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  International General Discussion (Moderators: Gustaf, afleitch, Hash, Dalla Piccola)
  Chile finally making progress on same-sex marriage (search mode)
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Author Topic: Chile finally making progress on same-sex marriage  (Read 362 times)
Dalla Piccola
Kalwejt
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« on: January 15, 2020, 05:28:04 pm »

That moment you see another traditional stronghold of the Catholic church influence on the verge of legalizing the SSM, and you feel embarrassed for your own country not following the suit.
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Dalla Piccola
Kalwejt
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« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2020, 08:12:46 am »

That moment you see another traditional stronghold of the Catholic church influence on the verge of legalizing the SSM, and you feel embarrassed for your own country not following the suit.

Although the influence of the Catholic Church in Chile has been rather strong, there's been enough of a cultural shift lately that would make it hard to define Chile as a stronghold. The sexual abuse scandals hurt the Church's image so badly that the number of Catholics have dropped in dramatic fashion, and it doesn't seem likely that this shift (which partly benefits Evangelicals, but mostly leads to a somewhat Agnostic population) will stop anytime soon.

In Poland the Church is becoming increasingly unpopular with the general population (though it depends on the region), and the population is becoming less religious too, but the political machine of the Church remains very strong, especially now with PiS in power (not that PO or even SLD, while in power, were much better).
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Dalla Piccola
Kalwejt
Moderator
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 55,936


« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2020, 03:53:26 pm »

That moment you see another traditional stronghold of the Catholic church influence on the verge of legalizing the SSM, and you feel embarrassed for your own country not following the suit.

Although the influence of the Catholic Church in Chile has been rather strong, there's been enough of a cultural shift lately that would make it hard to define Chile as a stronghold. The sexual abuse scandals hurt the Church's image so badly that the number of Catholics have dropped in dramatic fashion, and it doesn't seem likely that this shift (which partly benefits Evangelicals, but mostly leads to a somewhat Agnostic population) will stop anytime soon.

In Poland the Church is becoming increasingly unpopular with the general population (though it depends on the region), and the population is becoming less religious too, but the political machine of the Church remains very strong, especially now with PiS in power (not that PO or even SLD, while in power, were much better).

Interesting, I would have figured the general population was still very much on board with the Church and with social conservatism (rather than it being a result of political influence).

I wouldn't say there's some sudden, massive change of attitude, and it certainly depends on the region. But the church is doing everything to piss the people off due to stuff like greed, open exercising of its' political influence, like during the abortion debate, pedo scandals and so on.

And generally, even many people who declare himself Catholic are pretty much non-observant, but there's no reliable data. Of course in the countryside the church attendance is large, even if one doesn't really care for this. You know, "everybody does that", "what would other people think?" and so on. In small town and villages everybody knows everybody and of everybody. I've lived in such place for a couple of years. My family never went to church and it was known we were an atheist household, but if we were locals, we probably wouldn't get away with the pretty open judgment and peer pressure.

When people from the province moves to bigger cities, especially the younger ones (going to study/work after graduation), many essentially stops attending or does it irregularly.

As of the "social conservatism" thing, it is pretty strong, but it's more like a polarization than something decisively prevailing. For example the majority of Poles are, per all opinion polls, consistently in favor of abortion laws liberalization, and the church's inflexible and arrogant behavior in this regard only illustrated how deep the polarization goes now.

Ironically the "political class" as whole is more conservative socially than larger part of the population in cases such as abortion. That's the consequence of three decades of everybody not wanting to upset the church, or some people just became too rigid.
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