Regarding Personal Attacks

[Virginiá]

I don’t see how my post was a personal attack of any kind. I posted a quote from a movie in the box next to YT, but I don’t think anyone would seriously think it was a personal attack on him.

What was it supposed to mean? It looks like like a personal attack to me.'

I would have moderated that post as well. I mean, at the very least, several other people thought it was a personal attack too, based on the reports. To me, it looks like an insult towards YT, and I'm a bit curious if this post-deletion stuff is a walk back where someone pretends something blatantly offensive is somehow not blatantly offensive. And just because it's a movie quote does not mean it cannot be repurposed as an insult for someone.

This. Reminder that f***  Kingpoleon was left alone in 2016.

Lumine was not even in a moderator of AFE boards in 2016. Gustaf was, so two things: 1) if not one reported it, it would be easy to miss, 2) Gustaf may have made a different decision but that doesn't mean Lumine would go the same route. Diversity of opinion among mods is pretty common...

[Virginiá]

Maybe a better option here would be to work on some legislation to discourage people from using their ballots to throw shade at other users.

[Adam Griffin]

The mods need to get over this sudden and obsessive policing of votes in an elections simulator - and memey voters need to get over goofing around and otherwise risking the integrity of their votes with silly write-ins, foreign language ballots, and other not-as-edgy-as-it-seems behavior that throws our election results into question.

After observing multiple forms of shenanigans today (including a certain someone yet again encouraging people to de-register), I know what needs to be done. I will be introducing legislation very shortly to remedy multiple problems that for years we didn't have to worry about because we had legislative solutions.

[Former President tack50]

Bumping this to state it once again, please stop misusing the Voting Booth to post personal attacks or something of the kind.

I really don't like having to take action there, but I think made it fairly clear that it is clearly inappropriate, and what the result will be.

If this decides the election, we'll see you in court for your fraud.

Let moderators doing their job. Atlas issues > Atlasia issues.

Honestly, Wulfric does have a point here. While it doesn't apply in this election per se and I still trust Lumine's neutrality (even if I think he is wrong in this particular case), there is an extremely obvious conflict of interest for the moderators in Atlasia; especially in regards to voting booths; if they are active players in the game as well.

I am honestly surprised it has never surfaced in the 15 years or so that Atlasia has existed.

The only solutions I can think of are making either Gustaf more involved in modding the board (possibly even requiring the approval of both Lumine and Gustaf to delete ballots) or removing Lumine as a mod and swapping him with someone not involved in Atlasia (the only real candidate here would be muon2)

[Former President tack50]

Maybe a better option here would be to work on some legislation to discourage people from using their ballots to throw shade at other users.

Well, Atlasia apparently used to have rules against campaigning in the voting booth, but the Supreme Court found them unconstitutional

[YE]

The mods need to get over this sudden and obsessive policing of votes in an elections simulator - and memey voters need to get over goofing around and otherwise risking the integrity of their votes with silly write-ins, foreign language ballots, and other not-as-edgy-as-it-seems behavior that throws our election results into question.

After observing multiple forms of shenanigans today (including a certain someone yet again encouraging people to de-register), I know what needs to be done. I will be introducing legislation very shortly to remedy multiple problems that for years we didn't have to worry about because we had legislative solutions.

Yea, I'd be fully on board with that.

[fhtagn]

The mods need to get over this sudden and obsessive policing of votes in an elections simulator - and memey voters need to get over goofing around and otherwise risking the integrity of their votes with silly write-ins, foreign language ballots, and other not-as-edgy-as-it-seems behavior that throws our election results into question.

After observing multiple forms of shenanigans today (including a certain someone yet again encouraging people to de-register), I know what needs to be done. I will be introducing legislation very shortly to remedy multiple problems that for years we didn't have to worry about because we had legislative solutions.

You literally embraced meme ballots that made you president.

[Adam Griffin]

The mods need to get over this sudden and obsessive policing of votes in an elections simulator - and memey voters need to get over goofing around and otherwise risking the integrity of their votes with silly write-ins, foreign language ballots, and other not-as-edgy-as-it-seems behavior that throws our election results into question.

After observing multiple forms of shenanigans today (including a certain someone yet again encouraging people to de-register), I know what needs to be done. I will be introducing legislation very shortly to remedy multiple problems that for years we didn't have to worry about because we had legislative solutions.

You literally embraced meme ballots that made you president.

"Embraced"? You mean I didn't seek to have them invalidated?

I'm sure you thought you had a point in there somewhere.

[Pericles]

I don't think Lumine is coming at this from a position of bias or malice. People often accuse the mods of being biased and they're pretty much always wrong. However, I do think it is a slippery slope in moderating ballots, and should only be done for the most serious of situations such as ASV's ballot. This is a political game and people often make memes so there is a high risk of things going overboard here. We need much clearer and stricter guidelines, Lumine shouldn't be deciding things on a case by case basis because there is a much higher chance he either gets it wrong or undermines public confidence in his moderation, so for everybody's sake we need to make the ground rules absolutely clear.

[fhtagn]

The mods need to get over this sudden and obsessive policing of votes in an elections simulator - and memey voters need to get over goofing around and otherwise risking the integrity of their votes with silly write-ins, foreign language ballots, and other not-as-edgy-as-it-seems behavior that throws our election results into question.

After observing multiple forms of shenanigans today (including a certain someone yet again encouraging people to de-register), I know what needs to be done. I will be introducing legislation very shortly to remedy multiple problems that for years we didn't have to worry about because we had legislative solutions.

You literally embraced meme ballots that made you president.

"Embraced"? You mean I didn't seek to have them invalidated?

I'm sure you thought you had a point in there somewhere.

See bolded portion above.

[Adam Griffin]

The mods need to get over this sudden and obsessive policing of votes in an elections simulator - and memey voters need to get over goofing around and otherwise risking the integrity of their votes with silly write-ins, foreign language ballots, and other not-as-edgy-as-it-seems behavior that throws our election results into question.

After observing multiple forms of shenanigans today (including a certain someone yet again encouraging people to de-register), I know what needs to be done. I will be introducing legislation very shortly to remedy multiple problems that for years we didn't have to worry about because we had legislative solutions.

You literally embraced meme ballots that made you president.

"Embraced"? You mean I didn't seek to have them invalidated?

I'm sure you thought you had a point in there somewhere.

See bolded portion above. It's painfully obvious you don't actually care about this when it benefits you or someone you are trying to get elected. You can take your fake concern elsewhere, because no one is falling for it.

Uhh, I was talking about my side there.

[Lumine]

Right.

I think the biggest frustration that I have with this type of situation is that people seem to rapidly jump from disagreeing with a judgement to personal attacks.

It is one thing to disagree with a decision and raise the issue for review (or even bring it up to Virginia, Muon or the Mod Team in general), because, obviously, I can make mistakes. It is another to immediately shout fraud, imply or state I delete posts at whim (which some particular users have done several times before) and generally make the situation worse for all. In this case, I do stand by my decision and would like to thank YE and Virginia for offering their input, I strongly trust their judgement.

Having said that, I confess I don’t enjoy having my integrity constantly put into question by some users again and again, particularly as some people seem to prefer (and this is a legitimate point of view) a hands off approach. Mistakes that could be made aside, it is a bit hard to do the job if people can’t or won’t trust the motivations of someone trying to do it.

And well, perhaps that does mean having to actually choose between playing or moderating, it’s certainly something I’ve been considering lately and should probably take action on.

PS: The unpleasant situation aside, I wholeheartedly endorse legislation to address voting booth shenanigans.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

For the record, many people do prefer a hands-off approach, and a hands-off approach was what your predecessors did (and what you did initially).  Such an approach, especially in the voting booth, allows the winner to be well, the actual winner, rather than simply the candidate whose voters satisfied the latest changing standard of what qualifies as a "personal attack", which honestly seems to shift every few months on this site.

It's sad that we are in a point where one of the exceptions likely being established to the 'no double posting in the voting booth law' is deletion by a mod or admin, but such legislation is a necessity.

[GM Team Member and Deputy PPT WB]

I don’t see how my post was a personal attack of any kind. I posted a quote from a movie in the box next to YT, but I don’t think anyone would seriously think it was a personal attack on him.

What was it supposed to mean? It looks like like a personal attack to me.'

I would have moderated that post as well. I mean, at the very least, several other people thought it was a personal attack too, based on the reports. To me, it looks like an insult towards YT, and I'm a bit curious if this post-deletion stuff is a walk back where someone pretends something blatantly offensive is somehow not blatantly offensive. And just because it's a movie quote does not mean it cannot be repurposed as an insult for someone.

Maybe some people saw it that way, but it was not at all designed to be a personal attack. In fact, I'd say it looks less like a personal attack than what HCP did in the Senate election last week, and that post wasn't deleted.

[AustralianSwingVoter]

I still fail to understand why ballots that violate the TOS can't simply be edited to remove infringing content.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I still fail to understand why ballots that violate the TOS can't simply be edited to remove infringing content.

Involves even  deeper trust required in mods, as that would enable them to not only remove a vote for a candidate, but also give a vote to their opponent.

[AustralianSwingVoter]

I still fail to understand why ballots that violate the TOS can't simply be edited to remove infringing content.

Involves even  deeper trust required in mods, as that would enable them to not only remove a vote for a candidate, but also give a vote to their opponent.

Given how many vote trackers there are I strongly doubt a mod would be able to edit a ballot and change the votes without someone noticing.

[AustralianSwingVoter]

What we need to do is get an amendment passed that allows someone to recast their ballot if it has been moderated and deleted. That way we can cope with the moderators enforcing the TOS without it impacting upon the democratic process.

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

What we need to do is get an amendment passed that allows someone to recast their ballot if it has been moderated and deleted. That way we can cope with the moderators enforcing the TOS without it impacting upon the democratic process.

Seriously, this.

[AustralianSwingVoter]

What we need to do is get an amendment passed that allows someone to recast their ballot if it has been moderated and deleted. That way we can cope with the moderators enforcing the TOS without it impacting upon the democratic process.

Seriously, this.

And not just federally but also in all 3 regions.

[Unconditional Surrender Truman]

What we need to do is get an amendment passed that allows someone to recast their ballot if it has been moderated and deleted. That way we can cope with the moderators enforcing the TOS without it impacting upon the democratic process.

Seriously, this.

And not just federally but also in all 3 regions.

I've introduced legislation in Frémont to achieve this.

[Lumine]

What we need to do is get an amendment passed that allows someone to recast their ballot if it has been moderated and deleted. That way we can cope with the moderators enforcing the TOS without it impacting upon the democratic process.

Seriously, this.

And not just federally but also in all 3 regions.

Indeed, I think that would be a necessary solution.

The aggressive rhetoric aside, I do agree with Wulfric that editing ballots is not exactly workable as a solution and I've declined to do so thus far because it seemed obvious it would be both excessively controversial and a source for problems.

For the record, many people do prefer a hands-off approach, and a hands-off approach was what your predecessors did (and what you did initially).  Such an approach, especially in the voting booth, allows the winner to be well, the actual winner, rather than simply the candidate whose voters satisfied the latest changing standard of what qualifies as a "personal attack", which honestly seems to shift every few months on this site.

It's sad that we are in a point where one of the exceptions likely being established to the 'no double posting in the voting booth law' is deletion by a mod or admin, but the mod team has stooped so low that such legislation is a necessity.

Yes, a hands off approach was what took place before and the attitude I held as well. That changed out of the belief that - as I said before - allowing the board to go virtually un-moderated is not exactly a good idea because a lot of negative and unhealthy stuff (particulary things that blatantly go against the TOS) went unpunished in the past.

[Sestak]

You’d need to amend the constitution to pass such legislation, as the constitution explicitly bans posting twice at present.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

You’d need to amend the constitution to pass such legislation, as the constitution explicitly bans posting twice at present.

We are aware of that

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Atlasian drama $10

Atlasian drama requiring intervention of the mods $20


Predicting the next Atlasian drama because you have been here forever   priceless