Jeremy Corbyn is the most disastrous Leader of the Labour Party since...

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Including interim leaders because iirc a couple of them did have some degree of impact on the party's direction.

[Dr. MB]

He's got the best platform in a very long time but also did the worst electorally since an even longer time before that. Not quite sure.

[Antonio the Sixth]

There's an argument to be made that Foot left Labour in a worse long-term position, whereas a post-Corbyn Labour will find it easier to pick itself back up and become competitive again. I'm not sure if I buy it, and we won't know for sure until 2024. I want to hope that's true, though, so that's how I voted.

In fairness, both Corbyn and Foot had a lot of things going against them that weren't their fault (though with Corbyn there's also plenty that was his fault, of course). I think to find a Labour leader who was dealt a genuinely good hand and screwed it up, you'd have to go back to Gaitskell or to the 30s leaders.

[PSOL]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

Lmao yeah, definitely not his fault. Eeeverything is made up by the FAKE NEWS media and the (((wealthy donors)))! He did nothing wrong!

Good riddance.

[Mr. Smith]

Miliband

Can hardly blame trying to repeat what worked in 2017 again for 2019. What's the excuse for 2015?

[PSOL]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

Lmao yeah, definitely not his fault. Eeeverything is made up by the FAKE NEWS media and the (((wealthy donors)))! He did nothing wrong!

Good riddance.

Living in an imaginary world where the left singles out Jewish people is the best lie that they never stopped telling. His only fault was not pressing for a #lexit and representing the poorer working-class domains in the north, not any of this drivel pressed by the British rags.

[Blair]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

What a load of absolute rubbish from someone who clearly has no idea about British Politics or the Labour Party. It's barely coherent rubbish that reads like a 17 year old trying to analysis Marxism but let's go through it point by point.

The Party had tons of money; both from the Trade Unions and from the huge membership fees- however in the last year it's been wasted on a vanity pop concert (which cost £1 million quid) and legal fees from ongoing court action taken by lifelong Labour staffers. Add in the the wasting of money on target seats that we'd never win (Wimbledon as one example) and the fact that local campaigns are capped I'm not sure this is really the big issue you think it is. Labour spend more on facebook ads than the Tories.... so money clearly wasn't an issue.

I can't work out what your comment about holdovers means? Surely not the Party NEC (controlled by Corbyn) the Shadow Cabinet (Corbyn appointees) the Party General Secretary (appointed by Corbyn) or Labour HQ (staffed by pro-Corbyn people)

What smears? Jeremy Corbyn looked at a mural of Jews Bankers (as the painter admitted) playing monopoly over a bunch of dead bodies, and said the mural should stay. I'm also more than willing to list the other number of antisemtic candidates and Labour officials who have been given a free pass because they're from 'our side'.

Not playing dirty? For all his flaws this campaign was hardly some sort of relaxed affair. They pushed extremely aggressive, and rather excessive stories about Trump buying up the NHS.

And ffs if you actually understood Britain you'd know that the the 'poorer working class domains in the North' are not one big coherent block who want 'Lexit' (hello Liverpool, Newcastle, Leeds, Hull, Middlesborough etc etc etc)

And I don't suppose you have any idea about what Lexit would compose and how you would keep membership of the single market & customs union (a red line for Trade Unions) without having freedom of movement or the ECJ involved (two things hated by Labour leavers)

[Blair]

and what the hell does gerrymandering have to do with a British Election held under seat boundaries done by the last Labour Government?

[Suburbia]

Corbyn is the worst Labour Leader since Miliband.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

I'm willing to defend Foot from undue comparisons to Corbyn. Unlike Corbyn, who spent most of his career on the fringes, Foot, despite being firmly on the party's left side, had a record and a reputation of somebody able and willing to work with the Labour's right to get things done. After all we're talking about a guy who pulled miracle after miracle while Leader of the House under Callaghan. Yes, he wasn't a particularly good fit for a Prime Ministerial candidate, but he was largely undone by forces beyond his control. After 1979 Labour was tearing itself apart from the two ends. On the right you had people like David "I'm still relevant!" Owen, that soon left to form the SDP. On the left you had Tony Benn, who kept rocking the ship from the inside when the party was at its' worst form since the bloody 30s. If anything, Foot might've been the one who saved as much as it was possible for the party to sustain.

Corbyn, on the other hand, should have had everything going for him. The problem was not him being too much to the left (at least not in everything), but rather he sucked as a leader. We've had tons of examples of him having a terrible judgment.

[Blair]

Foot was a huge intellectual who spend years doing a lot of hard graft for the Party; and was the only person who stopped the party from splitting in 1981-Healey would pissed off the left & he stopped Benn from winning his deputy leadership bid. If Blair needed Kinnock, Kinnock needed Foot.

Foot was certainly a poor candidate for Prime Minister but he was an extremely brave parliamentarian who stood up against appeasement in the 40s, and delivered the best parliamentary speech in the 20th century.

Corbyn's only achievement is that he did less damage on the backbenches to the party than he did when he lead it through a period which has been the worse election defeat since 1935 and a statutory investigation into whether we're a racist party.
 

[buritobr]

The Labour Party in 2019 under the leadership of Jeremy Corbyn had more votes than in 2010 and 2015, under leadership of Gordon Brown and Ed Milliband. In 2017, under the leadership of Jeremy Corbyn, the Labour Party had 40%.

[jaichind]

Foot is worse.

[Intell]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

Lmao yeah, definitely not his fault. Eeeverything is made up by the FAKE NEWS media and the (((wealthy donors)))! He did nothing wrong!

Good riddance.

Living in an imaginary world where the left singles out Jewish people is the best lie that they never stopped telling. His only fault was not pressing for a #lexit and representing the poorer working-class domains in the north, not any of this drivel pressed by the British rags.

You are so arrogant and so full of crap. Get over yourself. Corbyn's antisemitism has been systematic and clear-as-day.

If you can't see that then that sounds like a personal problem for you to deal with.

Solid 26% of self hating  jews then.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

Lmao yeah, definitely not his fault. Eeeverything is made up by the FAKE NEWS media and the (((wealthy donors)))! He did nothing wrong!

Good riddance.

Living in an imaginary world where the left singles out Jewish people is the best lie that they never stopped telling. His only fault was not pressing for a #lexit and representing the poorer working-class domains in the north, not any of this drivel pressed by the British rags.

You are so arrogant and so full of crap. Get over yourself. Corbyn's antisemitism has been systematic and clear-as-day.

If you can't see that then that sounds like a personal problem for you to deal with.

Solid 26% of self hating  jews then.

87% of British Jews viewed Corbyn and Labour as having an Antisemitism problem.

I can throw around numbers as well.

The difference, of course, is that every major British Jewish group came out against Corbyn and Labour. Including Orthodox and Reform and Haredi Rabbis.

Also, where are you getting the 26% numbers? I've seen it before as well and I don't remember where it came from or what the context is.

I do know a Guardian Article stated: "In the 2017 election, 67% of Jewish voters backed the Tories and 11% supported Labour, according to figures supplied by JPR (Institute for Jewish Policy Research). "

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/10/anyone-but-corbyn-jewish-voters-turn-away-from-labour

I would imagine 2019 had similar numbers, based off that number.

However, I have seen other orgs and news orgs show slightly different numbers. This is because British Jews are 0.5% of the UK population and its hard to pinpoint 100% accurate numbers.

My guesstimate for 2017 is that British Jews probs voted in between 65-70% for the Tories; 12-18% for Labour; 12-23% for other parties.

I would imagine the numbers shifted towards the Tories in 2019 but we don't have solid numbers on this yet.

Even if 26% voted Labour, not all of them may agree with Corbyn, so it doesn't mean much. For example, I'd vote for Jewish MPs who oppose Corbyn but not for pro-Corbyn MPs.

In any case it's meaningless- what matters is the factual evidence and reports we've seen, and of course, Corbyn's own conduct.

[Blair]

A good question is what other leaders have had a statutory public body investigate them for institutional racism?

You can't claim it's a smear when an organisation is using powers under the Equality Act (an act introduced by the last Labour Government) to see if the party acted unlawfully towards Jewish Members.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

Lmao yeah, definitely not his fault. Eeeverything is made up by the FAKE NEWS media and the (((wealthy donors)))! He did nothing wrong!

Good riddance.

Living in an imaginary world where the left singles out Jewish people is the best lie that they never stopped telling. His only fault was not pressing for a #lexit and representing the poorer working-class domains in the north, not any of this drivel pressed by the British rags.

You are so arrogant and so full of crap. Get over yourself. Corbyn's antisemitism has been systematic and clear-as-day.

If you can't see that then that sounds like a personal problem for you to deal with.

Solid 26% of self hating  jews then.

87% of British Jews viewed Corbyn and Labour as having an Antisemitism problem.

I can throw around numbers as well.

The difference, of course, is that every major British Jewish group came out against Corbyn and Labour. Including Orthodox and Reform and Haredi Rabbis.

Also, where are you getting the 26% numbers? I've seen it before as well and I don't remember where it came from or what the context is.

I do know a Guardian Article stated: "In the 2017 election, 67% of Jewish voters backed the Tories and 11% supported Labour, according to figures supplied by JPR (Institute for Jewish Policy Research). "

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/10/anyone-but-corbyn-jewish-voters-turn-away-from-labour

I would imagine 2019 had similar numbers, based off that number.

However, I have seen other orgs and news orgs show slightly different numbers. This is because British Jews are 0.5% of the UK population and its hard to pinpoint 100% accurate numbers.

My guesstimate for 2017 is that British Jews probs voted in between 65-70% for the Tories; 12-18% for Labour; 12-23% for other parties.

I would imagine the numbers shifted towards the Tories in 2019 but we don't have solid numbers on this yet.

Even if 26% voted Labour, not all of them may agree with Corbyn, so it doesn't mean much. For example, I'd vote for Jewish MPs who oppose Corbyn but not for pro-Corbyn MPs.

In any case it's meaningless- what matters is the factual evidence and reports we've seen, and of course, Corbyn's own conduct.

Speaking only for myself (Jewish family background, don't identify as a Jew myself because it's patrilineal and I practice a different religion), I would have held my nose and voted for Labour because I think the other options are even worse, but I absolutely believe that Corbyn is a "soft" antisemite himself and has knowingly entertained "hard" antisemites within the party.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Lansbury, who was an extremely decent man, but wholly unprepared for the rise of Hitler as a staunch pacifist. Harman could be a decent pick as well, because her decisions as interim leader basically started the factional dsaster that would define the entire post-Miliband era of the Party.

Of course, George Brown had he won would have outstripped them all...

[BP🌹]

It's unfortunate that one who's accused of anti-semitism will have it stick to them and never hear the end of it, while racists and Islamophobes (like BoJo) can get away with it pretty easily.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

Lmao yeah, definitely not his fault. Eeeverything is made up by the FAKE NEWS media and the (((wealthy donors)))! He did nothing wrong!

Good riddance.

Living in an imaginary world where the left singles out Jewish people is the best lie that they never stopped telling. His only fault was not pressing for a #lexit and representing the poorer working-class domains in the north, not any of this drivel pressed by the British rags.

You are so arrogant and so full of crap. Get over yourself. Corbyn's antisemitism has been systematic and clear-as-day.

If you can't see that then that sounds like a personal problem for you to deal with.

Solid 26% of self hating  jews then.

87% of British Jews viewed Corbyn and Labour as having an Antisemitism problem.

I can throw around numbers as well.

The difference, of course, is that every major British Jewish group came out against Corbyn and Labour. Including Orthodox and Reform and Haredi Rabbis.

Also, where are you getting the 26% numbers? I've seen it before as well and I don't remember where it came from or what the context is.

I do know a Guardian Article stated: "In the 2017 election, 67% of Jewish voters backed the Tories and 11% supported Labour, according to figures supplied by JPR (Institute for Jewish Policy Research). "

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/10/anyone-but-corbyn-jewish-voters-turn-away-from-labour

I would imagine 2019 had similar numbers, based off that number.

However, I have seen other orgs and news orgs show slightly different numbers. This is because British Jews are 0.5% of the UK population and its hard to pinpoint 100% accurate numbers.

My guesstimate for 2017 is that British Jews probs voted in between 65-70% for the Tories; 12-18% for Labour; 12-23% for other parties.

I would imagine the numbers shifted towards the Tories in 2019 but we don't have solid numbers on this yet.

Even if 26% voted Labour, not all of them may agree with Corbyn, so it doesn't mean much. For example, I'd vote for Jewish MPs who oppose Corbyn but not for pro-Corbyn MPs.

In any case it's meaningless- what matters is the factual evidence and reports we've seen, and of course, Corbyn's own conduct.

Speaking only for myself (Jewish family background, don't identify as a Jew myself because it's patrilineal and I practice a different religion), I would have held my nose and voted for Labour because I think the other options are even worse, but I absolutely believe that Corbyn is a "soft" antisemite himself and has knowingly entertained "hard" antisemites within the party.

Yep. I have an Israeli friend (who's moving to Britain) who said the same- she'd vote Labour to prevent Brexit and would want to purge th antisemitism after Brexit is averted. So all in all it's further proof that Jews voting Labour isn't necessarily a sign they don't think Corbyn is antisemitic.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Corbyn's only achievement is that he did less damage on the backbenches to the party than he did when he lead it through a period which has been the worse election defeat since 1935 and a statutory investigation into whether we're a racist party.

Good point. There were MPs who spent most (if not all) of their careers on the backbenches, while still achieving something meaningful. Sydney Silverman was a perfect example from the Labour benches. Corbyn was never near that league.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

It's unfortunate that one who's accused of anti-semitism will have it stick to them and never hear the end of it, while racists and Islamophobes (like BoJo) can get away with it pretty easily.

It is, isn't it? I couldn't agree more. And yet that doesn't mean we of the left should give bigotry among Our People a pass just because the right did so first. Shame, that.

[Intell]

Since Ed Milliband. Not his fault that he doesn’t have backers with complete control of every and all wealthy donors who AstroTurfed #leavers, the press who made up smears against him, politicians who shifted the Overton window to insanity by frying people’s brains with austerity, and allegiance from a class most willing to rig the electoral process by gerrymandering in a so-called democracy. On top of that, there were ineffectual holdovers places by the elite to provide some opposition in inter-party feuds, who previously robbed the party of a majority by defecting for their lapdogs over the media’s obvious smears.

His only flaw was that, like most of Labour politicians, he has no will to play dirty like his opposition.

And I’m just talking about domestic forces here.

Lmao yeah, definitely not his fault. Eeeverything is made up by the FAKE NEWS media and the (((wealthy donors)))! He did nothing wrong!

Good riddance.

Living in an imaginary world where the left singles out Jewish people is the best lie that they never stopped telling. His only fault was not pressing for a #lexit and representing the poorer working-class domains in the north, not any of this drivel pressed by the British rags.

You are so arrogant and so full of crap. Get over yourself. Corbyn's antisemitism has been systematic and clear-as-day.

If you can't see that then that sounds like a personal problem for you to deal with.

Solid 26% of self hating  jews then.

87% of British Jews viewed Corbyn and Labour as having an Antisemitism problem.

I can throw around numbers as well.

The difference, of course, is that every major British Jewish group came out against Corbyn and Labour. Including Orthodox and Reform and Haredi Rabbis.

Also, where are you getting the 26% numbers? I've seen it before as well and I don't remember where it came from or what the context is.

I do know a Guardian Article stated: "In the 2017 election, 67% of Jewish voters backed the Tories and 11% supported Labour, according to figures supplied by JPR (Institute for Jewish Policy Research). "

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/10/anyone-but-corbyn-jewish-voters-turn-away-from-labour

I would imagine 2019 had similar numbers, based off that number.

However, I have seen other orgs and news orgs show slightly different numbers. This is because British Jews are 0.5% of the UK population and its hard to pinpoint 100% accurate numbers.

My guesstimate for 2017 is that British Jews probs voted in between 65-70% for the Tories; 12-18% for Labour; 12-23% for other parties.

I would imagine the numbers shifted towards the Tories in 2019 but we don't have solid numbers on this yet.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

He was the worst Labour leader ever because he was barely even a Labour leader. He was far more concerned with exporting his brand of far-left populist antisemitism into the streets worldwide.

Good riddance to him, but we'll be fighting the fires he started for a very long time.