Romanian Elections&Politics (June 9th - Local and europarliamentary elections)

[RGM2609]

Hello people! I have decided to make this thread about my country's politics, as it's name suggests. Since tommorow, I'll post daily updates on what sh**t goes on around here. It will be a lot since we are having all kinds of elections in the 2019-2020 cycle. Next one is presidential in November. Enjoy! If you have any questions on the topic, feel free to ask

[Former President tack50]

Welcome to the forum! Looking forwards to your contributions

[DavidB.]

Thanks, looking forward to this!

[Estrella]

Hey and welcome!

I have a question. From what I know about Romanian politics, it seems like ideology is, at best, an afterthought, and conflicts are mostly around clashes of egos. If that's true, then is there some overarching...thing that differentiates the parties? I understand that Romanian politics used to be based around one's opinion of Băsescu, but now that he's gone, what's the dividing line? Is it something like mildly autocratic Ceaușescu nostalgics (PSD and their puppets) vs. everybody else? Or am I entirely wrong about this?

[RGM2609]

Hey and welcome!

I have a question. From what I know about Romanian politics, it seems like ideology is, at best, an afterthought, and conflicts are mostly around clashes of egos. If that's true, then is there some overarching...thing that differentiates the parties? I understand that Romanian politics used to be based around one's opinion of Băsescu, but now that he's gone, what's the dividing line? Is it something like mildly autocratic Ceaușescu nostalgics (PSD and their puppets) vs. everybody else? Or am I entirely wrong about this?

You'd be entirely correct if you gave this answer 15 years ago, however ever since Basescu's election a more coherent debate started to emerge in Romania, between West vs East. And I don't mean that geo-politically (even PSD was afraid to attack the EU before Dragnea came along) but more like a debate on the political/cultural/organisation system the country should adopt. It is between the syncronisation with the Western Countries or adopting a model whose best comparison, even through imperfect, is with the one of Belarus. Basescu was the one who started this debate even through its roots were already in the society, by adopting a more West-leaning speech compared to all other politicians (calling Basescu a supported of the Western system, would be incorrect, he was rather a moderate on this debate), which is the reason he was so polarising. The 2010 austerity measures stopped this debate for a while, the focus being driven towards Basescu and his drastic cuts. However, once Basescu and his party lost control due to popular anger, Victor Ponta and then even more so Liviu Dragnea governed exactly in the "Eastern" way, which would be fine in 2000 but not in 2019. This led to a wave of hostility against them and their party, PSD, and made Romanians more and more leaning towards the "Western" side. If we were to translate this theory to the existing parties, USR-PLUS would be the "party of the West", PSD-ALDE-UDMR and disguised ProRo the one of the East. PNL is rather incoherent on all of this. Hope I clarified things for you all.

[Estrella]

Hey and welcome!

I have a question. From what I know about Romanian politics, it seems like ideology is, at best, an afterthought, and conflicts are mostly around clashes of egos. If that's true, then is there some overarching...thing that differentiates the parties? I understand that Romanian politics used to be based around one's opinion of Băsescu, but now that he's gone, what's the dividing line? Is it something like mildly autocratic Ceaușescu nostalgics (PSD and their puppets) vs. everybody else? Or am I entirely wrong about this?

You'd be entirely correct if you gave this answer 15 years ago, however ever since Basescu's election a more coherent debate started to emerge in Romania, between West vs East. And I don't mean that geo-politically (even PSD was afraid to attack the EU before Dragnea came along) but more like a debate on the political/cultural/organisation system the country should adopt. It is between the syncronisation with the Western Countries or adopting a model whose best comparison, even through imperfect, is with the one of Belarus. Basescu was the one who started this debate even through its roots were already in the society, by adopting a more West-leaning speech compared to all other politicians (calling Basescu a supported of the Western system, would be incorrect, he was rather a moderate on this debate), which is the reason he was so polarising. The 2010 austerity measures stopped this debate for a while, the focus being driven towards Basescu and his drastic cuts. However, once Basescu and his party lost control due to popular anger, Victor Ponta and then even more so Liviu Dragnea governed exactly in the "Eastern" way, which would be fine in 2000 but not in 2019. This led to a wave of hostility against them and their party, PSD, and made Romanians more and more leaning towards the "Western" side. If we were to translate this theory to the existing parties, USR-PLUS would be the "party of the West", PSD-ALDE-UDMR and disguised ProRo the one of the East. PNL is rather incoherent on all of this. Hope I clarified things for you all.

Thanks a lot!

[RGM2609]

11th August 2019 - Days of fire for Prime Minister Dancila
Viorica Dancila, the first female Prime Minister of Romania, who was picked for her obedience to her Boss, Liviu Dragnea, has taken charge of the party after the corrupt PSD Leader was imprisoned, has been trying to create a "PSD with a human face" (Author's note: the phrase is notorious in Romania due to its 1st President post-communism said he wants to build "socialism with a human face" rather then a capitalistic society. He also said he'll build an "original democracy") following large segments of society going mad at Dragnea and his puppets and demolished them at the EU elections. However her plan was thwarted by recent developments.
First of all, the spark which started the fire was the state's incompetence in rescuing a kidnapped girl who phoned the emergency number 5 times and was told to close the phone because she was keeping the line busy. Afterwards, the Police waited 19 hours to locate the girl and 4 hours to sit in front of the house of the kidnapper waiting for a warrant they didn't need. (if that doesn't tell you everything about the Romanian state, idk what could). In the mean time, the girl went missing, likely dead. The public outrage was taken by the Police and the PSD, who ruled for more then half of the time since revolution and is seen as guilty of the authorities's incompetence.
Second of all, ALDE, PSD's coalition partner, threatened to leave the ship as its support declined due to it being PSD's loudest puppet for many years, and join ProRomania (anti-Dragnea&Dancila PSD faction which is led by Victor Ponta) in opposition. A reason for this might be Dancila refusing to back Tariceanu (the leader of ALDE) for President but run herself. If ALDE leaves the coalition, PSD will no longer have a majority unless the Hungarians and other minorities join them (unlikely) and snap elections will be held.
And third of all, yesterday it was the 1st aniversary of 10 august 2018, in which the Police used force against anti-PSD protestors and harmed thousands of peaceful men and women and even children. This action was likely ordered by Dragnea and executed by his protege and Homeland Security Secretary, Carmen Dan. 20.000 rallied to Bucharest in commemoration, and likely the number would have grown if the deeply despised Dragnea and Dan were still around on the political scene. The PSD made no comments on this, in stark difference to last year when Dragnea said the rally was an "attempt by the deep state, using the misinformed Romanians outside the country, to stage a coup d'etat against the PSD govt"
But this is not it, because the above-mentioned Dragnea, now in jail, contested the election of Viorica Dancila as PSD Leader saying it is not statutory. If the judges decide he is right, it is unclear what will happen next.
So overall a bad week for Dancila when she could have afforded it the least, given how close the Presidential election is.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Welcome to the forum, really looking forward to you staying round!

Just a small style point: It's much easier on the eyes if you separate paragraphs by skipping a line.

What is Victor Ponta's game with PRO? IIRC he was perceived as a corrupt strongman so it's hard to buy him as some sort of liberal reformer. What's you view on the guy?

[RGM2609]

Welcome to the forum, really looking forward to you staying round!

Just a small style point: It's much easier on the eyes if you separate paragraphs by skipping a line.

What is Victor Ponta's game with PRO? IIRC he was perceived as a corrupt strongman so it's hard to buy him as some sort of liberal reformer. What's you view on the guy?

I don't like the guy because I don't believe his shocking transformation, I think he has no political ideology and is just swinging around being what he thinks the electorate wants him to be. He was a typical PSD corrupt leader as PM, after Dragnea ousted him he turned into full nationalism and conspiracy theories and then, when PSD took over that message, he became the liberal reformer he "is" today. Another reason for which I am skeptical of his change is that he welcomed with open arms Adrian Tutuianu, a man who used to dominate my county or state idk which is more accurate and is very controversial to say the least, in his party. I used to think he wants to come back to PSD when Dragnea gets ousted but now I believe his game is more long term - pushing PSD into PiS/Orban ideology while taking its electorate away. About the "liberal reformer" thing - he is appealing to what I like to call "embarassed PSD fans" - people respected in their communities likely from small towns or large rural areas who supported PSD when it was strong and powerful but started to turn away from it in the Dragnea Era when supporting it publicly would lead to them being ridiculed and lose prestige. This is one of his largest voting groups, together with people mobilised by PSD politicians who defected. He is also kind of getting a reevaluation now, especially when compared to Dragnea - the average Romanian still dislikes him, but doesn't hate him anymore. I hope I clarified the Ponta thing

[Diouf]

What is PLUS doing now with Ciolos as leader of the RENEW group in the EP? Is he still active in Romanian media, or do they have other figures who can keep the party afloat?

[RGM2609]

What is PLUS doing now with Ciolos as leader of the RENEW group in the EP? Is he still active in Romanian media, or do they have other figures who can keep the party afloat?

Not really. PLUS was pretty much a one men party (no offense to all of its respectable members), and with him going in Bruxelles, it faded into the background. They signed an electoral alliance for the entire cycle with USR so they will get a few members into offices but it is pretty clear to everyone which party dominates the alliance - internally, publicly and electoraly. I think the Party's future is either an absorbtion or becoming for USR like KDNP is for Fidesz, tho Romanian politics tend to complicate in surprising ways

[RGM2609]

12th August 2019 - Ponta's gamble likely failed: PSD-ALDE continues without PRO, and how bad can Dancila's proposals for EU Commissar be

Ponta's attempt to either break the coalition or get in it seams to have failed - in an extraordinary meeting Dancila ceded a lot of ground to ALDE and its leader, Tariceanu. More Cabinet positions for the party who got 4% at the last EU election (ALDE) the canceling of the budgetary reconciliation PSD was planning due to their financial incompetence which buried Romania in debt and deficit and the rewriting of the disastrous governmantal agenda which was wrote by Dragnea, who is one in jail. The biggest losers were Ponta and his party, who Dancila refused to include in the majority and ALDE sacrificed their plans to join PRO in favor of PSD's offers. However the elephant în the room, the presidential election, was not settled. Tariceanu is desperate to run for the job with PSD's backing, who refused the proposal and nominated Dancila. Tariceanu is known for his ego, and might despise Dancila for running against him so much that he may return to PRO. But we will see.

Dancila's proposals for the EU Commissar  were 2: Rovana Plumb and Dan Nica. Both are disastreous and I doubt EU accepting them. Dan Nica was sued for fraud with IT licences, lied on the floor of the EU Parliament about 98% of those accused of corruption în Romania are found innocent (real date: 10%), supported Dragnea's push against justice and was alledgedly payed by a Swedish company for lobby. Rovana Plumb is even worse. I happen to live in the county/state she rules over with puppets and I can tell you this: she is nicknamed "Mommy" because she appoints her son in all kinds of important offices without him proofing any kind of competence at any point, she is suspected to have given an island to the County/State ruled by Dragnea while Secretary, dar a big supported of Dragnea and his corrupt actions, she registred her car in Bulgaria to avoid paying a tax that was proposed and put în place by ... herself, and she praised all PSD Leaders while în power then after they are gone slam them. For example, she seemed close to having an orgasm while daily praising Dragnea în the EU campaign, and even went as far as saying that "Romania is Dragnea's". After he got arrested she said she has better things to do then visiting the, according to her earlier statement, owner of Romania. Ponta got treated în the same way and Dancila is on track of getting it too. So yeah...

[Diouf]

With von der Leyen's insistence on a gender-equal comission, I guess a female candidate would be more likely to end up being accepted. I think currently, 12 male and 9 female commissioners have been nominated. But corruption charges like the one you mention certainly seem like something the EP could use to reject a nominee if they wish to

[RGM2609]

With von der Leyen's insistence on a gender-equal comission, I guess a female candidate would be more likely to end up being accepted. I think currently, 12 male and 9 female commissioners have been nominated. But corruption charges like the one you mention certainly seem like something the EP could use to reject a nominee if they wish to

The investigation into Plumb was stopped by the Romanian Parliament's refusal to cancel her judicial immunity. Now that she is a member of the EU Parliament, idk if she still has immunity. She might even get arrested without it.

[RGM2609]

13 August 2019 - Tariceanu puts Dancila in a tight spot and the Crimes of Caracal still in the spotlight

Senate Chairman and ALDE Leader Calin Popescu Tariceanu once again changed his mind while sleeping. After yesterday seemingly coming to an agreement with Dancila on the future of the coalition, today he said the cabinet is "incompetent" and state agencies just pretend to be working, which are pretty big words coming from someone in power. This statements put PM Dancila in a very tight spot, who is seemingly blackmailed by ALDE. To be fair she did today gaffes too, by accusing sexism as the reason she is criticized and appointing the men of media oligarch Dan Voiculescu to coordinate the building of roads. About Tariceanu, I still think his goal is the Presidency, and tries to blackmail both PSD and Pro Romania into supporting him, but he has taken things too far and I wouldn't be surprised if both decide to screw him over due to how annoyed they are.

The Crimes of Caracal are still in the spotlight as the 2 girls seem to be dead due to the state's incompetence. Political implications later. Now just RIP...

[RGM2609]

Sorry guys I accidentaly deleted everything I wrote so I will give you a quick update since I don't feel I am up to writing it again now: Tariceanu and Dancila continue to clash, Dancila said that Tariceanu was likely thinking of ALDE's Secretaries when he said the Cabinet was incompetent even tho she later backed down and said that people from both parties need to go, and Mayor Firea of Bucharest did new strange things: imposed a tax on cars to cover up for the waste that happened during her tenure and which bankrupted the entire city, all while trying desperately to save her ineffective and declared illegal municipal public companies through loopholes. Also, please tell me what u think of this so far!

[aaaa2222]

Very useful! There's not much English language coverage of Romanian politics outside of very major events, so this is handy for getting a feel of how things are moving in the interim.

[Former President tack50]

Everything so far is great!

Just keep in mind that there is no need for a daily update, especially when things are calm and boring (which is not now I guess)

[TheSaint250]

Great to have you on the forum! Thank you for these updates. Like Tack said, please don’t feel obligated to post daily updates if there’s nothing big going on, but I greatly appreciate reading your posts about what’s going on in Romania

[RGM2609]

Great to have you on the forum! Thank you for these updates. Like Tack said, please don’t feel obligated to post daily updates if there’s nothing big going on, but I greatly appreciate reading your posts about what’s going on in Romania

Thanks everyone! Weirdly, everyone here just minded his/her own busniess so far today and nothing of note happened - except maybe for an incident at President Iohannis's Navy Day Speech, where a soldier fainted during the speech but he continued coldly. However this doesn't clash with Iohannis's cynical, cold public personna so is unlikely to produce any effects

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Thank you for having you on the forum. Do you have an idea who i would vote for in Romania if i vote PVDA-PTB in Belgium (a bit to the left than Sanders, BE (Portugal), Podemos, Corbyn's Labour and similar to PCF and PaP in Italy. Or are the social dems really the best option. Are they truly left-wing?

[RGM2609]

Thank you for having you on the forum. Do you have an idea who i would vote for in Romania if i vote PVDA-PTB in Belgium (a bit to the left than Sanders, BE (Portugal), Podemos, Corbyn's Labour and similar to PCF and PaP in Italy. Or are the social dems really the best option. Are they truly left-wing?

Definetly not. There are American billionares, fascist movements and authentic conservatives that are to the left of PSD economically, socially or both. About the vote - hmm. If you are integrated in the Romanian current debate (details in the thread), you'd most likely vote for USR-PLUS, because I doubt you like Neo-Feudalism. If you continue to vote based on Western ideologies tho, I think you'd vote for a small activist party named Demos.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Thank you for having you on the forum. Do you have an idea who i would vote for in Romania if i vote PVDA-PTB in Belgium (a bit to the left than Sanders, BE (Portugal), Podemos, Corbyn's Labour and similar to PCF and PaP in Italy. Or are the social dems really the best option. Are they truly left-wing?

Definetly not. There are American billionares, fascist movements and authentic conservatives that are to the left of PSD economically, socially or both. About the vote - hmm. If you are integrated in the Romanian current debate (details in the thread), you'd most likely vote for USR-PLUS, because I doubt you like Neo-Feudalism. If you continue to vote based on Western ideologies tho, I think you'd vote for a small activist party named Demos.

It depends on whether USR-PLUS is more like M5S or En Marche. I dislike EM, but like M5S. I like an anti-corruption platform but i am skeptical of other policies.

[RGM2609]

Viorica Dancila's electoral journey goes badly - like everything for her this days.
PM Dancila has already started campaigning for the Presidential election, by going in an official visit all around Moldova - a region which was traditionally enslaved by PSD but started rising up in the Ponta-Dragnea Era, an visit in which she visited party HQs and hospitals in which she bragged about the quality of the healthcare system (in which people go to hospital with cold and leave it dead or with some grave ilness) and how much the PSD govt doubled the salaries of doctors and other public workers (so much our government is almost bankrupt in the name of populism). Her visit was however instantly ridiculed because she used a helicopter to go to the region which has no highways after years and years of PSD government. She also met a few hecklers in Iasi, a city which is nowadays hating PSD but it could have been worse. Dragnea had a rally there in which he brought people from all corners of Moldova but there came as many people to counter-manifesto from Iasi only. The PM met with the Leader of the Hungarian party, probably to discuss a new governing majority if ALDE leaves. She made a few announcments about replacing some Secretaries and re-writing the governing program, nothing big tho. She also responded to criticism to her disastreous EU Commissar proposals by saying: "it was my choice to propose them". I would be very disappointed if they ever get close to the job.

[RGM2609]

Nothing big today - except Dancila announcing another PSD Convention in August 24th to likely nominate her as a Presidential candidate. Her running likely against her will is gonna be the last straw on her crumbling political future - especially if she, as polls suggest, fails to get in the 2nd round.