Were slaves in the South justified in killing their owners?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

There were a few slave rebellions were slaves would escape, find weapons and then kill slaveowners and overseers.

I vote yes of course. I would have no problems killing anyone who in any way whatsoever supported slavery.

[Platypus]

really, really tough call. If it was the only way to ensure freedom from oppresion, yes.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I don't see it as a tough call at all. Absolutely no difference between that and the French Resistance or Warsaw Uprising. Killing your oppressors in all ways.

[Blue Rectangle]

I would have no problems killing anyone who in any way whatsoever supported slavery.

So if you found out that one of the strippers at your favorite club is underage and being held against her will you'd suddenly turn into De Niro in Taxi Driver?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

No. That way there'd be no difference between the two. None at all.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I would have no problems killing anyone who in any way whatsoever supported slavery.

So if you found out that one of the strippers at your favorite club is underage and being held against her will you'd suddenly turn into De Niro in Taxi Driver?

How exactly do you hold them against their will? In the case of being underage though, no she should not be there, assuming by underage you mean under 18 and not under 21 which is the minimum legal age at the club here, although not at the best ones in Minneapolis.

[WalterMitty]

ill just wait here for a completely ridiculous comment from opebo.  im sure it is coming....

[Blue Rectangle]

I would have no problems killing anyone who in any way whatsoever supported slavery.

So if you found out that one of the strippers at your favorite club is underage and being held against her will you'd suddenly turn into De Niro in Taxi Driver?

How exactly do you hold them against their will? In the case of being underage though, no she should not be there, assuming by underage you mean under 18 and not under 21 which is the minimum legal age at the club here, although not at the best ones in Minneapolis.

Threatening violence, threatening to call the INS, threatening to report drug use to the police, threatening to send them back to their parents, etc.

[Frodo]

Yes, absolutely.  And that is a lesson any potential slaveowner should learn when they even consider holding another human being in bondage, treating them as possessions.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

And that is a lesson any potential slaveowner should learn when they even consider holding another human being in bondage, treating them as possessions.

But it only made the real slaveowners worse

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Threatening violence

If the club down here did that the police would find out very quickly and they'd be shut down pretty fast. As for Minneapolis ones I've never been to one sleazy enough to where that seems likely. Deja Vu is too big of a chain for that to be likely. Plus Minneapolis is much better at shutting down that type of stuff than most major cities.

threatening to call the INS

Don't think I've ever ran into a stripper who wasn't American-born. Even the non-white ones have all had accents which are clearly Midwestern or American born.

threatening to report drug use to the police

I doubt the club would know about this, since I can't see any here risking things like giving them drugs or letting them use them on the property. In that case the best thing would be for her to quit.

threatening to send them back to their parents, etc.

Only way I can see this happening is by firing her, in which case they're not exactly holding her against her will.

[Frodo]

And that is a lesson any potential slaveowner should learn when they even consider holding another human being in bondage, treating them as possessions.

But it only made the real slaveowners worse

Perhaps, but are you going to tell me that the great revolts led by slaves like Nat Turner and Spartacus were unjustified, and that the slaves should simply have meekly accepted their lot in life for the sake of maintaining the peace, and given their owners some peace of mind?

It is ridiculous merely on the face of it.  

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Perhaps, but are you going to tell me that the great revolts led by slaves like Nat Turner and Spartacus were unjustified, and that the slaves should simply have meekly accepted their lot in life for the sake of maintaining the peace, and given their owners some peace of mind?

No. But in the end it just made everything worse. There wasn't anything slaves could do to get out unless they got lucky and did a runner.
Sorry if that's more than a little depressive, btw.

[MODU]

Justified?  I'm not sure about that, but I don't think I would blame them either.  Would I be justified for setting your car on fire because you wouldn't give me back my bike? 

[Blue Rectangle]

Threatening violence

If the club down here did that the police would find out very quickly and they'd be shut down pretty fast. As for Minneapolis ones I've never been to one sleazy enough to where that seems likely. Deja Vu is too big of a chain for that to be likely. Plus Minneapolis is much better at shutting down that type of stuff than most major cities.

I was only suggesting a hypothetical situation, not accusing your particular club with wrongdoing.  In any case, your point about Minneapolis being better bascially conceeds that some sex workers in the U.S. live in virtual slavery.

Have you seen Taxi Driver?  It's a good movie.  If you have, would you consider the actions of De Niro's character to be justified?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Never seen it.

And while probably true about sex workers, that's mostly considering prostitutes and brothels, not likely to be common in strip clubs, unless they double as brothels.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

For the record I've only seen one stripper ever who I could possibly see being underage, and even in her case I'd be suprised. She looked like the freshmen girls at my unversity do.

[Storebought]

This question assumes that most slaves lived on giant plantations under the direct oversight of the landlord. That assumption is plainly false:

(1) Most slaves lived with their owners, inside the owner's shack. Killing the bossman in that circumstance was not some simple orgasmic liberating experience that (lefties) typically imagine -- more commonly, it was just a typical domestic dispute turned ugly.

(2) The field slaves on the gigantic 100+ slave plantations never saw their owners, or especially the owner's immediate family. The man wielding the lash was a driver, typically a poor white or even another slave.

(3) Most slaves, once freed, had more important concerns on their mind than revenge -- finding lost or sold relatives (the true evil of American slavery); migrating to less remote fields; for the slackers, loitering and vagabondage, etc.

[Cubby]

Its tied now, 4-4, which is interesting. Personally I can't wait to see States Rights response. Don't dissapoint us!

I voted yes but that doesn't mean I'm some kind of crazy revolutionary. Slavery was a horrible crime against humanity and there is no way you can defend it. Many slaveowners may have been rational people but defending them is kind of like giving "I was just following orders" as an excuse.  I'm sure someone here will find a way to take an opposing view, maybe based on economics or something.

[Ebowed]

I'm surprised you support the death penalty, Pym.

[A18]

There were a few slave rebellions were slaves would escape, find weapons and then kill slaveowners and overseers.

I vote yes of course. I would have no problems killing anyone who in any way whatsoever supported slavery.

So you don't support the death penalty for raping and killing a nine year old girl, but you support the death penalty for simply supporting something. Your consistency is impressive.

[Cubby]

I'm surprised you support the death penalty, Pym.

I certainly don't support the death penalty, only for terrorists like al-Qaeda or Tim McVeigh. It was a historical what if question, its not like it has any relevance to today's society. Don't take my response as an insult to your southern heritage.

[Ebowed]

I certainly don't support the death penalty

You stated: "I voted yes ... Slavery was a horrible crime against humanity."  So you support the death penalty for crimes against humanity.

I certainly don't support the death penalty, only for terrorists like al-Qaeda or Tim McVeigh.

This sentence is a contradiction.  If you wanted to say something coherent, perhaps try "I only support the death penalty for terrorists," not "I don't support the death penalty, except I do."

It was a historical what if question, its not like it has any relevance to today's society.

That does not change the fact that you support the death penalty.

Don't take my response as an insult to your southern heritage.

This is irrelevant and a personal attack.

[© tweed]

Depends entirely on the situation.

[12th Doctor]

I would have no problems killing anyone who in any way whatsoever supported slavery.

So if you found out that one of the strippers at your favorite club is underage and being held against her will you'd suddenly turn into De Niro in Taxi Driver?

How exactly do you hold them against their will? In the case of being underage though, no she should not be there, assuming by underage you mean under 18 and not under 21 which is the minimum legal age at the club here, although not at the best ones in Minneapolis.

I was not aware that such a "worldly" person could be in the dark about this.  Sex slavery is huge business all over the world, and the United States is not exception.