What next for the Federalist Party?
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #25 on: June 22, 2020, 12:13:16 PM »

The reason why Siren didn't get 40% is because she picked Muadd'ib, and as a result, she lost some of her left wing support. Had she picked somebody like OSR, she would have gotten more then 40%.



You think picking OSR would have given her 11 extra votes?

It is worth noting that Koopa/RC did better than this; and so did Feds in the December and April midterms

So what happened? The Feds have essencially turned back the small bounce they had and are back at rock bottom. Hell, I am pretty sure the left's House result was even better than Oct 19 and that we were closer to 7-2 than to 5-4!

That isn't because we have lost ground, IT IS BECAUSE YOU GUYS HAVE GAINED IT.

We have been in the 60's for our House slate for like 4 straight elections, which would have been enough to win any election for House prior to mid 2018. I think Encke said you guys went from like 85 to 110, 110!!!!!!!!!!

You guys some times focus so much on the percentages that you cannot see for the forest for the trees that is glaringly obvious when you look at the raw vote.
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #26 on: June 22, 2020, 12:14:46 PM »

The reason why Siren didn't get 40% is because she picked Muadd'ib, and as a result, she lost some of her left wing support. Had she picked somebody like OSR, she would have gotten more then 40%.



You think picking OSR would have given her 11 extra votes?

It is worth noting that Koopa/RC did better than this; and so did Feds in the December and April midterms

So what happened? The Feds have essencially turned back the small bounce they had and are back at rock bottom. Hell, I am pretty sure the left's House result was even better than Oct 19 and that we were closer to 7-2 than to 5-4!

Koopa/RC did worse in raw votes.


Math's hard yall!
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Former President tack50
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« Reply #27 on: June 22, 2020, 12:15:20 PM »


Had you split the party, I would have hunted you down until you and your third party would have been completely destroyed. Your federalist short term allies wouldn't have stood to you and would have tried to destroy you as well because they would have wanted to get their southern senate seats back.

In fairness this is also kind of the reason why Labor is so dominant for better or worse Tongue Not the only one, but a reason nontheless

I'd rather have a third party providing some competition than this in a way. Even a cultish third party! (and I hate cults)
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S019
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« Reply #28 on: June 22, 2020, 12:17:47 PM »

Honestly the best idea for the Feds is to become socially liberal, but remain economically conservative. This is similar to the New Dems IRL, culture wars issues like abortion are very polarizing, and it’s much easier to seek deregulation and tax cuts rather than banning access to abortion services and other forms of reproductive healthcare. If the feds, ever got back into power I’d also expect them to push fiscally conservative policies, and not focus on polarizing wedge social issues like gun control, abortion, or same sex marriage. This platform might help them peel off some more moderate left wing voters, ftr, I’ve said many times on Discord that this “soclib fiscon” approach is their best idea. So, I guess the best way to say this is that they should become neoliberals or a more economically conservative version of the Third Way Left that emerged under Bill Clinton’s presidency. But yeah, at this point the Feds need to stop being socially conservative to have a chance, imo. I guess they can make Tom Carper their idol and model Tongue.

Guns are not a partisan issue in Atlasia, a pretty solid chunk of the left is pro-gun and one of the most vocal people against the AWB is in the Peace Party.

No one has touched the issue of same sex marriage in the Atlasian right (except for maybe Ben Kenobi doing some ranting at some point).

Abortion is also not really a partisan issue in Atlasia either, as there are many pro-life members on the left, as well as pro-choice members on the right.


You really should stop providing bad advice, especially when it's clear you have no clue what you are talking about.

Those are just examples of social issues, but my point is that social issues remain very polarizing, and running on say tax cuts is a much easier sell than running on restricting reproductive healthcare. (Usual caveats about IRL to Atlasia comparisons) For example, here in NJ, the Republicans regularly run on tax cuts and many are pro-choice, iirc, Christie was. So, maybe you guys should take a page out of the playbook of Northeast Republicans or another idea is just to go full-on Rockefeller Republican.
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2020, 12:18:12 PM »

Something Encke has repeatedly pointed, Fed and Labor turnout by percentage usually tracks one another with one being slightly higher than the other.

This is because as soon as one side or the other looks to be gaining steam, their respective discords/DMs looks something this:

"OH SH@%T THEY JUST GOT X number of votes, can you get so and so out?Huh"
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Former President tack50
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« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2020, 12:23:33 PM »


That isn't because we have lost ground, IT IS BECAUSE YOU GUYS HAVE GAINED IT.

We have been in the 60's for our House slate for like 4 straight elections, which would have been enough to win any election for House prior to mid 2018. I think Encke said you guys went from like 85 to 110, 110!!!!!!!!!!

You guys some times focus so much on the percentages that you cannot see for the forest for the trees that is glaringly obvious when you look at the raw vote.

So what? If so then that means that the population of Atlasia has grown (which it has). Honestly under normal circumstances I'd still be blaming you for not recruiting enough.

However, I must admit Atlasia's electorate does not exist on a vacuum. I imagine the new arrivals into Atlas disproportionately lean left.

At this point beating Labor will probably require a party split of some sort, yet I cannot see a split happening.

And also, what Windjammer commented, even if a split somehow happened and even if said split was successful, Labor would probably put more effort into killing said splitter than the right.

I could easily see Labor pushing for a 5-4 over 5-3-1 or even electing a Fed president over the Labor splitter if "Labor proper" came in third somehow lmao (though at that point so much would have changed that Windjammer's comment would be irrelevant, MB could have plausibly come in 2nd, but not replaced the entire party)
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2020, 12:27:59 PM »


That isn't because we have lost ground, IT IS BECAUSE YOU GUYS HAVE GAINED IT.

We have been in the 60's for our House slate for like 4 straight elections, which would have been enough to win any election for House prior to mid 2018. I think Encke said you guys went from like 85 to 110, 110!!!!!!!!!!

You guys some times focus so much on the percentages that you cannot see for the forest for the trees that is glaringly obvious when you look at the raw vote.

So what? If so then that means that the population of Atlasia has grown (which it has). Honestly under normal circumstances I'd still be blaming you for not recruiting enough.

Grown form almost exclusively left wingers conditioned to desire conservative blood because they despise Trump. Once you scoop them up, it matters little that myself or Siren or any number of others cannot stand Trump either.
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fhtagn
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« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2020, 12:30:03 PM »

Honestly the best idea for the Feds is to become socially liberal, but remain economically conservative. This is similar to the New Dems IRL, culture wars issues like abortion are very polarizing, and it’s much easier to seek deregulation and tax cuts rather than banning access to abortion services and other forms of reproductive healthcare. If the feds, ever got back into power I’d also expect them to push fiscally conservative policies, and not focus on polarizing wedge social issues like gun control, abortion, or same sex marriage. This platform might help them peel off some more moderate left wing voters, ftr, I’ve said many times on Discord that this “soclib fiscon” approach is their best idea. So, I guess the best way to say this is that they should become neoliberals or a more economically conservative version of the Third Way Left that emerged under Bill Clinton’s presidency. But yeah, at this point the Feds need to stop being socially conservative to have a chance, imo. I guess they can make Tom Carper their idol and model Tongue.

Guns are not a partisan issue in Atlasia, a pretty solid chunk of the left is pro-gun and one of the most vocal people against the AWB is in the Peace Party.

No one has touched the issue of same sex marriage in the Atlasian right (except for maybe Ben Kenobi doing some ranting at some point).

Abortion is also not really a partisan issue in Atlasia either, as there are many pro-life members on the left, as well as pro-choice members on the right.


You really should stop providing bad advice, especially when it's clear you have no clue what you are talking about.

Those are just examples of social issues, but my point is that social issues remain very polarizing, and running on say tax cuts is a much easier sell than running on restricting reproductive healthcare. (Usual caveats about IRL to Atlasia comparisons) For example, here in NJ, the Republicans regularly run on tax cuts and many are pro-choice, iirc, Christie was. So, maybe you guys should take a page out of the playbook of Northeast Republicans or another idea is just to go full-on Rockefeller Republican.


Do yourself a favor and stop talking.
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S019
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« Reply #33 on: June 22, 2020, 12:33:28 PM »

Honestly the best idea for the Feds is to become socially liberal, but remain economically conservative. This is similar to the New Dems IRL, culture wars issues like abortion are very polarizing, and it’s much easier to seek deregulation and tax cuts rather than banning access to abortion services and other forms of reproductive healthcare. If the feds, ever got back into power I’d also expect them to push fiscally conservative policies, and not focus on polarizing wedge social issues like gun control, abortion, or same sex marriage. This platform might help them peel off some more moderate left wing voters, ftr, I’ve said many times on Discord that this “soclib fiscon” approach is their best idea. So, I guess the best way to say this is that they should become neoliberals or a more economically conservative version of the Third Way Left that emerged under Bill Clinton’s presidency. But yeah, at this point the Feds need to stop being socially conservative to have a chance, imo. I guess they can make Tom Carper their idol and model Tongue.

Guns are not a partisan issue in Atlasia, a pretty solid chunk of the left is pro-gun and one of the most vocal people against the AWB is in the Peace Party.

No one has touched the issue of same sex marriage in the Atlasian right (except for maybe Ben Kenobi doing some ranting at some point).

Abortion is also not really a partisan issue in Atlasia either, as there are many pro-life members on the left, as well as pro-choice members on the right.


You really should stop providing bad advice, especially when it's clear you have no clue what you are talking about.

Those are just examples of social issues, but my point is that social issues remain very polarizing, and running on say tax cuts is a much easier sell than running on restricting reproductive healthcare. (Usual caveats about IRL to Atlasia comparisons) For example, here in NJ, the Republicans regularly run on tax cuts and many are pro-choice, iirc, Christie was. So, maybe you guys should take a page out of the playbook of Northeast Republicans or another idea is just to go full-on Rockefeller Republican.


Do yourself a favor and stop talking.

Ultimately those are the choices that the Feds have, a Rockefeller Republican image could help peel off moderates, also disavowing social conservatism also helps with socially liberal moderates and center-leftists. In a way this “fiscon soclib” approach is a form of triangulation. Triangulation is what you desperately need.
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Former President tack50
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« Reply #34 on: June 22, 2020, 12:37:59 PM »


That isn't because we have lost ground, IT IS BECAUSE YOU GUYS HAVE GAINED IT.

We have been in the 60's for our House slate for like 4 straight elections, which would have been enough to win any election for House prior to mid 2018. I think Encke said you guys went from like 85 to 110, 110!!!!!!!!!!

You guys some times focus so much on the percentages that you cannot see for the forest for the trees that is glaringly obvious when you look at the raw vote.

So what? If so then that means that the population of Atlasia has grown (which it has). Honestly under normal circumstances I'd still be blaming you for not recruiting enough.

Grown form almost exclusively left wingers conditioned to desire conservative blood because they despise Trump. Once you scoop them up, it matters little that myself or Siren or any number of others cannot stand Trump either.

Guess the "Smash the Trumpists" PMs came 3 years early Tongue

Now seriously, in that you are right. Given Atlas' makeup, Feds need to win at least some leftists (and real ones at that, not just centrists). Whether it is through friendship and cults a la YT, through said leftists preferring the Feds out of spite (like it happened during the JCP era?) or whether it is simply because Labor is seen as too radical or something (like pre-reset).

The problem is of course that irl most Dems have a "vote blue no matter who" attitude and what not. Probably something I cannot relate to since non-American but still.

In any case, it is not like you can't try to recruit those same leftists who are looking for conservative blood Tongue Or are the Feds a Trumpist party after all? Wink

To be honest I wonder how a "real" centrist third party would be doing (we have not had one of those since the old Alliance Party; the monties barely count). Atlas actually has a surprising amount of moderate Dems for the internet, so if someone somehow painted Labor as either too conservative, or too liberal, that is a recepe for partial success. Then again that is what PSOL's been trying to do for a while and he is failing miserably.

I guess if the ""problem"" is the growth of Atlasia that could be ""solved"" by putting in place draconian registration and activity requirements though that is a bandaid at best. Or let Peebs put in place the Thanos Act Tongue
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Former President tack50
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« Reply #35 on: June 22, 2020, 12:45:36 PM »

I will also say S019 has a partial point.

Let's turn the clock way back to when the ACP got formed cause fhtagn thought the Feds were too moderate. If instead of reconciling and becoming a satellite party, the ACP had done the opposite (and the Feds became even more moderate) I would say the right at large would probably be in a better place.

For instance, instead of facing a 6-3 House right now, Feds could have courted moderate Dems and we would have a 5-2-2 House now for instance.

Koopa/RC, instead of being a somewhat incoherent ticket, would have been perfectly defensible. (Siren/Muaddib would have still been completely nuts whether it ends up as a Fed or an ACP ticket)

I think a party split or shakeup of some sort needs to happen. A Labor split is more likely to happen, but a Fed split, if the splitter steals mostly from Labor, could also work. I unironically believe we need a "Conservative Union Party" of some kind, at least that managed to make the left more competitive.

2018 may have been completely crazy, but the left proper did not get any House majorities from Oct 17 (the death of old Labor) to Jun 18 (PUP's peak I suppose). Maybe a CUP would either encourage the Feds to fight for their dear lives, or reenergize the right in some way
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« Reply #36 on: June 22, 2020, 12:50:01 PM »

I am... inevitable.
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fhtagn
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« Reply #37 on: June 22, 2020, 12:56:29 PM »

Honestly the best idea for the Feds is to become socially liberal, but remain economically conservative. This is similar to the New Dems IRL, culture wars issues like abortion are very polarizing, and it’s much easier to seek deregulation and tax cuts rather than banning access to abortion services and other forms of reproductive healthcare. If the feds, ever got back into power I’d also expect them to push fiscally conservative policies, and not focus on polarizing wedge social issues like gun control, abortion, or same sex marriage. This platform might help them peel off some more moderate left wing voters, ftr, I’ve said many times on Discord that this “soclib fiscon” approach is their best idea. So, I guess the best way to say this is that they should become neoliberals or a more economically conservative version of the Third Way Left that emerged under Bill Clinton’s presidency. But yeah, at this point the Feds need to stop being socially conservative to have a chance, imo. I guess they can make Tom Carper their idol and model Tongue.

Guns are not a partisan issue in Atlasia, a pretty solid chunk of the left is pro-gun and one of the most vocal people against the AWB is in the Peace Party.

No one has touched the issue of same sex marriage in the Atlasian right (except for maybe Ben Kenobi doing some ranting at some point).

Abortion is also not really a partisan issue in Atlasia either, as there are many pro-life members on the left, as well as pro-choice members on the right.


You really should stop providing bad advice, especially when it's clear you have no clue what you are talking about.

Those are just examples of social issues, but my point is that social issues remain very polarizing, and running on say tax cuts is a much easier sell than running on restricting reproductive healthcare. (Usual caveats about IRL to Atlasia comparisons) For example, here in NJ, the Republicans regularly run on tax cuts and many are pro-choice, iirc, Christie was. So, maybe you guys should take a page out of the playbook of Northeast Republicans or another idea is just to go full-on Rockefeller Republican.


Do yourself a favor and stop talking.

Ultimately those are the choices that the Feds have, a Rockefeller Republican image could help peel off moderates, also disavowing social conservatism also helps with socially liberal moderates and center-leftists. In a way this “fiscon soclib” approach is a form of triangulation. Triangulation is what you desperately need.

When you admit you are basing this off RL politics and can't back your points up with Atlasian examples, like I said, you really need to stop talking, because it's clear you have no clue what you are talking about.

Also Yankee's points (and to a smaller degree, Encke's) already mentioned in this thread throw a massive wrench in your entire argument here.
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Fmr. Representative Encke
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« Reply #38 on: June 22, 2020, 01:44:19 PM »


That isn't because we have lost ground, IT IS BECAUSE YOU GUYS HAVE GAINED IT.

We have been in the 60's for our House slate for like 4 straight elections, which would have been enough to win any election for House prior to mid 2018. I think Encke said you guys went from like 85 to 110, 110!!!!!!!!!!

You guys some times focus so much on the percentages that you cannot see for the forest for the trees that is glaringly obvious when you look at the raw vote.

So what? If so then that means that the population of Atlasia has grown (which it has). Honestly under normal circumstances I'd still be blaming you for not recruiting enough.

Grown form almost exclusively left wingers conditioned to desire conservative blood because they despise Trump. Once you scoop them up, it matters little that myself or Siren or any number of others cannot stand Trump either.

To be honest I wonder how a "real" centrist third party would be doing (we have not had one of those since the old Alliance Party; the monties barely count). Atlas actually has a surprising amount of moderate Dems for the internet, so if someone somehow painted Labor as either too conservative, or too liberal, that is a recepe for partial success. Then again that is what PSOL's been trying to do for a while and he is failing miserably.


The number of moderate Dems who're willing to join a 'centrist' party can be counted on one hand (if you're familiar with the voter lists from the past few elections, you should know who they are). Recall Ninja's failed experiment with the Liberal party.
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Blair
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« Reply #39 on: June 22, 2020, 01:55:45 PM »

I stand by my PM.
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« Reply #40 on: June 22, 2020, 02:18:53 PM »

It’s just not Atlasia, the forum as a whole has moved a great deal left since 2018 and is more partisan now then it was then too
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Adam Griffin
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« Reply #41 on: June 22, 2020, 02:39:06 PM »

The difference is that there is a 40 plus poster registration edge, most of whom vote completely based on partisan affiliation

[laughs in Griffin]

or how they are asked with little to no in game considerations or candidate quality even entering the equation.

We could run the best ticket ever and still not even come close. So all of this handwringing about "oh you guys ran a terrible ticket", is really just obfuscating the reality stated above.

Up until 12 months ago the Right was perfectly fine with these dynamics, using personality and Discord above all else to influence voters (which they used for more or less 2 years of victory). Y'all did run your best candidate against - arguably - our best candidate (me!) and still nearly won in June '19. After that, though, y'all gave up because once again, you lost the latest in a long line of messiahs who stopped caring about the movement after their personal glorification was exhausted.

Structurally - even when you guys were winning - the problem is that you always vest everything into one person. When y'all are sucking, it falls on you (or perhaps somebody like lfromnj who was talented but too impatient to wait things out). Otherwise, it's one presenting non-ideological personality (first Doof, then Fhtagn, then YT) who invariably either gets burned out, burns their reputation out, or who loses interest when short-term victory isn't possible. I imagine had YT won in June of last year, he wouldn't have disappeared - and if he'd beaten me, it's very likely he would have sailed to victory in re-election (and maybe even sought a third term), completely demoralizing the left in the process, exhausting any registration gains and pulling a 2017 Fed redux.

Anyway, y'all have to find a reliable, sustainable way to spread the workload, culture and effort of party management around to a team. As much as the opposite very much worked for Labor and myself at times pre-reset (again, I'm a Very Special Boy!), we've been so successful as of late because no one person has enough control or influence within the movement presently to take unilateral control of the apparatus, force specific behavior onto everybody or send the party careening because they suddenly disappear. You'll see discussions of this broader dynamic in previous posts in this thread as examples.
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Blair
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« Reply #42 on: June 22, 2020, 02:52:11 PM »

It just seems baffling to think that nothing that's happened over the last year on here has had an impact on the successive & historic failures.

I knew when Labor was collasping in 2017 that it was because of my leadership. Sure I blamed it on other factors but I knew that the culture and party I'd ran had created a problem.

It's getting to the stage where the only purpose of the federalist party is to provide token opposition and hobble across the line in the South.
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« Reply #43 on: June 22, 2020, 02:54:24 PM »

Not to distract from the customary dancing on a given party's grave whenever the other party wins or is on a victory streak, but I might as well point out these discussions would probably be a lot more productive if they both accounted for the state of the game, the factors that influence such a state, and (I can't stress this enough), the feasibility of proposed solutions.

I do think there's only so much the Atlasian right can do on its own to counter a rather daunting registration disadvantage (amplified by forum and RL trends), and while it arguably can (as it's been suggested) move leftwards or further moderate its platform, or try and find a new electoral machine player that overcomes ideology, that ground has been covered. And I distincly remember a lot of people (myself included, though I was wrong about a couple of points) arguing that such means tended to hurt rather than benefit the game. On the other side, you have a currently strong party of government which, understandably enough, is both keen to preserve itself (there's a "mentality", so to speak, which probably correlates with some of Griffin and Windjammer's points) and has an interest in not wanting competition (or challengers) to develop on its own grounds.

"Centrist parties" have shown some potential for creating a temporarily more interesting landscape in terms of the party system, but their existence is only championed by others when they don't exist. When they do exist, they have a very limited base of support, are often subject to the outright hostility of either one or both of the main parties, and yes, they generally seem to lack the type of zombie masters that parties need to thrive. If you add to that the following: A. many prominent members of previous centrist parties are gone, B. many potential voters feel comfortably enough in Labor (or in the Federalists), and C. there isn't much of a message to run on given how some traditional issues don't have the relevance they once did, I don't see how that road is feasible.

I'd love to say I have anything resembling a solution (I don't, and I'm rather struggling with how to make a positive difference in my own role), but perhaps it might be useful if people both accounted for feasibility of changes and didn't quite look towards the past that much. An attempt to repeat previous cycles on an endless basis, I think, is not exactly going to lead to a positive outcome.
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« Reply #44 on: June 22, 2020, 03:06:14 PM »

The Federalist Party reminds me of the "controlled" opposition that is seen in Russia, and in many African countries. It also reminds me of the Japanese anti-LDP opposition.
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« Reply #45 on: June 22, 2020, 03:06:36 PM »

The Feds will return someday. Perhaps the name will change or the actors will be different, but make no mistake, Labor domination will not last in perpetuity.

Nothing lasts forever. Even the longest, the most glittering reign must come to an end someday.

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« Reply #46 on: June 22, 2020, 03:25:54 PM »
« Edited: June 22, 2020, 03:36:33 PM by Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee »

I'd love to say I have anything resembling a solution (I don't, and I'm rather struggling with how to make a positive difference in my own role), but perhaps it might be useful if people both accounted for feasibility of changes and didn't quite look towards the past that much. An attempt to repeat previous cycles on an endless basis, I think, is not exactly going to lead to a positive outcome.

Exactly, there is no getting back to 2017 and there is no way for repeating that in the present environment.

The funny thing is that Blair basically refuted Adam. Adam said that if YT had one it would have been a doof redux with domination flowing from that. However, the key point that Blair said "it was my leadership". Regardless of exact proportion of blame for that, lets leave that aside, Doof was only able to pull off what he did because Labor dropped the ball.

The default position is and has always been leftwing dominance, success for the left merely requires getting everything else out of the way, so that gravity can take its normal course. No matter how much you curb factionalism and ego on the right, there is no natural majority that comes together to deliver victory.

It was much easier for the left as bad as it may have seen because the pieces were there, you just needed someone (Sestak) to put them together to make something happen. We don't have those pieces to put together. No amount of spreading the work load will change these numbers or the Atlas population as a whole, people realize that and thus there is no incentive to try.

LfromNJ is also incredibly naive and inexperienced. He let a single defeat wreck him and has spent the months since refusing to cooperate because he is not satisfied with other people's efforts. I hate to break it to him and this might come as surprise, but when you recruit until you are scrapping to the bottom of the barrel and do so using only the motivation of "join to trigger the libs", you can be little surprised when they don't give a flying f@$K about this game and don't want to cooperate, get valid or turn out to vote. Plus on top of that, the right is notorious for having voters that only certain people can turn out and there are several that only listen to LFromNJ.

They care more discord bullsh**t and edgelord comments and RL political extremism then anything related to this game, have no investment, interest or concern in the success or failure of the right here and yet he expects me to wave a magic wand and make his recruits cooperate, to get his recruits out to vote and to get his recruits valid. I messaged virtually everyone that needed it regarding the election, several other people sent several messages as well. The missing ingredient, was him.

Edit: Also this accerelationist bulls@%t is not too far removed from what several spent righties did in the radical era, this "oh I had my fun, so I am going to make life miserable for everyone else" mindset. Yea, that's going to be personal, very personal, if that happens.
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Former President tack50
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« Reply #47 on: June 22, 2020, 03:33:12 PM »

Ok, Lumine made a great post, so I guess I will try to analyze it and give some answers.

It is fairly obvious that Labor has a vested interest in staying in power. Like I have always said, "We are winning, why would we give up?". I most definitely lament the current state of Atlasia but Labor's leaders are taking the rational decisions.

The Why we got here? part is very simple to answer. Quite simply, recruitment and game expansion. In part I would accuse Federalists of being incompetent here and not being able to get the moderate Democrats they need in order to win based on ideology; nor the cultish personality based voters they need to win based on friendship.

The federalists have essencially 2 victory that do not count on Labor actively pissing off its own voters.

1) They win enough Democrats (presumably moderate Democrats) to win based on ideology. I cannot think of any recent examples where this happened. If it were to happen, it'd be because Labor runs a borderline communist ticket. Thing is, there isn't really anyone who would pull this off. Maybe if we ran like Pyro/PSOL or something of the sort, but even that would not work.

2) They get enough defections based on friendship or any other sort of grievances people may have with Labor. Considering Pericles is almost the poster child for "Atlasia is serious business", hypothetically someone like YT at his prime could have beaten him.

The other big element, is that the Labor leadership has just been too good at keeping the party united, and I honestly believe it is due to PTSD from older players in a way. We can look at the history of the left in Atlasia and find that pre-reset there were plenty of other forces on the left opposing Labor or JCP even at their peak.

OSR also has a point that the forum at large is now more left wing and especially, more partisan than it was 2 years ago. However we have an 8 page thread on the Forum Community board on that so I will not further develop the point Tongue But needless to say, Atlasia's electorate is not a vacuum.
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Former President tack50
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« Reply #48 on: June 22, 2020, 03:34:48 PM »

As for solutions, today I introduced a bill in Congress that tied to propose at least one solution: Non partisan elections.

Do I think such a bill will pass? Absolutely not and it might even be counterproductive but still that is one of my contributions

I will also "leak" that in Laborcord we discussed once the possibility of abolishing the House and returning to a larger unicameral chamber though I am not sure whether that makes things easier, harder or is no real change for the right.
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #49 on: June 22, 2020, 03:39:00 PM »

As for solutions, today I introduced a bill in Congress that tied to propose at least one solution: Non partisan elections.

Do I think such a bill will pass? Absolutely not and it might even be counterproductive but still that is one of my contributions

I will also "leak" that in Laborcord we discussed once the possibility of abolishing the House and returning to a larger unicameral chamber though I am not sure whether that makes things easier, harder or is no real change for the right.

It depends on how the new Senate is structured. The thing is with three regions and labor dominating the national popular vote, the mechanics that produced the Split Senate previously (3-2 and 2-3) would no longer apply, so probably worse.
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