Whe are some people so opposes to Private Schools?

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

Look, I'm a liberal, and yea, I pretty much do hate religion, but does the government have the right to tell parents what is best for their kids? Absolutely not.  And even though I can agree with you alot of the time opebo, calling religious parents tyranical (sp?) is going a little far.  Just as you and me think prevention of religion in our houses would be best, the conserative crowd probably feels just as strongly if not more that Christian or relgious values are essential in life.  Do I like it?  No, but if you are going to fight for individual freedom, like any true liberal does, you also have to remember you're fighting for the freedoms of everybody, not just those that agree with you.  We both want government off ours backs and stop telling us what's best.  If we stopped parents from doing things we don't like, aren't we just as bad?  Gotta take the good with the bad man. 

[Beet]

Right now, we have the free market is every major huge institution where it is practicable (few would argue for limiting police protection to those who can afford it, for example)...even in the military. The one big exception schools. We have a completely state-run system in schools. And it achieves nothing but one big interest group, and a ton of waste, inefficiency, and bureacratic momentum. The 18 year olds coming out of high schools today learn less in school than 18 year olds coming out 40 years ago. While virtually every other part of our society has improved in the last 40 years, the grade schools have deteriorated. In fact, grade school today is just one big playground where nothing serious is accomplished by the vast majority of people after the 9th grade. I'm simply convinced that students in public schools don't realize what they are missing.

I agree with a lot of what you're saying, but I think you're overblowing it a bit. I went to a public school, and it was a very good school - of course, there was also active involvement from the parents, and the school encouraged it. While I agree that private schools are often superior institutions, I argue that the two most important aspects in the educational process are how interested the parent is and how interested the student is(which often has a lot to do with the former). Parents who send their kids to private schools are much more likely to have an active interest, as opposed to public schools where you get a mixed bag. As to the second, I knew a guy who went to a very good private school for all but his last semester of high school - he was kicked out due to low grades, but he was more than smart enough to get an A in all his classes if he only applied himself. No matter what level of quality a school has, if the student isn't interested in learning it does no good. The opposite applies - an interested and determined student in a bad school can do very well(seen this happen, very smart engineering student I know at college was from a crappy high school), though would still likely do better in a better facility.

I don't think I was overblowing it but I wasn't saying that public school will necessarily lead to failure or private school will necessarily lead to success. I went to public school for all 13 years and my high school was a very good school. I had no problems with it, certainly no complaints, though admittedly it was one of the better ones in the area. But structurally there is a problem. From my experience at a state university it is clear that many of the people coming out of public schools today are not meeting their potential. Their potential is much, much higher than their level of intellectual development. That is the issue. For the more advanced students, you know they have learned more by getting around the system or from outside of school than they learned in regular classes. What we need is reform with far-reaching ends, not what we have now.

[7,052,770]

no, I hate private schools because all of them in Mississippi exist for one reason:  to keep out black people.  The racist people who go to them are so arrogant also.

Even if that statement was true, that does not reflect the nature of all private schools. You just hate the racist ones - prejudiced blanket statements will get you nowhere.

Tell me a private school (not counting parochial schools) in Mississippi that wasn't built during Integration to keep out blacks and I'll retract my statement.

Did you even read my post? I'll repeat it for you:

Even if that statement was true, that does not reflect the nature of all private schools. You just hate the racist ones - prejudiced blanket statements will get you nowhere.

If you hate racist private schools, I'm with you, but hating all private schools because of the actions of those in your state is dumb.

Did you read my posts?  I'm not familar with any non-racist private schools.  Now I haven't investigated the private schools outside of my state, but really...why should I?  Every private school I come in contact with is racist, and therefore I hate their existence.

[dazzleman]

Did you read my posts?  I'm not familar with any non-racist private schools.  Now I haven't investigated the private schools outside of my state, but really...why should I?  Every private school I come in contact with is racist, and therefore I hate their existence.

Then you should qualify your opinion to say you hate private schools that discriminate based on race.

I don't know of any private school near me that does discriminate based on race.  On the contrary, many make an effort to have an ethnically diverse student body.  In addition, in this section of the country, black parents who value education for their children very often choose private schools, even more than white parents, because blacks are much more likely than whites to live in areas with substandard public schools.

In the north, private schools, particularly parochial schools, are generally far more integrated than public schools.  It's an interesting contrast with the south.

[John Dibble]

no, I hate private schools because all of them in Mississippi exist for one reason:  to keep out black people.  The racist people who go to them are so arrogant also.

Even if that statement was true, that does not reflect the nature of all private schools. You just hate the racist ones - prejudiced blanket statements will get you nowhere.

Tell me a private school (not counting parochial schools) in Mississippi that wasn't built during Integration to keep out blacks and I'll retract my statement.

Did you even read my post? I'll repeat it for you:

Even if that statement was true, that does not reflect the nature of all private schools. You just hate the racist ones - prejudiced blanket statements will get you nowhere.

If you hate racist private schools, I'm with you, but hating all private schools because of the actions of those in your state is dumb.

Did you read my posts?  I'm not familar with any non-racist private schools.  Now I haven't investigated the private schools outside of my state, but really...why should I?  Every private school I come in contact with is racist, and therefore I hate their existence.

Yes, I did read your post. But if you had been paying attention to everyone else's posts on private schools, you'll note that racism isn't a big topic among them - even among the liberals. Why do you think that is? The obvious answer is most are not like that. Heck, all the ones around where I live are completely non-racist. You have to remember the culture in your state is NOT the same as the cultures in other states. Do you think private schools in a liberal state, like say California, would be racist?

[senatortombstone]

Opebo is a God-hater, that is why everything he says is so ridiculous.

I find it hard to hate something that doesn't exist.

How do I know that you exist, that you're a real person and not some Artificial-Unintelligent computer program posting stupid ideas and thoughts?  Because honestly If I had to pick from you being an AU or a real person, I'd pick the former.

Why? You have realized that a lot of people don't believe in God anymore?

A welfare reciepient is dependent on welfare because he's poor of wealth.

A fanatic is dependent on religion because he's poor of intelligence.

Another quote leading me to believe that you're an AU program.  Intelligence and religious beliefs have no correlation.

[opebo]

Look, I'm a liberal, and yea, I pretty much do hate religion, but does the government have the right to tell parents what is best for their kids? Absolutely not.  And even though I can agree with you alot of the time opebo, calling religious parents tyranical (sp?) is going a little far.  Just as you and me think prevention of religion in our houses would be best, the conserative crowd probably feels just as strongly if not more that Christian or relgious values are essential in life.  Do I like it?  No, but if you are going to fight for individual freedom, like any true liberal does, you also have to remember you're fighting for the freedoms of everybody, not just those that agree with you.  We both want government off ours backs and stop telling us what's best.  If we stopped parents from doing things we don't like, aren't we just as bad?  Gotta take the good with the bad man. 

I was only thinking of the children - the poor, defenseless children at the mercy of religious parents, indoctrinating them into their sick cults.  I don't know that individual rights and freedoms necessarily extend to the right to own/abuse your child.  Obviously at some point we must extend individual rights and freedoms to that child, at the expense of tyrannical parental power.

[dazzleman]

I was only thinking of the children - the poor, defenseless children at the mercy of religious parents, indoctrinating them into their sick cults.  I don't know that individual rights and freedoms necessarily extend to the right to own/abuse your child.  Obviously at some point we must extend individual rights and freedoms to that child, at the expense of tyrannical parental power.

I long ago discerned a very touching concern for children on your part.  I know how deeply interested you are in children having the proper family structure so that they can be raised properly.  It could be said to be your life's avocation.....

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I'm religious and I'm the main one here bitching about private schools.

That's not the issue at hand here people.

[A18]

You're not religious. You may believe in God, but certainly have no interest in Christian theology whatsoever.

[PBrunsel]

I'm religious

Could have fooled me.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I was wasting my time at church yesterday then.

[senatortombstone]

Look, I'm a liberal, and yea, I pretty much do hate religion, but does the government have the right to tell parents what is best for their kids? Absolutely not.  And even though I can agree with you alot of the time opebo, calling religious parents tyranical (sp?) is going a little far.  Just as you and me think prevention of religion in our houses would be best, the conserative crowd probably feels just as strongly if not more that Christian or relgious values are essential in life.  Do I like it?  No, but if you are going to fight for individual freedom, like any true liberal does, you also have to remember you're fighting for the freedoms of everybody, not just those that agree with you.  We both want government off ours backs and stop telling us what's best.  If we stopped parents from doing things we don't like, aren't we just as bad?  Gotta take the good with the bad man. 

I was only thinking of the children - the poor, defenseless children at the mercy of religious parents, indoctrinating them into their sick cults.  I don't know that individual rights and freedoms necessarily extend to the right to own/abuse your child.  Obviously at some point we must extend individual rights and freedoms to that child, at the expense of tyrannical parental power.

Secularism is the sickest cult of all. 

[John Dibble]

Look, I'm a liberal, and yea, I pretty much do hate religion, but does the government have the right to tell parents what is best for their kids? Absolutely not.  And even though I can agree with you alot of the time opebo, calling religious parents tyranical (sp?) is going a little far.  Just as you and me think prevention of religion in our houses would be best, the conserative crowd probably feels just as strongly if not more that Christian or relgious values are essential in life.  Do I like it?  No, but if you are going to fight for individual freedom, like any true liberal does, you also have to remember you're fighting for the freedoms of everybody, not just those that agree with you.  We both want government off ours backs and stop telling us what's best.  If we stopped parents from doing things we don't like, aren't we just as bad?  Gotta take the good with the bad man. 

I was only thinking of the children - the poor, defenseless children at the mercy of religious parents, indoctrinating them into their sick cults.  I don't know that individual rights and freedoms necessarily extend to the right to own/abuse your child.  Obviously at some point we must extend individual rights and freedoms to that child, at the expense of tyrannical parental power.

Secularism is the sickest cult of all. 

I'm secular. Do you think I'm sick?

Secularist aren't one big group, just as Christians aren't. There are many divergent opinions among both communities. For instance, opebo hates religion, but I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing. And if you think secularists are sick, do a little research on the End Timers cult of Lake City, FL - aka Meade Ministries - who are self-proclaimed Christians.

[phk]

Look, I'm a liberal, and yea, I pretty much do hate religion, but does the government have the right to tell parents what is best for their kids? Absolutely not.  And even though I can agree with you alot of the time opebo, calling religious parents tyranical (sp?) is going a little far.  Just as you and me think prevention of religion in our houses would be best, the conserative crowd probably feels just as strongly if not more that Christian or relgious values are essential in life.  Do I like it?  No, but if you are going to fight for individual freedom, like any true liberal does, you also have to remember you're fighting for the freedoms of everybody, not just those that agree with you.  We both want government off ours backs and stop telling us what's best.  If we stopped parents from doing things we don't like, aren't we just as bad?  Gotta take the good with the bad man. 

I was only thinking of the children - the poor, defenseless children at the mercy of religious parents, indoctrinating them into their sick cults.  I don't know that individual rights and freedoms necessarily extend to the right to own/abuse your child.  Obviously at some point we must extend individual rights and freedoms to that child, at the expense of tyrannical parental power.

Secularism is the sickest cult of all. 

When has anyone commited an atrocity or murder or some other crime in the name of Agnosticism? The answer is never.

The whole zealous faith over reason promotes such behavior. It is a small step from putting faith over science (such as believing it's even remotely feasible to have 2 of each species of animal on a wooden boat) to believing you are justified in murdering someone you believe to be a witch ("Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live") and so on.

Religion promotes self-justification over external science/reason and so many evil deeds begin with self-righteousness. I do not say Religion makes good people evil; I simply say that it is a wonderful garden for growing evil.

As far as we are all prone to imperfections. Bull. I will never use my humanity as an excuse for failing; and indeed I would love to see a murderer argue that, as a human, he was simply imperfect.

[opebo]

Secularism is the sickest cult of all. 

When has anyone commited an atrocity or murder or some other crime in the name of Agnosticism? The answer is never.

The whole zealous faith over reason promotes such behavior. It is a small step from putting faith over science (such as believing it's even remotely feasible to have 2 of each species of animal on a wooden boat) to believing you are justified in murdering someone you believe to be a witch ("Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live") and so on.

Religion promotes self-justification over external science/reason and so many evil deeds begin with self-righteousness. I do not say Religion makes good people evil; I simply say that it is a wonderful garden for growing evil.

As far as we are all prone to imperfections. Bull. I will never use my humanity as an excuse for failing; and indeed I would love to see a murderer argue that, as a human, he was simply imperfect.

Great post Marxist!  I could not agree more.  Religion is the source of nearly all the intolerance and misery in the world.

[senatortombstone]

Secularism is the sickest cult of all. 

When has anyone commited an atrocity or murder or some other crime in the name of Agnosticism? The answer is never.

The whole zealous faith over reason promotes such behavior. It is a small step from putting faith over science (such as believing it's even remotely feasible to have 2 of each species of animal on a wooden boat) to believing you are justified in murdering someone you believe to be a witch ("Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live") and so on.

Religion promotes self-justification over external science/reason and so many evil deeds begin with self-righteousness. I do not say Religion makes good people evil; I simply say that it is a wonderful garden for growing evil.

As far as we are all prone to imperfections. Bull. I will never use my humanity as an excuse for failing; and indeed I would love to see a murderer argue that, as a human, he was simply imperfect.

Great post Marxist!  I could not agree more.  Religion is the source of nearly all the intolerance and misery in the world.

I know it's the damn religion of dictators like Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Idi Amin, Hitler and so on.  Their belief in God has brought ruin uopon the world.

[PBrunsel]

I was wasting my time at church yesterday then.

I was kidding BRTD. I'm sure you are a religous person of sorts.

[senatortombstone]

Look, I'm a liberal, and yea, I pretty much do hate religion, but does the government have the right to tell parents what is best for their kids? Absolutely not.  And even though I can agree with you alot of the time opebo, calling religious parents tyranical (sp?) is going a little far.  Just as you and me think prevention of religion in our houses would be best, the conserative crowd probably feels just as strongly if not more that Christian or relgious values are essential in life.  Do I like it?  No, but if you are going to fight for individual freedom, like any true liberal does, you also have to remember you're fighting for the freedoms of everybody, not just those that agree with you.  We both want government off ours backs and stop telling us what's best.  If we stopped parents from doing things we don't like, aren't we just as bad?  Gotta take the good with the bad man. 

I was only thinking of the children - the poor, defenseless children at the mercy of religious parents, indoctrinating them into their sick cults.  I don't know that individual rights and freedoms necessarily extend to the right to own/abuse your child.  Obviously at some point we must extend individual rights and freedoms to that child, at the expense of tyrannical parental power.

Secularism is the sickest cult of all. 

When has anyone commited an atrocity or murder or some other crime in the name of Agnosticism? The answer is never.

The whole zealous faith over reason promotes such behavior. It is a small step from putting faith over science (such as believing it's even remotely feasible to have 2 of each species of animal on a wooden boat) to believing you are justified in murdering someone you believe to be a witch ("Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live") and so on.

Religion promotes self-justification over external science/reason and so many evil deeds begin with self-righteousness. I do not say Religion makes good people evil; I simply say that it is a wonderful garden for growing evil.

As far as we are all prone to imperfections. Bull. I will never use my humanity as an excuse for failing; and indeed I would love to see a murderer argue that, as a human, he was simply imperfect.

You obviously know nothing about true Christianity.  I'll give you a hint.  It is the emulation of Jesus' life on Earth.

[phk]

I could care less what every individual religion teaches or in better words, preaches.

[7,052,770]

no, I hate private schools because all of them in Mississippi exist for one reason:  to keep out black people.  The racist people who go to them are so arrogant also.

Even if that statement was true, that does not reflect the nature of all private schools. You just hate the racist ones - prejudiced blanket statements will get you nowhere.

Tell me a private school (not counting parochial schools) in Mississippi that wasn't built during Integration to keep out blacks and I'll retract my statement.

Did you even read my post? I'll repeat it for you:

Even if that statement was true, that does not reflect the nature of all private schools. You just hate the racist ones - prejudiced blanket statements will get you nowhere.

If you hate racist private schools, I'm with you, but hating all private schools because of the actions of those in your state is dumb.

Did you read my posts?  I'm not familar with any non-racist private schools.  Now I haven't investigated the private schools outside of my state, but really...why should I?  Every private school I come in contact with is racist, and therefore I hate their existence.

Yes, I did read your post. But if you had been paying attention to everyone else's posts on private schools, you'll note that racism isn't a big topic among them - even among the liberals. Why do you think that is? The obvious answer is most are not like that. Heck, all the ones around where I live are completely non-racist. You have to remember the culture in your state is NOT the same as the cultures in other states. Do you think private schools in a liberal state, like say California, would be racist?

I totally acknowledge that private schools in other states might be different.  But the question asked our individual opinions, and my opinion is based on my individual experience.  And I shouldn't be dragging this out and arguing over the point, it's just that I, along with my classmates (even the conservative ones), so utterly despise the private schools in Mississippi that I'll bash them any chance I get.

[John Dibble]

I totally acknowledge that private schools in other states might be different.  But the question asked our individual opinions, and my opinion is based on my individual experience.  And I shouldn't be dragging this out and arguing over the point, it's just that I, along with my classmates (even the conservative ones), so utterly despise the private schools in Mississippi that I'll bash them any chance I get.

Well, bash away at the Mississippi private schools, then. Just be sure to leave the decent ones out of your state out of your bashing.

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

Look, I'm a liberal, and yea, I pretty much do hate religion, but does the government have the right to tell parents what is best for their kids? Absolutely not.  And even though I can agree with you alot of the time opebo, calling religious parents tyranical (sp?) is going a little far.  Just as you and me think prevention of religion in our houses would be best, the conserative crowd probably feels just as strongly if not more that Christian or relgious values are essential in life.  Do I like it?  No, but if you are going to fight for individual freedom, like any true liberal does, you also have to remember you're fighting for the freedoms of everybody, not just those that agree with you.  We both want government off ours backs and stop telling us what's best.  If we stopped parents from doing things we don't like, aren't we just as bad?  Gotta take the good with the bad man. 

I was only thinking of the children - the poor, defenseless children at the mercy of religious parents, indoctrinating them into their sick cults.  I don't know that individual rights and freedoms necessarily extend to the right to own/abuse your child.  Obviously at some point we must extend individual rights and freedoms to that child, at the expense of tyrannical parental power.

I can definetely see what you're saying, but I think law has to be limited to physical harm.  I to THINK religion can be a form of mental harm and destructive mind conditioning, but a another group can think Howard Stern is harming people for expressing his free speech.  Should he be arrested?   

I understand your problems with Christianity, I have them to, but as a right now, they're really not hurting anybody.  Yea, the gays are still 2nd-class citizens thanks to them, but that can and will be gone with time.  Until there's another Crusade, which I doubt, I think you should just cool it with the Christians for now.  It's they're leaders and preachers like Falwell that should feel the brunt of that anger. 

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I was wasting my time at church yesterday then.

I was kidding BRTD. I'm sure you are a religous person of sorts.

I was talking to Philip

[A18]

Less a sign that you've been converted to Christianity than that your church has been converted to paganism.