West German federal election, 1949

[Lief 🗽]

Are we running through the elections as they happened or as we voted [them to happen].

As we vote.  The SPD is certain to become the largest party at this point.  I'm waiting to see a tie-breaking vote between the Union and the FDP.

Excellent news.

C'mon leftists; we can't have Schumacher die before he has any chance of power.

Kind of surprised at how well KPD is doing. I know there's a couple commies on the board, but who are the others? It's not like SPD has gone 3rd way on you guys yet

Yeah but the communists also haven't gone Hungary 1956 yet. Also KPD is more interesting for alternate history story reasons than SPD.

Though if I had realized I could change my vote I would have switched to DP so they could get above the threshold. Hopefully they win a constituency seat so they get their seats.

[Peter the Lefty]

Are we running through the elections as they happened or as we voted [them to happen].

As we vote.  The SPD is certain to become the largest party at this point.  I'm waiting to see a tie-breaking vote between the Union and the FDP.

Excellent news.

C'mon leftists; we can't have Schumacher die before he has any chance of power.

Kind of surprised at how well KPD is doing. I know there's a couple commies on the board, but who are the others? It's not like SPD has gone 3rd way on you guys yet

Yeah but the communists also haven't gone Hungary 1956 yet. Also KPD is more interesting for alternate history story reasons than SPD.

Though if I had realized I could change my vote I would have switched to DP so they could get above the threshold. Hopefully they win a constituency seat so they get their seats.

Actually, in 1949, you only needed to cross the threshold in at least one state to be given federal representation.  And the DP has in every state where it's on the ballot.

[Leftbehind]

Are we running through the elections as they happened or as we voted [them to happen].

As we vote.  The SPD is certain to become the largest party at this point.  I'm waiting to see a tie-breaking vote between the Union and the FDP.

Excellent news.

C'mon leftists; we can't have Schumacher die before he has any chance of power.

Kind of surprised at how well KPD is doing. I know there's a couple commies on the board, but who are the others? It's not like SPD has gone 3rd way on you guys yet

Well I wasn't so much as dissuading those from voting KPD as encouraging other leftists to vote. I'll probably be voting KPD when SPD aren't offering as attractive a platform.

[freefair]

CDU, enthusiastically.

This. The CDU dominance of Germany ensured the development of a healthy social market economy rather than falling into the nationalization trap like the Brits did, leading to a massive neoliberal backlash [1] under Thatcher.

[1] It is true Germany like other countries was affected by neoliberalism during its high tide in the 1990s and 2000s but it was far milder than most and at this point the CDU has fully abandoned it on a domestic level.

This, really. The UK swung between being to far too left wing and a little to right wing, whereas Germany found the golden mean and largely stuck to it, maybe shifted a little to the right in the last 20 years.

[minionofmidas]

Hilarious results thus far.  Might I just reiterate one more time that the FDP has tons of unrepentant ex-Nazis in it?

This surprises me.  It doesn't seem to me like the FDP platform would provide a natural home for ex-Nazis, is there any particular reason for this?

It doesn't? How much do you know about traditional German political cleavages, exactly? Nowt or next to nowt?

Just checking where I'd need to begin.

[traininthedistance]

Hilarious results thus far.  Might I just reiterate one more time that the FDP has tons of unrepentant ex-Nazis in it?

This surprises me.  It doesn't seem to me like the FDP platform would provide a natural home for ex-Nazis, is there any particular reason for this?

It doesn't? How much do you know about traditional German political cleavages, exactly? Nowt or next to nowt?

Just checking where I'd need to begin.

Less than I thought I did, apparently? 

[freefair]

If the actual election had gone this way, I feel Germany, infact all global geopolitics and economics would probably be totally screwed-up by now (well, much worse than it is already).
That's not an anti SPD comment btw(I find they're a pretty reasonable, decent progressive party), more an pro Social Market Economy, pro-NATO, pro-EU one these being the things that made the federal republic prosperous, free and secure.

[Peter the Lefty]

Hilarious results thus far.  Might I just reiterate one more time that the FDP has tons of unrepentant ex-Nazis in it?

This surprises me.  It doesn't seem to me like the FDP platform would provide a natural home for ex-Nazis, is there any particular reason for this?

It doesn't? How much do you know about traditional German political cleavages, exactly? Nowt or next to nowt?

Just checking where I'd need to begin.

Less than I thought I did, apparently? 

It is ironic, but the FDP was eager to have a "representative democracy," which meant re-integrating–er, "nationalist elements" into the political scene. 

[Lief 🗽]

"Libertarian" parties are often fronts for right-wing nationalists. See for example the great proportion of neo-Confederate Paul supporters.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

The issue is that the pre-1930s German liberal parties - one of which was in any case highly conservative - were part of the same electoral camp (i.e. not Socialist, not Catholic) as the Nazis. And that's where their voters stampeded to after the Depression hit. So, fast forward to the late 1940s and there's a new party in the German Liberal tradition, and it is part of a new party system that is a) being carefully watched over by the Allied Powers and b) dominated by the SPD and the Zentrum (even if it had been desectarianised and rechristened as the CDU). Given that, it's only natural that many ex-Nazis found the FDP to be a rather congenial option, all things considered.

[minionofmidas]

"Libertarian" parties are often fronts for right-wing nationalists. See for example the great proportion of neo-Confederate Paul supporters.

The FDP didn't have a "Libertarian" platform back then. It had a Liberal (and thus sort of Libertarian) minority wing and a Nationalist majority wing.

Yeah but the communists also haven't gone Hungary 1956 yet. Also KPD is more interesting for alternate history story reasons than SPD.

The relevant German issue equivalent (as far as 'soft' Commie support goes) is the Berlin Blockade. The 1949 election was after the Berlin blockade. Hence (rl) results well below those of the first round of state elections and the first two rounds of local elections (most states held new local elections in 1948.) However the effect hadn't fully set in - from 1950 on the KPD polled even lower - but fell only very slowly after 1950, the remaining 3% being hard to crack (the party was banned after 1956, but front organizations stood in most elections until the official founding of the DKP.)

[Filuwaúrdjan]

The FDP didn't have a "Libertarian" platform back then. It had a Liberal (and thus sort of Libertarian) minority wing and a Nationalist majority wing.

And I seem to remember that parts of the various even more overtly so parties (i.e. those parts that didn't head down the overtly neo-Nazi track) ended up joining the FDP in the 50s.

[DC Al Fine]

"Libertarian" parties are often fronts for right-wing nationalists. See for example the great proportion of neo-Confederate Paul supporters.

The FDP didn't have a "Libertarian" platform back then. It had a Liberal (and thus sort of Libertarian) minority wing and a Nationalist majority wing.

That explains a lot. I was wondering how market liberal could have won FPTP seats in 49.

[freefair]

"Libertarian" parties are often fronts for right-wing nationalists. See for example the great proportion of neo-Confederate Paul supporters.

Certainly not at all these days- the FDP is genuinely neo/classically liberal/libertarian. The FPO, on the other hand...

[Leftbehind]

"Libertarian" parties are often fronts for right-wing nationalists. See for example the great proportion of neo-Confederate Paul supporters.

Certainly not at all these days- the FDP is genuinely neo/classically liberal/libertarian.

AKA corporate lackeys.