How has your opinion in the Democratic Party changed over the summer

[RINO Tom]

Neutral.
The Democrats taking Covid-19 seriously and fighting against virus-truthers made it go up. The support for anarchists and chaos made it go down. Overall the two probably balanced out.

What mainstream Democratic politician has expressed support for "anarchists and chaos?"

How exactly do we define "mainstream"?  The cutoff for "mainstream Republican" in random stories Landslide Lyndon finds to post on the USGD board seems to be much more relaxed...

[S019]

It's probably improved, as it becomes clear what a disaster the Trump GOP is

[Dr. MB]

I don't know much about Portland but I'd imagine it's much the same story.  You have a bunch of really loud, really active extremists, and then 90% of the city is normal folks who don't pay much attention to politics.  The extremists control the narrative and lie their way into office, and it ends with something like this.  This is just the way local politics works all too often, and it won't change until people start paying attention to their local races.

Again, nothing to do with the Democratic Party.  The people running Seattle, except for Durkan, are not Democrats.  They are far, far outside the mainstream of the party and are fiercely opposed by the majority of Democrats in this city.

Your 90% figure is pretty high. You go to some neighborhoods in Portland and find some sort of political sign at every other house. And now everyone is talking about politics in some way or another, even the people who weren't politically active before. It's a natural consequence of this year. It's an elephant in the room everywhere.

Second of all, besides Sawant literally everyone running Seattle is a Democrat. And they were elected and re-elected over and over again by Democratic voters. If the "fierce opposition" was as strong as you claim then they'll all be out of office in a couple years' time (actually they'd never have been elected in the first place). But the truth is it's just a baseless fantasy that you wish were true.

[TDAS04]

My opinion of the Democratic Party has not changed in a while.

My opinion of the Republican Party keeps getting lower, lower, and lower.

[Alben Barkley]

Neutral.
The Democrats taking Covid-19 seriously and fighting against virus-truthers made it go up. The support for anarchists and chaos made it go down. Overall the two probably balanced out.

What mainstream Democratic politician has expressed support for "anarchists and chaos?"

How exactly do we define "mainstream"?  The cutoff for "mainstream Republican" in random stories Landslide Lyndon finds to post on the USGD board seems to be much more relaxed...

Well, let's start with finding ANY Democrat then who has expressed support for "anarchists and chaos." I'm still waiting on names.

And by the way, as I've told you before Tom, the mainstream Republican these days is a Trump Republican who is probably at least a little crazy and/or bigoted in some way. That's just a fact, sorry. It's actually the "RINOs" like you who are outside the mainstream for the party now.

Opposite for the Dems, where clearly the mainstream is still pretty moderate (hence why Biden is the nominee) and the far left is at the fringes. Rarely even winning any primaries, while we have multiple QAnon believing primary winners in the GOP now.

[GeneralMacArthur]

Your 90% figure is pretty high. You go to some neighborhoods in Portland and find some sort of political sign at every other house. And now everyone is talking about politics in some way or another, even the people who weren't politically active before. It's a natural consequence of this year. It's an elephant in the room everywhere.

Well they're involved and paying attention now but they weren't around the election.  It's the same in Seattle.  When the head tax debate was going, suddenly everyone was paying attention to local politics and everyone had a position.  But that was eight months before the election.  After the tax was repealed, everyone stopped paying attention.  Then a crazy-person majority was quietly elected, and they passed the tax again but with 10x higher rates, causing Amazon to immediately begin relocating across the lake.

Second of all, besides Sawant literally everyone running Seattle is a Democrat. And they were elected and re-elected over and over again by Democratic voters. If the "fierce opposition" was as strong as you claim then they'll all be out of office in a couple years' time (actually they'd never have been elected in the first place). But the truth is it's just a baseless fantasy that you wish were true.

Seattle is like 80-90% Democrats and a solid half of them are opposed to the current city council.  Pretty much every election was 55-45 or closer in the last cycle.  So you have big, solid chunks of Democrats opposed to the current city government.

As for everyone but Sawant being a Democrat, that's just because all politicians in Seattle are Democrats by default.  These people are so far outside the mainstream of the party that they are essentially their own "Seattle Crazy" party, but get the Democrat label because that's the default label in this city.  Although it's also worth noting that Tammy Morales was a member of Sawant's Socialist Alternative party up until she abandoned the label and ran for city council claiming she had never even heard of the party.

My point isn't really about the labels.  My point is, if you go in the Democratic Party platform, or the platforms of our Senators and Governors or our presidential ticket, you will find absolutely nothing remotely resembling the political positions of the Seattle City Council.  And in turn, were someone representative of the actual Democratic Party to run for a local position in Portland or Seattle, well, look at how Jenny Durkan is being treated these days because she's the only local politician who meets that description.

So you shouldn't go around saying that this is "The Democratic Party" or "Democratic Mayors" and use actions of the Seattle City Council to make your case.

For me it has gone down massively as democratic governors and mayors have made it clear they don’t care about law and order

Please don't stereotype the Democratic Party as these far-left morons rioting in the streets and their municipal-level enablers.

Kate Brown has been an enabler too

Kate Brown is a lousy governor who has awful approvals from Democrats in her state.  Sometimes you just have bad governors.  Gray Davis was a bad governor.  Chris Christie was a bad governor.  Rod Blagojevich was a bad governor.  Matt Bevin was a bad governor.  Brian Kemp is an awful governor.
 Jim Justice is an absolutely terrible governor and he's about to get re-elected!

Kate Brown is not Joe Biden, she is not the national Democratic Party, she is not really representative of us, especially on this issue.  Parties are by their nature big tents and occasionally you have these people in the wings who do or say really dumb s--t.  That shouldn't lower your opinion of the party as a whole, especially on an issue where Kate Brown is completely out of step with the rest of the party.

[RINO Tom]

Neutral.
The Democrats taking Covid-19 seriously and fighting against virus-truthers made it go up. The support for anarchists and chaos made it go down. Overall the two probably balanced out.

What mainstream Democratic politician has expressed support for "anarchists and chaos?"

How exactly do we define "mainstream"?  The cutoff for "mainstream Republican" in random stories Landslide Lyndon finds to post on the USGD board seems to be much more relaxed...

Well, let's start with finding ANY Democrat then who has expressed support for "anarchists and chaos." I'm still waiting on names.

And by the way, as I've told you before Tom, the mainstream Republican these days is a Trump Republican who is probably at least a little crazy and/or bigoted in some way. That's just a fact, sorry. It's actually the "RINOs" like you who are outside the mainstream for the party now.

Opposite for the Dems, where clearly the mainstream is still pretty moderate (hence why Biden is the nominee) and the far left is at the fringes. Rarely even winning any primaries, while we have multiple QAnon believing primary winners in the GOP now.

1) Okay, I could do without your DNC foot soldier babbling ... holy moly, bro.  I don’t care.

2) To show even small levels of support for something does not mean you have to explicitly and word-for-word endorse it with zero nuance.  Several Democratic mayors, including my own, have been slow or timid to condemn riots and looting out of crippling fear of not being a sufficient ally, even though 90% of Black people think it’s a disgrace and unnecessary trashing of their own communities.  I don’t need to find you some obscure and biased links.  I live in Chicago and have seen our pathetic mayor’s deflection of responsibility.  I saw that pansie of a mayor in Minneapolis bend over backward to not overly call out the burning of his own city or support the officers trying to manage the destruction.  I shouldn’t even have to say anything about the in’ freak running NYC.

Oh, so no Democratic Senators have said they love looting and chaos and anarchy?  That’s crazy!!!!  Guess what?  No GOP Senators have come out and said that police should shoot innocent Black people because they’re Black ... neither side has to explicitly say something like that for voters to do plenty of inferring.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

I cannot forget Parkland and KGB and Russia, and Trump has family members from Ukraine that don't believe in wearing mask. I was reminded about that when MSN correctly pointed that out. The Russian connection and the R party has gone back to Coolidge, when he made Jay E Hoover head of the FBI and he had contacts with Russia during the Eisenhower admin, but fumbled Parkland, in the 1960s when KGB was part of the conspiracy.


Biden, Kennedys and Daleys are all Irish Catholic and Daleys are just a WC as Biden is. It shouldn't matter, because Johnson was WC too.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

A few months ago I thought "I disagree strongly with the Democrats on a lot of things, but at least they seem somewhat responsible overall compared to Trump in a crisis."   I don't think that anymore.

[ηєω ƒяσηтιєя]

Of the party as a whole? No change.

My opinion of Joe Biden, on the other hand, has gone up dramatically.

My opinion of the Democratic Party has not changed in a while.

My opinion of the Republican Party keeps getting lower, lower, and lower.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

I will never vote for a Democrat again in my life after this summer. I voted Murphy in 2016, I've voted for Al Lawson, and several state representatives/senators. In the future, I'll vote for Republicans, Libertarians, Greens, and NPA candidates, as I already have, but I'll never vote Democrat.

[President Johnson]

Massive freedom party before, massive freedom party now.

Joe Biden and surrogates have repeatedly denounced violence from any sides. Its upon the Democratic Party now to win resounding victory in November and restore the federal government. For the previous years, only the Democratic Party has defended the rule of law in Washington. Republicans with a few rare exceptions have embraced Trumpism. Therefore, I hope the Democrats will be in power for the coming decade to move things on the right track.

[DaWN]

Before the summer, they were an incompetent, self-righteous band of blind morons, unable to do even basic elements of politics without falling flat on their face, but the better of the two parties by such a considerable distance entirely because they aren't absolutely insane.

After the summer, they are an incompetent, self-righteous band of blind morons, unable to do even basic elements of politics without falling flat on their face, but the better of the two parties by such a considerable distance entirely because they aren't absolutely insane.

[Xing]

Just over the summer? Not much change. My opinion has definitely gone down since 2016, as vitriol against the progressive wing has gone up and gotten to a very creepy and obsessive level among some Democrats, as many really do seem to hate people like Sanders and AOC more than Trump. Also, many leaders in the party have not learned the right lessons from 2016, and have only been fairly successful in recent elections because they've been able to capitalize on how disastrous of a president Trump has been. Instead of coming out against special interests, Super PACs, corruption, etc., they're decided to double down on previous positions.

I do think that local Democrats have generally done the best that they can with COVID-19, and there really isn't a good way to address the riots, and, of course, I can't imagine having a lower opinion of the Republican Party, so obviously my opinion of the Democratic Party is higher, but the increasing amount of hatred progressives get (under the guise of "civility" and "muh Bernie Bros") has definitely made me feel less welcome in the party, and I think that whatever happens in 2020, we're headed for deeper division in the future.

[OSR stands with Israel]

If there was an election between Kate Brown and Donald Trump id easily vote for Trump. Kate Brown is the Worst and is easily my most disliked politician in America right now(at this point I dislike Kate Brown more than I do with Bernie as well) .

This summer has proven that Democratic politicians like Republican politicians with a few exceptions  care more about politics than the rule of law and right now I wish this could be the result of the election:

- Trump loses but every Democratic Governor and Mayor of Major City loses as well and Republicans win both Houses of Congress.



The amount these Democratic Governors, Senators, and members of Congress have acted over the past few months is totally unacceptable and they should be voted out

[UlmerFudd]

gone down

[dw93]

From March until June it had gone up. From June till now it has stayed the same, but unfortunately it's falling fast.

[GeneralMacArthur]

Joe Biden denounced rioters and called for them to be prosecuted

what do you blue avatars not understand about this?

It's like you just want to believe that Democrats are in league with the anarchist white-kid rioters, so you can go back to siding with the morally bankrupt Republican party guilt-free.  You just need to give yourself an excuse, even if you know it's bullsh**t.

Absolutely deplorable intellectual dishonesty.  Deplorable.

If you want to vote Republican because that's your team and you stick to your team no matter what, fine.  That makes you just like every other Trump voter.  He can do as many horrible things as he wants and hurt your life as much as he wants because he's your guy, got it.  But just say that.  Don't give me this concern trolling about "oh lawdy the Democrats love the anarchists and I just can't deal with that."  Joe Biden and the leaders of the Democratic Party have clearly, loudly, and unambiguously condemned the rioters and called for them to be prosecuted.

The only person who is still encouraging violence at this point is Donald J. Trump, who all-but-endorsed that kid who shot two people in Kenosha.  But you don't care about that because you don't actually care about this, it's just your convenient excuse for this election cycle.  Just say it.  Stop with the bulls--t.

[GeneralMacArthur]

I just want to say this again because some truly thick people on this forum, many of whom I previously had a lot of respect for, seem to be willfully ignoring it for political purposes.  I don't want you to have ANY excuse.  No "oh I didn't hear it."  No "he needs to do it louder and more often."  No "the Democrats haven't promoted that message enough."  I want it to be very clear that when you say "The Democrats are in league with the anarchist rioters", you are lying and you know it.

Joe.
Biden.
Condemned.
Rioters.
And.
Called.
For.
Their.
Prosecution.

[RINO Tom]

^ You just wasted soooo much time typing that.  There are more Democrats than Joe Biden, and Democratic mayors of the largest cities in the country and prominent Democratic social media personalities DO contribute (rightfully) to one’s perception of where the party generally stands.  As I said in another thread, good on Joe Biden ... and as I said in this thread, you won’t find prominent Republicans or Trump openly saying something as unambiguous and stupid of an equivalent; Trump *said* after George Floyd’s death that it was “terrible,” and that his family “deserved justice.”  I don’t write in giant, bold font to beg you to take him at his literal word, and you shouldn’t expect Republicans to think Democrats are overly outraged about some of these “protests” gone awry.

Personally, I’m not sure how anyone who’s worth a shlt couldn’t both recognize the serious need for police reform and the rooting out of systemic racism and feel absolutely zero connection to or need to apologize for radicals and criminals who are capitalizing on the intensity of the moment to promote terrible ideas or inciting mass vandalism and crime.

[OSR stands with Israel]

I just want to say this again because some truly thick people on this forum, many of whom I previously had a lot of respect for, seem to be willfully ignoring it for political purposes.  I don't want you to have ANY excuse.  No "oh I didn't hear it."  No "he needs to do it louder and more often."  No "the Democrats haven't promoted that message enough."  I want it to be very clear that when you say "The Democrats are in league with the anarchist rioters", you are lying and you know it.

Joe.
Biden.
Condemned.
Rioters.
And.
Called.
For.
Their.
Prosecution.

Biden isnt the only Dem in the nation lol

[dw93]

I just want to say this again because some truly thick people on this forum, many of whom I previously had a lot of respect for, seem to be willfully ignoring it for political purposes.  I don't want you to have ANY excuse.  No "oh I didn't hear it."  No "he needs to do it louder and more often."  No "the Democrats haven't promoted that message enough."  I want it to be very clear that when you say "The Democrats are in league with the anarchist rioters", you are lying and you know it.

Joe.
Biden.
Condemned.
Rioters.
And.
Called.
For.
Their.
Prosecution.

Biden isnt the only Dem in the nation lol

This, and all those other Democrats that are sitting on their hands or even making excuses for this violence are a detriment to Biden and are playing right into Trump's tiny hands.

[GeneralMacArthur]

Who do you guys want?  What could the Democratic Party do to convince you that the position you ascribe to us is not our actual position?

We have the undisputed leader of our party saying firmly and clearly that the riots are a crime and should be prosecuted.  The rest of the party leadership has, when asked, endorsed this position (albeit with some but-alsos in some cases).  Nobody in party leadership has challenged this position.  In fact, to the best of my knowledge, no significant Democratic politician at all has challenged this position other than a handful of deeply unpopular west coast folks.

Twitter personalities do not represent the Democratic Party.  If you say that Joe Biden is just one guy, and then turn around and say that Shaun King and Nikkita Oliver are celebrating the protests and they represent the Democratic Party, you are clearly not operating in good faith.  That is pure hackery.  You would be pissed off at me if I tried to say that some random right-wing lunatics on Twitter are representative of the Republican Party.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Who do you guys want?  What could the Democratic Party do to convince you that the position you ascribe to us is not our actual position?

We have the undisputed leader of our party saying firmly and clearly that the riots are a crime and should be prosecuted.  The rest of the party leadership has, when asked, endorsed this position (albeit with some but-alsos in some cases).  Nobody in party leadership has challenged this position.  In fact, to the best of my knowledge, no significant Democratic politician at all has challenged this position other than a handful of deeply unpopular west coast folks.

Twitter personalities do not represent the Democratic Party.  If you say that Joe Biden is just one guy, and then turn around and say that Shaun King and Nikkita Oliver are celebrating the protests and they represent the Democratic Party, you are clearly not operating in good faith.  That is pure hackery.  You would be pissed off at me if I tried to say that some random right-wing lunatics on Twitter are representative of the Republican Party.

Congressional democrats refuse to call these people out and defend people like Kate Brown , Ted Wheeler , and Lori Lightfoot.


To say that’s it’s only twitter personalities who are refusing to call these rioters out is just not true

[GeneralMacArthur]

Congressional democrats refuse to call these people out and defend people like Kate Brown , Ted Wheeler , and Lori Lightfoot.

To say that’s it’s only twitter personalities who are refusing to call these rioters out is just not true

I have not seen a single Democrat get asked about the riots and violence, and refuse to condemn them.

If you want every Democrat to go give a speech like Biden did, that's simply not going to happen.  Our party leader gave a speech, and that got all the attention.  We don't need Tom Carper to go give the same speech just to let people know he's on the same page.  I'm sure if someone did an interview with Carper, or any other random congressional Democrat, and asked him if he agrees with Biden's condemnation of riots and violence, he would say yes.  Every Democrat who has been asked this question has said yes.

If you want Democrats to start issuing intra-party condemnations, like for Tom Carper (D-DE) to go out and condemn Kate Brown (D-OR) that's simply not going to happen.  That wouldn't happen in either party, that's just not the way politics works.  I'm sure Democratic governors behind the scenes are telling Kate Brown to get her f--king act together.  But they're not gonna go give a public speech ragging on her.

It seems like you are setting this absurdly high bar for you to believe something that in other circumstances you would just believe by default.  There's no reason to not believe that Democrats agree with Biden's extremely normal and popular opinion.  You simply don't want to believe it, because living in an alternate reality where we're all antifa-lovers lets you vote Republican with a clean-ish conscience, which is ultimately your goal in this election cycle.

Just endorse Trump and stop kidding yourself.  He's your team's guy, and when he goes patting Kyle Rittenhouse on the back you'll make excuses for it.