EP elections 2014 - Results Thread

[minionofmidas]

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Non-satirical? Not exactly...

[Middle-aged Europe]

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Non-satirical? Not exactly...

Why not exactly? At best it's only mildly satirical.

The parts of this FB post which could be interpreted as satirical are the very first sentence and restating their goal of "Inhalte überwinden".

As for the first sentence which claims that they have received offers from those three groups to join them, I wouldn't rule out the possibility Sonneborn had some unofficial chats with people from these parties regarding a possible group membership. To my knowledge, it has at the very least been semi-seriously discussed within the Green ranks whether Sonneborn could eventually join their group. So, while the first sentence is probably an exaggeration, it's not entirely untrue either.

As for restating their goal of "Inhalte überwinden"... they put a smiley behind it, implying that they're not fully serious about that goal either anymore.

[minionofmidas]

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Non-satirical? Not exactly...

Why not exactly? At best it's only mildly satirical.

The parts of this FB post which could be interpreted as satirical are the very first sentence and restating their goal of "Inhalte überwinden".

As for the first sentence which claims that they have received offers from those three groups to join them, I wouldn't rule out the possibility Sonneborn had some unofficial chats with people from these parties regarding a possible group membership. To my knowledge, it has at the very least been semi-seriously discussed within the Green ranks whether Sonneborn could eventually join their group. So, while the first sentence is probably an exaggeration, it's not entirely untrue either.

As for restating their goal of "Inhalte überwinden"... they put a smiley behind it, implying that they're not fully serious about that goal either anymore.

While it's a much milder form of satire than the usual PARTEI style, really the one entirely serious note here is point 5 (oh, and the explanatory second sentence of point 7).

[Јas]

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http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/brian-crowley-rumoured-to-be-moving-to-new-group-in-eu-parliament-1.1841643

[Јas]

Things developed quite quickly it seems...

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http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0623/625874-fianna-fail-europe/

[Diouf]

Der Standard reports that Martin Schulz will officially put forward his candidature for President of the European Parliament tomorrow. The German government will propose Günther Oettinger for another term as EU Commissioner. This means that there seems to be a deal with EPP and S&D, on persons at least. It remains to be seen how hard Renzi and his allies will push for concessions on the budget rules. It sounds there like some kind of a compromise might be crafted which keeps the Stability and Growth Pact as it is, but allows for a more flexible interpretation of it. What that exactly means is hard to know, but perhaps it's some new way of calculating budget deficits or maybe just more time for France or Italy to keep their budget deficit below 3 %.

Juncker will probably be nominated on the EU summit Friday with a vote. Then the EP will vote on him after a few weeks, the 16 July has been mentioned. They can do it by a secret vote, but with all the talk in the election campaign of no more backroom deals, I think it will be appropriate with an open vote.

http://derstandard.at/2000002234595/CDU-nominierte-Oettinger-als-EU-Kommissar-aus-Deutschland

[Diouf]

Geert Wilders has announced that the EAF won't be able to create a group before the start of the new parliament. However, he says that he is still optimistic about a group being created later this year. He also states that they won't cooperate with Korwin-Mikke's KNP; he describes that as "een brug te ver" (a bridge too far).

Only a few weeks ago, the general secretary of the EAP was cited as saying that they had managed to form a group, but that was probably just a part of the spin war to convince the few small parties who was torn between EFD and EAF. Must admit that I'm impressed that Farage managed to form a group; it always looked the most difficult for the EFD. The Sweden Democrats' decision to join EFD instead of EAF was arguably the key moment.

http://www.refdag.nl/nieuws/politiek/wilders_vorming_van_eu_fractie_mislukt_1_836888?localLinksEnabled=false&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

[YL]

Things developed quite quickly it seems...

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http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0623/625874-fianna-fail-europe/

Crowley has had the FF whip removed over this move.

[ObserverIE]

Things developed quite quickly it seems...

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http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0623/625874-fianna-fail-europe/

Crowley has had the FF whip removed over this move.

Doing a solo run to ally with the Tories was "een brug te ver" for FF, for historical-cultural reasons as much as ideological ones.

The combination of economic centrism, social conservatism by European standards, and less than total enthusiasm for further European integration means that FF doesn't naturally fit into any of the EP groups.

[politicus]

Things developed quite quickly it seems...

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http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0623/625874-fianna-fail-europe/

Crowley has had the FF whip removed over this move.

Doing a solo run to ally with the Tories was "een brug te ver" for FF, for historical-cultural reasons as much as ideological ones.

The combination of economic centrism, social conservatism by European standards, and less than total enthusiasm for further European integration means that FF doesn't naturally fit into any of the EP groups.

Apart from immigration issues, this combo makes FF identical to the DPP, who are already in the group.

[EPG]

FF hates the idea of associating with those parties. Its identity is like the Canadian Liberals; it's the party that built the country; it doesn't identify with junior-partner agrarian or anti-immigrant parties.

[politicus]

FF hates the idea of associating with those parties. Its identity is like the Canadian Liberals; it's the party that built the country; it doesn't identify with junior-partner agrarian or anti-immigrant parties.

True, but one thing is self perception, another is reality.

[EPG]

Politics is all about these perceptions, the pacts between voters who identify with and respect politicians, and politicians who identify with and respect each other. As is clear from European Parliament groups, the details of policies matter very little at all.

[politicus]

Politics is all about these perceptions, the pacts between voters who identify with and respect politicians, and politicians who identify with and respect each other. As is clear from European Parliament groups, the details of policies matter very little at all.

Unnecessary lecture is unnecessary.

[EPG]

Politics is all about these perceptions, the pacts between voters who identify with and respect politicians, and politicians who identify with and respect each other. As is clear from European Parliament groups, the details of policies matter very little at all.

Unnecessary lecture is unnecessary.

That is not a very polite response.

I merely noted that self-perception does indeed matter in politics. It is, as you might say, reality.

[ObserverIE]

Things developed quite quickly it seems...

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http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0623/625874-fianna-fail-europe/

Crowley has had the FF whip removed over this move.

Doing a solo run to ally with the Tories was "een brug te ver" for FF, for historical-cultural reasons as much as ideological ones.

The combination of economic centrism, social conservatism by European standards, and less than total enthusiasm for further European integration means that FF doesn't naturally fit into any of the EP groups.

Apart from immigration issues, this combo makes FF identical to the DPP, who are already in the group.

But where the DFP is concerned, isn't "apart from immigration issues" a bit like "but apart from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?".

FF were actually stranded in the then UEN group with Alleanza Nazionale, the DFP and LNNK from Latvia between 2004 and 2009 after the Gaullists left, in spite of the best efforts of the national FF leadership who wanted to get into ALDE after the 2004 elections. It was Crowley and some of the other then-MEPs who wouldn't agree to the move because they quite liked being biggish fish in a small pond. By 2009, AN were also leaving and the conciliatory Ahern had been replaced as FF leader by the more abrasive Cowen. The result was that Crowley & Co were decanted, kicking and screaming all the way, into ALDE.

I would have thought a closer analogue for FF than DFP would be Keskusta in Finland (or Centerpartiet in Sweden before it declined into irrelevancy). Centrist but not especially "liberal". In addition there would be similarities to CiU, PNV, or even the SNP as "regional" nationalist movements.

[politicus]

But where the DFP is concerned, isn't "apart from immigration issues" a bit like "but apart from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?".

Originally yes, but increasingly less so - their present appeal is much broader and in many ways they are trying to fill the position FF traditionally had in Irish politics (not that I think they will succeed in this, its a tall order).

[ObserverIE]

But where the DFP is concerned, isn't "apart from immigration issues" a bit like "but apart from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?".

Originally yes, but increasingly less so - their present appeal is much broader and in many ways they are trying to fill the position FF traditionally had in Irish politics (not that I think they will succeed in this, its a tall order).

That would require them to swallow most of the SD vote and define themselves against Venstre/Conservatives (the FG analogue) rather than be allied with it. I don't see it either.

Parties here have kept well away from immigration issues up until now (even in the middle of a recession with sizeable out-migration of Irish citizens) and I don't see FF as being willing to go there.

[International Brotherhood of Bernard]

Off topic, but I'm confused wrt the Netherlands results - how did CDA get less votes than D66 but more seats? I thought this was PR, not some FPTP silliness...

[politicus]

But where the DFP is concerned, isn't "apart from immigration issues" a bit like "but apart from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?".

Originally yes, but increasingly less so - their present appeal is much broader and in many ways they are trying to fill the position FF traditionally had in Irish politics (not that I think they will succeed in this, its a tall order).

That would require them to swallow most of the SD vote and define themselves against Venstre/Conservatives (the FG analogue) rather than be allied with it. I don't see it either.

Parties here have kept well away from immigration issues up until now (even in the middle of a recession with sizeable out-migration of Irish citizens) and I don't see FF as being willing to go there.

The view of immigration is one of the differences between Danish and Irish society (the level of secularization, historical strength of the left wing and size of the welfare state being other important ones).

Still, the strategic goal of the DPP leadership is to become the broad, national party of Denmark by cutting into the Liberals lower middle class/working class support in provincial Denmark and reducing them to the party of the affluent middle class (=FG) and relegating SD to a much smaller party (=Irish Labour) by taking their remaining working class voters and reducing them to a party of public employees.

The means to do this is a nationalist, populist message, that's somewhat leftist without really being it, but just enough to represent "the little guy". Euroscepticism, "Danishness", family values and cultural Christianity are also important parts of the platform. Their basis is increasingly small town and rural Denmark, with a much lower support in the capital area.

So there are clear similarities, but of course such parallels ls should not be taking too far.

The DPP leadership has an SD-DPP alliance as a preferred option "when a new generation takes over" in SD. That would make the Liberals their main rivals.

Whether this is possible is of course a matter of opinion. Still, I think its fair to say that "FF with xenophobia" would be a good description of where they want to be.

[freek]

Off topic, but I'm confused wrt the Netherlands results - how did CDA get less votes than D66 but more seats? I thought this was PR, not some FPTP silliness...

CDA was in an electoral alliance with CU/SGP, or as Dutch electoral law calls it: "combination of lists". This means that initially CDA & CU/SGP are seen as 1 list, when seats are apportioned, using the D'Hondt method. CDA+CU/SGP had enough votes for 7 seats.
Then, there is a second division, where for alliances seats are apportioned for the separate lists. The largest remainder / Hare-Niemeyer method is used. For this, a new alliance quota is calculated.

The CDA+CU/SGP together had 1.086.609 votes and 7 seats, so the quota is  155.229,86
CDA had 721.766 votes. 721.766/quota = 4,65 seats
CU/SGP had 364.843 votes. 364.843/quota = 2,35 seats.

CDA has the largest remainder -> CDA 5 seats, CU/SGP 2 seats.

Something similar happened for PvdA, which had 3 seats because of its alliance with GroenLinks, while SP had more votes and 2 seats.

[Diouf]

The final results at the deadline for creating groups for the beginning of the new EP yesterday. Chairs/co-chairs of the groups have also been elected:

221 - EPP -  Manfred Weber (CSU)
191 - S&D - Temporarily Martin Schulz (SPD), will be Gianni Pittella (PD) once Schulz is EP prez
 70  - ECR  - Syed Kamall (Conservatives)
 67  - ALDE  - Guy Verhofstadt (Open VLD)
 52  - GUE-NGL - Gabriele Zimmer (Linke)
 50  - Greens/EFA - Philippe Lamberts (Ecolo) and Rebecca Harms (Grünen)
 48  - EFD  -  Nigel Farage (UKIP) and David Borrelli (M5S)
 52  - NI

[justfollowingtheelections]

Geert Wilders has announced that the EAF won't be able to create a group before the start of the new parliament. However, he says that he is still optimistic about a group being created later this year.

Is this possible?  I was under the impression that new groups could not be formed after the deadline (which is today if I am not mistaken).

[justfollowingtheelections]

There has always been emerging new groups and old collapsing especially before 2004. They can not get any comittee chairs until 25 years when the things are reorganized.

25 years? I have a feeling that's not what you meant to say.

I was referring to articles such as this one according to which they missed the deadline:
http://www.euractiv.com/video/europe-freedom-and-direct-democracy-farages-new-group-eu-parliament-50920

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I am just a little confused whether they can form a group at a later date or not.

[swl]

So Juncker it is. As Le Monde said: "The person who has as visceral opponents the British Eurosceptic David Cameron and the Hungarian ultra-nationalist Viktor Orban cannot be a bad guy."

I often disagree with them, but this time I think this article from Open Europe if worth reading for those who wonder what's next for the UK: http://www.openeurope.org.uk/Article/Page/en/LIVE?id=20306&page=FlashAnalysis#