Netherlands, Austria & Co. attack Italy on its budget, Italy fires back

[Tender Branson]

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https://www.bloombergquint.com/politics/italy-s-populists-say-europe-wants-a-blood-and-tears-budget#gs._L7OjDY

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http://www.ansa.it/english/news/politics/2018/11/16/eu-must-act-over-italian-budget-austria_1d3f273c-ae25-42bf-b79a-abb5e66a6934.html

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https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1045984/italy-budget-news-eu-eurozone-italy-netherlands-austria

[Tender Branson]

Unbelieveable that Italy thinks it can do whatever it wants on their budget and add to their huge pile of debt, while other countries need to do whatever they can to keep their budgets balanced, not to burden future generations ...

[PSOL]

I think the rhetoric needs to be toned down...

That would require Italy to also tone it down. With how they accused the ECB of being biased, I don’t see de-escalation happening under the current Italian leadership.

[DavidB.]

Maybe not a bad idea to have a megathread on this?

Anyway:

On the one hand, it is insane that Italians wouldn't get what they voted for. On the other hand, they're part of a system that essentially forces others (like me) to pay for their demands. This is of course not a bug but a feature of the European monetary system, with more European integration and more technocracy being sold as the only feasible solution. However, the only real solution would be to end this nightmare while we still can and to gradually decrease the monetary integration of the eurozone.

[PSOL]

Maybe not a bad idea to have a megathread on this?

Anyway:

On the one hand, it is insane that Italians wouldn't get what they voted for. On the other hand, they're part of a system that essentially forces others (like me) to pay for their demands. This is of course not a bug but a feature of the European monetary system, with more European integration and more technocracy being sold as the only feasible solution. However, the only real solution would be to end this nightmare while we still can and to gradually decrease the monetary integration of the eurozone.

In starting the EU, was it not discussed what would occur if a nation started disobeying rules? What’s stopping the expulsion of members? Heck, what is stopping Italy from dropping the Euro and gaining monetary independence like Sweden? All of this sounds like politicians did not either understand the ramifications of joining, or they failed at explaining what the EU is to the people.

[DavidB.]

Maybe not a bad idea to have a megathread on this?

Anyway:

On the one hand, it is insane that Italians wouldn't get what they voted for. On the other hand, they're part of a system that essentially forces others (like me) to pay for their demands. This is of course not a bug but a feature of the European monetary system, with more European integration and more technocracy being sold as the only feasible solution. However, the only real solution would be to end this nightmare while we still can and to gradually decrease the monetary integration of the eurozone.

In starting the EU, was it not discussed what would occur if a nation started disobeying rules? What’s stopping the expulsion of members? Heck, what is stopping Italy from dropping the Euro and gaining monetary independence like Sweden? All of this sounds like politicians did not either understand the ramifications of joining, or they failed at explaining what the EU is to the people.

the thing is that Germany and France disobeyed the rules for years. Before the crisis, most countries didn't have their sh**t in order. And then it was too late.

There is no mechanism to kick countries out of the EU. Expulsion out of the euro, however, is technically possible according to the ECB (but voluntary withdrawal isn't...). Countries are obliged to introduce the Euro, but in practice a number of countries have received an opt-out (UK, Denmark) and others have been allowed not to introduce the euro (yet) without an official opt-out (Sweden, Poland, Czechia).

[PSOL]

Maybe not a bad idea to have a megathread on this?

Anyway:

On the one hand, it is insane that Italians wouldn't get what they voted for. On the other hand, they're part of a system that essentially forces others (like me) to pay for their demands. This is of course not a bug but a feature of the European monetary system, with more European integration and more technocracy being sold as the only feasible solution. However, the only real solution would be to end this nightmare while we still can and to gradually decrease the monetary integration of the eurozone.

In starting the EU, was it not discussed what would occur if a nation started disobeying rules? What’s stopping the expulsion of members? Heck, what is stopping Italy from dropping the Euro and gaining monetary independence like Sweden? All of this sounds like politicians did not either understand the ramifications of joining, or they failed at explaining what the EU is to the people.

the thing is that Germany and France disobeyed the rules for years. Before the crisis, most countries didn't have their sh**t in order. And then it was too late.

There is no mechanism to kick countries out of the EU. Expulsion out of the euro, however, is technically possible according to the ECB (but voluntary withdrawal isn't...). Countries are obliged to introduce the Euro, but in practice a number of countries have received an opt-out (UK, Denmark) and others have been allowed not to introduce the euro (yet) without an official opt-out (Sweden, Poland, Czechia).

So then why didn’t Italy negotiate for an opt-out, temporary or not? Also, since no one can follow the rules, why can’t the EU parliament just overturn any previous ruling?

[dead0man]

The excuse of "everybody is breaking the rules, but we can't do anything about it because of the rules" is a ballsy one to make.

[All Along The Watchtower]

No one else cares about Hitler's birthplace, OP.

[Omega21]

No one else cares about Hitler's birthplace, OP.

Nobody cares about an American Regressive commenting on Topics he knows nothing about.

[PSOL]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-italy-eu/italy-eu-to-work-to-bring-views-on-2019-budget-closer-together-commission-idUSKCN1NT0VY

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Well it’s good that another Eurozone crisis is averted.

Maybe not a bad idea to have a megathread on this?

I did try to make an Italian megathread a while ago. Would you like me to revive it?