opeboism: opebo defined

[MaC]

For the longest time people have been saying opebo's so far left he makes Stalin look moderate, ect.  I used to think opebo was a leftist, but now I realize it's not entirely true.  A real leftist would be tolerant of Christians being intolerant.  (but even then I thought that was just a pet issue).  The ah-ha moment came to me about opeboism when I saw the "High Frusctose Corn Syrup" thread.

opeboism consists of two basic principles
1.If I like it, it should be legal (and for the most part, everyone who disagrees with me is a prude)
2.If I dislike it, it should be illegal.

And I don't think he's alone in these veiws, lots of people think in these terms.  Fortunately most people on this forum can have negative opinions of something and yet still think it's not something that should be legalized/illegalized just because of their own personal preference.

[John Dibble]

I've already stated as much before - I call it facism though, not opeboism, since facism can hold a variety of views but no matter what those views are they are normally just based on the greed of the facist who will do anything to further his own goals.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I think opebeoism can be defined as an ideology consisting of this:

1-Supporting far left economic policies, but only as means to attract poor and working class voters
2-Being as socially libertarian as possible, and supporting sexual liberties in all cases
3-Staunch opposition to religion
4-Opposing all imperialism, and the spread of Americanization around the globe destroy local cultures.

[opebo]

Thanks for summing that up, BRTD, that is pretty much correct. 

It is basically a moderate, compromise political philosophy, and as far as I can see barely distinguishable from mainstream American liberalism.

[David S]

In my estimation, Opebo's socialist ideas, and his constant rants about the poor being oppressed by the rich, combined with plans to forcefully ban whatever he doesn't like puts him in the communist camp.

I think there are two groups of people who support communism:
1) People who naively believe that it would provide great benefits to  mankind, despite its history of providing only oppression and poverty.
2) People who know exactly what communism is and who plan to be among of the oppressors.
I don't believe Opebo is naive.

[John Dibble]

It is basically a moderate, compromise political philosophy, and as far as I can see barely distinguishable from mainstream American liberalism.

Mainstream liberals don't advocate a $15 minimum wage, a welfare state as big as you propose, lower the age of consent to 12, or feeding the religious to lions.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Must you all give him even more attention than he deserves? The obsession with him from a couple of posters is getting pretty disturbing...

[David S]

Must you all give him even more attention than he deserves? The obsession with him from a couple of posters is getting pretty disturbing...

Obsession -no. Disgust -yes.
Opebo has a unique  talent for causing thoughts of extreme violence in normally peaceful people.

[opebo]

It is basically a moderate, compromise political philosophy, and as far as I can see barely distinguishable from mainstream American liberalism.

Mainstream liberals don't advocate a $15 minimum wage,

Perhaps they are afraid to.. I suspect they would if they gained full control of the government.  Any wage below that is inadequate for even a meager existence.

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The welfare state I propose is not much different from that already existing in Scandinavia, the Benelux countries, and to some extent Germany and France.  It isn't extreme at all.

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I believe many liberals would support a moderate reduction in the age of consent - certainly it is lower in most of Western Europe as well as Asia - more enlightened places than the US.  As for feeding the religious to lions, I would have to admit that is my one and only extreme view, and of course I realize it is merely a dream.  If only...

[Frodo]

It is basically a moderate, compromise political philosophy, and as far as I can see barely distinguishable from mainstream American liberalism.

Mainstream liberals don't advocate a $15 minimum wage,

Perhaps they are afraid to.. I suspect they would if they gained full control of the government.  Any wage below that is inadequate for even a meager existence.

And how would you know that?  You don't even work for a living.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Opeboism is just a version of the modern wannabe social democratic left's policies taken to an extreme authoritarian level.

[opebo]

It is basically a moderate, compromise political philosophy, and as far as I can see barely distinguishable from mainstream American liberalism.

Mainstream liberals don't advocate a $15 minimum wage,

Perhaps they are afraid to.. I suspect they would if they gained full control of the government.  Any wage below that is inadequate for even a meager existence.

And how would you know that?  You don't even work for a living.

Because I can operate a calculator, prude caldwell. 

Look $15 times 40 = $600/week

$2,400/month
-   400 tax
-   500 - rent
-   300 - food
-   200 car payment
-    50 car insurance
- 100 health insurance
- 100 gas
- 100 utilities
- 200 entertainment
Thats all I can think of (and btw, that is a very low rent even for StLouis) which leaves us with $450/month to save.  And this is for a single person!  It would be impossible to properly raise a family on $15/hour. 

[opebo]

Opeboism is just a version of the modern wannabe social democratic left's policies taken to an extreme authoritarian level.

There is nothing authoritarian about it,Straha.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Opeboism is just a version of the modern wannabe social democratic left's policies taken to an extreme authoritarian level.

There is nothing authoritarian about it,Straha.

So mandating excessive regulations on business, taxing people into poverty and feedling the religious to lions doesn't count as authoritarian?

[opebo]

Opeboism is just a version of the modern wannabe social democratic left's policies taken to an extreme authoritarian level.

There is nothing authoritarian about it,Straha.

So mandating excessive regulations on business, taxing people into poverty and feedling the religious to lions doesn't count as authoritarian?

No, business is allowed to exist at all - this is a very lenient stance.  And taxing the rich at even 70% does not result in their impoverishment - they would still be very rich, and at the top of the social pinnacle.  Keep in mind that they were placed there by past governments, so why shouldn't mine whittle away a bit at their power - after all they've been keeping the bottom 90% of the population in poverty since the beginning of history.

As for the lion feeding program, that is a law and order measure - those people are dangerous, not unlike your 'terrorists'.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

1 That doesn't seem "lenient" it seems Stalinist. I'm against megacorporations having big powers but I think you're crazy.

2 We need more proportional taxes yes but not anywhere close to your highly socialistic ideas

3 The best way to do that is to get private money out of elections. There is no need for your socialistic measures.

4 How are people who believe in a religion dangerous? I'm against religion in public life but I think you go WAY too far.

[opebo]

1 That doesn't seem "lenient" it seems Stalinist. I'm against megacorporations having big powers but I think you're crazy.

Why?  The economy I invision is something like Belgium or Sweden - so it already works perfectly well in practice.

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70% was the top tax rate during decades of the post-war boom, at times even higher.  It had no ill effects - those years were far more properous for most americans than the last 20 have been.

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I have never proposed any nationalization of industries, straha, and am in no way a socialist.

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The religious are intolerants, Straha, and left to their own devices will seize power and oppress us - as you can see in the Police State in which you live (assuming you are in the US).

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

1 Those have lower growth rates and lower innovation

2 The point isn't to have higher tax rates. The point is to have more proportional rates.

3 Yes you are. you support a much higher minimum wage, more restrictions on business, not having free trade. That makes you 100% red socialist.

4 No its not all religious who are intolerant its just the christian coalition. While I find the US to be far too soically conservative and authoritarian for my tastes I don't think it should be called a police state. A nanny state yes but not a police state.

[opebo]

1 Those have lower growth rates and lower innovation

Why on earth would the great majority of people - the working class - give a damn about that?!

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Whose point?  I want higher rates.

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No, dumb, 100% socialist would be where the State confiscates all private property.

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You must be joking.  There is virtually no social safety net in the US - hence no 'nanny state', but there is a very obvious Police State - large percentages of the population are jailed for drugs, prostitution, and other completely harmless 'crimes'.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

1 "working class" people aren't the priority of the economy. The priority is growth and innovation.

2 Higher tax rates slow economic growth.

3 No that's 100% communist.

4 I'd say its a nanny state. The laws against drugs and other victimless crimes are "justified" by some false idea that the state has the right to interfere in the lives of their citizens in the name of "public order/public morality" or some other BS.

[opebo]

1 "working class" people aren't the priority of the economy. The priority is growth and innovation.

Priorities are conceived of by human minds, Straha.  'The economy' doesn't have priorities, people do, and working class people's interests are their priority, just as the owning class has its own seperate and opposed priorities.  It is certainly reasonable for the working class - the bottom 90% or more of the population - to prioritize its own interests of high pay and security over 'growth and innovation'.

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Hah!  Garbage.

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No,socialist.  WHy don'tyou go read up on the subject.

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Yes, precisely - a police state.

[John Dibble]

It is basically a moderate, compromise political philosophy, and as far as I can see barely distinguishable from mainstream American liberalism.

Mainstream liberals don't advocate a $15 minimum wage,

Perhaps they are afraid to.. I suspect they would if they gained full control of the government.  Any wage below that is inadequate for even a meager existence.

And how would you know that?  You don't even work for a living.

Because I can operate a calculator, prude caldwell. 

Look $15 times 40 = $600/week

$2,400/month
-   400 tax
-   500 - rent
-   300 - food
-   200 car payment
-    50 car insurance
- 100 health insurance
- 100 gas
- 100 utilities
- 200 entertainment
Thats all I can think of (and btw, that is a very low rent even for StLouis) which leaves us with $450/month to save.  And this is for a single person!  It would be impossible to properly raise a family on $15/hour. 

We actually debated this point before, opebo. Did you forget the budget that I worked out, in detail no less, months ago for a person making $6.50? It was a budget you could actually retire on, IIRC.

[Alcon]

Opeboism to me seems to be:

1. If I like it, everyone who opposes it hates freedom and is a prude
2. If I don't like it, freedom doesn't matter or it has negatives to some group, so it isn't free

[John Dibble]

1 Those have lower growth rates and lower innovation

Why on earth would the great majority of people - the working class - give a damn about that?!

Growth rates often increase job creation rates, which is good for working class people when they are out of work.

Innovation is important because it often makes it so that goods currently on the market can be produced cheaper and in greater quantities, resulting in decreases in prices which brings these goods into the reach of those who have lower incomes. Take for instance air conditioning - three decades ago only 36% of all US households had it, but thanks to innovations in this technology that made it more affordable it is now the case that 76% of poor households have AC. In other words:

"The capitalist engine is first and last an engine of mass production which unavoidably means also production for the masses. Electric lighting is no great boon to anyone who has money enough to buy a sufficient number of candles and to pay servants to attend them. It is the cheap cloth, the cheap cotton and rayon fabric, boots, motorcars and so on that are the typical achievements of capitalist production, and not as a rule improve-ments that would mean much to a rich man. Queen Elizabeth owned silk stockings. The capitalist achievement does not typically consist in providing more silk stockings for queens but in bringing them within the reach of factory girls in return for steadily decreasing amounts of effort." - Joseph Schumpeter

[opebo]

We actually debated this point before, opebo. Did you forget the budget that I worked out, in detail no less, months ago for a person making $6.50? It was a budget you could actually retire on, IIRC.

Yes, I remember your highly unrealistic budget.