Canada General Discussion (2019-)

[Never Made it to Graceland]

Trudeau also dismisses the group as a ‘small fringe’ that holds ‘unacceptable views’.  Wow so now Trudeau is now turning into the thought police as some views are now "unacceptable" according to him.

I mean swastikas, Confederate flags and other far right emphera waved by people in the convoy sort of proves him right.

That's not going to be an effective argument to jaichind.

[LordLarry]

[Damocles]

What is Trudeau doing?

Don’t give these rabble an inch. You need to respond swiftly, without any prior warning, and without any recourse. Confiscate their trucks with civil asset forfeiture, suspend their commercial driving licenses, and send in the Army to move the trucks out of the way. Then, round up and throw the ringleaders in jail, shut down any media outlets emboldening or supporting them, and track down any other dissenters.

These petulant f#%ks deserve to be put in their place for daring to endanger the supply chains that feed millions of Canadians, all to stroke their egos with this petty little “protest”. You have no right to be a plague rat, and in fact, refusing to institute any sort of mandates would be negligence on the part of the government.

Make them answer for why they want millions of Canadians to starve and be unable to access basic goods and services. Make them answer for their childish behavior in refusing to take a vaccine that has been administered hundreds of millions of times, with barely any adverse consequences. Make them answer for why they want to exacerbate the worst supply chain crisis that country has endured in decades. Make them answer for why they believe their individual freedom is transcendental, and gives them carte blanche to infringe on those of others.

No sympathy for these truckers. F#%k around and find out.

[MaxQue]

What is Trudeau doing?

Don’t give these rabble an inch. You need to respond swiftly, without any prior warning, and without any recourse. Confiscate their trucks with civil asset forfeiture, suspend their commercial driving licenses, and send in the Army to move the trucks out of the way. Then, round up and throw the ringleaders in jail, shut down any media outlets emboldening or supporting them, and track down any other dissenters.

These petulant f#%ks deserve to be put in their place for daring to endanger the supply chains that feed millions of Canadians, all to stroke their egos with this petty little “protest”. You have no right to be a plague rat, and in fact, refusing to institute any sort of mandates would be negligence on the part of the government.

Make them answer for why they want millions of Canadians to starve and be unable to access basic goods and services. Make them answer for their childish behavior in refusing to take a vaccine that has been administered hundreds of millions of times, with barely any adverse consequences. Make them answer for why they want to exacerbate the worst supply chain crisis that country has endured in decades. Make them answer for why they believe their individual freedom is transcendental, and gives them carte blanche to infringe on those of others.

No sympathy for these truckers. F#%k around and find out.

Both civil forfeiture and driver licences are provincial powers and courts would look very badly on any political use of any of the solutions you proposed.

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

Canada is a free society that allows protest no matter how much you disagree with it.

[King of Kensington]

Former Canadian Jewish Congress leader Bernie Farber says this was the worst display of Nazi propaganda he's seen in Canada over five decades;

https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1997828675918

[Damocles]

Both civil forfeiture and driver licences are provincial powers and courts would look very badly on any political use of any of the solutions you proposed.

It is an unlawful assembly that openly attracts, supports, and emboldens domestic terrorist organizations, and allows them a place to gather. They don’t exactly hide the fact that they welcome and empower White supremacists among their ranks. It must be quelled swiftly on that basis alone.

[Bootes Void]

I was watching the trucker protests on the news and yikes these guys are an embarrassment. They took an otherwise issues that some people may agree but turn it completely toxic

[DC Al Fine]

What is Trudeau doing?

Don’t give these rabble an inch. You need to respond swiftly, without any prior warning, and without any recourse.Confiscate their trucks with civil asset forfeiture, suspend their commercial driving licenses, and send in the Army to move the trucks out of the way. Then, round up and throw the ringleaders in jail, shut down any media outlets emboldening or supporting them, and track down any other dissenters.

Both civil forfeiture and driver licences are provincial powers and courts would look very badly on any political use of any of the solutions you proposed.

It is an unlawful assembly that openly attracts, supports, and emboldens domestic terrorist organizations, and allows them a place to gather. They don’t exactly hide the fact that they welcome and empower White supremacists among their ranks. It must be quelled swiftly on that basis alone.

I know a guy in textiles who can get you a good deal on brown shirts and jack boots. Let me know if you're interested.

[CumbrianLefty]

Yes......and??

[MaxQue]

Trudeau has COVID.

[StateBoiler]

I was watching the trucker protests on the news and yikes these guys are an embarrassment. They took an otherwise issues that some people may agree but turn it completely toxic

Give me 100 people organizing on any issue and I'll be able to find the 3 idiots and get them to talk portraying the group in the worst light possible. The larger the group, the easier to find idiots. It's one way how the media gaslights the public.

[Associate Justice PiT]

I was watching the trucker protests on the news and yikes these guys are an embarrassment. They took an otherwise issues that some people may agree but turn it completely toxic

Give me 100 people organizing on any issue and I'll be able to find the 3 idiots and get them to talk portraying the group in the worst light possible. The larger the group, the easier to find idiots. It's one way how the media gaslights the public.

     This is the dimension of "fake news" that people often miss. When they hear the term they think of outright falsehoods, but it is easy to report entirely factual information in a misleading manner, creating false impressions of the situation. This was what led to an overwhelming public impression that Kyle Rittenhouse was guilty until the testimony and evidence at trial revealed otherwise.

[mileslunn]

I think convoy probably helps Trudeau at least in short term.  Yes some will say calling these people fringe unhelpful but I think many tired of anti-vaxxers.  Tories are in tough spot as support this and risk alienating the key centrist swing voters or oppose this and risk seeing more on right flank going over to PPC.

I think long term it would be in their interest to say like most of us they are tired of pandemic and would like to find a way to remove restrictions as soon as possible.  But at same time this is not way and likewise getting vaccinated is still the best way to help return us to normal.

Real problem with convoy is much of what they are opposing has nothing to do with feds.  The vaccine mandate on cross border truckers is also applied by US so even if we dropped ours, Canadian truckers still would not be able to enter US.  Likewise most public health restrictions are provincial which Trudeau has no control over.  In addition I think enough take a nuanced view on this.  I don't think either on one end those wanting full lockdowns or on other end have no restrictions like Florida are in majority.  I think most Canadians fall somewhere in between those two.

Still looking provincially, I do believe future shutdowns of businesses, capacity limits and mask mandates will probably see support fall.  Asides for your hardcore types, most were for restrictions early on as wanted to save lives.  Longer it drags on, more fatigue sets in and no matter who is in government will be more polarizing.  Most of us hoped pandemic would be over and life back to normal by now, but it is not.  So you get divide between those who say keep restrictions in hope of saving lives and eventually ending it vs. those who want to throw in towel thinking this will be here forever so we just need to learn to live with it.

I do think though anti-viral medications could do a lot to keep people out of hospitals thus less need for lockdowns.  And likewise both feds and provinces should find way to increase ICU capacity so lockdowns aren't needed.  Europe a year ago generally in most places had more restrictive lockdowns than much of Canada.  Today most have vaccine passports and mask mandates, but everything is open despite much higher case rates due to the fact they have larger hospital capacity so they don't need to lockdown after each spike. 

[2952-0-0]

Give me 100 people organizing on any issue and I'll be able to find the 3 idiots and get them to talk portraying the group in the worst light possible. The larger the group, the easier to find idiots. It's one way how the media gaslights the public.

For a protest that's all about restarting the economy and restoring freedom, they didn't respect the thousands of retail and restaurant workers who lost hours, or the local business owners who lost customers, or the local residents who endured their honking and diesel exhaust. It's far beyond a few idiots with Nazi and Confederate flags. The group itself is a nuisance, and in any other context, would have been ordered to disperse long ago.

I think convoy probably helps Trudeau at least in short term.  Yes some will say calling these people fringe unhelpful but I think many tired of anti-vaxxers.  Tories are in tough spot as support this and risk alienating the key centrist swing voters or oppose this and risk seeing more on right flank going over to PPC.

I think long term it would be in their interest to say like most of us they are tired of pandemic and would like to find a way to remove restrictions as soon as possible.  But at same time this is not way and likewise getting vaccinated is still the best way to help return us to normal.

Erin O'Toole is deader than a dodo. He alienated both the party base and the centrist swing voters during last September's election, and his conduct since then hasn't helped matters. A gaggle of the party's hard-core names are now running their own show without the leader's involvement, and Pierre Poilievre has all but declared himself leader. Elsewhere, I'm sure the CPC and PPC will begin to converge in the polls. What that results in is anyone's guess.

Regardless what else happens, it's certain that we'll be in the same situation as the UK and Denmark no later than the Spring. No one enjoys the restrictions, and we all want them lifted ASAP.

[RogueBeaver]

Tory caucus revolt erupts, at least 35 MPs have signed a letter calling for a caucus leadership vote as soon as Wednesday. As usual, both sides claim a majority.

[jaymichaud]

This was bound to happen... only depressed cat ladies and wine moms want covid protocols to continue

[2952-0-0]

Oh dear...

https://twitter.com/Travisdhanraj/status/1488323446044073984

https://twitter.com/Travisdhanraj/status/1488324270988140545

[mileslunn]

Agreed O'Toole is finished as leader.  Real danger is party moves further right.  But as someone who follows British politics closely, maybe choosing Poilievre or Lewis and then getting crushed in a general election will be what forces party to wake up and change.  It was only after Corbyn took Labour to worst showing since 1935 that party started to smarten up and marginalize more left wing elements.  While on opposite side of spectrum, I do think Tories in Canada and Labour UK asides ideology have a lot in common in terms of infighting and keeping coalition together.

[PSOL]

I have full faith that electorally Trudeau would be fine, the FPTP system in Canada and Liberal strategizing in getting conservative haters to vote for him is a slick machine. I’m concerned more about conflict in Canada’s exterior given many secessionist and fascistic parties don’t need majorities, or even that many MP’s, to be dangerous. The fact that even the Canadian government sees this as a problem with previously banning the Proud Boys and Oath Keepers shows similar concern.

[T'Chenka]

This was bound to happen... only depressed cat ladies and wine moms want covid protocols to continue

...and the majority of Canadians, when polled. Oops.

[T'Chenka]

Agreed O'Toole is finished as leader.  Real danger is party moves further right.  But as someone who follows British politics closely, maybe choosing Poilievre or Lewis and then getting crushed in a general election will be what forces party to wake up and change. 

Agreed. The party moving further right is only a danger if it can successfully win an election that way. Which likely won't happen. The Conservatives need people like O'Toole and they need to move in that direction if they want to win. Luckily for leftists like me, the party seems to have no interest in doing anything like that at the moment.

[StateBoiler]

For a protest that's all about restarting the economy and restoring freedom, they didn't respect the thousands of retail and restaurant workers who lost hours, or the local business owners who lost customers, or the local residents who endured their honking and diesel exhaust. It's far beyond a few idiots with Nazi and Confederate flags. The group itself is a nuisance, and in any other context, would have been ordered to disperse long ago.

"People think what they want is freedom. What they really want is order."

-Imperial Army officer on the 2nd season of the Mandalorian

[Estrella]

Doubt that much will come out of this, but good to see that the police is at least pretending to do something: Ottawa police setting up hate crime hotline after reports of assaults, threats (CBC)

No matter where you live, no matter where your vehicle's registered, if you've come here and committed a crime, if you have committed a hate crime, you will be investigated. We will look for you, we will charge you. If necessary, we'll arrest you, and we will pursue prosecutions against you.

[The Right Honourable Martin Brian Mulroney PC CC GOQ]

Yes......and??

I mean, I don't think AOC has a public opinion on the trucker protest in Canada, but I know plenty of Canadians who stan AOC and would retweet this in a heartbeat, who are taking the opposite position when it comes to this particular protest