalow and the Consumer]

It would be disrespectful of Biden to deviate from Obama's cheerful, Wall-Street-friendly, drone-using, Mexican-drug-lord-arming, bland consensus neoliberalism.

[free my dawg]

Glad to see Biden rolling out the red carpet for Trump 2024.

[Ferguson97]

Invocations of the primaries/"Won't change my [2020] vote, so irrelevant" are missing the point: if Biden is giving up on this now (and the out-of-hand dismissal of anonymous sources is interesting given the general reactions here to the Trump disparaging soldiers story), he's going to give up on even more in January. That doesn't mean people shouldn't vote for him in November, but beyond a certain point, diminishing efforts to produce incremental progress merely offset the rate of decline. If inequity continues to rise, there will be more room for another right-wing populist and they are unlikely to be as incompetent as Trump. The less prepared Biden is to follow his own promises, the less his almost inevitably more popular agenda will matter come election day 2024.

Of course it's imperative to beat Trump, but giving up on reforms is only laying the foundations for Hawley 2024.

President Sanders is far more likely to lead to President Hawley than a President Biden is

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

Invocations of the primaries/"Won't change my [2020] vote, so irrelevant" are missing the point: if Biden is giving up on this now (and the out-of-hand dismissal of anonymous sources is interesting given the general reactions here to the Trump disparaging soldiers story), he's going to give up on even more in January. That doesn't mean people shouldn't vote for him in November, but beyond a certain point, diminishing efforts to produce incremental progress merely offset the rate of decline. If inequity continues to rise, there will be more room for another right-wing populist and they are unlikely to be as incompetent as Trump. The less prepared Biden is to follow his own promises, the less his almost inevitably more popular agenda will matter come election day 2024.

Of course it's imperative to beat Trump, but giving up on reforms is only laying the foundations for Hawley 2024.

President Sanders is far more likely to lead to President Hawley than a President Biden is

Based on what? Biden is going to fire up the Republican base just as much, if not more, because it is not banking reform that animates them - this should be obvious after Obama and HRC (if not after seeing the Republicans get worse after Clinton and Gore). That he describes himself as a "moderate" in the meantime signals weakness to a fair proportion of them and encourages them to pick someone they believe in (more likely than not to be a firebreather). Biden is still committed to DACA by executive order, reversing title IX changes (even the good ones) and probably will preside over an administration enacting all sorts of performative crap that alienates lifelong Democrats. If he doesn't even attempt an incremental economic agenda -  the one thing keeping many of those voters in his camp this time - all he has is fear that the Republican would be worse and, as we're seeing with Trump, "Things have gotten worse, but the opposition is even worse," isn't usually a strong message for an incumbent. Letting the Gilded Age deepen will also lead to people valuing civic virtues less and so becoming more open, in general, to a reactionary approach.

Arguably, the closest US precedent we have is ancient history in political terms, so I'd take the following with a bucket of salt either way, but FDR led to a long period of Democratic rule followed by Eisenhower, one of the best Republican presidents of the 20th and 21st centuries.

[Xing]

I will absolutely vote for Biden in November (even though my state is beyond safe for him) even if he says many things that disappoint me between now and then.

If Biden wins the election, however, all criticism is fair game. I'm not expecting him to govern like Sanders or Warren, but if he can't at least move things a bit in the right direction and makes no effort beyond platitudes to address income inequality, the affordability of higher education and health care (among many other things), climate change, criminal justice reform, or our immigration system, and basically just protects the status quo, he'll get an earful from me, and I will reassess whether or not I should continue considering myself a Democrat in 2024 and beyond. People are suffering in this country, and while Republicans have made no secret of the fact that they don't care, I'm running out of patience for Democrats saying that they care and not backing that up with their actions.

[GeneralMacArthur]

I will absolutely vote for Biden in November (even though my state is beyond safe for him) even if he says many things that disappoint me between now and then.

If Biden wins the election, however, all criticism is fair game. I'm not expecting him to govern like Sanders or Warren, but if he can't at least move things a bit in the right direction and makes no effort beyond platitudes to address income inequality, the affordability of higher education and health care (among many other things), climate change, criminal justice reform, or our immigration system, and basically just protects the status quo, he'll get an earful from me, and I will reassess whether or not I should continue considering myself a Democrat in 2024 and beyond. People are suffering in this country, and while Republicans have made no secret of the fact that they don't care, I'm running out of patience for Democrats saying that they care and not backing that up with their actions.

The issue is that there's nothing in it for him because no matter what he does he will still get the exact same criticism, with the exact same ferocity, from the left.

Biden's has moved his rhetoric substantially to the left, brought a lot of Sanders and Warren people on board, and adopted many of their most popular proposals, and he gets zero credit for it and we still have people saying "as soon as he becomes president we're going to attack him and force him to do what we want."

Why should he continue any sort of appeasement strategy with you guys any more than he's already done?  Clearly a lot of lefty folks were persuadable since this doesn't feel like Clinton again.  But the continent on the far left continues to say the exact same things about him that they said about Clinton.  There's no way to win other than to transform into Bernie Sanders.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

I will absolutely vote for Biden in November (even though my state is beyond safe for him) even if he says many things that disappoint me between now and then.

If Biden wins the election, however, all criticism is fair game. I'm not expecting him to govern like Sanders or Warren, but if he can't at least move things a bit in the right direction and makes no effort beyond platitudes to address income inequality, the affordability of higher education and health care (among many other things), climate change, criminal justice reform, or our immigration system, and basically just protects the status quo, he'll get an earful from me, and I will reassess whether or not I should continue considering myself a Democrat in 2024 and beyond. People are suffering in this country, and while Republicans have made no secret of the fact that they don't care, I'm running out of patience for Democrats saying that they care and not backing that up with their actions.

The issue is that there's nothing in it for him because no matter what he does he will still get the exact same criticism, with the exact same ferocity, from the left.

Biden's has moved his rhetoric substantially to the left, brought a lot of Sanders and Warren people on board, and adopted many of their most popular proposals, and he gets zero credit for it and we still have people saying "as soon as he becomes president we're going to attack him and force him to do what we want."

Why should he continue any sort of appeasement strategy with you guys any more than he's already done?  Clearly a lot of lefty folks were persuadable since this doesn't feel like Clinton again.  But the continent on the far left continues to say the exact same things about him that they said about Clinton.  There's no way to win other than to transform into Bernie Sanders.

He should pursue his own agenda not as an "appeasement strategy" but to maintain his personal integrity and that of the political process (and also because it's good policy, or so he claims).

Action is a lot more persuasive than words and a lot of the discontent in this thread is coming from people who will or would be voting for Biden in 2020 in the hope that their low expectations are wrong (within the wider populace, this group is much less likely to do so for a member of the incumbent party if it's already disappointed, so will be harder to hold onto if Biden abandons all ambition). A number of those who won't be voting for him in 2020 might even be winnable in 2024 should he pleasantly surprise them, as has been true for previous presidents who surpassed expectations in certain communities.

[Rookie Yinzer]

I don't care about any of this. I want a responsible administration handling the COVID crisis and a DOJ focused on racial justice in policing not Trump's rape accusers.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

How about we see what he actually does first?

[Beet]

The "Biden campaign" is composed of a lot of people who are likely jockeying for position. Each one will attempt to represent the campaign as reflecting the will of their supporters.

Either way, progressives will have more leverage over a Biden administration than a second Trump administration. If the rumors that Biden would not serve a second term a true, then they would be able to threaten Kamala Harris with a primary challenge if the administration ignores them too much. Knowing Harris' ambition, that will affect the advice she gives to Biden.

[Xing]

I will absolutely vote for Biden in November (even though my state is beyond safe for him) even if he says many things that disappoint me between now and then.

If Biden wins the election, however, all criticism is fair game. I'm not expecting him to govern like Sanders or Warren, but if he can't at least move things a bit in the right direction and makes no effort beyond platitudes to address income inequality, the affordability of higher education and health care (among many other things), climate change, criminal justice reform, or our immigration system, and basically just protects the status quo, he'll get an earful from me, and I will reassess whether or not I should continue considering myself a Democrat in 2024 and beyond. People are suffering in this country, and while Republicans have made no secret of the fact that they don't care, I'm running out of patience for Democrats saying that they care and not backing that up with their actions.

The issue is that there's nothing in it for him because no matter what he does he will still get the exact same criticism, with the exact same ferocity, from the left.

Biden's has moved his rhetoric substantially to the left, brought a lot of Sanders and Warren people on board, and adopted many of their most popular proposals, and he gets zero credit for it and we still have people saying "as soon as he becomes president we're going to attack him and force him to do what we want."

Why should he continue any sort of appeasement strategy with you guys any more than he's already done?  Clearly a lot of lefty folks were persuadable since this doesn't feel like Clinton again.  But the continent on the far left continues to say the exact same things about him that they said about Clinton.  There's no way to win other than to transform into Bernie Sanders.

He'll get criticism from a small number of people on Twitter if he doesn't govern exactly like Sanders, but if he at least got a few legislative victories, he'd get far less criticism than if he did absolutely nothing to tackle the issues that progressives care about.

I don't know if you noticed, but I did acknowledge Biden's pivot in rhetoric more than once, and I wasn't the only one on here. If you recognized that several of us here do that, and dropped the "you guys" gag to refer to everyone who voted for or likes Sanders (and used fewer strawmen), I think you'd face much less criticism here. I'm willing to have an open mind about how Biden will be as President, and I'm simply saying that I'll assess him honestly. If he does prove to be a very effective president who brings about a great deal of progress, I'll certainly praise him for it. If he does next to nothing to improve lives, I'll also express how I feel. I don't see how that's "forcing him to do what I want."

He's not going to win over literally everyone who supported Sanders, but he'll certainly have a lot to gain from making a good portion of the left happy, or at least somewhat satisfied (and just because someone on Rose Twitter posts about how much they hate Biden, that doesn't mean every progressive is hating on him or being unreasonable.) A better legacy, higher turnout in 2022 resulting in a more cooperative Congress in 2023-24 (or at least avoiding a complete train wreck for Democrats that year), and perhaps bridging the divide somewhat in the party. He has plenty to lose by throwing the left under the bus after taking office, even if he only plans on serving a single term.

[solidcoalition]

Figures. More hate for my girl Warren. I’m about to jump ship from Biden.

[Rand]

Figures. More hate for my girl Warren. I’m about to jump ship from Biden.

If you start to drown out there just grab onto some floating debris from one of Trump’s sunken boats. Like Rose in Titanic.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

How about we see what he actually does first?

Well, he had 36 years in the Senate and 8 years as VP, so I think we have a good idea.

[Ferguson97]

How about we see what he actually does first?

Well, he had 36 years in the Senate and 8 years as VP, so I think we have a good idea.

It's totally impossible for anyone to ever change their mind over the course of 50 years.