Culture Gap Could Keep Democrats From Gaining Seats in 2006

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

I'm against gay marriage, but for civil unions.  CarlHayden is right in that this is the position favored my several other Americans.  It is yet another position that Dems should adopt in the near future. 

Go for, and win the civil union battle.  Then, once that is resolved, they can try to take on the gay marriage battle.  It's an effective, long-term strategy. 

Careful, there.  I think jfern is about to insult us on how this is an unwinnable strategy and how we're "spineless moderates."

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

[Virginian87]

I'm against gay marriage, but for civil unions.  CarlHayden is right in that this is the position favored my several other Americans.  It is yet another position that Dems should adopt in the near future. 

Go for, and win the civil union battle.  Then, once that is resolved, they can try to take on the gay marriage battle.  It's an effective, long-term strategy. 

Careful, there.  I think jfern is about to insult us on how this is an unwinnable strategy and how we're "spineless moderates."

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

Kerry has his own problems.  Gay marriage was not what cost him the election.  It's not him MODU and I were talking about.  It's the perception of Democrats as a whole. 

And could we stop the name-calling please?  You're acting like an elementary schooler by calling people "idiots" and "fools".

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

I'm against gay marriage, but for civil unions.  CarlHayden is right in that this is the position favored my several other Americans.  It is yet another position that Dems should adopt in the near future. 

Go for, and win the civil union battle.  Then, once that is resolved, they can try to take on the gay marriage battle.  It's an effective, long-term strategy. 

Careful, there.  I think jfern is about to insult us on how this is an unwinnable strategy and how we're "spineless moderates."

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

Kerry has his own problems.  Gay marriage was not what cost him the election.  It's not him MODU and I were talking about.  It's the perception of Democrats as a whole. 

And could we stop the name-calling please?  You're acting like an elementary schooler by calling people "idiots" and "fools".

Instead of moving to the right because we're percieved as liberals, perhaps we need to frame things better.

[MODU]

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

We know Kerry speaks from both sides of his mouth.  Most politicians do.  While Kerry was saying he was against gay marriage, he was backing the politicians and their efforts to make gay marriage legal.  It's the ol' Potomac two-step son.  But, you can keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel better.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

We know Kerry speaks from both sides of his mouth.  Most politicians do.  While Kerry was saying he was against gay marriage, he was backing the politicians and their efforts to make gay marriage legal.  It's the ol' Potomac two-step son.  But, you can keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel better.

What a bunch of utter bullsh**t. Kerry is a moderate. Get your head out of your ass.

[Virginian87]

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

We know Kerry speaks from both sides of his mouth.  Most politicians do.  While Kerry was saying he was against gay marriage, he was backing the politicians and their efforts to make gay marriage legal.  It's the ol' Potomac two-step son.  But, you can keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel better.

What a bunch of utter bullsh**t. Kerry is a moderate. Get your head out of your ass.

Do you think Ted Kennedy is moderate too?

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

We know Kerry speaks from both sides of his mouth.  Most politicians do.  While Kerry was saying he was against gay marriage, he was backing the politicians and their efforts to make gay marriage legal.  It's the ol' Potomac two-step son.  But, you can keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel better.

What a bunch of utter bullsh**t. Kerry is a moderate. Get your head out of your ass.

Do you think Ted Kennedy is moderate too?

Do you have anything useful to say? You seem to have no spine, and are confusing Democrats with a spine with being necessarily liberal. I suppose you hate Senator Reid.

[KEmperor]

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

We know Kerry speaks from both sides of his mouth.  Most politicians do.  While Kerry was saying he was against gay marriage, he was backing the politicians and their efforts to make gay marriage legal.  It's the ol' Potomac two-step son.  But, you can keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel better.

What a bunch of utter bullsh**t. Kerry is a moderate. Get your head out of your ass.

Just like Barbara Boxer.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

We know Kerry speaks from both sides of his mouth.  Most politicians do.  While Kerry was saying he was against gay marriage, he was backing the politicians and their efforts to make gay marriage legal.  It's the ol' Potomac two-step son.  But, you can keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel better.

What a bunch of utter bullsh**t. Kerry is a moderate. Get your head out of your ass.

Just like Barbara Boxer.

Barbara Boxer is the most liberal current Senator, and she set a record for the most votes ever for one candidate in a non-national election. Now, do you have a point?

[Blue Rectangle]

What a bunch of utter bullsh**t. Kerry is a moderate. Get your head out of your ass.

John Kerry:
--supports public funding of abortion
--supports public funding of embryonic stem cell research
--opposes capital punishment
--in 2002, received an F from the NRA and 100% approval from the Brady Campaign
--received a 0% approval from the National Right to Life and 100% approval from NARAL
--voted against the DOMA (which passed with large bipartisan support), opposes Clinton's "don't ask/don't tell" policy and has received a 100% rating from the nation's largest gay-rights group

How is he a moderate on social issues?

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

John Kerry:
--supports public funding of abortion

So did Clinton

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So do Senators Hatch and Frist, and it passed in California

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The numbers are moving against capital punishment, so it's not as an extreme a position as 15 years ago.

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Dean had an A from the NRA, and no one cared

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I didn't say he was the dead center on abortion. It's one of the few issues that he's left of center on. There are others like socialized medicine where he's far to the right, since 65% want single payer, and he opposes it.

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He's had some inconsistant statements on this. However, his opponent was the master flip flopper.

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On gay marriage he's pretty close the the center. On abortion he is left of center, but remember that Roe vs. Wade has 65%-29% support. Gun control doesn't seem like so much of a left/right issue. He talked some about his religious beliefs in speeches.

[Virginian87]

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

We know Kerry speaks from both sides of his mouth.  Most politicians do.  While Kerry was saying he was against gay marriage, he was backing the politicians and their efforts to make gay marriage legal.  It's the ol' Potomac two-step son.  But, you can keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel better.

What a bunch of utter bullsh**t. Kerry is a moderate. Get your head out of your ass.

Do you think Ted Kennedy is moderate too?

Do you have anything useful to say? You seem to have no spine, and are confusing Democrats with a spine with being necessarily liberal. I suppose you hate Senator Reid.

Senator Reid is a pretty good leader in the Senate.
You know, I think you're the one with nothing constructive to say, since you doggedly pursue the same argument over and over ("spineless moderate! spineless moderate!").  It's no wonder you don't display your age.  You probably don't want people to know you're in fifth or sixth grade.

[A18]

I doubt most Americans support paying 25% in payroll taxes alone, as they would under single-payer health care.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

I doubt most Americans support paying 25% in payroll taxes alone, as they would under single-payer health care.

Countries with single-payer spend far less on health care than the US, and have longer life expectancies.

[A18]

What does that have to do with anything? Not everyone wants health care, especially not when the quality sucks.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Kerry said he was against gay marriage, fool.

We know Kerry speaks from both sides of his mouth.  Most politicians do.  While Kerry was saying he was against gay marriage, he was backing the politicians and their efforts to make gay marriage legal.  It's the ol' Potomac two-step son.  But, you can keep repeating yourself if it makes you feel better.

What a bunch of utter bullsh**t. Kerry is a moderate. Get your head out of your ass.

Do you think Ted Kennedy is moderate too?

Do you have anything useful to say? You seem to have no spine, and are confusing Democrats with a spine with being necessarily liberal. I suppose you hate Senator Reid.

Senator Reid is a pretty good leader in the Senate.
You know, I think you're the one with nothing constructive to say, since you doggedly pursue the same argument over and over ("spineless moderate! spineless moderate!").  It's no wonder you don't display your age.  You probably don't want people to know you're in fifth or sixth grade.

I'm surprised that you like someone so non spineless. You seem to    think that the Democratic party should move further to the right.  Do you support the war? The bankruptcy bill?

Hint, does the Republican party win by moving to the center? Time for you to learn some lessons from them.

All, I want is for the Democratic party to win, which it can't do when hijacked by spineless "moderates" who can't oppose the Republican agenda, because if you oppose Bush, you're "some crazy liberal".

[MODU]

Hint, does the Republican party win by moving to the center? Time for you to learn some lessons from them.

Hmmmm . . . that's still flawed.  You need to look more closely as to why they won.  Most of the challengers the Republicans faced were further away from the center than they were or failed to meet the needs of the voting population.  I would think that if you want to increase the number of Democratic politicians in office, you would want to move where the voters are, win their votes, get your party people in office, and then work back towards the left, rather than jump to the left, expect the voters to follow you, and then complain about being the minority party when the Republicans win again.

[Virginian87]

Hint, does the Republican party win by moving to the center? Time for you to learn some lessons from them.

Hmmmm . . . that's still flawed.  You need to look more closely as to why they won.  Most of the challengers the Republicans faced were further away from the center than they were or failed to meet the needs of the voting population.  I would think that if you want to increase the number of Democratic politicians in office, you would want to move where the voters are, win their votes, get your party people in office, and then work back towards the left, rather than jump to the left, expect the voters to follow you, and then complain about being the minority party when the Republicans win again.

I've stopped paying attention to him, MODU.  Let him live his dream.

[MODU]

Hint, does the Republican party win by moving to the center? Time for you to learn some lessons from them.

Hmmmm . . . that's still flawed.  You need to look more closely as to why they won.  Most of the challengers the Republicans faced were further away from the center than they were or failed to meet the needs of the voting population.  I would think that if you want to increase the number of Democratic politicians in office, you would want to move where the voters are, win their votes, get your party people in office, and then work back towards the left, rather than jump to the left, expect the voters to follow you, and then complain about being the minority party when the Republicans win again.

I've stopped paying attention to him, MODU.  Let him live his dream.

hehehe . . . though I have tried in the past, I can't seem to give up hope on him. 

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Hint, does the Republican party win by moving to the center? Time for you to learn some lessons from them.

Hmmmm . . . that's still flawed.  You need to look more closely as to why they won.  Most of the challengers the Republicans faced were further away from the center than they were or failed to meet the needs of the voting population.  I would think that if you want to increase the number of Democratic politicians in office, you would want to move where the voters are, win their votes, get your party people in office, and then work back towards the left, rather than jump to the left, expect the voters to follow you, and then complain about being the minority party when the Republicans win again.

Most of the issues are on the side of the Democrats. Increasing minimum wage has 86-12 support. Kerry was actually on the losing side of the socialized medicine issue, by opposing it. Basically the Democratic party is center on most issues, left of center on a few issues, right of center on a few issues. In contrast, the Republican party doesn't seem too concerned about polls when they choose the 12% side.

[A18]

Uh, 65% of Americans oppose a government take over of health care, according to Gallup.

[MODU]

Most of the issues are on the side of the Democrats. Increasing minimum wage has 86-12 support. Kerry was actually on the losing side of the socialized medicine issue, by opposing it. Basically the Democratic party is center on most issues, left of center on a few issues, right of center on a few issues. In contrast, the Republican party doesn't seem too concerned about polls when they choose the 12% side.

That's because the 12% know that increasing the minimum wage will hurt the economy, which is why the people do not vote directly in the government.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Uh, 65% of Americans oppose a government take over of health care, according to Gallup.

Here's the far more reputable Pew poll.

[A18]

Gallup is more reputable than Pew, and unlike Pew, actually asked the question you're talking about.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Gallup is more reputable than Pew, and unlike Pew, actually asked the question you're talking about.

So I slightly misremembered it. I once saw some poll that did have high support for single payer healthcare, but in any case, Democrats should fight for the 65% who want universal health care.