Shots fired: PRC calls out USA for judging others while ignoring own problems

[Bacon King]

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/china/2014-02/28/c_133150579.htm

Issues raised in the White Paper:

• increases in violent crime, especially mass shootings
• NSA Surveillance problems and other issues with law enforcement
• widespread use of solitary confinement and high incarceration rate
• high unemployment and widespread homelessness
• widespread labor abuses in agriculture
• drone strikes causing civilian deaths
• not ratifying core UN human rights conventions: Convention on Rights of the Child, Convention on Rights of the Disabled, etc.
• Political power coalescing into the hands of wealthy elites
• erosion of labor union authority and leverage
• widespread racial discrimination in the criminal justice system
• systematic gender discrimination in employment opportunities
• neglect of children in privatized foster care systems
• sexual assault rampant throughout the armed forces
• child laborers working in unsafe conditions in the agriculture industry
• torture of foreign terrorism suspects in secret extraterritorial prisons

Thoughts? Are these problems not as bad as they sound? Can we criticize human rights abuses abroad without being hypocritical? Is our inaction on these issues limiting our foreign policy?

[Famous Mortimer]

Ad hominem attack.

[Franzl]

They're right, but it's pretty rich coming from the PRC of all places.

[Antonio the Sixth]

The US is still a better place to live in than any of the countries it has called out.

[Gustaf]

Lots of different issues to keep apart.

1. A criticism of a policy isn't invalidated by the critic having flaws.

2. China can't say the US can't criticize others due to their flaws since they are worse themselves and are doing just that with this white paper.

3. There is, imo, a big difference with problems in a society (say racial tensions or gender norms) and government abuses. Many problems don't have easy fixes.

4. THat being said, some of this is perfectly legit, and, yes, the US should clean up its act on stuff like surveillance or Gitmo.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

The US is still a better place to live in than any of the countries it has called out.

Which means?

Anyway, while the US obviously has a better human rights situation than China there's obviously a host of human rights abuses in America.

[Nhoj]

"increases in violent crime, especially mass shootings" is objectively false save for maybe the mass shooting part.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

The US is still a better place to live in than any of the countries it has called out.

1. Doesn't necessarily disprove valid criticism when applicable
2. Your transformation into Mr. More Catholic than the Pope is becoming quite annoying

[Antonio the Sixth]

The US is still a better place to live in than any of the countries it has called out.

1. Doesn't necessarily disprove valid criticism when applicable
2. Your transformation into Mr. More Catholic than the Pope is becoming quite annoying

1. Sure, valid criticism is fine. However, I don't see why the US should not be able to "judge others by ignoring its own problems" if said problems are less big than those the US is talking about. Or put another way, I'm fine with the US calling out Afghanistan or North Korea - not with them calling out Sweden or New Zealand.

2. What the hell is that supposed to mean?

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

The US is still a better place to live in than any of the countries it has called out.

1. Doesn't necessarily disprove valid criticism when applicable
2. Your transformation into Mr. More Catholic than the Pope is becoming quite annoying

1. Sure, valid criticism is fine. However, I don't see why the US should not be able to "judge others by ignoring its own problems" if said problems are less big than those the US is talking about. Or put another way, I'm fine with the US calling out Afghanistan or North Korea - not with them calling out Sweden or New Zealand.

OK, I'm glad to hear it. But I hope you'd agree that U.S. calling other countries out would carry more weight without tons of hypocrisy on American side.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Figuring this our shall be your home assignment

[Antonio the Sixth]

The US is still a better place to live in than any of the countries it has called out.

1. Doesn't necessarily disprove valid criticism when applicable
2. Your transformation into Mr. More Catholic than the Pope is becoming quite annoying

1. Sure, valid criticism is fine. However, I don't see why the US should not be able to "judge others by ignoring its own problems" if said problems are less big than those the US is talking about. Or put another way, I'm fine with the US calling out Afghanistan or North Korea - not with them calling out Sweden or New Zealand.

OK, I'm glad to hear it. But I hope you'd agree that U.S. calling other countries out would carry more weight without tons of hypocrisy on American side.

I don't really see glaring hypocrisy, tbh. I mean there is a good deal of hypocrisy for sure, but all countries do it to some extent. Sure, Guantanamo is an absolute disgrace and NSA is pretty awful, but this stuff doesn't in any way measure up to what goes on in Russia, China and those other brave spearheads of the struggle against the Evil American Empire. I do think Americans should open themselves up a lot more to foreign criticism... but certainly not from this sort of countries.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Figuring this our shall be your home assignment [/quote]

I would do it if I didn't have actual home assignments to worry about. Anyway, if you have substantiated criticism of my posting style I'd be happy to discuss it.

[Oakvale]

I didn't know China was an orange avatar'd Atlas poster.

[bullmoose88]

I didn't know China was an orange avatar'd Atlas poster.

Bing!

I agree with Gustaf and Antonio.

[IceSpear]

I didn't know China was an orange avatar'd Atlas poster.

[Storebought]

There is a name for this type of argument: "And you are lynching Negroes".

The Soviets used to end every dispute with the US during the 50s and 60s with it, to devastating effect in the decolonizing world.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

There is a name for this type of argument: "And you are lynching Negroes".

The Soviets used to end every dispute with the US during the 50s and 60s with it, to devastating effect in the decolonizing world.

Which is why it was motivating factor among many elite US institutions (like the State Department) to abolish segregation. However, this time around such cajoling is unlikely to have such an effect, especially as large numbers of the US elite seem to be remarkably uninterested on what the rest of the world thinks of them, although this is much better under Obama than his predecessor.

[Simfan34]

I didn't know China was an orange avatar'd Atlas poster.

Bing!

I agree with Gustaf and Antonio.

I like it!

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

There are some legitimate points if you ignore the fact that this is a country with a 7,6 Freedom House rating that decided to troll.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

There are some legitimate points if you ignore the fact that this is a country with a 7,6 Freedom House rating that decided to troll.

>freedom house

[Oakvale]

There are some legitimate points if you ignore the fact that this is a country with a 7,6 Freedom House rating that decided to troll.

>freedom house

...?

[MaxQue]

There are some legitimate points if you ignore the fact that this is a country with a 7,6 Freedom House rating that decided to troll.

>freedom house

...?

Well, it was good before, but, now, they have a clear neoliberal lean, especially with their "economical liberty" index, where not being economically liberal is bad.

[Oakvale]

There are some legitimate points if you ignore the fact that this is a country with a 7,6 Freedom House rating that decided to troll.

>freedom house

...?

Well, it was good before, but, now, they have a clear neoliberal lean, especially with their "economical liberty" index, where not being economically liberal is bad.

As far as I'm aware Freedom House actually reduces 'freedom' rankings for such  leftist inventions as restrictions on trade union activity, so I don't know why the Trotley Crue want to throw around the n-word for no reason. I'm also not exactly sure why economic freedom should be considered less important than other measures, considering the strong correlation between economic and... all other freedoms but okay.