Voter suppresion/"stealing the election" megathread

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

A few adjustments for the resumption of the joint session, assuming objections continue to be  pursued.

Vote prediction is 73-26 Biden instead of 71-28 Biden

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

the Senate is back in session

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

debate is back in full swing now, hopefully we can vote soon

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

More and more votes for Biden.

Current estimate 77-22

[GeorgiaModerate]

Watched the Senate roll, I made it 5 objecting (Cruz, Hawley, Kennedy, Marshall, Tuberville).  Some of them were hard to hear.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

93-6.

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Supporting the objection:

Cruz
Hawley
Hyde-Smith
Marshall
Kennedy
Tuberville

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

FINAL:



Arizona has been counted. Trump ahead 12-11.

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

joint session  resuming

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Arkansas has been counted. Trump ahead 18-11.

California has been counted. Biden ahead 66-18!

Colorado has been counted. Biden ahead 75-18!

Connecticut has been counted. Biden ahead 82-18!

Delaware has been counted. Biden ahead 85-18!

DC has been counted. Biden ahead 88-18!

Florida has been counted. Biden ahead 88-47.

Georgia has been counted. Biden ahead 104-47! No senator signed onto the objection.

Hawaii has been counted. Biden ahead 108-47!

Idaho has been counted. Biden ahead 108-51.

Illinois has been counted. Biden ahead 128-51!

Indiana has been counted. Biden ahead 128-62.

Iowa has been counted. Biden ahead 128-68.

Kansas has been counted. Biden ahead 128-74.

Kentucky has been counted. Biden ahead 128-82.

Louisiana has been counted. Biden ahead 128-90.

Maine has been counted. Biden ahead 131-91!

Maryland has been counted. Biden ahead 141-91!

Massachusetts has been counted. Biden ahead 152-91!

Michigan has been counted. Biden ahead 168-91! No senator signed onto the objection.

Minnesota has been counted. Biden ahead 178-91!

Mississippi has been counted. Biden ahead 178-97.

Missouri has been counted. Biden ahead 178-107.

Montana has been counted. Biden ahead 178-110.

Nebraska has been counted. Biden ahead 179-114!

Nevada has been counted. Biden ahead 185-114! No senator signed onto the objection.

New Hampshire has been counted. Biden ahead 189-114!

New Jersey has been counted. Biden ahead 203-114!

New Mexico has been counted. Biden ahead 208-114!

New York has been counted. Biden ahead 237-114!

North Carolina has been counted. Biden ahead 237-129.

North Dakota has been counted. Biden ahead 237-132.

Ohio has been counted. Biden ahead 237-150.

Oklahoma has been counted. Biden ahead 237-157.

Oregon has been counted. Biden ahead 244-157!



An Objection has been raised to Pennsylvania. Debate begins.

[(no subject)]

We learn this morning that one of the Trump-incited mob that stormed the US Capitol was shot by a police officer, and later died in hospital. The exact circumstances of the shooting are unknown, except that it took place inside the Capitol. So we know that this person was one of those who had illegally and violently entered the building, with the intent of preventing Congress doing its work.
What are to think about this? It's all very well to deplore violence and to regret any loss of life. But we need to be clear about what happened in Washington, and about where responsibility for this death lies.
This was not a "protest" or a "demonstration." It was an attempted insurrection, an attempt to seize the Capitol and prevent Congress certifying the results of the November election. It was a direct and deliberate assault on the institutions of democracy, and its leaders did not disguise that fact.
Once a political movement steps outside the boundaries of democratic politics and resorts to insurrectionary tactics, that movement becomes responsible for whatever follows. This person knew that what she was doing was illegal, and that the DC police carry firearms, and that in a situation of violent confrontation people sometimes get shot - after all, this is far from an uncommon occurrence in the US.
The state can only function if it retains a monopoly on the lawful use of armed force.* That is almost the definition of the state. And furthermore, a democratic state can only sustain itself against attacks from anti-democratic forces if it retains the ability and the right to use lethal force when this is necessary to protect itself against violent overthrow.
Did the mob at the Capitol pose a real threat of overthrowing democracy? Probably not, but that was not a judgement for the DC Police to make. Their responsibility was to stop this mob from storming the Capitol and forcing the suspension of Congress. They were fully entitled to use whatever force was necessary to achieve that end.
Indeed, since the mob did storm the Capitol and did force Congress to suspend, it might well be argued that the Police in fact did not deploy enough force. It's not for me to second-guess their tactical decisions, but a credible threat, made in advance, to use lethal force against anyone attempting to storm the building might have been an effective deterrent.
Let me give the most obvious historical analogies.
In October 1922 Benito Mussolini led about 30,000 fascists in the "March on Rome." This mob, which was mostly unarmed, could easily have been dispersed by the police, or if necessary by the army. Instead, the weak and corrupt Italian political class persuaded the King to appoint Mussolini as Prime Minister. The result of this capitulation was 20 years of dictatorship and a ruinous war in which 500,000 Italians died.
In November 1923, in direct imitation of Mussolini's successful coup, Adolf Hitler tried the same stunt with the Beer Hall Putsch in Munich. His plan was to seize control of Munich and then persuade the army to join him in a "March on Berlin." Instead the Bavarian authorities showed some spine and deployed the Munich police. Sixteen Nazis and four police were killed in the ensuing shoot-out. The result was that the Hitler movement collapsed and its ringleaders were jailed.
(It's true of course that Hitler later revived his movement and came to power in 1933 by other means. But the point here is that he never again tried to launch an armed insurrection.)
It's easy to write off the Trump cult and its posturing "militia" as pathetic crackpots and losers. No doubt they are. But contemporary press accounts said exactly the same things about Mussolini and his Blackshirts, and about Hitler and his stormtroopers, right up until they came to power and silenced all their critics (permanently in many cases).
It is not safe for a democracy to assume that anti-democratic forces do not pose a serious threat. When anti-democratic rhetoric is weaponised into action, it must be met with an appropriately robust response.
The real blame for the shocking events in Washington rests with Trump, his enablers in the Republican Party and his cheerleaders in the Murdoch and other right-wing media. But of course it was not them but their deluded followers who tried to put Trump's insurrectionary rhetoric into action. It would no doubt have been more just if it was Trump and Lindsay Graham and Sean Hannity who got shot at the Capitol, rather than one of their foot-soldiers. But that doesn't absolve the people who actually did storm the Capitol of responsibility for their actions, and its consequences.

*This is why the US Supreme Court's wilful misreading of the Second Amendment is so dangerous.

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Senate rejected PA Objection 7-92.

Rick Scott: No --> Aye
Lummis: No --> Aye
Kennedy: Aye --> No

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Pennsylvania has been counted. Biden leads 264-157!

Joint session to resume shortly.

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Rhode Island has been counted. Biden ahead 268-157!

South Carolina has been counted. Biden ahead 268-166.

South Dakota has been counted. Biden ahead 268-169.

Tennessee has been counted. Biden ahead 268-180.

Texas has been counted. Biden ahead 268-218.

Utah has been counted. Biden ahead 268-224.

Vermont has been counted. Biden wins!!!! 271-224!

Virginia has been counted. Biden winning 284-224!

Washington has been counted. Biden winning 296-224!

West Virginia has been counted. Biden winning 296-229.

Wisconsin has been counted. Biden winning 306-229! No Senator signed onto the objection.

Wyoming has been counted. Biden's 306-232 win is complete!!!

[Hammy]

Biden beat Trump's 2020 AND 2016 total! Sad!

[(no subject)]

Psephos/Adam Carr has an interesting take: https://www.facebook.com/adam.j.carr

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Isolated Trump reluctantly pledges 'orderly' transition after inciting mob

President Donald Trump's dark-of-night statement vowing an "orderly transition" was issued in part to stanch a wave of resignations from within the West Wing and the broader administration, according to a person familiar with the matter.

The resignations began Wednesday with the first lady's chief of staff, the White House social secretary, a deputy press secretary and Trump's deputy national security adviser all exiting before the night's end. Other officials, sources told CNN, had been considering resigning. And a growing number of Republican leaders and Cabinet members told CNN on Wednesday that they were considering having Trump removed from office by impeachment or through the invocation of the 25th Amendment.

But at least one person who was believed Wednesday to be considering resigning is now planning to remain in the administration. National security adviser Robert O'Brien has told aides he now intends to remain in his post until Trump leaves office, though his plans could still change depending on how Trump approaches the day. He made his decision before Trump released the statement.

He needs to go, now. (This has always been true.)

[MR DARK BRANDON]

Ig we can unpin this now?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Ig we can unpin this now?

I'd think so. If there's more unrest after this point then it'll probably be a matter for USGD.

[Non Swing Voter]

Serious question because I’m unfamiliar with definitions: Is this an act of terrorism? I understand that if it were a black person or a Muslim more people would probably be calling it terrorism, but in an objective sense is this an act of terrorism?

What the Trump cult did was an act of war.  They should be treated as enemy combatants IMO.

[Hammy]

Serious question because I’m unfamiliar with definitions: Is this an act of terrorism? I understand that if it were a black person or a Muslim more people would probably be calling it terrorism, but in an objective sense is this an act of terrorism?

What the Trump cult did was an act of war.  They should be treated as enemy combatants IMO.

Exaggerating the situation does nothing but delegitimize criticism of it. This was a coup attempt, or an act of terrorism (or both)--the scale and actions taken do not justify calling it an act of war.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/willsommer/status/1347542261932945408

Yes, that's billion with a B.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/AmyEGardner/status/1347956972491051012

[Penn_Quaker_Girl]

https://twitter.com/AmyEGardner/status/1347956972491051012

By "separate", meaning another call that hasn't been released yet?