Is the police force too powerful?

[ElectionsGuy]

Yes, undoubtedly. I think until we actually emphasize and care about the 4th amendment and put restrictions on what they can do, we're going to keep hearing these awful stories about police brutality in the USGD and IGD. Dismantling the unions behind the police would also help, since then they would actually be held accountable and in jail, not collecting their pay checks while being fired instead of thrown in jail or at least fined.

[bedstuy]

I would say yes.  But...

I don't think I buy the argument about unions.  If there's a problem with the CBA that makes it difficult to punish police officers for civil rights violations, crimes and tortious acts, fix the CBA.  Police officers still deserve to be paid decent wages and benefits.  If you paid police officers like rent-a-cops you would get more problems because the quality of the labor force would be lower. 

On the civil rights issue, that's certainly a problem in some instances.  But, it's tough to make any reasonable argument at that level of generality.  What specific policies and doctrines should we change? 

Finally, it's easy for a suburban teenager to decry the police overreaching, because you don't have to deal with crime on a regular basis.  Public safety is actually extremely valuable, but you can easily undervalue it until you're the victim of a crime. 

[DemPGH]

Yes, but not because of the unions. Police officers get suspended, fired, etc. all the time.

The problem is that the Supreme Court has given police too much leeway and too much benefit of the doubt.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

At the very least the fascist pigs among them should be prosecuted instead of getting away with shooting innocent black kids.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Lean Yes. My best friends dad is a cop in the neighboring city, and my grandfather was in the NYPD back in the fifties, so I am "pro-police", though the Boynton Police Force has proven itself to be hideously inept; during Hurricane Wilma, a homeless man actually broke into our garage for shelter, and the cops not only refused to take him to a public hurricane shelter, but lectured my dad for not sheltering the strange man. They also angrily lectured my brother for calling the police after a man pulled a gun on him when our dog was attacked by his.

[I Will Not Be Wrong]

Yes, undoubtedly. I think until we actually emphasize and care about the 4th amendment and put restrictions on what they can do, we're going to keep hearing these awful stories about police brutality in the USGD and IGD. Dismantling the unions behind the police would also help, since then they would actually be held accountable and in jail, not collecting their pay checks while being fired instead of thrown in jail or at least fined.

Very well said.

[dead0man]

While I agree 100% that "bad cops" should be punished harsher than they are now (like MUCH harsher....people in positions of power should be held to a MUCH higher standard than regular Joe...and if they commit a crime while abusing that position of power, they should certainly never have any authority again, should probably spend their life in prison and maybe they need to die), I don't see the cops having too much power. 

What power(s) would you be taking away from them?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

While I agree 100% that "bad cops" should be punished harsher than they are now (like MUCH harsher....people in positions of power should be held to a MUCH higher standard than regular Joe...and if they commit a crime while abusing that position of power, they should certainly never have any authority again, should probably spend their life in prison and maybe they need to die), I don't see the cops having too much power. 

What power(s) would you be taking away from them?

Stop and frisk. The most obvious. Only an issue in one city, but that's also the largest in the country, so not moot.

And the protections against entrapment in the US are far weaker than in most countries.

[dead0man]

WHOA slow down Batman!  I didn't know it was that bad.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Huh?

[dead0man]

If that's all you got, then clearly the police in this country isn't all that bad.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Just for starters. It's late anyway and I'm thinking of other stuff.

Here's an actually good example from a New York Express thread for once: http://nypost.com/2014/02/21/cops-hit-my-car-then-arrested-me-to-cover-it-up-suit

[dead0man]

I'll agree that the NYPD sucks ass, that stop and frisk is wrong and bad cops (like the ones in your link) should be punished, harshly.  But that doesn't, at least in my opinion, show that all American cops have too much power.

[ingemann]

Yes, undoubtedly. I think until we actually emphasize and care about the 4th amendment and put restrictions on what they can do, we're going to keep hearing these awful stories about police brutality in the USGD and IGD. Dismantling the unions behind the police would also help, since then they would actually be held accountable and in jail, not collecting their pay checks while being fired instead of thrown in jail or at least fined.

Raah raah Unions.

American police may and may not have their problem, but weaken their negotiation position will not help.

[Ban my account ffs!]

The justice system and our police forces need major reforms and a change in attitude.

Many local police forces are visible members of their local communities.  If we refocused their efforts to being peace officers and backed them up with a plethora of tools from the welfare state to help people they catch screwing up... they could actually be a positive force in the community.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Duh.

[Randy Bobandy]

How is this even a question? The answer is obviously yes.

[Person Man]

Yes, but not because of the unions. Police officers get suspended, fired, etc. all the time.

The problem is that the Supreme Court has given police too much leeway and too much benefit of the doubt.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Here's another example for dead0man: https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=181984.0

[Mordecai]

Yes, but not for the reasons the OP thinks.

[dead0man]

Here's another example for dead0man: https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=181984.0

Again, bad cops should be punished.  What "power" would you take away from cops to prevent this?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

From that very thread:

This is kind of unbelievable.  There must be some information missing here.  What doctor is going to force someone to take medicine, go under general anesthesia and get a colonoscopy without their consent?  In what world would a colonoscopy be necessary to check someone's rectum for drugs?

Unfortunately, the believable aspect to this is that the police can arrest you for almost anything and strip search you as part of booking.  That's Constitutionally fine apparently.  This is a bridge too far.

[dead0man]

The police CAN'T arrest you for almost anything.  Can they make sh**t up?  Of course, but like I've said at least 3 times now, BAD COPS SHOULD BE PUNISHED HARSHLY.  Do you want to take their ability to arrest people away?  Do you want to take away the power to search people before putting them in a cell with other humans?  Of course not, so what do you want to take away, their ablity to arrest people for any excuse they can think of?  They can't do that now.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

The problem is that even the cops who aren't "bad cops" who do stuff like this will stand by and tolerate or defend those who do, see about how just about every police organization in the country spoke in support of the pigs who beat up Rodney King.

Also look at all those police organizations and sheriff's associations that were lobbying against legalizing marijuana in Colorado and Washington. They were basically unanimously opposed. So doesn't exactly disprove that almost all cops are assholes if they're all going to rally against pot like that.

[Sasquatch]

Obviously.