Liberals Ready to Abandon Abortion as an Issue

[Smash255]

I will always be pro-choice, and will do everything in my power to keep the party on that track.

That's fine. Just quit trying to pack the courts.

Pack the courts? We're the ones trying to pack the courts?

Putting people on the judiciary to legislate from the bench is definitely packing the courts.

You mean the same way that many in the GOP were whining about the court not getting involved & not legislating from the bench in the whole Schiavo matter

1. I never supported that.
2. The Congress passed a law... upholding it is not 'legislating from the bench'

They wound up passing the law because the courts refused to legislate from the bench

[A18]

No, they passed a law to provide a legal basis for federal review.

[Lincoln Republican]

Winfield, why don't you mind your own business?

I don't get all bent out of shape if you remove your spleen or some such part.

I beg your pardon?  My own business?

I, or anyone else, can express themselves on this issue, or any other as they see fit, thank you very much.

And your comparison of a "spleen or some such part" to a helpless infant is, to say the least, in extremely bad taste. 

The point is you are proposing interference in someone elses internal organs.  Talk about intrusive government!

Couldn't possibly have any bearing on you.

If you or anyone else whish to condone baby killing by disguising it as "choice", that's your own decision.  

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

[Smash255]

Winfield, why don't you mind your own business?

I don't get all bent out of shape if you remove your spleen or some such part.

I beg your pardon?  My own business?

I, or anyone else, can express themselves on this issue, or any other as they see fit, thank you very much.

And your comparison of a "spleen or some such part" to a helpless infant is, to say the least, in extremely bad taste. 

The point is you are proposing interference in someone elses internal organs.  Talk about intrusive government!

Couldn't possibly have any bearing on you.

If you or anyone else whish to condone baby killing by disguising it as "choice", that's your own decision. 

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

Something that can't live outside the womb is certaintly not a baby

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

If you or anyone else whish to condone baby killing by disguising it as "choice", that's your own decision. 

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

Oh, come on, Republicans don't really care about people after they're born.

[Blue Rectangle]

Something that can't live outside the womb is certaintly not a baby

And why not?  Is humanity defined by the ability to breathe on your own?

Oh, come on, Republicans don't really care about people after they're born.

For someone who has screamed "strawman!" more than once in the past couple weeks, you sure have a double standard.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Oh, come on, Republicans don't really care about people after they're born.

For someone who has screamed "strawman!" more than once in the past couple weeks, you sure have a double standard.

This doesn't sound like a Republican:

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

[TheresNoMoney]

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

The Republican party represents the antithesis of that statement.

[Emsworth]

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

With all due respect, that is not the job of the government.

[John Dibble]

Winfield, why don't you mind your own business?

I don't get all bent out of shape if you remove your spleen or some such part.

I beg your pardon?  My own business?

I, or anyone else, can express themselves on this issue, or any other as they see fit, thank you very much.

And your comparison of a "spleen or some such part" to a helpless infant is, to say the least, in extremely bad taste. 

The point is you are proposing interference in someone elses internal organs.  Talk about intrusive government!

Couldn't possibly have any bearing on you.

If you or anyone else whish to condone baby killing by disguising it as "choice", that's your own decision.  

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

Opebo is just trying to get a rise out of you, ignore him.

[Gabu]

I'm so glad I decided to just shut up about abortion.

[Rob]

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

As a libertarian, I disagree with that very liberal statement.

[Cashcow]

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

As a libertarian, I disagree with that very liberal statement.

It's been deformed into meaningless pro-life rhetoric. I wouldn't call it liberal anymore.

[Blue Rectangle]

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

The Republican party represents the antithesis of that statement.

So Republicans are anti-charity?  Here's a listing of charitable giving per capita by state:

Mississippi (highest charitable giving per capita)
Arkansas
Oklahoma
Louisiana
Alabama
Tennessee
South Dakota
Utah
South Carolina
Idaho
Wyoming
Texas
West Virginia
Nebraska
North Dakota
North Carolina
Kansas
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
Montana
Missouri
New Mexico
Alaska
Indiana
New York
Iowa
Ohio
California
Maryland
Illinois
Maine
Delaware
Washington
Vermont
Oregon
Hawaii
Virginia
Arizona
Nevada
Pennsylvania
Michigan
Colorado
Connecticut
Minnesota
Wisconsin
New Jersey
Rhode Island
Massachusetts
New Hampshire

The top 25 voted for Bush in 2004.  9 of the bottom 10 voted Kerry.

[TheresNoMoney]

That list is skewed because many southerners give 10% of their income to their church.

[bullmoose88]

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

The Republican party represents the antithesis of that statement.

So Republicans are anti-charity?  Here's a listing of charitable giving per capita by state:

Mississippi (highest charitable giving per capita)
Arkansas
Oklahoma
Louisiana
Alabama
Tennessee
South Dakota
Utah
South Carolina
Idaho
Wyoming
Texas
West Virginia
Nebraska
North Dakota
North Carolina
Kansas
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
Montana
Missouri
New Mexico
Alaska
Indiana
New York
Iowa
Ohio
California
Maryland
Illinois
Maine
Delaware
Washington
Vermont
Oregon
Hawaii
Virginia
Arizona
Nevada
Pennsylvania
Michigan
Colorado
Connecticut
Minnesota
Wisconsin
New Jersey
Rhode Island
Massachusetts
New Hampshire

The top 25 voted for Bush in 2004.  9 of the bottom 10 voted Kerry.

You know thats a terrible argument. You know it.

We need a list of individuals...because state citizens and voters aren't the borg.

[Gabu]

So Republicans are anti-charity?  Here's a listing of charitable giving per capita by state:

[snip]

The top 25 voted for Bush in 2004.  9 of the bottom 10 voted Kerry.

I would be interested to see actual absolute numbers instead of a comparative list, given that 3.0000000000001 > 3.

[Blue Rectangle]

That list is skewed because many southerners give 10% of their income to their church.

OK, but given that regular church attendees in the South vote overwhelmingly Republican, doesn't that proven that at least some Republicans are generous?

I would be interested to see actual absolute numbers instead of a comparative list, given that 3.0000000000001 > 3.

http://www.catalogueforphilanthropy.org
The spread is about 2:1, so we're not talking about small differences here.

You know thats a terrible argument. You know it.

We need a list of individuals...because state citizens and voters aren't the borg.

Scoonie was nice enough to confirm exactly who is doing the most giving, and yeah, they are Republicans.

[TheresNoMoney]

It proves they're generous to their church.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

The Republican party represents the antithesis of that statement.

So Republicans are anti-charity?  Here's a listing of charitable giving per capita by state:

Mississippi (highest charitable giving per capita)
Arkansas
Oklahoma
Louisiana
Alabama
Tennessee
South Dakota
Utah
South Carolina
Idaho
Wyoming
Texas
West Virginia
Nebraska
North Dakota
North Carolina
Kansas
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
Montana
Missouri
New Mexico
Alaska
Indiana
New York
Iowa
Ohio
California
Maryland
Illinois
Maine
Delaware
Washington
Vermont
Oregon
Hawaii
Virginia
Arizona
Nevada
Pennsylvania
Michigan
Colorado
Connecticut
Minnesota
Wisconsin
New Jersey
Rhode Island
Massachusetts
New Hampshire

The top 25 voted for Bush in 2004.  9 of the bottom 10 voted Kerry.

So? The Kerry states tend to send a lot more to the federal government than they get back.

[Rob]

It's been deformed into meaningless pro-life rhetoric. I wouldn't call it liberal anymore.

Yes, but it's ironic that he's using liberal rhetoric to argue his cause. When supposedly conservative Republicans sound like bleeding-heart leftists, there's something wrong.

[Blue Rectangle]

It proves they're generous to their church.

Hey, you know what?  You and jfern are the ones making the unsubstantiated and outrageous claim that Republicans are a bunch of cold-hearted misers.  Why don't you provide some evidence to back it up?

[Blue Rectangle]

So? The Kerry states tend to send a lot more to the federal government than they get back.

What does paying taxes and benefiting from federal spending have to do with charity?

[riceowl]

Money given to churches doesn't JUST go to the church though.  I just gave X amount to my church on Sunday, but I wrote on the envelope: "half to church, half to missions"

And those mission offerings go to a heck of a lot of charity.

[Speed of Sound]

The character and worth of a nation is determined by how they treat the most helpless and vulnerable in society.

The Republican party represents the antithesis of that statement.

So Republicans are anti-charity?  Here's a listing of charitable giving per capita by state:

Mississippi (highest charitable giving per capita)
Arkansas
Oklahoma
Louisiana
Alabama
Tennessee
South Dakota
Utah
South Carolina
Idaho
Wyoming
Texas
West Virginia
Nebraska
North Dakota
North Carolina
Kansas
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
Montana
Missouri
New Mexico
Alaska
Indiana
New York
Iowa
Ohio
California
Maryland
Illinois
Maine
Delaware
Washington
Vermont
Oregon
Hawaii
Virginia
Arizona
Nevada
Pennsylvania
Michigan
Colorado
Connecticut
Minnesota
Wisconsin
New Jersey
Rhode Island
Massachusetts
New Hampshire

The top 25 voted for Bush in 2004.  9 of the bottom 10 voted Kerry.

how is this known? is it done by tax write-offs or by polls, or some other way?