The Next DNC Chair: TOM PEREZ WINS, makes Ellison deputy chair

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

Oh for Christ sake it's the chair Trumpbis freaking attacking our freedom of the press am covering up possible illegal Russian ties. There are big things going on

And we're never gonna get him out without a competent and ideologically correct Democratic party.

Unless you want us to spend our time writing thinkpieces wagging our fingers at Jason Chaffetz for not investigating Trump properly? I'm sure that will do *lots * of good.

[Xing]

It seems many Democrats can't discuss differences of opinion or vision for the future of the party without lots of insults. I guess this is yet another reason why we lose elections and can't have nice things.

I'm with Gass in that I supported Sanders and currently support Ellison, but even if Perez becoming chair represents a symbolic victory for the establishment, why is that the end of the world? It's not like Perez is a corporate centrist shill, and it's not like Senators like Sanders will become invisible. Change generally does come from the bottom up, and what's far more important that who becomes the chair of the DNC is who shows up to vote in 2017 and 2018.

I feel like the Bernie wing of the Democratic party has been fighting tooth and nail every step of the way just to have a voice at the table. It's as if the "old guard" of the DNC is resisting us every step of the way, while at the same time screaming in our faces to "suck it up and stay in line!" Why does the establishment need a symbolic victory? They got to nominate Hillary Clinton, and she lost to Donald Trump of all people. Electing Perez is just going further fracture the party and lead to more of the name calling that you seem to despise.

I keep hearing the canned "every one of these candidates would be a great DNC chair" line. But if we're going to be honest with ourselves we all know that isn't true. You can call the Bernie wing childish and unreasonable for wreaking havoc if Ellison isn't elected, but we all know it's going to happen if he loses. This makes Perez objectively a worse choice for party unity. So why not throw "Bernie bros" a symbolic bone and elect Ellison. Everyone seems to think he'll be a great DNC Chair, so what's the problem?

I have a feeling there is something more nefarious at work here.

I'm not saying that the establishment getting a symbolic victory would be a good thing, or that progressives wouldn't raise a fuss. I'm saying that there are bigger, more important battles, and that Perez might not end up being beholden to the establishment, and might still take the party in a more progressive direction.

I want Ellison to win, and I think it would definitely represent a change in course for the Democratic Party. But the fact is, many Democrats still don't see any reason to even throw a bone to the Bernie wing, since, as they put it, "Bernie lost in a landslide." Progressives have to participate and vote in droves to show the Democratic leaders that they're the future of the party, and can't be ignored.

[OneJ]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

I never said that progressives and the establishment were the same team. Stop putting words in my mouth and actually read. I stated that the Establishment should give Progressives a voice. I don't think they should rig either for anyone.

But "Progressives" like you aren't much better when you refuse cooperate. That's one of the reasons why Democrats have been losing elections.

You're delusional if you think "progressives refusing to cooperate" is why Democrats have been losing elections. It is incumbent upon the DNC to put up candidates who can win. And it's the DNC's sense of entitlement to our votes that has lost them elections.

Why can't you discuss your differences without calling me "delusional?"

Sorry, I can.

It's just that this thread has me a little worked up.

It's okay. I'm also quite angry that Democrats (Lefties period) can't get along. It definitely is like the 2016 Primary all over again.

To clarify, I didn't mean all Progressives. Just a minority that cause tension within the party. If it cheers you up, I prefer Ellison.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Oh for Christ sake it's the chair Trumpbis freaking attacking our freedom of the press am covering up possible illegal Russian ties. There are big things going on

And we're never gonna get him out without a competent and ideologically correct Democratic party.

Unless you want us to spend our time writing thinkpieces wagging our fingers at Jason Chaffetz for not investigating Trump properly? I'm sure that will do *lots * of good.

I agree I'm frustrated with both sides, Perez isn't bad/worth abandoning the Dems over but at the same time the establishment wing should of rallied behind Ellison and never bring Perez up

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

It's okay. I'm also quite angry that Democrats (Lefties period) can't get along. It definitely is like the 2016 Primary all over again.

To clarify, I didn't mean all Progressives. Just a minority that cause tension within the party.

If this is the Democratic primary again, maybe we should make the right choice this time?

I agree I'm frustrated with both sides, Perez isn't bad/worth abandoning the Dems over but at the same time the establishment wing should of rallied behind Ellison and never bring Perez up

He might not be worth abandoning the party over, but he *is * worth getting very mad over, and his election would significantly discourage me re: the future viability of the party.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

This is like the primary all over again.

This is gonna last until the Bernie wing eventually takes over the Party. It's gonna be a long 4-12 years.

They will eventually. But this kind of "dialogue" is toxic.

How bad is this compared to the Tea Party vs the establishment pubs back in 2009?

Good point

[Confused Democrat]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

I never said that progressives and the establishment were the same team. Stop putting words in my mouth and actually read. I stated that the Establishment should give Progressives a voice. I don't think they should rig either for anyone.

But "Progressives" like you aren't much better when you refuse cooperate. That's one of the reasons why Democrats have been losing elections.

You're delusional if you think "progressives refusing to cooperate" is why Democrats have been losing elections. It is incumbent upon the DNC to put up candidates who can win. And it's the DNC's sense of entitlement to our votes that has lost them elections.

Why can't you discuss your differences without calling me "delusional?"

Sorry, I can.

It's just that this thread has me a little worked up.

It's okay. I'm also quite angry that Democrats (Lefties period) can't get along. It definitely is like the 2016 Primary all over again.

To clarify, I didn't mean all Progressives. Just a minority that cause tension within the party. If it cheers you up, I prefer Ellison.

I don't think it's as small of a minority as you might think. If that were the case, we would be winning elections instead of losing them.

[Hindsight was 2020]

This is like the primary all over again.

This is gonna last until the Bernie wing eventually takes over the Party. It's gonna be a long 4-12 years.

They will eventually. But this kind of "dialogue" is toxic.

How bad is this compared to the Tea Party vs the establishment pubs back in 2009?

Good point

Not really RWers are shameless hypocrites who fall in line behind the (R). I can totally see left wingers voting third party in 2018 to protest Perez.

[ApatheticAustrian]

that's why we can't have nice things.

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

I never said that progressives and the establishment were the same team. Stop putting words in my mouth and actually read. I stated that the Establishment should give Progressives a voice. I don't think they should rig either for anyone.

But "Progressives" like you aren't much better when you refuse cooperate. That's one of the reasons why Democrats have been losing elections.

You're delusional if you think "progressives refusing to cooperate" is why Democrats have been losing elections. It is incumbent upon the DNC to put up candidates who can win. And it's the DNC's sense of entitlement to our votes that has lost them elections.

Why can't you discuss your differences without calling me "delusional?"

At this point it seems like a lost cause with them. Let them bitch and moan. Seems all they can do.

I very likely did a heck of a lot more to elect Democrats than you did this cycle. So let's relax with the evidence-free accusations, hmm?

[JerryArkansas]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

I never said that progressives and the establishment were the same team. Stop putting words in my mouth and actually read. I stated that the Establishment should give Progressives a voice. I don't think they should rig either for anyone.

But "Progressives" like you aren't much better when you refuse cooperate. That's one of the reasons why Democrats have been losing elections.

You're delusional if you think "progressives refusing to cooperate" is why Democrats have been losing elections. It is incumbent upon the DNC to put up candidates who can win. And it's the DNC's sense of entitlement to our votes that has lost them elections.

Why can't you discuss your differences without calling me "delusional?"

At this point it seems like a lost cause with them. Let them bitch and moan. Seems all they can do.

I very likely did a heck of a lot more to elect Democrats than you did this cycle. So let's relax with the evidence-free accusations, hmm?

What did I say earlier in the thread. If it isn't about you don't make it about you.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

I never said that progressives and the establishment were the same team. Stop putting words in my mouth and actually read. I stated that the Establishment should give Progressives a voice. I don't think they should rig either for anyone.

But "Progressives" like you aren't much better when you refuse cooperate. That's one of the reasons why Democrats have been losing elections.

You're delusional if you think "progressives refusing to cooperate" is why Democrats have been losing elections. It is incumbent upon the DNC to put up candidates who can win. And it's the DNC's sense of entitlement to our votes that has lost them elections.

Why can't you discuss your differences without calling me "delusional?"

At this point it seems like a lost cause with them. Let them bitch and moan. Seems all they can do.

I very likely did a heck of a lot more to elect Democrats than you did this cycle. So let's relax with the evidence-free accusations, hmm?

Can we all just start fresh and try to make this a civil, substantive, and respectful debate about who would do the best job as DNC Chair?  I think everyone (myself included) got a little too riled up.

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

I never said that progressives and the establishment were the same team. Stop putting words in my mouth and actually read. I stated that the Establishment should give Progressives a voice. I don't think they should rig either for anyone.

But "Progressives" like you aren't much better when you refuse cooperate. That's one of the reasons why Democrats have been losing elections.

You're delusional if you think "progressives refusing to cooperate" is why Democrats have been losing elections. It is incumbent upon the DNC to put up candidates who can win. And it's the DNC's sense of entitlement to our votes that has lost them elections.

Why can't you discuss your differences without calling me "delusional?"

At this point it seems like a lost cause with them. Let them bitch and moan. Seems all they can do.

I very likely did a heck of a lot more to elect Democrats than you did this cycle. So let's relax with the evidence-free accusations, hmm?

What did I say earlier in the thread. If it isn't about you don't make it about you.

It is about me. I'm a Bernie hack, as much as Confused Dem (okay not quite as much as Jfern, but whatever), as much as pretty much anyone on the board. If your complaints about us don't apply to one of us, that's because your complaint is inaccurate, not because you get to pick and choose among the "impudent children" in the party.

[Hindsight was 2020]

I do seriously have to admit when googling Keith's name an all the hate articles on him does freak me out, but on the same hand Google Perez an it's Bernie people saying they'll revolt if he wins. Rock an a hard place

[JerryArkansas]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

I never said that progressives and the establishment were the same team. Stop putting words in my mouth and actually read. I stated that the Establishment should give Progressives a voice. I don't think they should rig either for anyone.

But "Progressives" like you aren't much better when you refuse cooperate. That's one of the reasons why Democrats have been losing elections.

You're delusional if you think "progressives refusing to cooperate" is why Democrats have been losing elections. It is incumbent upon the DNC to put up candidates who can win. And it's the DNC's sense of entitlement to our votes that has lost them elections.

Why can't you discuss your differences without calling me "delusional?"

At this point it seems like a lost cause with them. Let them bitch and moan. Seems all they can do.

I very likely did a heck of a lot more to elect Democrats than you did this cycle. So let's relax with the evidence-free accusations, hmm?

What did I say earlier in the thread. If it isn't about you don't make it about you.

It is about me. I'm a Bernie hack, as much as Confused Dem (okay not quite as much as Jfern, but whatever), as much as pretty much anyone on the board. If your complaints about us don't apply to one of us, that's because your complaint is inaccurate, not because you get to pick and choose among the "impudent children" in the party.

No I talk about the children who will bitch and whine and quit the party because they don't get what they want. Not you, and not all Bernie supporters. So please stop making every damn criticism about you and Bernie people. It's not

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

This is totally ridiculous. Both of the Establishment wing and the Progressive wing need to realize that calling each other out will not form unity. It prolongs the chaos. We're already a "minority party" nationally and in most states.

Perez winning will definitely not be the end of the world. If you are a Sanders Loyalist, don't let it get to you and not participate in anything of Democrats. Sanders Loyalists are already attempting to take over parties in some places w/o the help of anyone.

The Establishment Wing needs to give space for Progressive Wingers a voice within the party. Admit it. We need something fresh in many states in which the GOP has taken advantage. We need to join forces, grow up, and win elections again.

*Also, the DNC race isn't the most important race right now. It's the federal and statewide races for the next couple of years to worry about.

The DNC rigged the primary and then tried to start a new cold war with Russia to distract people when they got busted. The idea that progressives and the 3rd way establishment are somehow on the same team is ridiculous.

We are on the same team. The Truck Fump Team.

My worry with the establishment Dems is that they may not be willing to fight our dictator wanna-be, or that they are so disconnected as to be completely unable to effectively do so.

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

No I talk about the children who will bitch and whine and quit the party because they don't get what they want. Not you, and not all Bernie supporters. So please stop making every damn criticism about you and Bernie people. It's not

I'm bitchin'. I'm whinin'. If there were any, any, ANY option otherwise I would have changed my registration to Independent on November 10th. If Perez wins tomorrow, my gf is likely actually going to change her registration.

It's about me. Or people close enough to my views to essentially make it about me. And we're not children. You centrists are.

[Dr. Arch]

This is like the primary all over again.

This is gonna last until the Bernie wing eventually takes over the Party. It's gonna be a long 4-12 years.

They will eventually. But this kind of "dialogue" is toxic.

How bad is this compared to the Tea Party vs the establishment pubs back in 2009?

I don't know. I wasn't politically-involved at the time.

[JerryArkansas]

No I talk about the children who will bitch and whine and quit the party because they don't get what they want. Not you, and not all Bernie supporters. So please stop making every damn criticism about you and Bernie people. It's not

I'm bitchin'. I'm whinin'. If there were any, any, ANY option otherwise I would have changed my registration to Independent on November 10th. If Perez wins tomorrow, my gf is likely actually going to change her registration.

It's about me. Or people close enough to my views to essentially make it about me. And we're not children. You centrists are.

Im not a centrist asshole.

So I guess the post was about you. Must be why you reacted so violently to it.  Go off. Be the child your post so clearly illustrates you are.

[RogueBeaver]

Perez claims the entire KY/MS/VI delegations.

[Confused Democrat]

Perez claims the entire KY/MS/VI delegations.

This is going to get real ugly real fast.

[Citizen (The) Doctor]

Wow, Ellison lost Iowa. That's really bad.

[Heisenberg]

What time does the voting begin tomorrow?

[Shameless Lefty Hack]

What time does the voting begin tomorrow?

10:00am eastern, according to a friend there.

[Chief Justice Keef]

Ellison apparently has received support from every voting member in Minnesota, Nebraska, Rhode Island, South Dakota, and Vermont, along with the majority of DNC voters from Texas and California.

Also, does anybody have a list of all the voting DNC members?