U.N. Passes Resolution Against Israel Settlements, U.S. Abstains

[Angel of Death]

It's funny how people are expressing contempt for the UN as if it were responsible for this resolution as some sort of autonomous entity, rather than all the countries in the world that voted for it. But that's propaganda for you.

[America Needs R'hllor]

The real coward here is Barack Obama- he's now spitting unprecedented attacks against the Netanyahu administration, but he only has the guts because Clinton wasn't elected. He's like a little child who's coy when his parents are there, but throws tantrums whenever they're not there.

ftfy

AW and Mencken get it.

I don't like Netanyahu, but every Jew who chooses to criticize Netanyahu instead of Obama right now has their priorities -- and probably actually more than that: their values -- profoundly messed up.

How can I not criticize Netanyahu's awful and incompetent foreign policy? Not even talking about the actual actions, like spitting in Obama's face and going to a speech in Congress while there's an election season at home- he never appointed a foreign relations minister, and his ambassador in the UN is laughably incompetent and was only sent there because he was a political problem for Netanyahu,

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

It's funny how people are expressing contempt for the UN as if it were responsible for this resolution as some sort of autonomous entity, rather than all the countries in the world that voted for it. But that's propaganda for you.

Oh, believe you me, I despise both the farcical entity, and every. single. country. that helped it along while still washing the blood of Jews through history off their own filthy hands.

[Comrade Funk]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

[windjammer]

I don't remember someone having more ruined his country than Netanyahu.

[GoTfan]

I don't know why people are praising Obama for this. All this shows is that he is a coward that neither has the guts to stand up for Israel nor vote in favour of the resolution.

He literally just gave Israel $38 billion in aid. I'm sure that will keep them warm at night.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

The arguments abour God given land and the return of the messias sound very ISIS-like.

You can criticize the Jews all you want but it's still THEIR LAND. They lived there centuries before Islam even began.

Though it ought to be point there were almost no Jews left in Palestine when the Muslims came and due to centuries of living there Arab have a right consider parts of Palestine "their land".

I really think this is a stupid argument. You have plenty of lands which were once dominated by one nationality but are now, frequently for centuries, a homeland to some other. There's too many examples to name there.

And, for the record, I've been always in favor of Israel's "right to exist". We may debate whether the Jewish state should've been established in Palestine, given centuries of no Jewish presence there and somehow artificial resettlement, but it's irrelevant. Israel exists since the late 1940s and you can't just reverse this basic fact. After experiences of the World War II, establishment of Jewish state was a necessity. It's too bad it turned into a prolonged conflict (started, it must be admitted, by the Arabs' initial refusal to share) though.

But this also means you can't reverse the basic fact parts of Palestine are an Arab homeland.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

I don't know why people are praising Obama for this. All this shows is that he is a coward that neither has the guts to stand up for Israel nor vote in favour of the resolution.

The United States remains and will remain Israel's closest ally. It's just the present administration doesn't blindly approve every move of the Israeli government. It's natural even among close allies.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

You may have missed it, but 90% of Democrats not leaving office in three weeks (assuming an orderly transition of power) are condemning the Obama administration.

This isn't Israel vs. America - at least not yet. It's America and Israel vs. Obama and the UN.

[windjammer]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

You may have missed it, but 90% of Democrats not leaving office in three weeks (assuming an orderly transition of power) are condemning the Obama administration.

This isn't Israel vs. America - at least not yet. It's America and Israel vs. Obama and the UN.

This is not true.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

You may have missed it, but 90% of Democrats not leaving office in three weeks (assuming an orderly transition of power) are condemning the Obama administration.

This isn't Israel vs. America - at least not yet. It's America and Israel vs. Obama and the UN.

You might not realize what you're implying here, but you just said that Obama is a traitor to the United States because he didn't support Israel's settlements. You also implied the people of the United States now oppose Obama and every single nation in the world other than Israel.

Neither of those statements are remotely true.

That's not remotely what I said.

What I said was that Obama sided with the UN against Israel and the wishes of the vast majority of the American public.

That is objectively true.

Also, the resolution wasn't about settlements.

[ingemann]

I don't know why people are praising Obama for this. All this shows is that he is a coward that neither has the guts to stand up for Israel nor vote in favour of the resolution.

I agree all the legacy building Obama do right now are pretty embarrassing. That doesn't mean that he's wrong, but the fact that he haven't done this earlier, make this rather meaningless.

[ingemann]

Also the whole it's the Jew's country, the Palestinians aren't Arab immigrants, they're descendant of the population who have lived in the area since the agricultural revolution, whatever these people called themselves, they have of course had a influx of genes from other groups. But they're more related to the Jews of Biblical times than most Jews are.

In fact geneticist have use Palestinian-Jewish comparison to show that Ashkenazi Jews wasn't descendant of the Khazar (which are common anti-Israel propaganda), but was descendant of Levantine immigrants mixed with central Europeans.

[ingemann]

I don't know why people are praising Obama for this. All this shows is that he is a coward that neither has the guts to stand up for Israel nor vote in favour of the resolution.

I agree all the legacy building Obama do right now are pretty embarrassing. That doesn't mean that he's wrong, but the fact that he haven't done this earlier, make this rather meaningless.

I agree, if he wanted to do this, he should have done this years ago, but now he is doing it out of selfish spite and trying to undermine the incoming Administration. This is entirely out of line and Obama should really avoid doing anything like this during a transition period.

I also object to Obama manufacturing an international crisis during the Christmas Holidays as well as during Hanukah.

It's not a international crisis, it's just harsh word between lame duck administration and one of USA's client states.

[Tintrlvr]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

You may have missed it, but 90% of Democrats not leaving office in three weeks (assuming an orderly transition of power) are condemning the Obama administration.

This isn't Israel vs. America - at least not yet. It's America and Israel vs. Obama and the UN.

You might not realize what you're implying here, but you just said that Obama is a traitor to the United States because he didn't support Israel's settlements. You also implied the people of the United States now oppose Obama and every single nation in the world other than Israel.

Neither of those statements are remotely true.

That's not remotely what I said.

What I said was that Obama sided with the UN against Israel and the wishes of the vast majority of the American public.

That is objectively true.

Also, the resolution wasn't about settlements.

I doubt the vast majority of the American public is even aware that anything happened or has a view on UN resolutions relating to Israel generally.

And what was the resolution about if it wasn't about settlements??

Ultimately, of course, the settlements themselves aren't the problem (provided they are conducted legally, i.e. on Israeli government land or land properly purchased from Palestinian owners, which is true for most settlements). The Israeli government's separate treatment of the settlers from Palestinians is.

There are two reasonable ways where the settlements are acceptable: (i) You support a two-state solution, Palestine becomes a state, and the settlements become part of Palestine and the settlers citizens of Palestine or (ii) You support a one-state solution, Palestine becomes part of Israel (or perhaps a renamed Israel-Palestine), and the settlers and Palestinians alike become Israeli citizens with equal rights to other Israelis. The problem is that the Israeli government wants to have its cake and eat it, too, by denying citizenship to Palestinians (which they have motive to do given how large the Muslim minority in a unified Israel-Palestine would be) but also sabotaging Palestine as a viable separate state by claiming settlements, sometimes deep in the West Bank, as territory of Israel and containing Israeli citizens. Ultimately the settlements are peripheral to the central issue, that Israel wants to control the West Bank but not grant citizenship to the Palestinian people, which is utterly unacceptable from an international perspective. They have to choose one or the other.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

You may have missed it, but 90% of Democrats not leaving office in three weeks (assuming an orderly transition of power) are condemning the Obama administration.

This isn't Israel vs. America - at least not yet. It's America and Israel vs. Obama and the UN.

You might not realize what you're implying here, but you just said that Obama is a traitor to the United States because he didn't support Israel's settlements. You also implied the people of the United States now oppose Obama and every single nation in the world other than Israel.

Neither of those statements are remotely true.

That's not remotely what I said.

What I said was that Obama sided with the UN against Israel and the wishes of the vast majority of the American public.

That is objectively true.

Also, the resolution wasn't about settlements.

I doubt the vast majority of the American public is even aware that anything happened or has a view on UN resolutions relating to Israel generally.

And what was the resolution about if it wasn't about settlements??

Jerusalem, the capital of Israel.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

And the Palestinian Arabs are rightful residents of the area as well. There's no point in arguing with that. That's why roughly 2/3rds of Mandatory Palestine was carved out for them when it was partitioned, with the remaining third remaining in British hands until it was eventually ceded to the Jewish reclamation movement.

[ingemann]

And the Palestinian Arabs are rightful residents of the area as well. There's no point in arguing with that. That's why roughly 2/3rds of Mandatory Palestine was carved out for them when it was partitioned, with the remaining third remaining in British hands until it was eventually ceded to the Jewish reclamation movement.

In that case it's no problem if we move all the Israelis to Antarctican Peninsula, I mean it's much bigger than Israel.

Quality of the land count more than the amount of land.

[Tintrlvr]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

You may have missed it, but 90% of Democrats not leaving office in three weeks (assuming an orderly transition of power) are condemning the Obama administration.

This isn't Israel vs. America - at least not yet. It's America and Israel vs. Obama and the UN.

You might not realize what you're implying here, but you just said that Obama is a traitor to the United States because he didn't support Israel's settlements. You also implied the people of the United States now oppose Obama and every single nation in the world other than Israel.

Neither of those statements are remotely true.

That's not remotely what I said.

What I said was that Obama sided with the UN against Israel and the wishes of the vast majority of the American public.

That is objectively true.

Also, the resolution wasn't about settlements.

I doubt the vast majority of the American public is even aware that anything happened or has a view on UN resolutions relating to Israel generally.

And what was the resolution about if it wasn't about settlements??

Jerusalem, the capital of Israel.

East Jerusalem was mentioned, but not all of Jerusalem. All capital buildings are in West Jerusalem. In any case, the resolution is about "Israeli settlements", explicitly, and not East Jerusalem only.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

And the Palestinian Arabs are rightful residents of the area as well. There's no point in arguing with that. That's why roughly 2/3rds of Mandatory Palestine was carved out for them when it was partitioned, with the remaining third remaining in British hands until it was eventually ceded to the Jewish reclamation movement.

In that case it's no problem if we move all the Israelis to Antarctican Peninsula, I mean it's much bigger than Israel.

Quality of the land count more than the amount of land.

Neither parcel of land has significant natural reserves, at least Israel didn't until they spent decades on innovation.

Regardless, four wars of genocidal aggression and winding up with what you started with sounds pretty good to me. But as long as the Hashemites are able to keep their murderous grip on Jordan, the conflict is unresolveable.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

You may have missed it, but 90% of Democrats not leaving office in three weeks (assuming an orderly transition of power) are condemning the Obama administration.

This isn't Israel vs. America - at least not yet. It's America and Israel vs. Obama and the UN.

You might not realize what you're implying here, but you just said that Obama is a traitor to the United States because he didn't support Israel's settlements. You also implied the people of the United States now oppose Obama and every single nation in the world other than Israel.

Neither of those statements are remotely true.

That's not remotely what I said.

What I said was that Obama sided with the UN against Israel and the wishes of the vast majority of the American public.

That is objectively true.

Also, the resolution wasn't about settlements.

I doubt the vast majority of the American public is even aware that anything happened or has a view on UN resolutions relating to Israel generally.

And what was the resolution about if it wasn't about settlements??

Jerusalem, the capital of Israel.

East Jerusalem was mentioned, but not all of Jerusalem. All capital buildings are in West Jerusalem. In any case, the resolution is about "Israeli settlements", explicitly, and not East Jerusalem only.

It declares the Western Wall a settlement.

You should know that this is the ultimate poison pill that ends any conversations about peace for the next generation. The Obama administration did not seek to have this removed before choosing to support it. They want as bloody a fight as they can get.

[Tintrlvr]

The Israeli government doesn't seem to understand that politics is a pendulum. The Democrats will regain power (hell, they won more votes this year, imagine if Trump is hated how they'll do). Netanyahu openly allying Trump and the GOP is good for the short term, but horrific for Israel in the long term. They need the Democrats more. GOP support is a given, but they continually spit in the faces of Democrats who already feel alienated.

You may have missed it, but 90% of Democrats not leaving office in three weeks (assuming an orderly transition of power) are condemning the Obama administration.

This isn't Israel vs. America - at least not yet. It's America and Israel vs. Obama and the UN.

You might not realize what you're implying here, but you just said that Obama is a traitor to the United States because he didn't support Israel's settlements. You also implied the people of the United States now oppose Obama and every single nation in the world other than Israel.

Neither of those statements are remotely true.

That's not remotely what I said.

What I said was that Obama sided with the UN against Israel and the wishes of the vast majority of the American public.

That is objectively true.

Also, the resolution wasn't about settlements.

I doubt the vast majority of the American public is even aware that anything happened or has a view on UN resolutions relating to Israel generally.

And what was the resolution about if it wasn't about settlements??

Jerusalem, the capital of Israel.

East Jerusalem was mentioned, but not all of Jerusalem. All capital buildings are in West Jerusalem. In any case, the resolution is about "Israeli settlements", explicitly, and not East Jerusalem only.

It declares the Western Wall a settlement.

You should know that this is the ultimate poison pill that ends any conversations about peace for the next generation. The Obama administration did not seek to have this removed before choosing to support it. They want as bloody a fight as they can get.

There's no hope for a two-state solution anyway. Israel isn't interested and is actively sabotaging the process by continuing to support and build settlements (not talking about East Jerusalem). Moreover, the intransigence of Israel in not even considering allowing a potential Palestinian state to jointly consider East Jerusalem their capital is absurd and defiant of reasonable compromise. This is not to say Palestine is doing a better job of compromising, either, but the burden to compromise is on both sides.

It's a poison pill on both sides; why does Israel get to say it is a poison pill when Palestine demands East Jerusalem as solely its capital and its territory but Palestine does not get to claim it is a poison pill when Israel demands that East Jerusalem be considered only a part of Israel? They are equally unreasonable conversation ending positions if you're serious about two states.

(Of course, you don't have to be serious about two states; I think one state is the only viable solution at this point. But it is not popular.)

[ingemann]

And the Palestinian Arabs are rightful residents of the area as well. There's no point in arguing with that. That's why roughly 2/3rds of Mandatory Palestine was carved out for them when it was partitioned, with the remaining third remaining in British hands until it was eventually ceded to the Jewish reclamation movement.

In that case it's no problem if we move all the Israelis to Antarctican Peninsula, I mean it's much bigger than Israel.

Quality of the land count more than the amount of land.

Neither parcel of land has significant natural reserves, at least Israel didn't until they spent decades on innovation.

Regardless, four wars of genocidal aggression and winding up with what you started with sounds pretty good to me. But as long as the Hashemites are able to keep their murderous grip on Jordan, the conflict is unresolveable.

There was a reason that Cisjordan and not Transjordan was home to the strongest local states in the antic. That was that it was much more fertile. Israel was under the Ottomans two province, while Jodan was run from Damascus, thanks to the much larger population in Israel.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Also the whole it's the Jew's country, the Palestinians aren't Arab immigrants, they're descendant of the population who have lived in the area since the agricultural revolution, whatever these people called themselves, they have of course had a influx of genes from other groups. But they're more related to the Jews of Biblical times than most Jews are.

Good thing we don't customarily delineate cultural and political lines of descent based on genetics. Give me a break.

[Blue3]

Question...




which countries did vote AGAINST (not abstain) from this resolution?