🇩🇪 German elections (federal & EU level)

[Anzeigenhauptmeister]

That's the Ruhr (in German: Ruhrgebiet).

Some people also call it Ruhrpott.

It does depend a bit on what you mean by rural, but all gemeinden in NRW include at least one (and often more) substantial market town. The main feature of the places with the largest CDU leads on the map is that they are also very, very Catholic: the hinterland of Paderborn for instance. These were actually the places where modern Political Catholicism in Germany was born, back in the 19th century.

It's one of the most conservative regions within Germany. Not "Trump-conservative", but rather "Cruz-conservative".
Oh, btw, I worte a post about that area similar to yours, but PUTP said I had absolutely no clue about German demography and called me a Nazi thereupon.

[Anzeigenhauptmeister]

Its interesting that both the Greens and the FDP do so much better among 18-29 year olds. I have a pretty clear stereotype in my mind of a German 20-something who votes Green (don't Germans call them "muesli-fressers"?:-))

But who are the 20-somethings who vote FDP? I'm pictured uptight young (mostly men and some women) who studied economy and commerce and who waddle around with briefcases and dream of jobs as real estate agents or working in a bank tower in Frankfurt.

Am I right?

Somewhat, but I also think even a lot of lower income ones voted for them.  They opposed lockdowns although not other public health restrictions and generally speaking lockdowns were much harder on people in their 20s who tend to be out a lot more than older people.  While not all of them, I suspect some voted FDP over that and may not necessarily agree with them on other economic issues.  Because Germany tends to result in coalitions that are usually close to centre, younger voters who do have same loyalty to a party as older ones will easily crossover for a variety of reasons.  Its not like US where most always vote for a party on one side of the spectrum  There isn't the same hatred towards left or right that you see in English speaking world from other side.  Personality and stance on issues and general competence rather than where one falls on political spectrum play in bigger role in how Germans vote.  Because all parties close enough to centre, ideology matters less than in places that are more polarized. 

That's true. The FDP interestingly increased their vote share among "workers" (blue collar mostly) and unemployed, while suffering a big dip among pensioners, making it their worst group when considering occupation. The perception and stance on age-related issues like Covid-19 especially seemed to have played a bigger role than the priorities during the campaign might suggest.

At this juncture, I'd like to mention JuLi chair Jens Teutrine, the official youth organization of the FDP, whose life career isn't typical of a leading FDP politician whatsoever.

[H. Ross Peron]

A majority of Union supporters and even 47% of AFD voters want Scholz as Chancellor:

https://twitter.com/marceldirsus/status/1448921163317628939

[President Johnson]

Statement from trafficlight party leaders expected very soon today. DPA is already reporting that SPD, Greens and FDP intend to start actual coalition talks next week.

EDIT (it's official):

https://twitter.com/jared_reed/status/1448965553880813568


CHANCELLOR SCHOLZ INCOMING

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

Statement from trafficlight party leaders expected very soon today. DPA is already reporting that SPD, Greens and FDP intend to start actual coalition talks next week.

When is Schulz likely to become chancellor? (educated guess on basis of what we know right now)

[President Johnson]

Statement from trafficlight party leaders expected very soon today. DPA is already reporting that SPD, Greens and FDP intend to start actual coalition talks next week.

When is Schulz likely to become chancellor? (educated guess on basis of what we know right now)

Actual coalition negotations are expected to begin next week. That will certainly last three or four weeks and afterwards all three parties need internal approval. The Greens will definitely issue a referendum among members, perhaps the SPD as well. FDP will most likely hold a party convention. So all in all, if things go smoothly, the new government could take office in December, just before christmas.

[President Johnson]

The agreement paper that was presented today will be the framework for actual coalition negotiations. Some issues and compromises here:

- Robert Habeck said Germany is aiming to become carbon neutral within one and a half decades. Exact measures will be discussed in coalition agreements.

- While tax hikes are off the table and Germany expected to return to the debt brake in 2023 (that was a red line of the FDP), a minimum wage hike to 12,-€ as promised by Olaf Scholz and supported by the Greens was agreed to. Christian Lindner explicitly confirmed this was a key demand from SPD and Greens he was willing to accept.

- The FDP seems to have gotten so called Aktienrente, which means an addition to the public social security system similar to Sweden, where retirement funds are invested in the capital market. Like many other Western nations, Germany has a demographic problem to fund social security beyond 2025.

- More generally, all three parties emphasized the need for massive investments in digital infrastructure and climate action.

Overall, the word "modernization" was used many times by all participants of the press conference. Interestingly, Lindner said this was only possible in this trio, which is kinda surprising as he was long leaning towards a coalition with CDU/CSU. All three parties praised the constructive and confidential nature of the talks.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

Statement from trafficlight party leaders expected very soon today. DPA is already reporting that SPD, Greens and FDP intend to start actual coalition talks next week.

When is Schulz likely to become chancellor? (educated guess on basis of what we know right now)

Actual coalition negotations are expected to begin next week. That will certainly last three or four weeks and afterwards all three parties need internal approval. The Greens will definitely issue a referendum among members, perhaps the SPD as well. FDP will most likely hold a party convention. So all in all, if things go smoothly, the new government could take office in December, just before christmas.

So there is a 90% chance or so Merkel becomes longest serving Chancellor of post-WWII Germany?

[President Johnson]

Statement from trafficlight party leaders expected very soon today. DPA is already reporting that SPD, Greens and FDP intend to start actual coalition talks next week.

When is Schulz likely to become chancellor? (educated guess on basis of what we know right now)

Actual coalition negotations are expected to begin next week. That will certainly last three or four weeks and afterwards all three parties need internal approval. The Greens will definitely issue a referendum among members, perhaps the SPD as well. FDP will most likely hold a party convention. So all in all, if things go smoothly, the new government could take office in December, just before christmas.

So there is a 90% chance or so Merkel becomes longest serving Chancellor of post-WWII Germany?

Hard to say at this point, she would need stay in office until December 19. I think Scholz' election could happen in the days before or shortly afterwards. Previous chancellor elections took place on a Tuesday, so it could be - to do some wild guessing - December 14 or December 21. The in my opinion best political scientist in Germany, Albrecht von Lucke, just said in an interview he expects the coalition agreement to be presented in early December, if not sooner and chancellor election before christmas.

Obviously we're counting days as acting chancellor, too. Just a reminder that the new Bundestag will meet first on October 26, and President Steinemeier will then formally dismiss the government and appoint Merkel acting chancellor. Until then, she and the cabinet are still in office on a regular basis.

[Leading Political Consultant Ma Anand Sheela]

A majority of Union supporters and even 47% of AFD voters want Scholz as Chancellor:

https://twitter.com/marceldirsus/status/1448921163317628939

Seems to me that the German electorate are crying out as one 'he won, now get on with it'.

[President Johnson]

A somewhat more detailled summary of the agreement between SPD, Greens and FDP, which will be the framework for coalition talks scheduled to begin next week:

- Climate: Exit of coal energy production until 2030 to save carbon emmissions. This is eight years ahead of schedule: 2038 was the exit date of the Grand Coalition, but criticized by the Greens. Massive investments in renewable energies and science for new, climate friendly technologies planned. Trafficlight coalition wants planning and construction processes for wind turbines and power lines shortened significantly to speed up green energy production and guarantee energy safety at the same time.

- Minimum wage: Minimum wage will be increased to 12€/hour within the first year. Subsequent annual increases will be decided by an independent commission consisting labor, business and economists. An estimation is that this increase will give ten million workers a raise. It was a key promise by Scholz and the SPD.

- Finances and budget: No tax increases, debt brake will be reinstated in 2023 (it's currently paused due to Covid relief programs). However, global minimum corporate tax Scholz co-negotiated will increase tax revenue for the government. Subventions and other expenditures will be audited and a number of them will be reduced or abolished to save money for other purposes. These points were very important to the FDP.

- Social programs: "Hartz IV" will be replaced by a so-called Bürgergeld. Details not known yet, but a major reform of the controversial unemployment insurance adopted under Gehard Schröder in 2003 and that cost the SPD a lot of support since.

- Family policy: Adopt civil rights for children into the constitution (that will require CDU/CSU votes in Bundestag and Bundesrat)

- Housing: Measures to relief the housing market. Target is 400,000 new apartments annually, 100,000 of them subsidized by the federal government for low income households.

- Science: Spending increase for science to 3.5% of the GDP.

- Voting rights: SPD, Greens and FDP want to lower the voting age to 16 years. However, that requires a constitutional amendment and therefore CDU/CSU votes (at least Die Linke will vote for this, too).

- Digitalization: More investments, especially to modernize the state and its authorities.

- Immigration: Immigration reform and implementation of a point system similar to Canada.

- Drugs: SPD, Greens and FDP plan to legalize and regulate cannabis sale and consumption. That was long blocked by CDU/CSU.

These are ambitious goals and if most of that is enacted, a Scholz cabinet may really go down in history as one of the most reform-minded in modern German history.

Political observers already described the 12-pages long paper as relatively detailed as a basis for coalition talks and have praised the discipline the talks were conducted. The only question remaining is how the expenditures can be financed without tax increases. On a more general note, at least all parties agree to modernize industry and labor market and combat bureaucracy to bring Germany to a path of lasting prosperity and economic growth.

Some tax increases and the speedlimit on all highways were things I would have liked to see here, but I realize the FDP just couldn't do that (more important is that they agreed on the minimum wage hike). The Free Democrats came a long a way given that before the election Lindner said he "lacks the fantasy for an offer SPD and Greens could make". However, I'm very happy with the results and the manner of which the talks were conducted exceeded expectations by a lot. The fact that we are at this point today certainly proves functionality of the political system, which is nothing to take for granted.

Trafficlight was certainly my preferred coalition all along because there's the potential to unite social safety, environmentalism, innovation, sound economic and fiscal policies, an open society and a pro-EU, pro-Western foreign policy under the headline of more pragmatism and less ideology.

[BigSerg]

A somewhat more detailled summary of the agreement between SPD, Greens and FDP, which will be the framework for coalition talks scheduled to begin next week:

- Climate: Exit of coal energy production until 2030 to save carbon emmissions. This is eight years ahead of schedule: 2038 was the exit date of the Grand Coalition, but criticized by the Greens. Massive investments in renewable energies and science for new, climate friendly technologies planned. Trafficlight coalition wants planning and construction processes for wind turbines and power lines shortened significantly to speed up green energy production and guarantee energy safety at the same time.

- Minimum wage: Minimum wage will be increased to 12€/hour within the first year. Subsequent annual increases will be decided by an independent commission consisting labor, business and economists. An estimation is that this increase will give ten million workers a raise. It was a key promise by Scholz and the SPD.

- Finances and budget: No tax increases, debt brake will be reinstated in 2023 (it's currently paused due to Covid relief programs). However, global minimum corporate tax Scholz co-negotiated will increase tax revenue for the government. Subventions and other expenditures will be audited and a number of them will be reduced or abolished to save money for other purposes. These points were very important to the FDP.

- Social programs: "Hartz IV" will be replaced by a so-called Bürgergeld. Details not known yet, but a major reform of the controversial unemployment insurance adopted under Gehard Schröder in 2003 and that cost the SPD a lot of support since.

- Family policy: Adopt civil rights for children into the constitution (that will require CDU/CSU votes in Bundestag and Bundesrat)

- Housing: Measures to relief the housing market. Target is 400,000 new apartments annually, 100,000 of them subsidized by the federal government for low income households.

- Science: Spending increase for science to 3.5% of the GDP.

- Voting rights: SPD, Greens and FDP want to lower the voting age to 16 years. However, that requires a constitutional amendment and therefore CDU/CSU votes (at least Die Linke will vote for this, too).

- Digitalization: More investments, especially to modernize the state and its authorities.

- Immigration: Immigration reform and implementation of a point system similar to Canada.

- Drugs: SPD, Greens and FDP plan to legalize and regulate cannabis sale and consumption. That was long blocked by CDU/CSU.

These are ambitious goals and if most of that is enacted, a Scholz cabinet may really go down in history as one of the most reform-minded in modern German history.

Political observers already described the 12-pages long paper as relatively detailed as a basis for coalition talks and have praised the discipline the talks were conducted. The only question remaining is how the expenditures can be financed without tax increases. On a more general note, at least all parties agree to modernize industry and labor market and combat bureaucracy to bring Germany to a path of lasting prosperity and economic growth.

Some tax increases and the speedlimit on all highways were things I would have liked to see here, but I realize the FDP just couldn't do that (more important is that they agreed on the minimum wage hike). The Free Democrats came a long a way given that before the election Lindner said he "lacks the fantasy for an offer SPD and Greens could make". However, I'm very happy with the results and the manner of which the talks were conducted exceeded expectations by a lot. The fact that we are at this point today certainly proves functionality of the political system, which is nothing to take for granted.

Trafficlight was certainly my preferred coalition all along because there's the potential to unite social safety, environmentalism, innovation, sound economic and fiscal policies, an open society and a pro-EU, pro-Western foreign policy under the headline of more pragmatism and less ideology.

Lol, lowering the voting age is stupid and would only benefit the left. The CDU should vote against that.

[Middle-aged Europe]

A somewhat more detailled summary of the agreement between SPD, Greens and FDP, which will be the framework for coalition talks scheduled to begin next week:

- Climate: Exit of coal energy production until 2030 to save carbon emmissions. This is eight years ahead of schedule: 2038 was the exit date of the Grand Coalition, but criticized by the Greens. Massive investments in renewable energies and science for new, climate friendly technologies planned. Trafficlight coalition wants planning and construction processes for wind turbines and power lines shortened significantly to speed up green energy production and guarantee energy safety at the same time.

- Minimum wage: Minimum wage will be increased to 12€/hour within the first year. Subsequent annual increases will be decided by an independent commission consisting labor, business and economists. An estimation is that this increase will give ten million workers a raise. It was a key promise by Scholz and the SPD.

- Finances and budget: No tax increases, debt brake will be reinstated in 2023 (it's currently paused due to Covid relief programs). However, global minimum corporate tax Scholz co-negotiated will increase tax revenue for the government. Subventions and other expenditures will be audited and a number of them will be reduced or abolished to save money for other purposes. These points were very important to the FDP.

- Social programs: "Hartz IV" will be replaced by a so-called Bürgergeld. Details not known yet, but a major reform of the controversial unemployment insurance adopted under Gehard Schröder in 2003 and that cost the SPD a lot of support since.

- Family policy: Adopt civil rights for children into the constitution (that will require CDU/CSU votes in Bundestag and Bundesrat)

- Housing: Measures to relief the housing market. Target is 400,000 new apartments annually, 100,000 of them subsidized by the federal government for low income households.

- Science: Spending increase for science to 3.5% of the GDP.

- Voting rights: SPD, Greens and FDP want to lower the voting age to 16 years. However, that requires a constitutional amendment and therefore CDU/CSU votes (at least Die Linke will vote for this, too).

- Digitalization: More investments, especially to modernize the state and its authorities.

- Immigration: Immigration reform and implementation of a point system similar to Canada.

- Drugs: SPD, Greens and FDP plan to legalize and regulate cannabis sale and consumption. That was long blocked by CDU/CSU.

These are ambitious goals and if most of that is enacted, a Scholz cabinet may really go down in history as one of the most reform-minded in modern German history.

Political observers already described the 12-pages long paper as relatively detailed as a basis for coalition talks and have praised the discipline the talks were conducted. The only question remaining is how the expenditures can be financed without tax increases. On a more general note, at least all parties agree to modernize industry and labor market and combat bureaucracy to bring Germany to a path of lasting prosperity and economic growth.

Some tax increases and the speedlimit on all highways were things I would have liked to see here, but I realize the FDP just couldn't do that (more important is that they agreed on the minimum wage hike). The Free Democrats came a long a way given that before the election Lindner said he "lacks the fantasy for an offer SPD and Greens could make". However, I'm very happy with the results and the manner of which the talks were conducted exceeded expectations by a lot. The fact that we are at this point today certainly proves functionality of the political system, which is nothing to take for granted.

Trafficlight was certainly my preferred coalition all along because there's the potential to unite social safety, environmentalism, innovation, sound economic and fiscal policies, an open society and a pro-EU, pro-Western foreign policy under the headline of more pragmatism and less ideology.

Lol, lowering the voting age is stupid and would only benefit the left. The CDU should vote against that.

Well, it will probably benefit the Greens and the FDP the most considering these parties' results in the respective age bracket in the last election.
 
I suppose the CDU will vote against it, but considering they're not even in the next government it doesn't really matter anyway.

[parochial boy]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

[bigic]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

Did Germans even elect a left-wing government? Red-Red-Green has no majority, so CDU and/or FDP are needed for a government. Luckily for SPD and Greens, AfD is extremely toxic.

[mileslunn]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

Did Germans even elect a left-wing government? Red-Red-Green has no majority, so CDU and/or FDP are needed for a government. Luckily for SPD and Greens, AfD is extremely toxic.

Yes 1998-2005, you had a Red-Green coalition under Schroeder.

[mileslunn]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

That is part of negotiations.  If Greens and SPD had a majority on their own, taxes on wealthy would go up and there would be more spending.  In fact I think this was probably a trade off as they got a minimum wage hike and that will benefit their supporters a lot more than tax hikes on rich.  If in 2025, left gets a majority, taxes on rich will go up.  And obviously on fiscal policy a lot depends on economy.  If a strong economic rebound, they may be able to fund their spending without large deficits or tax hikes.  But if economy experiences slower growth, then can always make changes.  And if FDP won't go along, could call another election.

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

If you add up the FDP+CDU/CSU + AFD + Free Voters, that's 51.1% of the vote. It seems like a majority of the populace actually wants conservative policies and it's only because the AFD is too toxic to work with you have a left-wing goverment.

[brucejoel99]

A somewhat more detailled summary of the agreement between SPD, Greens and FDP, which will be the framework for coalition talks scheduled to begin next week:

- Climate: Exit of coal energy production until 2030 to save carbon emmissions. This is eight years ahead of schedule: 2038 was the exit date of the Grand Coalition, but criticized by the Greens. Massive investments in renewable energies and science for new, climate friendly technologies planned. Trafficlight coalition wants planning and construction processes for wind turbines and power lines shortened significantly to speed up green energy production and guarantee energy safety at the same time.

- Minimum wage: Minimum wage will be increased to 12€/hour within the first year. Subsequent annual increases will be decided by an independent commission consisting labor, business and economists. An estimation is that this increase will give ten million workers a raise. It was a key promise by Scholz and the SPD.

- Finances and budget: No tax increases, debt brake will be reinstated in 2023 (it's currently paused due to Covid relief programs). However, global minimum corporate tax Scholz co-negotiated will increase tax revenue for the government. Subventions and other expenditures will be audited and a number of them will be reduced or abolished to save money for other purposes. These points were very important to the FDP.

- Social programs: "Hartz IV" will be replaced by a so-called Bürgergeld. Details not known yet, but a major reform of the controversial unemployment insurance adopted under Gehard Schröder in 2003 and that cost the SPD a lot of support since.

- Family policy: Adopt civil rights for children into the constitution (that will require CDU/CSU votes in Bundestag and Bundesrat)

- Housing: Measures to relief the housing market. Target is 400,000 new apartments annually, 100,000 of them subsidized by the federal government for low income households.

- Science: Spending increase for science to 3.5% of the GDP.

- Voting rights: SPD, Greens and FDP want to lower the voting age to 16 years. However, that requires a constitutional amendment and therefore CDU/CSU votes (at least Die Linke will vote for this, too).

- Digitalization: More investments, especially to modernize the state and its authorities.

- Immigration: Immigration reform and implementation of a point system similar to Canada.

- Drugs: SPD, Greens and FDP plan to legalize and regulate cannabis sale and consumption. That was long blocked by CDU/CSU.

These are ambitious goals and if most of that is enacted, a Scholz cabinet may really go down in history as one of the most reform-minded in modern German history.

Political observers already described the 12-pages long paper as relatively detailed as a basis for coalition talks and have praised the discipline the talks were conducted. The only question remaining is how the expenditures can be financed without tax increases. On a more general note, at least all parties agree to modernize industry and labor market and combat bureaucracy to bring Germany to a path of lasting prosperity and economic growth.

Some tax increases and the speedlimit on all highways were things I would have liked to see here, but I realize the FDP just couldn't do that (more important is that they agreed on the minimum wage hike). The Free Democrats came a long a way given that before the election Lindner said he "lacks the fantasy for an offer SPD and Greens could make". However, I'm very happy with the results and the manner of which the talks were conducted exceeded expectations by a lot. The fact that we are at this point today certainly proves functionality of the political system, which is nothing to take for granted.

Trafficlight was certainly my preferred coalition all along because there's the potential to unite social safety, environmentalism, innovation, sound economic and fiscal policies, an open society and a pro-EU, pro-Western foreign policy under the headline of more pragmatism and less ideology.

Lol, lowering the voting age is stupid and would only benefit the left. The CDU should vote against that.

Well, it will probably benefit the Greens and the FDP the most considering these parties' results in the respective age bracket in the last election.
 
I suppose the CDU will vote against it, but considering they're not even in the next government it doesn't really matter anyway.

Well, it does matter insofar as their votes would be required to amend the Basic Law on family policy & voting rights.

[Anzeigenhauptmeister]

As this hasn't been done before (at least I hope so), I've compiled a map displaying the split-ticket voting regarding the first and second vote.
I neither discovered any SPD/CDU nor any Grüne/CDU constituency, thus I hope there are really only 15 different permutations.

[President Johnson]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

If you add up the FDP+CDU/CSU + AFD + Free Voters, that's 51.1% of the vote. It seems like a majority of the populace actually wants conservative policies and it's only because the AFD is too toxic to work with you have a left-wing goverment.

FDP is a party of classical liberalism not conservative. Their economic and fiscal policies can be described as center-right if you want while culturally it's closer to SPD and Greens.

When it comes to issues, the electorate's preferences are more differentiated. The cited ZDF poll above found that 40% support adding new debt, while 53% are opposed. However, minimum wage hike has nearly 80% support and even 60% favor higher taxes for the rich.

What most Germans don't want is a R2G government and I'm glad that option is not even available. A left-wing government would have faced a lot more backlash in civil society and business (not to mention foreign policy issues). The FDP could instead be seen as some sort of "corrective", and also keeps the left-wing of SPD and Greens in check. I would still have preferred a Red-Green government, though that's obviously not possible. At least a trafficlight coalition has a solid Bundestag majority while Red-Green would only have a very narrow one.

[parochial boy]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

If you add up the FDP+CDU/CSU + AFD + Free Voters, that's 51.1% of the vote. It seems like a majority of the populace actually wants conservative policies and it's only because the AFD is too toxic to work with you have a left-wing goverment.

That’s the problem, or at least part of the problem. The real problem is the SPD and Greens caving in to the FDP’s demands because they don’t have any meaningful structurally innovative economic policies of their own. There is interesting and creative left wing thought on economics out there, but the SPD and Greens are far to timid and lacking in imagination to start really incorporating them into a governing programmes; hence their happy to let the liberals dictate this thing to them in return for the popular but hardly structurally meaningful ones like the minimum wage

[President Johnson]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

If you add up the FDP+CDU/CSU + AFD + Free Voters, that's 51.1% of the vote. It seems like a majority of the populace actually wants conservative policies and it's only because the AFD is too toxic to work with you have a left-wing goverment.

That’s the problem, or at least part of the problem. The real problem is the SPD and Greens caving in to the FDP’s demands because they don’t have any meaningful structurally innovative economic policies of their own. There is interesting and creative left wing thought on economics out there, but the SPD and Greens are far to timid and lacking in imagination to start really incorporating them into a governing programmes; hence their happy to let the liberals dictate this thing to them in return for the popular but hardly structurally meaningful ones like the minimum wage

I disagree. SPD and Greens aren't "caving" to FDP demands, they're making meaningful compromises. No tax increases and return to the debt brake (not to be confused with a balanced budget, the debt brake still allows certain investments) were key priorities the party ran on and promised to deliver in any governing constellation. In doing so, they received a pretty good election result. Compromises are the essence of any governing coalition if you want stuff to get done. If people wanted left-wing policies across the board, they would have given Die Linke a stronger mandate or Red-Green a seat majority. If these compromises were not agreed to, we'd either end up with a Jamaica coalition or another Grand Coalition, which nobody wants.

I would have liked higher taxes on upper incomes, but now we need to see whether certain spending cuts (especially subventions) can still provide room for certain other expenditures. The debt brake won't get reinstated until 2023 anyway and it's certainly possible the new government will borrow several billions next year to make massive investments in renewable energy.

Scholz also has pretty detailled economic policies how to make sure Germany remains a strong industrial country in the coming decade, especially by managing the transformation to a carbon neutrality. He talked about that quite a lot during the campaign and I have no doubt he has the experience and competence to get it done.

[Lord Halifax]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

If you add up the FDP+CDU/CSU + AFD + Free Voters, that's 51.1% of the vote. It seems like a majority of the populace actually wants conservative policies and it's only because the AFD is too toxic to work with you have a left-wing goverment.

FDP is a party of classical liberalism not conservative.

tomayto, tomahto 

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

Elect a left wing government, get the same absurd attitude to fiscal policy.

RIP Europe. You were too conservative, too intellectually impotent and too risk averse to ever have much chance of adapting to the 21st century

If you add up the FDP+CDU/CSU + AFD + Free Voters, that's 51.1% of the vote. It seems like a majority of the populace actually wants conservative policies and it's only because the AFD is too toxic to work with you have a left-wing goverment.

That’s the problem, or at least part of the problem. The real problem is the SPD and Greens caving in to the FDP’s demands because they don’t have any meaningful structurally innovative economic policies of their own. There is interesting and creative left wing thought on economics out there, but the SPD and Greens are far to timid and lacking in imagination to start really incorporating them into a governing programmes; hence their happy to let the liberals dictate this thing to them in return for the popular but hardly structurally meaningful ones like the minimum wage

Well you can't claim that the people elected a left-wing goverment when the majority of the vote went to parties promising right-wing economic policies of various stripes. Hell the german left should be grateful that the AFD and it's toxicity exists as it's the only thing allowing them into power, if the AFD was a less toxic party or didn't exist than the right-bloc would have easily been considered the winner of this election.