2017 French Presidential Election

[Shadows]

I got -

Benoit Hamon 77%
Nathalie Arthaud 75%
Philippe Poutou 74%
Jean-Luc Mélenchon 73%
Jacques Cheminade 60%
Emmanuel Macron 59%
Marine Le Pen 50%
Nicolas Dupont-Aignan 46%
François Fillon 42%

Among the major candidates -

Hamon 77%, Melenchon 73%, Macron 59%, Le Pen 50% (God knows how!!!), Fillon 42%

[Boston Bread]

Melenchon has an online video game now: http://fiscalkombat.fr/

[Zinneke]

Reading this forum you'd think Mélenchon was going to resurrect the Soviet Union.

Jean-Luc Mélenchon is an old-style Republican Socialist. Think Jean Jaurès and Léon Blum.
He is not communist by any standard, nor do he want to start chopping heads off, or seize the means of production, or start a planned economy without property rights... And he also doesn't want to isolate France from the rest of the world, he just want to renegotiate the European treaties.

Somebody who praises people like Robespierre and supported great "Socialist" figures such as Chavez and Castro, as well as "anti-imperialist" figures like Ahmedinijad, does give people the right to be criitical.

[Shadows]

Reading this forum you'd think Mélenchon was going to resurrect the Soviet Union.

Jean-Luc Mélenchon is an old-style Republican Socialist. Think Jean Jaurès and Léon Blum.
He is not communist by any standard, nor do he want to start chopping heads off, or seize the means of production, or start a planned economy without property rights... And he also doesn't want to isolate France from the rest of the world, he just want to renegotiate the European treaties.

Somebody who praises people like Robespierre and supported great "Socialist" figures such as Chavez and Castro, as well as "anti-imperialist" figures like Ahmedinijad, does give people the right to be criitical.

What exactly did he say? There is something good to praise about everyone but the devil is in the details. I am sure he didn't say I support Castro's dictatorship etc! Links?

[RFK Jr.’s Brain Worm]

Melenchon has an online video game now: http://fiscalkombat.fr/

Requires a computer? WTF. I want to play it on my Minitel.

Also, this Mélenchon surge is fascinating. I'm not sure who the top two will be. I'd guess Le Pen will be in it, but I'd say Macron and Le Pen should be worrying about losing their spot to Mélenchon.

[Zinneke]

Reading this forum you'd think Mélenchon was going to resurrect the Soviet Union.

Jean-Luc Mélenchon is an old-style Republican Socialist. Think Jean Jaurès and Léon Blum.
He is not communist by any standard, nor do he want to start chopping heads off, or seize the means of production, or start a planned economy without property rights... And he also doesn't want to isolate France from the rest of the world, he just want to renegotiate the European treaties.

Somebody who praises people like Robespierre and supported great "Socialist" figures such as Chavez and Castro, as well as "anti-imperialist" figures like Ahmedinijad, does give people the right to be criitical.

What exactly did he say? There is something good to praise about everyone but the devil is in the details. I am sure he didn't say I support Castro's dictatorship etc! Links?

http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/video/2016/10/10/ce-que-jean-luc-melenchon-aurait-fait-face-a-robespierre_5011125_823448.html

Here's a program where he tries his best to be an apologist of Robespierre, and he is also quoted as saying his old Parti de Gauche was the spiritual successor of the movement.

http://www.humanite.fr/melenchon-chavez-cest-lideal-inepuisable-de-lesperance-humaniste-de-la-revolution

Chavez was an "Indefatigable idea of humanist hope"

http://www.bfmtv.com/politique/mort-de-fidel-castro-l-hommage-de-jean-luc-melenchon-rassemble-200-personnes-a-paris-1063941.html

Pays tribute in wonderful terms to Castro.

I'll get the ONPC when he talks about Ahamdenijad later. He definitely cosied up to the anti-imp movement that basically think the US is the source of all problems in the world. As evidence by his stance on Syria and his cosying up to Putin.

[Intell]

Reading this forum you'd think Mélenchon was going to resurrect the Soviet Union.

Jean-Luc Mélenchon is an old-style Republican Socialist. Think Jean Jaurès and Léon Blum.
He is not communist by any standard, nor do he want to start chopping heads off, or seize the means of production, or start a planned economy without property rights... And he also doesn't want to isolate France from the rest of the world, he just want to renegotiate the European treaties.

Somebody who praises people like Robespierre and supported great "Socialist" figures such as Chavez and Castro, as well as "anti-imperialist" figures like Ahmedinijad, does give people the right to be criitical.

What exactly did he say? There is something good to praise about everyone but the devil is in the details. I am sure he didn't say I support Castro's dictatorship etc! Links?

http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/video/2016/10/10/ce-que-jean-luc-melenchon-aurait-fait-face-a-robespierre_5011125_823448.html

Here's a program where he tries his best to be an apologist of Robespierre, and he is also quoted as saying his old Parti de Gauche was the spiritual successor of the movement.

http://www.humanite.fr/melenchon-chavez-cest-lideal-inepuisable-de-lesperance-humaniste-de-la-revolution

Chavez was an "Indefatigable idea of humanist hope"

http://www.bfmtv.com/politique/mort-de-fidel-castro-l-hommage-de-jean-luc-melenchon-rassemble-200-personnes-a-paris-1063941.html

Pays tribute in wonderful terms to Castro.

I'll get the ONPC when he talks about Ahamdenijad later. He definitely cosied up to the anti-imp movement that basically think the US is the source of all problems in the world. As evidence by his stance on Syria and his cosying up to Putin.

Robespierre was a great socialist, so that's nice, and Castro's done a lot to get his country rid of the US banna state, and improved living standards a lot and has one of the highest social developments in  Latin America, albeit the dictatorship is horrible, and that country needs to move towards being a democracy. 

What's his stance in syria, that we shouldn't bomb and air strike Syriaa?

Ahamdenijad, what did he say was good about him before before?

[Shadows]

Reading this forum you'd think Mélenchon was going to resurrect the Soviet Union.

Jean-Luc Mélenchon is an old-style Republican Socialist. Think Jean Jaurès and Léon Blum.
He is not communist by any standard, nor do he want to start chopping heads off, or seize the means of production, or start a planned economy without property rights... And he also doesn't want to isolate France from the rest of the world, he just want to renegotiate the European treaties.

Somebody who praises people like Robespierre and supported great "Socialist" figures such as Chavez and Castro, as well as "anti-imperialist" figures like Ahmedinijad, does give people the right to be criitical.

What exactly did he say? There is something good to praise about everyone but the devil is in the details. I am sure he didn't say I support Castro's dictatorship etc! Links?

http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/video/2016/10/10/ce-que-jean-luc-melenchon-aurait-fait-face-a-robespierre_5011125_823448.html

Here's a program where he tries his best to be an apologist of Robespierre, and he is also quoted as saying his old Parti de Gauche was the spiritual successor of the movement.

http://www.humanite.fr/melenchon-chavez-cest-lideal-inepuisable-de-lesperance-humaniste-de-la-revolution

Chavez was an "Indefatigable idea of humanist hope"

http://www.bfmtv.com/politique/mort-de-fidel-castro-l-hommage-de-jean-luc-melenchon-rassemble-200-personnes-a-paris-1063941.html

Pays tribute in wonderful terms to Castro.

I'll get the ONPC when he talks about Ahamdenijad later. He definitely cosied up to the anti-imp movement that basically think the US is the source of all problems in the world. As evidence by his stance on Syria and his cosying up to Putin.

Both were some eulogies in death, so I would cut him some slack - I didn't like the Chavez stuff, way too much praise, ohh progressive this & healthcare & what not! Castro stuff was okay, small praise & he admitted Castro made mistakes. Him gushing over Chavez was too much IMO. But atleast Chavez was somewhat democratic & won elections unlike Castro who ran a dictatorship.

He's probably too left IMO & beyond the "Socialist" Hamon but not a communist or a dictator. I also thought Hamon would be better !

[Tirnam]

Yesterday, Fillon compared himself to Vercingetorix, winner of battle of Gergovia (52 BC) against Julius Caesar "the frontrunner in the polls".

The downside of this is that he did not say that ultimately Julius Caesar won the second round in Alesia.

[windjammer]

Yesterday, Fillon compared himself to Vercingetorix, winner of battle of Gergovia (52 BC) against Julius Caesar "the frontrunner in the polls".

The downside of this is that he did not say that ultimately Julius Caesar won the second round in Alesia.

A fitting comparison to be honest. Vercingetorix was literally betrayed by his "clan".

[parochial boy]

[Zinneke]

Reading this forum you'd think Mélenchon was going to resurrect the Soviet Union.

Jean-Luc Mélenchon is an old-style Republican Socialist. Think Jean Jaurès and Léon Blum.
He is not communist by any standard, nor do he want to start chopping heads off, or seize the means of production, or start a planned economy without property rights... And he also doesn't want to isolate France from the rest of the world, he just want to renegotiate the European treaties.

Somebody who praises people like Robespierre and supported great "Socialist" figures such as Chavez and Castro, as well as "anti-imperialist" figures like Ahmedinijad, does give people the right to be criitical.

What exactly did he say? There is something good to praise about everyone but the devil is in the details. I am sure he didn't say I support Castro's dictatorship etc! Links?

http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/video/2016/10/10/ce-que-jean-luc-melenchon-aurait-fait-face-a-robespierre_5011125_823448.html

Here's a program where he tries his best to be an apologist of Robespierre, and he is also quoted as saying his old Parti de Gauche was the spiritual successor of the movement.

http://www.humanite.fr/melenchon-chavez-cest-lideal-inepuisable-de-lesperance-humaniste-de-la-revolution

Chavez was an "Indefatigable idea of humanist hope"

http://www.bfmtv.com/politique/mort-de-fidel-castro-l-hommage-de-jean-luc-melenchon-rassemble-200-personnes-a-paris-1063941.html

Pays tribute in wonderful terms to Castro.

I'll get the ONPC when he talks about Ahamdenijad later. He definitely cosied up to the anti-imp movement that basically think the US is the source of all problems in the world. As evidence by his stance on Syria and his cosying up to Putin.

Robespierre was a great socialist, so that's nice, and Castro's done a lot to get his country rid of the US banna state, and improved living standards a lot and has one of the highest social developments in  Latin America, albeit the dictatorship is horrible, and that country needs to move towards being a democracy. 

What's his stance in syria, that we shouldn't bomb and air strike Syriaa?

Ahamdenijad, what did he say was good about him before before?

The point is that when his sympathisers say "muh he's not a communist", not only are they being patronising (we can all read Méluche's economic program, he is not a M-L), they are also ignoring the deeper issue that Mélenchon's foreign policy seems to be a relic of Cold War binary geopolitics, replacing Capitalism vs Communism with Western Imperialism vs Anti-Imperialism. The result is a ridiculously desperate attempt to justify any senseless, authoritarian tinpot regime that pisses off Uncle Sam, and the belief that eliminating American hegemony in Europe relies on cosying up to Russia. I wonder how Mélenchon's puff speeches over Russia in the European Parliament go down with his supporters on here?

Tirnam has already showed what his stance on Syria is : Pro-Assad, pro Russia Anti-US. He even said Putin was going to "sort out" Syria on ONPC. The same black-white world his supporters love to be nostalgic of.

[SNJ1985]

These are usually more amusing than anything else you can glean from them, but France24 has made an English-version Vote Compass for the election.

Marine Le Pen: 59%
François Fillon: 57%
Nicolas Dupont-Aignan: 42%
Emmanuel Macron: 36%
Jacques Cheminade: 31%
Benoit Hamon: 20%
Jean-Luc Mélenchon: 20%
Philippe Poutou: 17%
Nathalie Arthaud: 14%

[Intell]

Reading this forum you'd think Mélenchon was going to resurrect the Soviet Union.

Jean-Luc Mélenchon is an old-style Republican Socialist. Think Jean Jaurès and Léon Blum.
He is not communist by any standard, nor do he want to start chopping heads off, or seize the means of production, or start a planned economy without property rights... And he also doesn't want to isolate France from the rest of the world, he just want to renegotiate the European treaties.

Somebody who praises people like Robespierre and supported great "Socialist" figures such as Chavez and Castro, as well as "anti-imperialist" figures like Ahmedinijad, does give people the right to be criitical.

What exactly did he say? There is something good to praise about everyone but the devil is in the details. I am sure he didn't say I support Castro's dictatorship etc! Links?

http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/video/2016/10/10/ce-que-jean-luc-melenchon-aurait-fait-face-a-robespierre_5011125_823448.html

Here's a program where he tries his best to be an apologist of Robespierre, and he is also quoted as saying his old Parti de Gauche was the spiritual successor of the movement.

http://www.humanite.fr/melenchon-chavez-cest-lideal-inepuisable-de-lesperance-humaniste-de-la-revolution

Chavez was an "Indefatigable idea of humanist hope"

http://www.bfmtv.com/politique/mort-de-fidel-castro-l-hommage-de-jean-luc-melenchon-rassemble-200-personnes-a-paris-1063941.html

Pays tribute in wonderful terms to Castro.

I'll get the ONPC when he talks about Ahamdenijad later. He definitely cosied up to the anti-imp movement that basically think the US is the source of all problems in the world. As evidence by his stance on Syria and his cosying up to Putin.

Robespierre was a great socialist, so that's nice, and Castro's done a lot to get his country rid of the US banna state, and improved living standards a lot and has one of the highest social developments in  Latin America, albeit the dictatorship is horrible, and that country needs to move towards being a democracy. 

What's his stance in syria, that we shouldn't bomb and air strike Syriaa?

Ahamdenijad, what did he say was good about him before before?

The point is that when his sympathisers say "muh he's not a communist", not only are they being patronising (we can all read Méluche's economic program, he is not a M-L), they are also ignoring the deeper issue that Mélenchon's foreign policy seems to be a relic of Cold War binary geopolitics, replacing Capitalism vs Communism with Western Imperialism vs Anti-Imperialism. The result is a ridiculously desperate attempt to justify any senseless, authoritarian tinpot regime that pisses off Uncle Sam, and the belief that eliminating American hegemony in Europe relies on cosying up to Russia. I wonder how Mélenchon's puff speeches over Russia in the European Parliament go down with his supporters on here?

Tirnam has already showed what his stance on Syria is : Pro-Assad, pro Russia Anti-US. He even said Putin was going to "sort out" Syria on ONPC. The same black-white world his supporters love to be nostalgic of.

Where does Melechon support Ahamdenijad?

What does pro-assad mean, not going into war against assad? Is that what is meant by defending authoritarianism?

What did Melechon mean when he said Russia was going to sort out Syria, that they can interfere in Sryia to fight ISIS (exactly what is wrong with this...)

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Mélenchon might not personally be a Commie, but he is the candidate of that tradition in French politics (a tradition that is far more popular and viable than the wretched remnants of the PCF) much as he was last time.

[DavidB.]

What the thell, Mélenchon's FP vision seems to be the worst. Should have known that, of course, for the reason Al gave. I'd definitely vote for Macron over him.

[jaichind]

Yesterday, Fillon compared himself to Vercingetorix, winner of battle of Gergovia (52 BC) against Julius Caesar "the frontrunner in the polls".

The downside of this is that he did not say that ultimately Julius Caesar won the second round in Alesia.

Well, Fillon I think made a good analogy for the benefit himself.    Alesia was very close and the Romans were about to fall apart about when the Romans played their last card: have the Roman cavalry charge the Gaul position where the Gauls made a breach in the Roman lines .  If the Gauls just held on and not break and run they would have won.  That is the message I guess Fillon has for his supporters: hold on, do not lose hope and vote Fillon on the first round.

[Barnes]

Do remember in the first debate that Melenchon proposed a "Congress of Europe" to redraw national borders, a la Vienna, 1814. I'm not too sure certain Eastern European countries would jump on that bandwagon...

[heatcharger]

It's obviously highly unlikely, but just hypothetically, who would win in a Macron-Melenchon matchup? I would think Le Pen voters would probably vote Macron, but who knows...

[Filuwaúrdjan]

It's obviously highly unlikely, but just hypothetically, who would win in a Macron-Melenchon matchup? I would think Le Pen voters would probably vote Macron, but who knows...

Macron landslide; the political tradition that Mélenchon presently represents is poisonous to a majority of French voters. But a very interesting map, I suspect.

[RFK Jr.’s Brain Worm]

It's obviously highly unlikely, but just hypothetically, who would win in a Macron-Melenchon matchup? I would think Le Pen voters would probably vote Macron, but who knows...

Macron landslide; the political tradition that Mélenchon presently represents is poisonous to a majority of French voters. But a very interesting map, I suspect.

I'd agree. I'd guess at least a 2:1 margin in favor of Macron.

[Kringla Heimsins]

I deeply regret starting a political argument.

To be honest, FP is the main thing that scares me about Mélenchon (My favorite candidate was Montebourg, Mélenchon isn't exactly my dream candidate).

He said many contradictory things about Russia, but he certainly isn't a Putin supporter. He doesn't seem to know much about Syria, he principally wants to stay out this mess, but he has only praised Putin's action against ISIS (without explicitly denouncing his strikes against the rebels).

He also (mildly) denounced Castro's and Chavez's authoritarianism many times in the past, even though he praised them when they died. I can't recall anything about Iran though.

He would definitely be crushed by Macron in a second round though.

[Former President tack50]

Hamon 53%
Arthaud 53%
Le Pen 52%
Poutou 52%
Fillon 48%
Mélenchon 47%
Cheminade 47%
Dupont-Aignan 46%
Macron 44%

That was... interesting. I do agree with Hamon being my first choice, but I am surprised to see Le Pen as the 2nd (of the major candidates); to see Fillon above Melenchon and to see Macron as the worst choice for me.

Then again mostly tied. The diffrence between Macron and Hamon for me is only 9 points

Edit: After weighing my results, it moves to:

Le Pen 57%
Hamon 56%
Melenchon 52%
Fillon 51%
Macron 44%

Even more interesting. For some reson Le Pen jumps to number 1.

[SunSt0rm]

Hamon indicates that he would rather endorse Melenchon than Macron if he loses the first round

http://www.lemonde.fr/election-presidentielle-2017/article/2017/04/09/benoit-hamon-appellera-a-voter-jean-luc-melenchon-s-il-perd-au-premier-tour_5108409_4854003.html

[jaichind]

A French Town Known for Picking Presidents Sees Big Upset Ahead
The foie gras town of Donzy is almost always right in picking a winner, and this year it sees Fillon beating Le Pen.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2017-04-09/a-french-town-known-for-picking-presidents-sees-big-upset-ahead