Can we all agree that Trumps nomination/rise has one positive outlook:
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  Can we all agree that Trumps nomination/rise has one positive outlook:
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Author Topic: Can we all agree that Trumps nomination/rise has one positive outlook:  (Read 1352 times)
Saint Milei
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« on: March 12, 2016, 03:50:22 PM »

The death of neoconservatism
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RR1997
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« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2016, 03:51:05 PM »

I disagree.
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Ronnie
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« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2016, 03:53:16 PM »
« Edited: March 12, 2016, 04:05:35 PM by Ronnie »

Yes, it took a devastating hit, and I have to admit that, even though I am terrified about the prospect of Trump winning the nomination, I can't help but look forward to Rubio losing his home state on Tuesday--assuming that happens.  I want to see a final stake plunged in the heart of that putrid ideology.
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RR1997
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« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2016, 03:54:34 PM »

You disagree with the death of neoconservatism or that this is a positive thing?

I disagree that it is a positive thing.
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RR1997
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« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2016, 03:55:56 PM »
« Edited: March 12, 2016, 03:57:43 PM by RR1997 »

I'd consider myself to be moderately neoconservative.

Neoconservatism is far preferable to paleoconservatism/right-wing populism.
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The Last Northerner
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« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2016, 03:56:25 PM »

Of course and the GOP establishment brought it upon themselves.
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#TheShadowyAbyss
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« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2016, 04:02:15 PM »

Neoconservatism has resulted in 2 failed wars, trillions of dollars down the drain and millions of innocents dead. I'm glad Trump is killing it even if I want him to drop off the face of the earth and will never vote for the man
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komodozer
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« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2016, 04:26:40 PM »

Trump wants to send 40,000 troops to the Middle East.

If that isn't "neoconservative" then I don't know what is.

Perhaps I don't understand the term.
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DavidB.
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« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2016, 04:28:14 PM »

Lol @ people thinking Trump is a foreign policy non-interventionist while he literally says he'd do anything to kill off ISIS.
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Kingpoleon
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« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2016, 04:31:20 PM »

The youth mob anti-neoconservatism is hilarious.
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RR1997
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« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2016, 04:32:07 PM »

Trump wants to send 40,000 troops to the Middle East.

If that isn't "neoconservative" then I don't know what is.

Perhaps I don't understand the term.

You don't understand term. By definition, neocons are globalists. They are pro-immigration and pro-free trade (Trump is the exact opposite of this). Neocons tend to also be socially liberal.

I agree that Trump doesn't have a non-interventionist foreign policy, despite what many Atlas posters try to tell you. His foreign policy plan is to "bomb ISIS and take their oil."
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Vosem
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« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2016, 04:35:05 PM »

I disagree that it would be a positive thing, but I also disagree that it's occurred at all. trump has spent large portions of the campaign pandering to neoconservatives.
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IceSpear
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« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2016, 04:45:40 PM »

Neoconservatism will never die. Remember when it was dead after Obama was elected? Then was dead again once non interventionism started becoming mainstream in the GOP, with Rand Paul becoming a major frontrunner? Then ISIS became a serious threat, and it was right back in style again.
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Indy Texas 🇺🇦🇵🇸
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« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2016, 04:54:46 PM »

Neoconservatism will never die. Remember when it was dead after Obama was elected? Then was dead again once non interventionism started becoming mainstream in the GOP, with Rand Paul becoming a major frontrunner? Then ISIS became a serious threat, and it was right back in style again.

ITT: People who don't really understand what neoconservatism is.

The fact that you support the invasion of a given country or an intervention in a given foreign conflict does not make you a neoconservative.

By that definition, Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman, Dwight Eisenhower, John F. Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon were all neoconservatives.
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Phony Moderate
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« Reply #14 on: March 12, 2016, 04:55:28 PM »

TRUMP's foreign policy is realist i.e. he advocates America acting in its own interest. Realism is not the same as neoconservatism as neocons are concerned with regime change and the spreading of democracy and capitalism. Leading realist academics such as John Mearsheimer opposed the Iraq War for that reason.
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« Reply #15 on: March 12, 2016, 04:56:17 PM »

No Hillary is a neo con
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« Reply #16 on: March 12, 2016, 05:22:32 PM »

Neocons are hypocritical and sanctimonious (there's a reason most of them used to be trots) but not as bad as TRUMPISM.
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« Reply #17 on: March 12, 2016, 05:25:07 PM »

Lol @ people thinking Trump is a foreign policy non-interventionist while he literally says he'd do anything to kill off ISIS.

Naturally he's not a non-interventionist. However I don't understand those who equate fighting ISIS with neoconservatism.
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IceSpear
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« Reply #18 on: March 12, 2016, 05:28:00 PM »

Neoconservatism will never die. Remember when it was dead after Obama was elected? Then was dead again once non interventionism started becoming mainstream in the GOP, with Rand Paul becoming a major frontrunner? Then ISIS became a serious threat, and it was right back in style again.

ITT: People who don't really understand what neoconservatism is.

The fact that you support the invasion of a given country or an intervention in a given foreign conflict does not make you a neoconservative.

By that definition, Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman, Dwight Eisenhower, John F. Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon were all neoconservatives.

Obviously just wanting to go after ISIS doesn't make you a neoconservative. But the rise of ISIS has emboldened neoconservatives and resurrected their worldview.
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Ljube
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« Reply #19 on: March 12, 2016, 05:32:01 PM »

Neoconservatism will never die. Remember when it was dead after Obama was elected? Then was dead again once non interventionism started becoming mainstream in the GOP, with Rand Paul becoming a major frontrunner? Then ISIS became a serious threat, and it was right back in style again.

ITT: People who don't really understand what neoconservatism is.

The fact that you support the invasion of a given country or an intervention in a given foreign conflict does not make you a neoconservative.

By that definition, Theodore Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman, Dwight Eisenhower, John F. Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon were all neoconservatives.

Obviously just wanting to go after ISIS doesn't make you a neoconservative. But the rise of ISIS has emboldened neoconservatives and resurrected their worldview.

Your Hillary is a typical neocon.
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Fuzzy Bear
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« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2016, 06:42:50 PM »

Neoconservatism has resulted in 2 failed wars, trillions of dollars down the drain and millions of innocents dead. I'm glad Trump is killing it even if I want him to drop off the face of the earth and will never vote for the man

What he said.
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Fuzzy Bear
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« Reply #21 on: March 12, 2016, 08:58:31 PM »

Interesting comments. And no, neoconservatism is not preferable to paleoconservatism

What he said.  With emphasis.
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Ronnie
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« Reply #22 on: March 12, 2016, 09:24:45 PM »

To complement this thread, I'll post a wonderful essay that Vox just put up:

http://www.vox.com/2016/3/10/11189350/twilight-of-the-neoconservatives
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Orser67
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« Reply #23 on: March 12, 2016, 09:36:32 PM »

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Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin
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« Reply #24 on: March 12, 2016, 09:36:42 PM »

Lol @ people thinking Trump is a foreign policy non-interventionist while he literally says he'd do anything to kill off ISIS.
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