Chattanooga VW workers reject UAW, 53-47%

[TNF]

This sort of makes me wonder if the next major Republican policy push would be against unions instead of social security or health care. I could easily see this becoming something that could be a winner for Republicans in 2017 if they don't get in too over their heads like Clinton did with healthcare and Obama almost did with health care. Perhaps it would be something between a National Right to Work Law or a law that will allow states to no longer have unions recognized in their states.

Unions are much too popular nationwide for this to be a winning issue.

The reason the union lost this time was that Corker and others threatened them.

They're so popular than union busters Rick Snyder, Scott Walker, and John Kasich are all favored for re-election in bluish/purplish states.

This is a shame, but no surprise. These days, even the Republican cashiers at McDonald's are just temporarily embarrassed millionaires, so they see no irony in hating unions.

That sounds like a punk rock group, the "Temporarily Embarrassed Millionaires".  Like I said, if union busting made big inroads in the rust belt, it will probably be front in center in 2017, depending on how 2016 goes.

If Rick Snyder is re-elected in Michigan of all places, I think that will mark the end of unions being an effective political force in this country. Walker surviving the recall was the canary in the coal mine, if Snyder wins, it will be the fat lady singing.

And yeah, I could definitely see nationwide RTW being on top of the Republican agenda if they win the presidency. Luckily that's pretty unlikely.

You know unions were considered dead in the water in the 1920s, right? That was before the largest explosion in union membership in this nation's history. There are so many things going on right now for labor, so many new possibilities, etc. that I wouldn't be surprised if the next decade saw a similar explosion. The fast food workers are organizing. The retail workers are organizing. One vote going the wrong way in Chattanooga (as a result of political interference, no less) won't stop the onward march of working people in this country.

[Person Man]

This sort of makes me wonder if the next major Republican policy push would be against unions instead of social security or health care. I could easily see this becoming something that could be a winner for Republicans in 2017 if they don't get in too over their heads like Clinton did with healthcare and Obama almost did with health care. Perhaps it would be something between a National Right to Work Law or a law that will allow states to no longer have unions recognized in their states.

Unions are much too popular nationwide for this to be a winning issue.

The reason the union lost this time was that Corker and others threatened them.

They're so popular than union busters Rick Snyder, Scott Walker, and John Kasich are all favored for re-election in bluish/purplish states.

This is a shame, but no surprise. These days, even the Republican cashiers at McDonald's are just temporarily embarrassed millionaires, so they see no irony in hating unions.

That sounds like a punk rock group, the "Temporarily Embarrassed Millionaires".  Like I said, if union busting made big inroads in the rust belt, it will probably be front in center in 2017, depending on how 2016 goes.

If Rick Snyder is re-elected in Michigan of all places, I think that will mark the end of unions being an effective political force in this country. Walker surviving the recall was the canary in the coal mine, if Snyder wins, it will be the fat lady singing.

And yeah, I could definitely see nationwide RTW being on top of the Republican agenda if they win the presidency. Luckily that's pretty unlikely.

You know unions were considered dead in the water in the 1920s, right? That was before the largest explosion in union membership in this nation's history. There are so many things going on right now for labor, so many new possibilities, etc. that I wouldn't be surprised if the next decade saw a similar explosion. The fast food workers are organizing. The retail workers are organizing. One vote going the wrong way in Chattanooga (as a result of political interference, no less) won't stop the onward march of working people in this country.

We'll see. But the union rate was the same then as now and unions were technically illegal until 1935 (many bosses fired union members, put restraining orders on strikers and so forth) and also the catalyst that created made the labor movement big for 40 years  was a massive depression. It could simply be that conservatives and their understudies simply haven't caused the loss of confidence in the liberal market to cause unionization. Unions were in the shadows for over a hundred years in this country before the NRLA and it was tough and they created militias and even assassinated politicians to survive persecution.

[IceSpear]

This sort of makes me wonder if the next major Republican policy push would be against unions instead of social security or health care. I could easily see this becoming something that could be a winner for Republicans in 2017 if they don't get in too over their heads like Clinton did with healthcare and Obama almost did with health care. Perhaps it would be something between a National Right to Work Law or a law that will allow states to no longer have unions recognized in their states.

Unions are much too popular nationwide for this to be a winning issue.

The reason the union lost this time was that Corker and others threatened them.

They're so popular than union busters Rick Snyder, Scott Walker, and John Kasich are all favored for re-election in bluish/purplish states.

This is a shame, but no surprise. These days, even the Republican cashiers at McDonald's are just temporarily embarrassed millionaires, so they see no irony in hating unions.

That sounds like a punk rock group, the "Temporarily Embarrassed Millionaires".  Like I said, if union busting made big inroads in the rust belt, it will probably be front in center in 2017, depending on how 2016 goes.

If Rick Snyder is re-elected in Michigan of all places, I think that will mark the end of unions being an effective political force in this country. Walker surviving the recall was the canary in the coal mine, if Snyder wins, it will be the fat lady singing.

And yeah, I could definitely see nationwide RTW being on top of the Republican agenda if they win the presidency. Luckily that's pretty unlikely.

You know unions were considered dead in the water in the 1920s, right? That was before the largest explosion in union membership in this nation's history. There are so many things going on right now for labor, so many new possibilities, etc. that I wouldn't be surprised if the next decade saw a similar explosion. The fast food workers are organizing. The retail workers are organizing. One vote going the wrong way in Chattanooga (as a result of political interference, no less) won't stop the onward march of working people in this country.

This vote makes no difference, you're right. The far more consequential issue is union busters not only surviving but thriving in areas of the country where being anti-union used to be the third rail of politics. Michigan is in the top 3 most heavily unionized states in the country, yet Rick Snyder has a positive approval rating and is currently winning in the polls, despite LYING about not supporting RTW and forcing it through virtually overnight with a lame duck Republican legislature. The goldfish-like attention span of the modern American worker will prove to be their undoing.

In addition, the Republicans seem to have convinced a substantial portion of former/would-be union supporters that unions are evil. I'm guessing because "well, if them republycans are Godly and Holy on abortion and homo marriage, they must be right about unions too!". Because of this, there's not much room for a full scale union revival.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

Occupy made unions cool again. I have noticed in some polls that younger voters are much more likely to support pro-union policies.

[Badger]

Occupy made unions cool again. I have noticed in some polls that younger voters are much more likely to support pro-union policies.

Oh holy God on high..... It actually believes it's spew.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Occupy made unions cool again. I have noticed in some polls that younger voters are much more likely to support pro-union policies.

Oh holy God on high..... It actually believes it's spew.

I don't think that Bandit believes it is spew, tho it certainly believes its spew.

[Linus Van Pelt]

I still remember when I read the data in business school 40 years ago, that Unions outside monopolies and oligopolies did not increase wages, because I was just amazed, but then realized that is what economic theory dictates - it was at once to me elegant, and true, that that had to be the case.

This is not what the data show.

Here (pdf) is a paper by economists David Blanchflower and Alex Bryson using data from the Current Population Survey that finds a union wage premium across a variety of areas; I've given the chart below. As you can see, the largest difference was in construction. Their literature review at the beginning of the paper suggests that others have found the same, and that the main disagreements are over the extent of the difference. It also appears to have been larger 40 years ago than it is now.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

The construction unions serve not only to give their members a say, but they generally provide employers with a labor pool certified to be skilled at their task.  That function is likely why the construction unions are able to command a premium.

[Person Man]

The construction unions serve not only to give their members a say, but they generally provide employers with a labor pool certified to be skilled at their task.  That function is likely why the construction unions are able to command a premium.

The main thing about unions is that you can ensure and retain quality and professionalism by being able to incentivize competent workers for going to Business School and staying on the floor. I am guessing networks (globalization) and computers (mechanization) have a lot of trades that depend on people staying and doing a good job obsolete. The only jobs that are not in themselves professional and managerial now are service jobs.

The problem with them has been that employers and customers have been tolerant of just low paid service workers doing a half assed job. It would be interesting to see what happens in the next couple of decades. Will they organize and provide a better product that people are willing to pay for? Will they in turn be replaced a new wave of inexpensive robots with enough AI? Will there be no problems with the current status quo of very little asked for and very little given?

[Indy Texas]

The construction unions serve not only to give their members a say, but they generally provide employers with a labor pool certified to be skilled at their task.  That function is likely why the construction unions are able to command a premium.

The main thing about unions is that you can ensure and retain quality and professionalism by being able to incentivize competent workers for going to Business School and staying on the floor. I am guessing networks (globalization) and computers (mechanization) have a lot of trades that depend on people staying and doing a good job obsolete. The only jobs that are not in themselves professional and managerial now are service jobs.

The problem with them has been that employers and customers have been tolerant of just low paid service workers doing a half assed job. It would be interesting to see what happens in the next couple of decades. Will they organize and provide a better product that people are willing to pay for? Will they in turn be replaced a new wave of inexpensive robots with enough AI? Will there be no problems with the current status quo of very little asked for and very little given?

You could argue that the reason service jobs are that way is because consumers don't demand any better. Most of the services we "consume" are fleeting, perfunctory encounters. Sure, the cashier at Wal-Mart may be slow and not know where items are and the lines may be long, but people put up with that for 15 minutes so they can pay less for the TV that they'll use hours a day for years. As long as the TV works as it should, there's nothing else to complain about.

I recently did some reorganizing at home and bought a lot of shelving and boxes at The Container Store. The staff were helpful and eager to answer my questions, had a lot of ideas and knew a lot about the products. Because they're relatively well paid, they can afford to buy the products their store sells and can offer advice based on their own experiences with the products. I was really taken aback by how much personal investment and pride they seemed to have in their work. They weren't people who were getting paid $8 an hour, were going to work there a few months and then move on to somewhere else that paid $8 an hour.

But the difference between the Container Store employee and the Wal-Mart employee is also one of expertise. Even if the Wal-Mart employee were paid more, I really don't need advice on buying shampoo and soda. There's nothing complex about that in the way there is about knowing what shelves will fit, what the dimensions are and how well they'll hold up over time and what kind of screws and nails to use to install them.

So, at risk of deviating into Tom Friedman territory, if you want to get paid more than $8 an hour, you need to offer something "extra." There's not a lot of "extra" involved in simply standing at a register, scanning items and swiping the customer's credit card.

[Comrade Funk]

VW should build more factories in the North.

[The Dowager Mod]

Haha hope this is true!

[pbrower2a]

The construction unions serve not only to give their members a say, but they generally provide employers with a labor pool certified to be skilled at their task.  That function is likely why the construction unions are able to command a premium.

If you want a project built on time and not over budget, then you need skilled construction workers who are more precise in their work and less likely to have accidents that stop work.

[Franzl]

Haha hope this is true!

The German media is also reporting that.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

This sort of makes me wonder if the next major Republican policy push would be against unions instead of social security or health care. I could easily see this becoming something that could be a winner for Republicans in 2017 if they don't get in too over their heads like Clinton did with healthcare and Obama almost did with health care. Perhaps it would be something between a National Right to Work Law or a law that will allow states to no longer have unions recognized in their states.

Unions are much too popular nationwide for this to be a winning issue.

The reason the union lost this time was that Corker and others threatened them.

They're so popular than union busters Rick Snyder, Scott Walker, and John Kasich are all favored for re-election in bluish/purplish states.

This is a shame, but no surprise. These days, even the Republican cashiers at McDonald's are just temporarily embarrassed millionaires, so they see no irony in hating unions.

Actually Kasich largely failed whenever he tried to pass union-busting legislation.  During a good chunk of 2011, he was tying Rick Scott for most unpopular Governor in the country due to SB 5 (boy was I proud to be an Ohioan the day we killed that horrible piece of legislation ).  Walker's actions sparked a recall election (albeit one that he won) and Snyder's popularity definitely took a hit due to his right to low wages law.

[IceSpear]

This sort of makes me wonder if the next major Republican policy push would be against unions instead of social security or health care. I could easily see this becoming something that could be a winner for Republicans in 2017 if they don't get in too over their heads like Clinton did with healthcare and Obama almost did with health care. Perhaps it would be something between a National Right to Work Law or a law that will allow states to no longer have unions recognized in their states.

Unions are much too popular nationwide for this to be a winning issue.

The reason the union lost this time was that Corker and others threatened them.

They're so popular than union busters Rick Snyder, Scott Walker, and John Kasich are all favored for re-election in bluish/purplish states.

This is a shame, but no surprise. These days, even the Republican cashiers at McDonald's are just temporarily embarrassed millionaires, so they see no irony in hating unions.

Actually Kasich largely failed whenever he tried to pass union-busting legislation.  During a good chunk of 2011, he was tying Rick Scott for most unpopular Governor in the country due to SB 5 (boy was I proud to be an Ohioan the day we killed that horrible piece of legislation ).  Walker's actions sparked a recall election (albeit one that he won) and Snyder's popularity definitely took a hit due to his right to low wages law.

Yeah, they were hurt short term, but due to the goldfish attention spans of the public, they've all recovered since then, and are favored in their respective races. Decades ago, they would've all been complete lame ducks by now if they tried that crap.

[ingemann]

Haha hope this is true!

If I remember correctly one of the reason (the other was angry unions at home) that VW tried to push unions, was because they was completely unable to keep the good workers, because of the lousy work place "climate", which harmed their product quality, and put their brand value at risk.  Setting up the union was an attempt to improve this by getting input from the workers. So this vote may result in them leaving the South. Of course before people become to happy about this, it just mean that they expand the production in Mexico, which have been able to deliver an acceptable quality in the products.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

I thought Germany had a law that says German-based corporations must have labor representatives on their corporate boards. I thought that was why Volkswagen was more open to unionization.

[ingemann]

I thought Germany had a law that says German-based corporations must have labor representatives on their corporate boards. I thought that was why Volkswagen was more open to unionization.

Honestly I'm not enough into German law to know that, but even if they have, it doesn't necessary mean that they have to have that abroad.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

This sort of makes me wonder if the next major Republican policy push would be against unions instead of social security or health care. I could easily see this becoming something that could be a winner for Republicans in 2017 if they don't get in too over their heads like Clinton did with healthcare and Obama almost did with health care. Perhaps it would be something between a National Right to Work Law or a law that will allow states to no longer have unions recognized in their states.

Unions are much too popular nationwide for this to be a winning issue.

The reason the union lost this time was that Corker and others threatened them.

They're so popular than union busters Rick Snyder, Scott Walker, and John Kasich are all favored for re-election in bluish/purplish states.

This is a shame, but no surprise. These days, even the Republican cashiers at McDonald's are just temporarily embarrassed millionaires, so they see no irony in hating unions.

Actually Kasich largely failed whenever he tried to pass union-busting legislation.  During a good chunk of 2011, he was tying Rick Scott for most unpopular Governor in the country due to SB 5 (boy was I proud to be an Ohioan the day we killed that horrible piece of legislation ).  Walker's actions sparked a recall election (albeit one that he won) and Snyder's popularity definitely took a hit due to his right to low wages law.

Yeah, they were hurt short term, but due to the goldfish attention spans of the public, they've all recovered since then, and are favored in their respective races. Decades ago, they would've all been complete lame ducks by now if they tried that crap.

Kasich should be demolishing a candidate even half as weak as Fitzgerald (sorry Adam ), the reason that it has stayed a four or five point race is because a lot of people here do remember SB 5.

[MalaspinaGold]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/21/uaw-election-tennessee_n_4833270.html?utm_hp_ref=politics&ir=Politics
UAW to appeal to NLRB for a new election, citing threats by Republicans.

Here's hoping they win.

[krazen1211]

If at first you don't succeed, vote and vote again! They need dues to spread liberal propaganda. No wonder they lost.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

If you truly believe that was why they lost, you are even less in touch with reality than your previous posts have made you appear to be.

[krazen1211]

Turns out that democracy wins the day and those unions have been routed!

[Zioneer]

Turns out that democracy wins the day and those unions have been routed!

You are the most ridiculous person on this board since opebo was banned.