Trump ranked worst president ever by American Poli Sci Association

[ProudModerate2]

A group of liberal elites say Trump is the worst President ever a year and a half into his term. Breaking news.

GOP scholars had Trump ranked at the bottom....try again.

Yep.
Republican scholars have him ranked 40 out of 44.
Democrats rank him at 44.
Independent scholars have him at 43.

The specific # ranking is irrelevant. He’s one of the worst and this is agreed upon across the political spectrum among those who are much more knowledgeable than any of us.

Funny whenever Reagan fan says something stupid he usually hightails it out of the thread.
Usually.

Hello? Mike naso? Still here? Did you read the part in the article how the self-described conservatives who rated Reagan the third greatest president behind only Washington and Lincoln consider Trump the 40th worst president in American history? Tell us more about the liberal Elites Mike.

Or, don't respond and sit in silence in the corner admitting defeat. Not in this thread, just life in general.

[pbrower2a]

Rating of Presidents starting in 1900

McKinley 19
T Roosevelt 4
Taft 24
Wilson 11
Harding 39
Coolidge 28
Hoover 36
F Roosevelt 3
Truman 6
Eisenhower 7
Kennedy 16
L Johnson 10
Nixon 33
Ford 25
Carter 26
Reagan 9
G H W Bush 17
Clinton 13
G W Bush 30
Obama 8
Trump 44

Cleveland is counted only once.  

George W. Bush was worse than Nixon and Hoover IMHO.That to me is the one down side of Trump, Bush is getting whitewashed.

Hoover is faulted for one thing -- bungling the response to the worst economic meltdown. Nixon did wrong, but few Americans were hurt by it. Dubya mishandled intelligence that should have warned us of 9-11, got us into a war that spiraled into a quagmire, and sponsored a corrupt bubble in real estate and bad lending that precipitated the worst economic meltdown since the 1930s (after a year and a half the meltdowns beginning in the autumns of 1929 and 2007 were similar in severity... for undoing most of Dubya's mess, Obama deserves that #8 spot.

It's hard to believe that Trump can do more damage than could Dubya, but if Dubya was callous toward the helpless among us, Donald Trump fosters sadism against such people. The core of his foreign policy is acting as a mole for some foreign leader contemptuous of American  democracy. His political practice is largely doing bad things to people who did not support his election and faulting such people for not appreciating what he has done to them.

We are going to need a President at least as astute as Obama after Trump just to start undoing Trump damage, and we are going to need to be patient enough to not fault him for not undo the damage as fast as we might like.   

[Progressive Pessimist]

A group of liberal elites say Trump is the worst President ever a year and a half into his term. Breaking news.

This is possibly the most predictable post ever for a thread like this.

[dw93]

Rating of Presidents starting in 1900

McKinley 19
T Roosevelt 4
Taft 24
Wilson 11
Harding 39
Coolidge 28
Hoover 36
F Roosevelt 3
Truman 6
Eisenhower 7
Kennedy 16
L Johnson 10
Nixon 33
Ford 25
Carter 26
Reagan 9
G H W Bush 17
Clinton 13
G W Bush 30
Obama 8
Trump 44

Cleveland is counted only once.  

George W. Bush was worse than Nixon and Hoover IMHO.That to me is the one down side of Trump, Bush is getting whitewashed.

Hoover is faulted for one thing -- bungling the response to the worst economic meltdown. Nixon did wrong, but few Americans were hurt by it. Dubya mishandled intelligence that should have warned us of 9-11, got us into a war that spiraled into a quagmire, and sponsored a corrupt bubble in real estate and bad lending that precipitated the worst economic meltdown since the 1930s (after a year and a half the meltdowns beginning in the autumns of 1929 and 2007 were similar in severity... for undoing most of Dubya's mess, Obama deserves that #8 spot.

It's hard to believe that Trump can do more damage than could Dubya, but if Dubya was callous toward the helpless among us, Donald Trump fosters sadism against such people. The core of his foreign policy is acting as a mole for some foreign leader contemptuous of American  democracy. His political practice is largely doing bad things to people who did not support his election and faulting such people for not appreciating what he has done to them.

We are going to need a President at least as astute as Obama after Trump just to start undoing Trump damage, and we are going to need to be patient enough to not fault him for not undo the damage as fast as we might like.   

I agree with a majority of what you're saying, which is why I modified my original posts to say "one of the many downsides" instead of "the one down side" of Trump. With that said, we're going to Need a Franklin Roosevelt, a non hawkish Theodore Roosevelt, or even a Lyndon Johnson to come in after Trump, which is what we should've gotten after 43 IMHO, but didn't. Obama did decently all things considered but we needed someone that was really gonna shake things up like a Roosevelt during and after the recession instead we got "No Drama Obama."

[Reaganfan]

A group of liberal elites say Trump is the worst President ever a year and a half into his term. Breaking news.

This is possibly the most predictable post ever for a thread like this.

But it's true. The Steve Schmidts of the world don't represent the Republican Party anymore just as the Joe Manchins don't represent the Democratic Party.

These elites hated Trump then, they hate him now, they'll hate him tomorrow.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

Rating of Presidents starting in 1900

McKinley 19
T Roosevelt 4
Taft 24
Wilson 11
Harding 39
Coolidge 28
Hoover 36
F Roosevelt 3
Truman 6
Eisenhower 7
Kennedy 16
L Johnson 10
Nixon 33
Ford 25
Carter 26
Reagan 9
G H W Bush 17
Clinton 13
G W Bush 30
Obama 8
Trump 44

Cleveland is counted only once. 

George W. Bush was worse than Nixon and Hoover IMHO. To me,  one of the many down sides of Trump, is Bush's Presidency getting whitewashed.

[DC Al Fine]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

Yeah you need time for current events to fade away so you can evaluate their legacy more effectively. We're barely to the point we can evaluate Kennedy and Nixon properly, much less a sitting President who hasn't even made it to the midterms yet.

[Inmate Trump]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

So our bar now is "has he/she started a civil war?"

I'm sorry, but no.  And you can most certainly rank a president before the end of their term.  I'll give you that it's not as valid of a ranking as presidents who have completed their terms, but you can certainly say that "as of this moment, President ____ ranks here."  There's perfectly fine to do.  And as of this moment, Trump's performance has sucked.

We've never been more divided as a nation than we are now, and Trump is the direct cause.  Our allies now consist of Russia and North Korea, and most other countries no longer trust us and no longer respect us.  That's directly linked to Trump.  Our healthcare system is in shambles.  Not 100% Trump's fault but he's definitely a large contributing factor.  His only agenda has been to undo everything from the previous administration, not for policy reasons, but for personal reasons because he hates Obama and always has.  He is the most divisive president arguably in our history.  He is by far the most inexperienced president in modern history (and it shows).  His integrity is non-existant.  These are things we can and should rank him on regardless of the completion of his term.  And should things change by the end of his term, he will be re-ranked.  If things don't change, he will be re-ranked.  Presidential rankings are a constant and they are ongoing.

His performance up to now has been that of a failed administration and yes, we can rank his performance up to now.  If, by 2020, he's changed, then we can surely re-rank him just as we will re-rank every single other president years and decades and centuries later.

[SWE]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

So our bar now is "has he/she started a civil war?"

In a discussion as to who the worst president is and we've had a president that did that, I'd say that's a reasonable place to set the bar.

[💥💥 brandon bro (he/him/his)]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

So our bar now is "has he/she started a civil war?"

In a discussion as to who the worst president is and we've had a president that did that, I'd say that's a reasonable place to set the bar.

Buchanan didn't start the Civil War.

[NEW JERSEY FOR MENENDEZ]

Me reading this thread:

[Progressive Pessimist]

A group of liberal elites say Trump is the worst President ever a year and a half into his term. Breaking news.

This is possibly the most predictable post ever for a thread like this.

But it's true. The Steve Schmidts of the world don't represent the Republican Party anymore just as the Joe Manchins don't represent the Democratic Party.

These elites hated Trump then, they hate him now, they'll hate him tomorrow.

I'll agree that the Never Trump Republicans are an extremely small minority of the GOP. But the elite has embraced him. Hell, he is the "elite." he has embraced that label recently. Hell, what is more "elite" or "establishment" than being the damn President? He controls the party and they are loyal to him to a fault.

[junior chįmp]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

Yeah you need time for current events to fade away so you can evaluate their legacy more effectively. We're barely to the point we can evaluate Kennedy and Nixon properly, much less a sitting President who hasn't even made it to the midterms yet.

Compare the 2018 list of ''great presidents'' to the 1996 list:



Not much has changed. It's obvious Trump will go down as one of the worst...if not the worst.

[SWE]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

Yeah you need time for current events to fade away so you can evaluate their legacy more effectively. We're barely to the point we can evaluate Kennedy and Nixon properly, much less a sitting President who hasn't even made it to the midterms yet.

Compare the 2018 list of ''great presidents'' to the 1996 list:



Not much has changed. It's obvious Trump will go down as one of the worst...if not the worst.

Reagan that low really sticks out.

[junior chįmp]

Reagan that low really sticks out.

Because he sucked and his entire legacy is a right-wing created myth.

[Fight for Trump]

Wow, that 1996 list is so good. The left destroying the legacies of my three favorite Presidents, Jackson, Wilson, and Polk, is a disgrace!

[junior chįmp]

Wow, that 1996 list is so good. The left destroying the legacies of my three favorite Presidents, Jackson, Wilson, and Polk, is a disgrace!

fact check: you may be right!

[Progressive Pessimist]

Reagan that low really sticks out.

Because he sucked and his entire legacy is a right-wing created myth.

[Reaganfan]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

So our bar now is "has he/she started a civil war?"

I'm sorry, but no.  And you can most certainly rank a president before the end of their term.  I'll give you that it's not as valid of a ranking as presidents who have completed their terms, but you can certainly say that "as of this moment, President ____ ranks here."  There's perfectly fine to do.  And as of this moment, Trump's performance has sucked.

We've never been more divided as a nation than we are now, and Trump is the direct cause.  Our allies now consist of Russia and North Korea, and most other countries no longer trust us and no longer respect us.  That's directly linked to Trump.  Our healthcare system is in shambles.  Not 100% Trump's fault but he's definitely a large contributing factor.  His only agenda has been to undo everything from the previous administration, not for policy reasons, but for personal reasons because he hates Obama and always has.  He is the most divisive president arguably in our history.  He is by far the most inexperienced president in modern history (and it shows).  His integrity is non-existant.  These are things we can and should rank him on regardless of the completion of his term.  And should things change by the end of his term, he will be re-ranked.  If things don't change, he will be re-ranked.  Presidential rankings are a constant and they are ongoing.

His performance up to now has been that of a failed administration and yes, we can rank his performance up to now.  If, by 2020, he's changed, then we can surely re-rank him just as we will re-rank every single other president years and decades and centuries later.

Trump didn't create the situation, the situation created Trump.

[Inmate Trump]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

So our bar now is "has he/she started a civil war?"

I'm sorry, but no.  And you can most certainly rank a president before the end of their term.  I'll give you that it's not as valid of a ranking as presidents who have completed their terms, but you can certainly say that "as of this moment, President ____ ranks here."  There's perfectly fine to do.  And as of this moment, Trump's performance has sucked.

We've never been more divided as a nation than we are now, and Trump is the direct cause.  Our allies now consist of Russia and North Korea, and most other countries no longer trust us and no longer respect us.  That's directly linked to Trump.  Our healthcare system is in shambles.  Not 100% Trump's fault but he's definitely a large contributing factor.  His only agenda has been to undo everything from the previous administration, not for policy reasons, but for personal reasons because he hates Obama and always has.  He is the most divisive president arguably in our history.  He is by far the most inexperienced president in modern history (and it shows).  His integrity is non-existant.  These are things we can and should rank him on regardless of the completion of his term.  And should things change by the end of his term, he will be re-ranked.  If things don't change, he will be re-ranked.  Presidential rankings are a constant and they are ongoing.

His performance up to now has been that of a failed administration and yes, we can rank his performance up to now.  If, by 2020, he's changed, then we can surely re-rank him just as we will re-rank every single other president years and decades and centuries later.

Trump didn't create the situation, the situation created Trump.

No, son, Trump has caused/is causing more division.  I don't even know where to begin with you.  Where do you guys get off simply rejecting any notion that some things could be his fault?


What situation caused Trump to make fun of a disabled person?

What situation caused him to degrade war heroes?

What situation caused him to cheat on his wife with a porn star and multiple other women?

What situation causes him to bend over for Vladimir Putin?

What situation caused him to hire all the wrong people?  Many of whom have now had to resign or been asked to leave?

What situation caused him to mock the #MeToo campaign?

What situation caused him to lock away children in camps, separated from their parents?  Some of whom we can't find now.

What situation has caused a new scandal to form around him nearly daily or weekly?

What situation in your life has caused you to be blinded to any wrongdoing someone can do just because of their party ID?  What situation has caused your blind hatred and distrust of Democrats?

I understand that when you're young you generally mimic your parents politics.  I've been there too.  But you're an adult now, and it's time to look at the world through your own eyes; that means opening them and being objective.  It means stop watching fake news or listening to fake news. (Fox News and talk radio are opinion based and largely not fact-based).  Talking to you guys is like talking to brick walls and I absolutely hate that.  With your side, there is no reason or logic.  Wake the f*** up, because we are losing everything that has ever made this country great, and it's being lost on your side's watch!

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Trump is not an accident. There already were several factors that enabled him to attain the power. He just was the only one who saw how to use it to his advantage. Do you think people like him appears out of the blue?

Let's keep deluding yourself everything was great with the American right before Trump "hijacked" it. No, Trump is a logical consequence of a longtime GOP's direction, and let's admit this: most of Republican Trump "skeptics" are supporting bulk of his policies. Maybe they view some things as "too extreme", but it's mostly about they're feeling uncomfortable with GOP abandoning any pretense of "civility" (not that it didn't start way before Trump) or "compassionate conservatism" in favor of "in your face" approach.

And take a look abroad, Europe for example. We've been having this very process going on in several countries.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Trump has no plan and you rarely see Pence , unless its a controversy, its a bad presidency

[Frodo]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

So our bar now is "has he/she started a civil war?"

I'm sorry, but no.  And you can most certainly rank a president before the end of their term.  I'll give you that it's not as valid of a ranking as presidents who have completed their terms, but you can certainly say that "as of this moment, President ____ ranks here."  There's perfectly fine to do.  And as of this moment, Trump's performance has sucked.

We've never been more divided as a nation than we are now, and Trump is the direct cause.  Our allies now consist of Russia and North Korea, and most other countries no longer trust us and no longer respect us.  That's directly linked to Trump.  Our healthcare system is in shambles.  Not 100% Trump's fault but he's definitely a large contributing factor.  His only agenda has been to undo everything from the previous administration, not for policy reasons, but for personal reasons because he hates Obama and always has.  He is the most divisive president arguably in our history.  He is by far the most inexperienced president in modern history (and it shows).  His integrity is non-existant.  These are things we can and should rank him on regardless of the completion of his term.  And should things change by the end of his term, he will be re-ranked.  If things don't change, he will be re-ranked.  Presidential rankings are a constant and they are ongoing.

His performance up to now has been that of a failed administration and yes, we can rank his performance up to now.  If, by 2020, he's changed, then we can surely re-rank him just as we will re-rank every single other president years and decades and centuries later.

Surely the decade leading up to the Civil War was worse than today? 

[pbrower2a]

As someone who doesn't have much love for T***p AND has a vested interest in defending the APSA, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You don't rank a President two years into their term, and whatever you can say about T***p he hasn't sparked a civil war yet.

So our bar now is "has he/she started a civil war?"

I'm sorry, but no.  And you can most certainly rank a president before the end of their term.  I'll give you that it's not as valid of a ranking as presidents who have completed their terms, but you can certainly say that "as of this moment, President ____ ranks here."  There's perfectly fine to do.  And as of this moment, Trump's performance has sucked.

We've never been more divided as a nation than we are now, and Trump is the direct cause.  Our allies now consist of Russia and North Korea, and most other countries no longer trust us and no longer respect us.  That's directly linked to Trump.  Our healthcare system is in shambles.  Not 100% Trump's fault but he's definitely a large contributing factor.  His only agenda has been to undo everything from the previous administration, not for policy reasons, but for personal reasons because he hates Obama and always has.  He is the most divisive president arguably in our history.  He is by far the most inexperienced president in modern history (and it shows).  His integrity is non-existant.  These are things we can and should rank him on regardless of the completion of his term.  And should things change by the end of his term, he will be re-ranked.  If things don't change, he will be re-ranked.  Presidential rankings are a constant and they are ongoing.

His performance up to now has been that of a failed administration and yes, we can rank his performance up to now.  If, by 2020, he's changed, then we can surely re-rank him just as we will re-rank every single other president years and decades and centuries later.

Trump didn't create the situation, the situation created Trump.

No, but he certainly exploited it and intensified it. The only way in which one can endorse the Trump Presidency is if one believes that its radical changes are a good thing, and he accomplishes them.

One ironic effect of Trump is that he causes me to think more sympathetically of Reagan, who at least knew when to back off and could say a kind word. Reagan knew enough to take what he could while he could and not try to grab everything all at once.

Yes, you can rank a President before the end of his term, understanding that the term is incomplete. This allows for explaining why Nixon and Hoover, who both seemed so promising so early, could fail.

Donald Trump has done nothing but express the most reactionary sentiments in American history in my lifetime. He has imposed a dimwitted Machiavellianism in American political life. He has treated anyone who opposed him as a pariah to be a victim of his politics. He has acted more like a despot or dictator than any prior President.

The only connection that he can have with Presidential greatness is that his successor will prove great by repudiating all that he has done -- and perhaps undoing some of the pathology that made his rise possible.

To paraphrase an argument against George W. Bush in the essay "Worst President Ever"...

Washington, Lincoln, and FDR get nearly-uniform credit as the three greatest Presidents for taking a country deeply divided and in danger and leading America into greater unity and out of danger. Dubya has taken a country with few real divisions and no danger and created new divisions and led America into new dangers.

OK -- Obama went in the right direction. Reagan at the least put an end to a stagflation that nobody liked. After Trump, we are going to need a Washington, Lincoln, or FDR.   

[Progressive Pessimist]

Trump is not an accident. There already were several factors that enabled him to attain the power. He just was the only one who saw how to use it to his advantage. Do you think people like him appears out of the blue?

Let's keep deluding yourself everything was great with the American right before Trump "hijacked" it. No, Trump is a logical consequence of a longtime GOP's direction, and let's admit this: most of Republican Trump "skeptics" are supporting bulk of his policies. Maybe they view some things as "too extreme", but it's mostly about they're feeling uncomfortable with GOP abandoning any pretense of "civility" (not that it didn't start way before Trump) or "compassionate conservatism" in favor of "in your face" approach.

And take a look abroad, Europe for example. We've been having this very process going on in several countries.