Opinion of RCP's No-Tossups Map
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  Opinion of RCP's No-Tossups Map
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Question: Opinion of RCP's No-Tossups Map
#1
Freedom Map
 
#2
Horrible Map
 
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Total Voters: 65

Author Topic: Opinion of RCP's No-Tossups Map  (Read 922 times)
AGA
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« on: October 04, 2016, 11:43:14 AM »

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elcorazon
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« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2016, 11:44:22 AM »

Freedom, but waiting for Ohio and Iowa to flip.
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Pessimistic Antineutrino
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« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2016, 11:46:35 AM »

That's my current prediction, so FM.
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Figueira
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« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2016, 11:48:13 AM »

Looks solid based on where the polls are currently.
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ProudModerate2
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« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2016, 11:53:30 AM »

I would be very happy with this map come Nov 8.
To embarrass trump further, it would be nice for Hillary to also take Ohio.
To completely bury trump, throw-in Iowa, ME-02 and NE-02.
To annihilate trump with a nuclear election bomb, also take Georgia and Arizona.
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Maxwell
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« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2016, 12:22:44 PM »

Pretty silly with ME-2, still. Otherwise, looks fine.
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Beefalow and the Consumer
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« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2016, 12:28:11 PM »

Freedom, but waiting for Ohio and Iowa to flip.
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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2016, 12:33:06 PM »

Pretty silly with ME-2, still. Otherwise, looks fine.

This.  Take out ME-2 and it's the most likely outcome (today).
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Eraserhead
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« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2016, 01:25:57 PM »

My map is exactly the same as this one, so it works for me.

Do we have any evidence yet to suggest that ME-2 has moved back to Clinton?
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BlueSwan
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« Reply #9 on: October 04, 2016, 01:28:38 PM »

The most sober map at the current point in time.
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Figueira
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« Reply #10 on: October 04, 2016, 01:32:04 PM »

Pretty silly with ME-2, still. Otherwise, looks fine.

I expect Clinton to win ME-2, but the RCP map is intentionally just based on polls.
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ursulahx
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« Reply #11 on: October 04, 2016, 02:40:27 PM »

Looks pretty good to me, even with ME-02 turning red (ie blue on the map).
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Xing
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« Reply #12 on: October 04, 2016, 02:43:20 PM »

Seems plausible. If Clinton wins by more like 5-6%, I'd expect at least two of IA, OH, and ME-02 to flip, but in a 3-4% win for her, this map could happen.
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ag
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« Reply #13 on: October 04, 2016, 02:57:17 PM »

Very plausible. And that fact alone is staggering: it is almost a generic D vs. R map from the last few elections.
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KingSweden
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« Reply #14 on: October 04, 2016, 04:17:00 PM »

The most sober map at the current point in time.
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Badger
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« Reply #15 on: October 04, 2016, 04:34:55 PM »

Looks solid based on where the polls are currently.
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Nyvin
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« Reply #16 on: October 04, 2016, 05:38:18 PM »

Very realistic.   I could see this being the outcome, give or take a few states here or there.
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AGA
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« Reply #17 on: October 04, 2016, 05:41:09 PM »

Freedom map. I would not be surprised if this were the outcome, and this probably is what would happen if the election were held today.
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Wisconsin+17
Ben Kenobi
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« Reply #18 on: October 04, 2016, 06:34:35 PM »

Seems pretty reasonable to me, aside from ME-02. Ohio should flip back pretty soon.

Now, will all you democrats stop panicking? Wink
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Figueira
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« Reply #19 on: October 04, 2016, 06:43:57 PM »

Seems pretty reasonable to me, aside from ME-02. Ohio should flip back pretty soon.

Now, will all you democrats stop panicking? Wink

Ohio would need more polls. Ohio is blue on 538 because Clinton's national lead would imply that.
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Maxwell
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« Reply #20 on: October 04, 2016, 06:55:53 PM »

The trend map would be cooler.
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Wisconsin+17
Ben Kenobi
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« Reply #21 on: October 04, 2016, 06:59:50 PM »

Well, right now I have it scored as 264-204 with 70 outstanding.

Trump's only path to victory is Nevada, Colorado, Florida, North Carolina and Arizona.

That's 5 tossups with 2 of them he's ahead, so say, 60/40 in AZ and 52/48 in North Carolina. Florida is 40/60, Nevada is 45-55, and Colorado is now 40-60. I put his winning chance down to about 3 percent.

Trump has never lead in the state aggregate poll, the closest he came is when he actually cracked the FRIEWALL, lead in Colorado and lost in Florida.

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LLR
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« Reply #22 on: October 04, 2016, 07:14:29 PM »

Seems pretty reasonable to me, aside from ME-02. Ohio should flip back pretty soon.

Now, will all you democrats stop panicking? Wink

ME-02 is completely reasonable, I think.

This map seems very accurate
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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #23 on: October 04, 2016, 07:30:03 PM »


Trump's only path to victory is Nevada, Colorado, Florida, North Carolina and Arizona.

That's 5 tossups with 2 of them he's ahead, so say, 60/40 in AZ and 52/48 in North Carolina. Florida is 40/60, Nevada is 45-55, and Colorado is now 40-60. I put his winning chance down to about 3 percent.



On the whole I like your analysis, but two things:

1. These aren't independent events.  I agree that Trump is the underdog in Colorado (if anything, I think your 40% is overly generous to him) -- but if he manages to win it, there would likely have been national movement such that his probability of winning the other states is considerably higher than shown.

2. There's an uncertainty factor that decreases as the election gets closer.  If these are the probabilities in those states on Nov. 7, then I agree that Trump's chances are minuscule.  But if they're the probabilities today, his chances are higher (10%? 15? 20?) because there's time for him to make up some ground.  Stuart Rothenberg once said, when someone asked him who would win if the election was today: "Nobody.  Because there is no election today."  This is worth keeping in mind.

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Wisconsin+17
Ben Kenobi
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« Reply #24 on: October 05, 2016, 02:06:48 AM »

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He's gotten it down to one state, up to about a maximum of about 1/3 when he was down a couple points in Florida and up in Colorado. 

The problem with multiple states is that you're assuming that if he improves in one state, that necessarily means that other states will improve too. Sure- it's a possibility, but what we've seen is that even with an improvement, he has to improve enough to flip a state. This is why we're better treating these as independent events.

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Granted. These are predictions, "if the election were held today, this would be his percentage chance of winning. You're quite right, that we have a month to go and things can change.

The problem, however, is that the election is narrowing. Undecideds are at about 8 percent, so any state with a differential greater than 8 is a state that's unwinnable for Trump. Granted, this doesn't include lots of states which are still winnable, but the second problem is the law of large numbers.

If I have a bin of 10, and I need 8 of those 10 to swing my way, I have a chance of winning.

If I have a bin of 100,000, and I need 80,000 to swing my way, this is much harder.

Consider the graph of Clinton minus Trump. If we take the Integral of the area under Hillary, this is the same as political momentum. Trump is vastly outweighted in political momentum over the course of a year's campaign. It's narrowed, certainly, but he's still behind and Clinton is adding to her momentum.

Trump has to not only stop her momentum - in accumulating decided voters but also has to flip the numbers and lead himself. Trump's major problem is that while he was on track to overcome her momentum temporarily, he is actually losing ground.

Personally, I think we're in for Romney II with Trump fading on the homestretch.
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