Longwood University Vice Presidential debate @ 9pm ET **live commentary thread**

[Mr. Morden]

The vice presidential debate is tonight at 9pm ET.  Venue is Longwood University in Farmville, VA.  Elaine Quijano is moderating.  More details here:

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/09/everything-you-need-to-know-about-2016-vice-presidential-debate-228886

Post your live commentary in this thread.

[Attorney General, Senator-Elect, & Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Go Kaine!

[ProudModerate2]

It should be interesting.
Ready or not ..... here it comes.

[PeteB]

The VP debate tonight is probably more important than a veep debate in a normal election year, so I figured we should have proposed strategies for both Pence and Kaine.  Let me start, with some thoughts:


Pence's proposed strategy

If I was advising Pence, I would suggest that he does NOT defend Trump. He should deflect those questions, take the initiative and present a conservative vision of America, throwing in Trump's red meat pieces (border security, jobs, lower taxes, etc.). He should also remind voters about Clinton's negatives and try and get a point across that "she has as many or more negatives and deficiencies as Trump". That would give Trump a chance (which he probably won't take ) to deliver a strong performance next week, and catch up with Clinton. If he has the opportunity, Pence should say something like this:

"Senator, your candidate Secretary Clinton, represents everything that is wrong with America today. I would actually consider voting for you, but not for her. None of us is perfect, including myself or Mr. Trump, but at least the Trump/Pence ticket offers change and the chance to make America great again."


Kaine's proposed strategy

If I was advising Kaine, I would suggests that he engages in shadow boxing (i.e. ignore Pence and go against the invisible opponent in the room - Trump). He should argue against Trump's vision, and tie any reasonable Pence arguments into Trump's unreasonable ones. If he has the opportunity, Kaine should say something like this:

"Governor, I disagree with you on a lot of issues, but I think that you are a capable leader who, in your own way, believe in some important values. Unfortunately you are not the Presidential candidate and Mr. Trump, who is, is NEITHER capable, nor does he subscribe to those values. I am sorry to say but there is only one option in this election and it is Secretary Clinton."‎

[PeteB]

Of course, if you are not a policy wonk, this is what you probably think of the VP debate:

[ApatheticAustrian]

i pray kaine doesn't bomb totally...he clearly is no biden and i guess he also doesn't have HRC's killer instinct.

the more boring the better for kaine i guess.

[MasterJedi]

Whether you agree with him or not Pence isn't Trump, he won't implode. I expect a draw or a tiny Kaine win.

[Illiniwek]

Whether you agree with him or not Pence isn't Trump, he won't implode. I expect a draw or a tiny Kaine win.

He won't implode, but I can't see him landing any on the jugular. But I agree, slight Kaine win, effectively a draw as needle will not move.

[PeteB]

i pray kaine doesn't bomb totally...he clearly is no biden and i guess he also doesn't have HRC's killer instinct.

the more boring the better for kaine i guess.

I actually think Kaine is a pretty capable speaker, but Pence may be a better debater, by virtue of his radio experience.  Realistically, Kaine has the easier job but also has more to lose. 

Clinton/Kaine is ahead right now, and Trump is perceved as unsuitable - Kaine has to demonstrate that Pence is just "Trump redux" to win - no easy feat.

Pence (if he takes my advice above ), and does not try to waste time explaining and justifying Trump's words, could  gain a lot, simply by showing up and having a decent debate.

I suspect that, if there was a choice, the Clinton Kaine team would take a draw and skip the debate.

[ursulahx]

One thing to bear in mind is that both of these men may currently be running for the 2020 general election, if you know what I mean.

[heatcharger]

Clinton/Kaine is ahead right now, and Trump is perceved as unsuitable - Kaine has to demonstrate that Pence is just "Trump redux" to win - no easy feat.

Kaine can bring up Pence's extremist views on Planned Parenthood and those religious freedom bills as well. Those aren't mainstream positions.

[Mr. Morden]

Kaine has to demonstrate that Pence is just "Trump redux" to win - no easy feat.

Not sure why that's necessary.  There's no need to attack Pence, since Trump's the one people care about.  I assume that Kaine will mostly attack Trump and Pence will mostly attack Clinton.  People don't usually vote on the basis of who the VP nominee is, so it seems like a waste of time for them to attack each other.

[PeteB]

Kaine has to demonstrate that Pence is just "Trump redux" to win - no easy feat.

Not sure why that's necessary.  There's no need to attack Pence, since Trump's the one people care about.  I assume that Kaine will mostly attack Trump and Pence will mostly attack Clinton.  People don't usually vote on the basis of who the VP nominee is, so it seems like a waste of time for them to attack each other.

It is not. If he keeps Pence on the defence, trying to explain Trump's positions, he will at least draw. Which was the preferred strategy I proposed fo him.

However, for the type of win Clinton had against Trump, he will have to get Pence to agree with Trump's crazier ideas.

[PeteB]

Clinton/Kaine is ahead right now, and Trump is perceved as unsuitable - Kaine has to demonstrate that Pence is just "Trump redux" to win - no easy feat.

Kaine can bring up Pence's extremist views on Planned Parenthood and those religious freedom bills as well. Those aren't mainstream positions.

He definitely could. But Pence may actually welcome that (for him it's probably a much easier argument to have, than Trump's taxes). 

[ag]

Clinton/Kaine is ahead right now, and Trump is perceved as unsuitable - Kaine has to demonstrate that Pence is just "Trump redux" to win - no easy feat.

Kaine can bring up Pence's extremist views on Planned Parenthood and those religious freedom bills as well. Those aren't mainstream positions.

He definitely could. But Pence may actually welcome that (for him it's probably a much easier argument to have, than Trump's taxes). 

Yep. Why have Pence talk about things he is comfortable saying? Keep him uncomfortable.

[Likely Voter]

Using Price is Right rules (closest without going over), what say you on how many minutes in does Kaine speak in Spanish.

I will go with 25 minutes.

Same with how many minutes in does it take Pence to compare Trump with Reagan. I will go with 15 minutes on that one.

[Wells]

Trump to live tweet VP debate.

He's going to say something stupid that will sink Pence.

[Crumpets]

Exclusive behind-the-scenes pictures of the candidates getting ready:

[Suburbia]

They're boring, safe candidates. My type sometimes. They may be "too white" in the age of BLM. But we'll see.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Kaine has to demonstrate that Pence is just "Trump redux" to win - no easy feat.

Not sure why that's necessary.  There's no need to attack Pence, since Trump's the one people care about.  I assume that Kaine will mostly attack Trump and Pence will mostly attack Clinton.  People don't usually vote on the basis of who the VP nominee is, so it seems like a waste of time for them to attack each other.

It is not. If he keeps Pence on the defence, trying to explain Trump's positions, he will at least draw. Which was the preferred strategy I proposed fo him.

However, for the type of win Clinton had against Trump, he will have to get Pence to agree with Trump's crazier ideas.

Getting Pence to publicly disagree with Trump's ideas could also be seen as a win.

[Rand]

Tim Kaine is a smart politician and I personally don't find him boring at all. He is quite affable, whereas Mike Pence is more reserved and far less charismatic--a model conservative. Plus Kaine doesn't swear on the campaign trail in front of children like Pence. Don't forget Kaine will be as prepared as Hillary was in the first presidential debate. The Clinton team are political vipers and if the first debate was any indicator, they will arm Tim Kaine with the same political venom that Hillary injected into the Trump campaign for this debate. Worst case scenario is a draw.

[Progressive]

What Kaine should do is bring up Pence's extreme, fringe positions on abortions, Planned Parenthood, LGBT rights, and promulgated the idea that between Trump's dangerous, unbalanced rhetoric on immigration and national security, and Pence's maniacal rhetoric on social issues, the two of them combined are the most dangerous presidential ticket in modern history

[rafta_rafta]

The GOP just declared Mike Pence as the clear winner hours before the debate

https://gop.com/who-won-the-vice-presidential-debate/

[Rand]

The GOP just declared Mike Pence as the clear winner hours before the debate

https://gop.com/who-won-the-vice-presidential-debate/

Quick, somebody call Trump--this needs tweeted ASAP.

[Devout Centrist]

The GOP just declared Mike Pence as the clear winner hours before the debate

https://gop.com/who-won-the-vice-presidential-debate/

That's embarrassing.