Bernie Sanders 2020 campaign megathread

[James Monroe]

https://twitter.com/SallyAlbright/status/1142584257874923527

[💥💥 brandon bro (he/him/his)]

Bernie stans need to realize that the issue moderates/establishment people have with them isn't do to policy. The issue is that they are incompetent and the campaign is amateurish. Like yesterday, Bernie is at Clyburn's Fish Fry and does a speech on the third way think tank. How many voters do you think knows and actually cares about some DC centrist think tank? Warren is no moderate herself and you see some Democratic hacks warming up to her and it is in part because she doesn't do stupid stuff like this.

Nailed it.

When you run an insurgent campaign, you're going to make people upset because you're an insurgent no matter what you believe.

Plenty of people were mad at squishy "centrists" like Seth Moulton and Tim Ryan for trying to mobilize Congressional Democrats to go scorched earth against Pelosi in December 2018. If the movement stayed relevant for longer than ten days then these dudes' names would be mud right now rather than punchlines.

[QAnonKelly]

That is not true. The centrist think tanks know Bernie is the only candidate who can get a Medicare for all or some sort of that legislation passed & are worried about it.

Lmao.

The "centrists" (whatever the hell that means these days) don't want Sanders because they think he would blow the election. His campaign is being run by morons and that what spooks them.

They aren't scared of Bernie getting MFA passed. They know that is DOA given how the Senate is made up.

"Oh it's too hard, we give up" is an approach Democrats took for 8 years under Obama. Every time he gave Republicans a little bit of ground, they lurched rightward. I mean, isn't Obamacare a right-wing policy originally developed as the counter to universal healthcare in the 1990s?

Meeting Republicans halfway will not change a damn thing. If there's one thing Democrats should've learnt from Republicans by now, it's that if you start out from a more extreme negotiating position, you're more likely to get more of what you want in the final bill.

I have no idea what your post has to do with anything I said.

Bernie stans need to realize that the issue moderates/establishment people have with them isn't do to policy. The issue is that they are incompetent and the campaign is amateurish. Like yesterday, Bernie is at Clyburn's Fish Fry and does a speech on the third way think tank. How many voters do you think knows and actually cares about some DC centrist think tank? Warren is no moderate herself and you see some Democratic hacks warming up to her and it is in part because she doesn't do stupid stuff like this.

Warren is nothing if not a team player. She's also got a great team. Sanders has hired a bunch of rose twitter hacks to run his campaign and it shows. Only rose twitter people care about what Third Way has to say.

[NOVA Green]

That is not true. The centrist think tanks know Bernie is the only candidate who can get a Medicare for all or some sort of that legislation passed & are worried about it.

Lmao.

The "centrists" (whatever the hell that means these days) don't want Sanders because they think he would blow the election. His campaign is being run by morons and that what spooks them.

They aren't scared of Bernie getting MFA passed. They know that is DOA given how the Senate is made up.

"Oh it's too hard, we give up" is an approach Democrats took for 8 years under Obama. Every time he gave Republicans a little bit of ground, they lurched rightward. I mean, isn't Obamacare a right-wing policy originally developed as the counter to universal healthcare in the 1990s?

Meeting Republicans halfway will not change a damn thing. If there's one thing Democrats should've learnt from Republicans by now, it's that if you start out from a more extreme negotiating position, you're more likely to get more of what you want in the final bill.

Love your Tom Baker sig!

Aside from all that, part of the reason me and my wife (Working-Class Oregonians) have Bernie set on an Auto $27/Month Payment is because we realize that regardless of win or lose, the economic platforms when it comes to minimum wage and Health Care Reform, will not only push the party towards the Left, but at the end of the day, pay off when it comes to whatever Democratic Candidate becomes the eventual nominee, when it comes to our Household bottom line, despite how much we liked and agreed with Obama when he was POTUS fighting against PUB obstructionism....

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

The debates are in September, Bernie has a great campaign in IA, and has homestate advantage in NH, anyone predicting this race is over, has another thing coming.

Iowa likes to scramble the races, and knock the Democratic frontrunner off its heels. Bernie has a great chance in Iowa.

[Sprouts Farmers Market ✘]

Crazy Bernie proposed cancelling all student loan debt. I think we're just about done here. Really amazing how low quality this gigantic field is. Rivals the non-Trump 2016 GOP.

[Pyro]

Sanders' Debt Forgiveness Plan

Sanders back in the headlines with this new expansion to the College for All proposal.
This sounds spectacular to me, though iirc Warren had a similar plan out months ago.

[Yank2133]

That is not true. The centrist think tanks know Bernie is the only candidate who can get a Medicare for all or some sort of that legislation passed & are worried about it.

Lmao.

The "centrists" (whatever the hell that means these days) don't want Sanders because they think he would blow the election. His campaign is being run by morons and that what spooks them.

They aren't scared of Bernie getting MFA passed. They know that is DOA given how the Senate is made up.

"Oh it's too hard, we give up" is an approach Democrats took for 8 years under Obama. Every time he gave Republicans a little bit of ground, they lurched rightward. I mean, isn't Obamacare a right-wing policy originally developed as the counter to universal healthcare in the 1990s?

Meeting Republicans halfway will not change a damn thing. If there's one thing Democrats should've learnt from Republicans by now, it's that if you start out from a more extreme negotiating position, you're more likely to get more of what you want in the final bill.

I have no idea what your post has to do with anything I said.

Bernie stans need to realize that the issue moderates/establishment people have with them isn't do to policy. The issue is that they are incompetent and the campaign is amateurish. Like yesterday, Bernie is at Clyburn's Fish Fry and does a speech on the third way think tank. How many voters do you think knows and actually cares about some DC centrist think tank? Warren is no moderate herself and you see some Democratic hacks warming up to her and it is in part because she doesn't do stupid stuff like this.

Warren is nothing if not a team player. She's also got a great team. Sanders has hired a bunch of rose twitter hacks to run his campaign and it shows. Only rose twitter people care about what Third Way has to say.

Yup.

I remember some posters were downplaying some of Bernie's hires, while some of us were sounding the alarm. Stuff like the speech at Clyburn, taking shots at Warren, picking fights with Nate Silver on twitter are stuff you would expect if your campaign is ran by twitter trolls.

[Ilhan Apologist]

Crazy Bernie proposed cancelling all student loan debt. I think we're just about done here. Really amazing how low quality this gigantic field is. Rivals the non-Trump 2016 GOP.

Tell me how this is a bad idea? If we could afford a $2.3T tax cut, why can't we afford to relieve $1.5T of student debt?

[Some of My Best Friends Are Gay]

Crazy Bernie proposed cancelling all student loan debt. I think we're just about done here. Really amazing how low quality this gigantic field is. Rivals the non-Trump 2016 GOP.

Tell me how this is a bad idea? If we could afford a $2.3T tax cut, why can't we afford to relieve $1.5T of student debt?

We can afford both, but neither is a good use of public wealth. This is toxic stuff. Democrats will rue day the day that Warren introduced this no-good, awful, very bad idea to the electorate.

Why is cancelling student loan debt a bad use of public wealth, in your opinion?

[John Dule]

Crazy Bernie proposed cancelling all student loan debt. I think we're just about done here. Really amazing how low quality this gigantic field is. Rivals the non-Trump 2016 GOP.

Tell me how this is a bad idea? If we could afford a $2.3T tax cut, why can't we afford to relieve $1.5T of student debt?

We can afford both, but neither is a good use of public wealth. This is toxic stuff. Democrats will rue day the day that Warren introduced this no-good, awful, very bad idea to the electorate.

Why is cancelling student loan debt a bad use of public wealth, in your opinion?

It's redistribution targetted toward a narrow group of people, most of whom need it less than the median American. It does nothing to address the underlying causes of student debt. It's also politically toxic. Bankruptcy protection, public service forgiveness, and income based repayment should be enough here.

This program is so expensive that we would do more good splitting the money evenly and writing every person in the country a check. There's no shortage of better proposals: single payer health care, two years of tuition-free post-seconsary education or training, high speed rail, climate change preparedness, primary health care expansion, Social Security expansion, the list goes on and on and on. The idea that we would have no idea what to do with additional public funds without a student debt jubilee is beyond ridiculous.

This is what people tend to overlook the most when looking at this proposal. The PBS Newshour did a piece on how most of these debt packages would go to the children of white, upper-middle-class suburban families, but people are acting like this is some kind of redistribution policy to assist the poor and needy. Even if you want these kinds of government handouts, shouldn't your primary goal be to help people who are in a bad financial situation through no fault of their own, not people who chose to go into debt voluntarily?

[Beet]

It's a good proposal. I get the objections that Averroes has, but that is why Warren's plan has income based cutoffs. No, bankruptcy protection and income based repayment are not enough. High levels of debt among young people delays many other aspects of a healthy society, including household formation & marriage, childbearing, and homeownership. Housing, childcare, and marriage are already extremely expensive. To add student debt on top of that is crushing, for a large enough share of the population that it is of concern to society at large. Spending money on other priorities doesn't address the issue.

As far as the bigger picture, this seriously introduces the idea of debt forgiveness into the public sphere outside of bankruptcy. High levels of private sector debt are crippling to economic mobility  and inflate asset prices in general, contributing to inequality. Debt cancellation forces society to recognize the costs of debt and provides a way, other than disastrous bankruptcy or inflation, to get rid of it. It also recognizes debt for what it actually is (or has become): Not a moral obligation but a way of greasing the wheels of the economy.

[Cassandra]

This is what people tend to overlook the most when looking at this proposal. The PBS Newshour did a piece on how most of these debt packages would go to the children of white, upper-middle-class suburban families, but people are acting like this is some kind of redistribution policy to assist the poor and needy. Even if you want these kinds of government handouts, shouldn't your primary goal be to help people who are in a bad financial situation through no fault of their own, not people who chose to go into debt voluntarily?

Universal programs have strategic value. Means tested programs are always in danger of being stripped away, because the wealthy do not benefit from them. Whereas universal programs such as Social Security or Medicare are politically impossible to axe.

[RI]

No one's mentioned that Bernie wants to fund his debt forgiveness with a financial transactions tax, a tax which not only fail to generate revenue but would be devastating to the stock market, retirement portfolios, and firm liquidity.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Averroës is right.

This is a bad proposal and it's frankly enough to knock Bernie out of my #1 spot.

I'm on the team for Mayor Pete now.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Averroës is right.

This is a bad proposal and it's frankly enough to knock Bernie out of my #1 spot.

I'm on the team for Mayor Pete now.

It's not my favorite proposal even though it would personally benefit me somewhat, but the idea that Buttigieg would suddenly be better than Bernie because of this is LOL.

[💥💥 brandon bro (he/him/his)]

As far as the bigger picture, this seriously introduces the idea of debt forgiveness into the public sphere outside of bankruptcy. High levels of private sector debt are crippling to economic mobility  and inflate asset prices in general, contributing to inequality. Debt cancellation forces society to recognize the costs of debt and provides a way, other than disastrous bankruptcy or inflation, to get rid of it. It also recognizes debt for what it actually is (or has become): Not a moral obligation but a way of greasing the wheels of the economy.

This is the only reason I'm even remotely sympathetic to the idea of debt forgiveness. I think lording "people are in debt due to their bad decisions" is a little misguided, considering 1) professional degree programs (not just four-year college) serve as gatekeeping mechanisms for several professions which are needed for higher income and 2) many people saddled with debt are effectively preyed upon and abused by lenders.

With that said a blanket forgiveness seems like a blunt and ineffective way of addressing the problem, and I would be very disappointed if more sophisticated and effective plans (yes, that most likely includes some means testing) got shouted down by purity-mongerers. And yes this is by far my least favorite of all Warren's proposals.

[Xing]

Blunt forgiveness might be too much, but saying "eh, they chose to go to college, it's their problem" is just neglectful, and enables the absurd cost (which is continually greater) of tuition. At the very least, Sanders and Warren continually bring up an issue that most politicians are more than happy to ignore.

[Blue3]

Think of the economic stimulus that would come with this passing.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

No one's mentioned that Bernie wants to fund his debt forgiveness with a financial transactions tax, a tax which not only fail to generate revenue but would be devastating to the stock market, retirement portfolios, and firm liquidity.

Yes, this would effectively result in middle class stockholders having to pay a tax that would disproportionately go to paying off the loans of people who are making at least five times their salary.

[Sprouts Farmers Market ✘]

Think of the economic stimulus that would come with this passing.

Think of the economic stimulus of handing out money to people who actually need it in the form of expanded welfare as opposed to people who are just going to start stashing it away in their climb up the wealth charts.

[Saint Milei]

There's a lot of reasons to oppose this:
1. It's messed up to forgive debt and ignore everyone who paid their debt off
2. It doesn't address the rising costs of college
3. It won't address the rising number of students who will attend college knowing that one bailout will lead to another
4. What about those debts that won't be forgiven
5. It's political pandering

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Student loan debt isnt the most important thing. Obama did a lot for loan forgiveness.  Healthcare, social security and jobs are important too, that is why Sanders is stuck in polls

[Saint Milei]

Crazy Bernie proposed cancelling all student loan debt. I think we're just about done here. Really amazing how low quality this gigantic field is. Rivals the non-Trump 2016 GOP.

Tell me how this is a bad idea? If we could afford a $2.3T tax cut, why can't we afford to relieve $1.5T of student debt?

We can afford both, but neither is a good use of public wealth. This is toxic stuff. Democrats will rue day the day that Warren introduced this no-good, awful, very bad idea to the electorate.

Why is cancelling student loan debt a bad use of public wealth, in your opinion?

It's redistribution targetted toward a narrow group of people, most of whom need it less than the median American. It does nothing to address the underlying causes of student debt. It's also politically toxic. Bankruptcy protection, public service forgiveness, and income based repayment should be enough here.

This program is so expensive that we would do more good splitting the money evenly and writing every person in the country a check. There's no shortage of better proposals: single payer health care, two years of tuition-free post-seconsary education or training, high speed rail, climate change preparedness, primary health care expansion, Social Security expansion, the list goes on and on and on. The idea that we would have no idea what to do with additional public funds without a student debt jubilee is beyond ridiculous.

This is what people tend to overlook the most when looking at this proposal. The PBS Newshour did a piece on how most of these debt packages would go to the children of white, upper-middle-class suburban families, but people are acting like this is some kind of redistribution policy to assist the poor and needy. Even if you want these kinds of government handouts, shouldn't your primary goal be to help people who are in a bad financial situation through no fault of their own, not people who chose to go into debt voluntarily?

I never thought about this

[RI]

Think of the economic stimulus that would come with this passing.

We don't need economic stimulus right now.