Evo Morales resigns
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  Evo Morales resigns
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Author Topic: Evo Morales resigns  (Read 5048 times)
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Ray Goldfield
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« Reply #25 on: November 11, 2019, 09:13:21 AM »

On the right side of history with Pinochet, on the right side of history tonight.



The would-be Butcher of Britain never found a left-wing autocrat he didn't support.

Yes we get it, you think that military coups (very possibly followed by ethnic genocide) are cool.

Bolsonaro and Pinochet admirer too, I presume?

Pinochet was awful, just like all dictators. Bolsonaro has awful policies, although he's at least an elected official.

How do you feel about Morales' kidnapping of Jacob Ostreicher? Because I can guess how Corbyn feels about it.
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2019, 09:57:30 AM »

On the right side of history with Pinochet, on the right side of history tonight.



The would-be Butcher of Britain never found a left-wing autocrat he didn't support.

Yes we get it, you think that military coups (very possibly followed by ethnic genocide) are cool.

Bolsonaro and Pinochet admirer too, I presume?

Pinochet was awful, just like all dictators. Bolsonaro has awful policies, although he's at least an elected official.

Bolsonaro's policies are far, far worse (and more devastating) than Morales'. I wonder if some people now cheering the coup in Bolivia would feel the same way if Bolsonaro were to be coup'd. Probably not, since Bolsonaro's "on the right side".

Quote
How do you feel about Morales' kidnapping of Jacob Ostreicher? Because I can guess how Corbyn feels about it.

Sure, another excuse to make everything about Corbyn Tongue

And speaking of the abuses of power committed by Morales, they ought to be condemned.
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weatherboy1102
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« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2019, 10:24:46 AM »



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Omega21
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« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2019, 11:49:13 AM »





I can summarize that whole tweet in a simple picture.

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Crumpets
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« Reply #29 on: November 11, 2019, 12:05:20 PM »

If I may just come in with the blistering hot take that 1) this was indeed a coup and that 2) the U.S. intelligence community probably only played an extremely marginal role, if any.
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« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2019, 12:09:42 PM »

If I may just come in with the blistering hot take that 1) this was indeed a coup and that 2) the U.S. intelligence community probably only played an extremely marginal role, if any.

This. Let me also say the US role in the Pinochet coup is vastly overstated. That was planned and carried out almost exclusively by the Chilean military and the extent of the US's role is basically just having a vague idea that it was very likely to occur and not warning Allende about it.
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KaiserDave
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« Reply #31 on: November 11, 2019, 12:12:08 PM »

Both Morales and the coup plotters are HPs.
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lfromnj
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« Reply #32 on: November 11, 2019, 12:13:03 PM »

Hmm let's see
If Donald Trump ran for a 3rd term and won I would call for a coup. I see nothing wrong with a coup here for a man who refuses to step down.
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Lumine
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« Reply #33 on: November 11, 2019, 12:29:45 PM »

Although there is a formal investigation on the electoral fraud led by the Attorney General and arrests of government officials supposedly involved have been made (the heads of the Supreme Electoral Tribunal), the Bolivian police stated last night there was no formal arrest order against Morales (thus contradicting what Camacho had said). General Calderon (head of the national police) has also resigned, being one of the targets of an internal strike by several police units across the country for the past few days.

Morales is apparently still in Cochabamba, and with the mass resignation of his government and the heads of Congress there is a clear power vacuum at the moment. The constitutional solution at the moment appears to be in the Bolivian Congress going into session to accept (or reject, since Morales's MAS has a majority) the resignations, either leading to Senator Áñez becoming President or, should they decide to block that option, electing someone else to lead the Senate and thus assume the Presidency.
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Intell
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« Reply #34 on: November 11, 2019, 12:43:15 PM »

Hmm let's see
If Donald Trump ran for a 3rd term and won I would call for a coup. I see nothing wrong with a coup here for a man who refuses to step down.

If trump won election to a 3rd term not you wouldn’t and you shouldn’t even if you were.
Term limits are stupid and undemocratic.
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America Needs R'hllor
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« Reply #35 on: November 11, 2019, 01:59:12 PM »
« Edited: November 11, 2019, 02:06:42 PM by Parrotguy »



From Morales' wikipedia:

Quote
In November 2017, the Supreme Tribunal of Justice of Bolivia ruled that—in contrast to the constitution—all public offices would have no term limits, blaming American imperialism and influence for the referendum's outcome, thus allowing Morales to run for a fourth term.

Yes.... seems like a very professional court....

The victimization language of leftists like this guy and Lee Carter is wrong. Yes, the coup is bad, and it should be pointed out and condemned, and if I was President of the U.S. I'd hopefully act to try and stop right-wing authoritarians from taking power instead. But speaking as if Morales was some god-like, successful people's hero is just unfourtunate. No offense, but this I hoped that this thread would be informative and give us a good rundown of the events that happened- instead, it's just another ideological argument trying to paint a picture in which Morales is an angle.
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President Johnson
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« Reply #36 on: November 11, 2019, 02:06:55 PM »

A crisis of Morales' own making. He should have refrained from running again since it was against the rules.
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« Reply #37 on: November 11, 2019, 03:13:22 PM »

On the right side of history with Pinochet, on the right side of history tonight.



The would-be Butcher of Britain never found a left-wing autocrat he didn't support.

Yes we get it, you think that military coups (very possibly followed by ethnic genocide) are cool.

Bolsonaro and Pinochet admirer too, I presume?

Pinochet was awful, just like all dictators. Bolsonaro has awful policies, although he's at least an elected official.

How do you feel about Morales' kidnapping of Jacob Ostreicher? Because I can guess how Corbyn feels about it.
Yes Bolsonaro was elected, just like Vladimir Putin, Recep Erdogan, Hugo Chavez, Robert Mugabe and Morales himself initially were. The issue is that he doesn't even really pretend to be a small "d" democrat, something most of those at least made an attempt to. Whether he remains a democratic leader is too much of a question mark.
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #38 on: November 11, 2019, 03:52:54 PM »

Normally it would be a welcome development, and Morales deserves a credit for not clinging onto power, which could make things worse. The problem is that certain elements may very well sneak into power.
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Green Line
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« Reply #39 on: November 11, 2019, 04:17:01 PM »

Hopefully, whoever the new rulers are, they keep The Church in mind.  And there is not biolence.
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America Needs R'hllor
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« Reply #40 on: November 11, 2019, 04:59:03 PM »

Hopefully, whoever the new rulers are, they keep The Church in mind.  And there is not biolence.

And what acts should they do while keeping the Church in mind? Because for now, they seem to be keeping it in mind:



If bigotry, racism and religious oppression is how the Church in wants to be kept in mind, then the Church is evil.
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Cashew
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« Reply #41 on: November 11, 2019, 05:45:03 PM »
« Edited: November 11, 2019, 07:00:02 PM by Tulsi "Both sides" Gabbard »

What a shame, had he focused on building up his party and potential successors he could have left office with both his policies and reputation intact, and be remembered as one of the best presidents Bolivia ever had. Too bad he got too greedy, now the future prospects of MAS are questionable.
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KaiserDave
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« Reply #42 on: November 11, 2019, 06:48:50 PM »

South American evangelism....yikes. All the yikes.
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Green Line
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« Reply #43 on: November 11, 2019, 07:01:57 PM »

Hopefully, whoever the new rulers are, they keep The Church in mind.  And there is not biolence.

And what acts should they do while keeping the Church in mind? Because for now, they seem to be keeping it in mind:



If bigotry, racism and religious oppression is how the Church in wants to be kept in mind, then the Church is evil.

Is he Catholic or Evangelical?  Its an important distinction.
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jfern
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« Reply #44 on: November 11, 2019, 07:22:28 PM »

This is what Trump should be impeached for.

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Nathan
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« Reply #45 on: November 11, 2019, 08:26:15 PM »
« Edited: November 11, 2019, 08:31:07 PM by Eastern Kentucky Demosaur fighting the long defeat »

Hopefully, whoever the new rulers are, they keep The Church in mind.  And there is not biolence.

And what acts should they do while keeping the Church in mind? Because for now, they seem to be keeping it in mind:



If bigotry, racism and religious oppression is how the Church in wants to be kept in mind, then the Church is evil.

Is he Catholic or Evangelical?  Its an important distinction.

I'm wondering this too, especially since Pachamama is currently an intra-Catholic political shibboleth (and specifically an anti-Pope Francis shibboleth) for non-Morales-related reasons.
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Lumine
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« Reply #46 on: November 11, 2019, 08:52:35 PM »

Hopefully, whoever the new rulers are, they keep The Church in mind.  And there is not biolence.

And what acts should they do while keeping the Church in mind? Because for now, they seem to be keeping it in mind:



If bigotry, racism and religious oppression is how the Church in wants to be kept in mind, then the Church is evil.

Is he Catholic or Evangelical?  Its an important distinction.

I'm wondering this too, especially since Pachamama is currently an intra-Catholic political shibboleth (and specifically an anti-Pope Francis shibboleth) for non-Morales-related reasons.

Camacho is Catholic - deeply Catholic -, but he's been skillful enough to garner a lot of Evangelical support and, from the looks of it, to mobilize religious-minded Bolivians in general through his use of religious rhetoric. The first round also saw evangelical pastor Chi Hyun Chung reach almost 9% of the votes in a surprising result, and it would appear his supporters (as well as many who supported Mesa or Ortiz, the moderate right candidate) are also firmly behind Camacho now.

However, it should be noted the Bolivian Opposition is not a united force. Camacho - who has been compared to Bolsonaro, although it is early to make that comparison - rose virtually out of nowhere to become the unofficial leader of the protests, but he's clearly at odds with the traditional parties and politicians (particularly with former President Mesa), and though his stock appears to have risen substantially - to the point in which one can easily see him running for President and doing well - he is not (yet) in power. Still, he's proven remarkably successful thus far.
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Nathan
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« Reply #47 on: November 11, 2019, 09:23:56 PM »
« Edited: November 11, 2019, 09:27:13 PM by Eastern Kentucky Demosaur fighting the long defeat »

Hopefully, whoever the new rulers are, they keep The Church in mind.  And there is not biolence.

And what acts should they do while keeping the Church in mind? Because for now, they seem to be keeping it in mind:



If bigotry, racism and religious oppression is how the Church in wants to be kept in mind, then the Church is evil.

Is he Catholic or Evangelical?  Its an important distinction.

I'm wondering this too, especially since Pachamama is currently an intra-Catholic political shibboleth (and specifically an anti-Pope Francis shibboleth) for non-Morales-related reasons.

Camacho is Catholic - deeply Catholic -, but he's been skillful enough to garner a lot of Evangelical support and, from the looks of it, to mobilize religious-minded Bolivians in general through his use of religious rhetoric.

Good grief.
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Lumine
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« Reply #48 on: November 11, 2019, 09:40:27 PM »

The Mexican Foreign Minister confirms Morales has boarded a plane sent by his government, he should land in Mexico (he'll recieve asylum there) in the next few hours.
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Green Line
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« Reply #49 on: November 11, 2019, 10:20:25 PM »

Mexico is really turning into a problematic state.
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